101. lemwalker - Aug. 5, 1999 - 5:20 PM PT
Y2K preparedness:
Keep no record of your financial obligations. You probably owe the bank more than your worth anyway.
Don't worry about not having money. The cash registers wont work and food will be the best barter. Visit the pound before Christmas to stock up!
Be glad your are close to poverty line. The fall wont be as noticable.
Eat lots now! You can lose it easily.
102. ProfEmeritus - Aug. 5, 1999 - 5:29 PM PT
lem
I also agree with everything you said.
Irv
So sorry. I forgot that you do a little golfing now and then.
103. stamper - Aug. 5, 1999 - 5:48 PM PT
well i sure do have a question you folks could help me with. now in a twin engine boat one engine rotates in one direction and one in the other direction. how can you take say a checy 350 and make it run backwards. now don't tell me to put it into reverse 'cause that just won't do. some might do it through the trany but i can not do that in this case. i sure would appreciate your help
104. katewrath - Aug. 5, 1999 - 5:49 PM PT
Which species of fish is believed to reproduce via only the females? (Maybe it's native to the Amazon rain forest, she adds helpfully.)
P.S. My *#$*ing marine biologist chum is off on some ecological conference and I'm trying to write a fish trivia question, so if anyone wants to suggest another (not too obscure) species with another (fairly intriguing) behavior pattern, that would be nice too.
105. CalGal - Aug. 5, 1999 - 6:00 PM PT
Prof,
Argh. My system crashed as I was about to post my answer. Short version: No, I just forgot about the physical stuff. Sure, have cash on hand and food and blankets. In fact, you might want to open an account at a second bank if you're a belt and suspenders guy.
The real thing is this: if something goes *really* wrong and kicks off a dreadful financial crisis, cash probably won't be worth all that much anyway, yes? So go ahead and plan for any temporary inconvenience--but unless you're planning on investing in gold and chipping it off to buy food, there's not much you can do if the shit really hits the fan.
Here's what I would also do--as the yearend gets closer, and your activities for next year start shaping up, look at each of those activities and ponder how they might be affected. Where are their dependencies? It might help you determine how to fend off potential problems.
106. chloel - Aug. 5, 1999 - 7:02 PM PT
Having everything around that you're supposed to have for other emergencies - earthquake, ice storm, etc. - will cover one of the common Y2K scenarios; a week or so of black- or brown-outs, and then things coming mostly back together. And if the gods laugh, and we get through the date-change fine and then are hit by unexpected earthquakes, ice storms, etc.; why, you'll be modestly prepared for that too.
I have no clue what to do about the Greater Economic Questions, but I have enough solar panels to charge 12v batteries for light power tools and have planted my kale for the winter. Beyond that I'd expect to need to improvise, which I usually enjoy anyway.
107. chloel - Aug. 5, 1999 - 7:04 PM PT
I was once walking along a switchyard when a train coupling snapped - very exciting! I was two cars away and grateful of it - perhaps the tail of the train hadn't been stopped properly, and was compressed in its couplings.
108. OhioSTOPAS - Aug. 5, 1999 - 7:16 PM PT
I have a question: Where does the phrase "pushing the envelope" - meaning to agressively try to stretch existing limits - come from? I don't understand the metaphor. Why would one push an envelope? "Overstuffing the envelope" would be a more appropriate metaphor; does "push" here just mean "overstuff"?
(Obviously I don't have anything important to wonder about . . .)
109. ProfEmeritus - Aug. 5, 1999 - 7:33 PM PT
CalGal
Thanks for the thoughtful answers. Yes, the financial system may well present the most serious problems, given the interdependence of many different components. Since January 1 is a Saturday, the banks might want to have all their personnel on hand all weekend so everything can be tested before they open for business in the New Year. The federal government would be wise to make all transfer payments (like social security} a few days early so they would an extra month to check out all systems.
110. Amaxen - Aug. 5, 1999 - 7:38 PM PT
'Pushing the envelope' comes from the early days of flight testing. The flight envelope of a plane is its known characteristics of speed, handling, & altitude & how they interact with each other. I am not quite sure how the flight envelope came to be called that, though.
At any rate, the only way to do it before they had CAD/CAM computers was to send a guy up to find out just what *would* happen if the plane were to take a 5 g turn at 10000 feet.
111. msgreer - Aug. 5, 1999 - 8:05 PM PT
ProfEmeritus
you have gotten alot of good answers to your Y2K question.
may i suggest to all two other things to consider.
make sure you have a 3 month supply of any medication you take.
also, lots of water.
112. msgreer - Aug. 5, 1999 - 8:14 PM PT
and no, the water is not only to swallow your medication with.
it is for sanitary and other health related issues. it is like preparing for a hurricane in my part of the country.
the obvious ones being bathing. and making a sanitary toilet if one has to. you would need other devices for this too.
and the obvious...drinking. each person needs 3 gallons of water per day in any situation where water maybe cut off for any length of time to fill all these needs.
113. jonesatlaw - Aug. 5, 1999 - 9:21 PM PT
Stamper- I'm not sure how you would make a Chevy 350 run backwards. I would think that if you tried to reverse the direction of crankshaft rotation, you would have to reverse the camshaft lobes as well, otherwise, you'll have your valves opening in the wrong order, won't you?
But, if you reverse the motor in the boat, and do your power take off on the water pump side of things, you'll have opposite rotation, right?
Finally, isn't it easier to allow for torque in a different way? I know that single outboards have a small gizzmo to compensate for the torque thrust.
114. bubbaette - Aug. 6, 1999 - 6:02 AM PT
re: Y2K
Ill probably stock up on H2O like Ms. Greer suggests -- fill the tub and buy several gallons of drinking H20. We were planning to get a pick-up load of firewood anyhow, and we've already got white gas for the colman stove and lantern and a couple bottles of propane gas for the other lantern. I've got an entire closet full of home-canned food, so if we pull a couple hundred in cash out of the bank, and fill the tanks on both vehicles, we'll be set.
I don't think it's going to be much of a crisis. After all, we managed to survive for thousands of years without computers.
115. thoughtful - Aug. 6, 1999 - 8:02 AM PT
ProfE, re Message #109 watch it! There's only one thoughtful in these thar threads!
KateW, I know (or at least I think I know) that male seahorses do the "child rearing".
116. thoughtful - Aug. 6, 1999 - 8:12 AM PT
I would expect longer-term Y2K dislocations on overseas products so buy your imports ahead of time. (You'd be amazed as what all is imported these days.) Gasoline is going to be a biggie since gas pumps don't work without electric, so I can see gas shortages in the end of December as a problem, even if Y2k problems don't materialize. Cash probably won't be much use, though it won't hurt to have some around. Stack up on canned goods, and don't forget a non-electric can opener. Of course water is essential and in cold climes, you might consider heating options.
Those who aren't afraid of guns may wish to keep one handy as any long-term electricity outage can lead to rioting and looting or just an increased opportunity for criminals as they realize security alarms don't work without electric. If the phones go down you can't call 911, and the police may be too busy to respond anyway.
The thoughtful's will have their generator ready to go, lots of canned goods, water and other liquids, and wood for the wood stove.
If you have a choice of where to spend the holiday, just think about what location is most comfortable for living without electric. That should help you decide. I would think loss of electric would be the biggest challenge to survival. If the power stays on, then the rest may be a pain in the butt, but survivable.
117. Raskolnikov - Aug. 6, 1999 - 8:17 AM PT
I am working on some Y2K stuff, and I don't think it is going to be all that bad. My guess is that smaller businesses and units of government will be affected most, and they will find it easiest to function without computers in the first place.
Actually, Social Security has gotten rave reviews for its Y2K preparedness.
118. benear - Aug. 6, 1999 - 8:38 AM PT
I am only speculating, but an envelop is nothing more than a container. If you are inside the container, you are safe. If you are outside of it you are in danger.
So pushing the envelop just sounds better than, pushing the container, or pushing the box, or pushing the 55 gallon drum.
Or it could be that air forms an envelop around the plane?
As for Y2K, The Federal Reserve certified all of its mission critical computer systems on June 30, 1999 after extensive testing. So wire transfer, automatic clearinghouse functions and all of the interfaces with commercial banks have been tested for the doomsday dates.
Just in case, the Fed has ordered a 30% increase in the stock of currency just in case there is a run on the banks. The only problem the Fed is having is they haven't located enough vault space to store all that currency.
Also this year, every bank in Georgia, save two have been tested and their systems are also Y2K compliant. The two banks that didn't pass were small rural banks that were not Y1900 compliant, that alone Y2000.
119. benear - Aug. 6, 1999 - 8:42 AM PT
And why is everyone so concerned about water? Go visit your local water plant. You will discover that there is a lot of computerized control equipment. You will also discover that every pump and valve in the plant can be manually turned on and off or open and close as the case may be. More likely, you will have problems with your bill, but not the water itself.
120. bubbaette - Aug. 6, 1999 - 8:46 AM PT
What should I have for lunch?
121. DanDillon - Aug. 6, 1999 - 8:52 AM PT
bub Message #120,
Now *there's* a question I can answer!
Tuna salad on wheat toast, sour cream and onion chips (baked, if you prefer), an apple, and maybe an Oreo if you still have room. Milk to drink. If you haven't access to these fine items, then I suggest you pack your lunch yourself tomorrow and go grab a slice of pizza today.
122. FreetoChoose - Aug. 6, 1999 - 8:56 AM PT
Milk?
Don't you read Slate on Milk
123. bubbaette - Aug. 6, 1999 - 9:00 AM PT
FTC
I prefer to read my Slate on vodka and grapefruit juice.
124. bubbaette - Aug. 6, 1999 - 9:02 AM PT
Dan dillon
Hmm... That tuna salad sounds good.
I try to pack my lunch, but I'm married and dh gets first dibs on leftovers.
125. CuriousPluck - Aug. 6, 1999 - 9:02 AM PT
Irv: Thanks for the Answer Thread. It has amusing potential!
Christino: I have a question. These were the results of one of the riddle players' logic. I haven't checked them against the problem yet. I wondered if you could run them through your program to see if there was a flaw in 1) our conclusions, or 2) the puzzle.
first, the green house: norwegian, coffee, pall malls, birds
to the right, the blue house: german, water, prince, cats
white house: swede, milk, blends, dogs
red house: brit, beer, bluemasters, horses
yellow house: dane, tea, dunhill, FISH
126. benear - Aug. 6, 1999 - 9:06 AM PT
Wow. A fellow vodkaholic. I take mine with tonic. I drink the cheap stuff at home but Absolute when I am in public and Ketal One when I feel the need to impress my friends.
On those occasions when I run out of tonic, I use whatever is in the fridge. And in order of preference:
grapefruit juice
cranberry juice
tomato juice
coca cola (bleech)
apple juice (double bleech)
Lately if I am forced to contemplate the later two, I skip the vodka an go to the store the next day.
127. bubbaette - Aug. 6, 1999 - 9:08 AM PT
Benear
I also like vodka with a little lime juice and 7-up.
128. JJBiener - Aug. 6, 1999 - 9:12 AM PT
A friend of mine tells the story of how as a young man he spent the evening consuming vodka (Stoly) and chocolate chip cookies. The sugar in the cookies affected how the alcohol in the vodka was metabolized and he ended up with the worst hangover of his life.
129. thoughtful - Aug. 6, 1999 - 9:16 AM PT
benear, the concern about water is, unless a city system is gravity fed, the pumps to get the water around require electricity. No electric, no water, despite hand valves. Also, many of us are on wells, not city water so we depend on electricity to pump up the water. There are a few like my folks who have a shallow well and can throw a bucket on a 15' rope down the well to get water who have no worries.
130. Jenerator - Aug. 6, 1999 - 9:16 AM PT
Rask,
I sat through a few presentations made by these folks, and they claimed that Social Security isn't in good shape for Y2K . They even suggested that we contact SS and establish as much of a paper trail as possible.
131. thoughtful - Aug. 6, 1999 - 9:17 AM PT
Envelopes are for pushing, circles are for going around in, boxes are for thinking outside of, squares keep us hep, and triangles are for lovers.
132. IrvingSnodgrass - Aug. 6, 1999 - 9:30 AM PT
Curious Pluck:
The solution you present might work, depending on how the following clue is interpreted:
"The green house is on the left of the white house."
If you assume, as I did, that it means *imediately* to the left, then the solution doesn't work. If you allow for *somewhere* on the left, it appears to be a viable alternate solution.
133. pellenilsson - Aug. 6, 1999 - 9:39 AM PT
Amaxen --- Message #110
That's a fine piece of trivia know-how!
134. pellenilsson - Aug. 6, 1999 - 9:44 AM PT
benear
"I drink the cheap stuff at home but Absolute when I am in public"
You have been reported to the Council of Swedish Trademark Owners for gross misuse of the name of one of its finest products.
It is *Absolut*.
135. FreetoChoose - Aug. 6, 1999 - 9:51 AM PT
Jenerator
“… they claimed that Social Security isn't in good shape for Y2K”
They claim otherwise.
(Of course, I'm not vouching for the accuracy of their claim.)
136. uzmakk - Aug. 6, 1999 - 12:46 PM PT
What is the opposite of ortho?
137. Slackjaw - Aug. 6, 1999 - 12:47 PM PT
non-ortho
138. uzmakk - Aug. 6, 1999 - 1:06 PM PT
Would that be like non-ortho-molecular?
139. pellenilsson - Aug. 6, 1999 - 1:15 PM PT
If the answer is 'Hay sweep', what is the question?
140. uzmakk - Aug. 6, 1999 - 1:32 PM PT
I have told you before, Pellenillson, I do not understand the subtleties of the Haysweep.
141. ChristinO - Aug. 6, 1999 - 1:44 PM PT
CuriousPluck,
Yep, what Irv said. I went and looked and it fits all the rules so long as you don't assume "to the left of" to mean next door neighbor on the left. Of course I went and did this before I saw that Irving had already answered you.
The only tricky thing I did to myself was wondering if I should apply the rule of "left" from my point of view or from the POV of the owner. I figured since we give directions from the approaching POV I was pretty safe in assuming it was my left rather than the owner's left.
142. jonesatlaw - Aug. 6, 1999 - 1:51 PM PT
Benear- If you ever have the chance- try some Polish buffalo grass vodka. It is flavored with herbs and grass. Sounds gawd-awful, tastes great. I first had some when I was in college, and a visiting soviet diplomat handed out the Cuban cigars and Polish and Russian vodka to impress the capitalist students. It was nearly enough to make me defect. Stoly was almost unheard of in these parts at the time.
143. pellenilsson - Aug. 6, 1999 - 1:58 PM PT
uzmakk
Is that the question?
By the way, glad to see that you have found a little more time for the Fray.
144. MsIvoryTower - Aug. 6, 1999 - 2:06 PM PT
The answer is:
I've been gone, and now I'm back.
145. uzmakk - Aug. 6, 1999 - 2:07 PM PT
I am just saying, Pelle, that haysweeps leave me completely baffled and I cannot formulate either questions or answers concerning them.
146. pellenilsson - Aug. 6, 1999 - 2:09 PM PT
I put two question yesterday but soon after the Thread really took of so maybe tem escaped attention. I repost them here in case anyone has an answer or can give me a hint of where it might be found. They are of some importance to me.
For how long per day is the average internet subscriber on line?
(For this one I found a figure from 1995: 35 minutes, but it may be obsolete because then there wasn't any e-commerce)
How many bits (or bytes) does h/she download and upload during that time?
147. CalGal - Aug. 6, 1999 - 2:09 PM PT
I already wondered that question a while ago and came up with the right answer, apparently.
148. pellenilsson - Aug. 6, 1999 - 2:10 PM PT
Sorry about the typos. It's getting late here.
149. ProfEmeritus - Aug. 6, 1999 - 2:11 PM PT
pelle
What rhymes with Gay Sheep?
150. pellenilsson - Aug. 6, 1999 - 2:12 PM PT
CalGal
Please clarify.
151. judithathome - Aug. 6, 1999 - 2:21 PM PT
ProfE:
Nay, sleep.
152. stostosto - Aug. 6, 1999 - 2:28 PM PT
What is Randy Newman's best song?
153. pellenilsson - Aug. 6, 1999 - 2:30 PM PT
I'm fighting off sleep just so I can inform jonesatlaw that reliable sources say that the 'herbs' in the Polish vodka are in fact a generous dose of buffalo piss (just check the colour). Yes, they have the European variety of buffalo there, the bison,in a large natural park shared with Belarus. I've been there and the sale of piss from bison stallions in heat is apparently a major source of income.
154. stostosto - Aug. 6, 1999 - 2:39 PM PT
I may go out tomorrow
if I can borrow
a coat to wear
O, I step out in style
with my sincere smile
and my dancing bear
155. stostosto - Aug. 6, 1999 - 2:40 PM PT
...perhaps. I honestly don't know.
156. JJBiener - Aug. 6, 1999 - 2:45 PM PT
Sto - "What is Randy Newman's best song?"
Too many to decide.
157. CalGal - Aug. 6, 1999 - 2:46 PM PT
Pelle,
I was posting to the Ms' questions, sorry.
I thought a Hay Sweeps would be a very successful series of movie censorship decisions.
Sto,
Short People. Or the Cleveland song from Major League.
158. JJBiener - Aug. 6, 1999 - 2:54 PM PT
Does anyone have any contacts in music publishing? I am looking for an outlet for the songs I have been writing lately. I am also looking for a lyricist to work with. If anyone knows of someone I can contact, I would appreciate it.
159. FreeToChoose - Aug. 6, 1999 - 3:23 PM PT
MsIvoryTower
Unbelievable. I was just wondering today where you were, and who I should talk to to find out what the story was. Welcome back!!!
160. harper - Aug. 6, 1999 - 3:38 PM PT
Isn't the Polish vodka with buffalo grass (which I have had many a glass of) called hrilka?
161. ChristinO - Aug. 6, 1999 - 3:49 PM PT
JJ,
True, but a couple of my faves:
"They Just Got Married"
"I Think It's Gonna Rain Today"
and the one that sounds like Muddy Waters "Walkin' Blues" , I think it's called "The Girls in My Life".
162. PincherMartin - Aug. 6, 1999 - 3:56 PM PT
Here are some questions for our Fray economists:
What are the accepted ways to compare incomes internationally? Why is PPP the preferred method? When did PPP become the accepted method? And what was the old way that was used to measure the communists' countries income?
163. IrvingSnodgrass - Aug. 6, 1999 - 4:31 PM PT
sto:
"What is Randy Newman's best song?"
"Sail Away," without a doubt.
164. IrvingSnodgrass - Aug. 6, 1999 - 4:33 PM PT
Pincher:
Good questions. I also eagerly await the answers to those.
165. stamper - Aug. 6, 1999 - 4:34 PM PT
jonesatlaw
i got a bit more info on making an engine run backward. i could pull the cam from the old engine that got ruined by the exhust manifold rusting out and water getting in the block and sitting there long enough to rust our the pistons. now i could get a used short block but i would have to get forged pistons 'cause they have to be put in reversed and regular pistons are stong one side. then i would have to reverse the fireing order and that should do the trick. i do thank you for your response since i know my question ain't down everyones alley. i'll let you know if it works.
166. OhioSTOPAS - Aug. 6, 1999 - 5:54 PM PT
Amaxen: Thanks for the answer in #110. I'd never heard the phrase "flight envelope" before; "pushing the envelope" makes more sense now.
167. OhioSTOPAS - Aug. 6, 1999 - 6:01 PM PT
JJ's #158 brought this question to mind: How do songwriters (and producers, and music publishers) know that a seemingly original tune is not a plagiarism of an existing song? With so many songs having been recorded, it's surprising to me that more recorded songs don't turn out to have unintentionally copied a previously recorded song (like George Harrison's "My Sweet Lord" following "He's So Fine"). Do people in the music business just know a LOT of songs?
168. cigarlaw - Aug. 6, 1999 - 6:07 PM PT
the answer is 12.
169. DaveCook - Aug. 6, 1999 - 6:32 PM PT
Pinch, Purchasing power parity adjusted incomes takes the actual domestic currency income of a given country, divides it buy the price of a fixed market basket of goods (this international market basket is derived as the number of each type of goods bought by the average world purchaser) and then multiplied by the cost of that market basket in the United States. The advantage of this method is that it tells you how much goods people in a given country can actually buy with their incomes. The typical alternative method, simply multiplying domestic currency incomes by exchange rates, is a problem because (apart from cyclical movements in rates which can themselves be dramatic) exchange rates are basically set by the relative price of traded goods(raw materials, industrial equipment and materials primarily). Thus, exchange rate adjustment may tend to overvalue the incomes of countries which have particularly pricey non-traded goods sectors (non-traded goods constitute most of the goods people buy). Third world countries tend to have very cheap non-traded goods relatively speaking (because labor is dirt cheap) and so exchange rate adjustment undervalues their already small income. The US also has cheap non-traded goods relative to other developed countries (probably due to a combination of plentiful land, cheaper unskilled labor,and fewer regulations) and so PPP comparisons tend to emphasize how much more goods Americans can afford relative to Europeans or Japanese.
170. DaveCook - Aug. 6, 1999 - 6:40 PM PT
The big problem with PPP adjustment is that measuring average prices and the average market basket in a 100 odd countries is a huge project that is not undertaken very often (usually about 5 year intervals). Current figures are actually interpolations. This exacerbates the fact that no country's people actually buy the international market basket and thus ignores the fact that people will switch their purchases to goods actually getting cheaper in their country. Thus, measuring growth rates in PPP figures may be less accurate than calculating growth rates in a country's own currency. Still for comparing levels I think almost everyone would agree PPP figures are better measures of real income levels.
I don't know how long people have thought that PPP is better, but actually measuring PPP was first started I think in the late 60's or early 70's by Irving Kravis' International Comparison Project (I believe under the auspices of the UN) and continued by Alan Summers and Robert Heston at Penn.
171. FreeToChoose - Aug. 6, 1999 - 8:06 PM PT
DaveCook
Cool answer.
I asked a form of this question (why doesn't PPP mirror exchange rates) to someone in my office yesterday, and he essentially gave the answer you did, although you worded it differently. After hearing both answers, I have a better understanding.
172. pellenilsson - Aug. 7, 1999 - 9:59 AM PT
Answer: Hay sweep.
Question: What was the name of the Contraption that pelle described so well and in such loving detail in the early days of the PlayPen?
The complete Hay Sweep Treatise is now available in a beautiful collectors' edition, painstakingly handcrafted in rich materials as per uzmakk's exquisite design.
The special Fray price is $199.95 (you save $48.37) and includes a witty personal dedication by the author. (Postage and handling not included.)
173. jonesatlaw - Aug. 7, 1999 - 10:09 AM PT
Stamper- everything you said made sense. After I saw your post, I was scratching my head for awhile. I worried whether I had covered all the bases. It sounds like you have.
174. IrvingSnodgrass - Aug. 7, 1999 - 10:17 AM PT
DaveCook:
Thanks for a very informative and well-expressed answer. I learned something new.
175. judithathome - Aug. 7, 1999 - 10:53 AM PT
cigarlaw:
I loved your answer in #168....my husband answers all questions beginning "when" with "Tuesday" and all questions beginning "what time" with "12".
176. PincherMartin - Aug. 7, 1999 - 11:27 AM PT
Dave Cook --
Thanks. That is an outstanding answer to my questions.
177. FreeToChoose - Aug. 7, 1999 - 12:10 PM PT
judithathome
Well, that answered a puzzle that has been bothering me, namely, why is it we never see you in the Fray on Tuesdays at midnight. Now I know :)
178. judithathome - Aug. 7, 1999 - 12:22 PM PT
FTC:
Yes, he keeps me fairly busy after dark...especially since we got cable.
179. stostosto - Aug. 7, 1999 - 2:46 PM PT
Pincher
I agree that DaveCook's answer covers it very well. But I think the biggest problem with international PPPs is that the 'international basket of market goods' is necessarily a construct, simply because the problem in the first place is that there *is* no international market for such goods. How can you tell if the quality of a kilo of French bread is the same as that of a kilo of German bread (of a German variety). You can't. Not even in a case of such a relatively standard good. So what about housing? Education? Health care? Plus the myriad goods that each country consumes which are specific to that country?
These problems are of course compounded for countries which deliberately cut themselves off from the world market as was the case with the former European communist block (but also many Latin American and Asian countries until recently). Even if you were able to get statistics on the consumption of most goods - which was in fact usually the case - you would have a hard time estimating their quality. Seemingly straightforward things like cars, radios, TVs, clothing, and food could be dramatically different in quality from that on the world market.
In the case of Eastern Europe, different estimates of their PPP varied dramatically. Of course, using the currency exchange rates was even more meaningless, since they were fixed by planners and their currencies weren't traded at the world market.
You ask about the income measure of the communist countries. This was called the Net Material Product (NMP) and was, among other things, characteristic by excluding most services - as a deference to some Marxist orthodoxy. As these countries' economies became more advanced and complex (which they did, in their own distorted way), the NMP became more and more misleading. Again, the big problem was how to gauge quality. The market didn't do it for them, not even within the countries - remember the empty shelves and the eternal queues: Everythin
180. stostosto - Aug. 7, 1999 - 2:48 PM PT
...Everything sold. Consumer preferences had practically no effect on supply. So the NMP was basically an account of the economies' use of raw materials, priced more or less arbitrarily, with a fixed-by-the-plan mark-up at every step of the processing chain.
The raw materials were generally underpriced by the planners leading to a gigantic waste of good world class energy and raw materials that were processed into shabby second or third rate end products.
I remember one estimate some years ago that the U.S.S.R. would actually have been better off stopping its own industrial production, selling its raw materials on the world market and importing all of its industrials instead. Its economy was in effect subtracting value from its natural resources.
But the going PPP estimate at the time was around $5,000 per cap. compared with some $24,000 in the USA.
I am not vouching for the accuracy here, mind you, its all off the top of my head.
181. pellenilsson - Aug. 7, 1999 - 2:56 PM PT
You're up late Søren.
182. FreeToChoose - Aug. 7, 1999 - 3:01 PM PT
stostosto
"I remember one estimate some years ago that the U.S.S.R. would actually have been better off stopping its own industrial production, selling its raw materials on the world market and importing all of its industrials instead. Its economy was in effect subtracting value from its natural resources."
I recall a specific discussion involving diamonds. Their diamond cutters were not very skilled, and the value of the cut diamonds was actually worth less than the uncut ones. As you said, they were adding negative value.
Regarding the difficulties of PPP, The Economist has a semi-serious comparison using Big Mac pricing around the world. I'm guessing that it started off mostly as a joke, but, over time, people realized it was decent (certainly in a cost-benefit tradeoff). The advantage (economic, not culinary) is that the item is close to identical the world around, so it avoids the comparison problems you mention. They use it to indicate which exchange rates are more likely to move up (or down) and they seem to have a decent track record (although I haven't seen a formal study of their conclusions.)
183. stostosto - Aug. 7, 1999 - 3:01 PM PT
ChristinO
"I Think It's Going To Rain Today" is a wonderful, wonderful song.
And how about this one:
Stay with me
for a little while
You've nowhere to go
I've nowhere to go
Makes me so happy
when you smile
at me
Live all your life
end up with nothing
to live in one room
like a bum
Once I flew in a plane
and I fought in a war
I lived in a castle
and I slept on the floor
I don't wanna be
all alone anymore
I'm sorry
----
I had to quote it, first because it's so moving, second because I don't recall the title.
I am just so overly, extatically thrilled there are so many Randy Newman conoscenti here. He is my absolute favourite.
184. stostosto - Aug. 7, 1999 - 3:06 PM PT
FTC, I meant to mention the Big Mac index but I got carried away and thought I'd best limit myself. I haven't seen a formal study of it neither though I suspect they must exist.
As I remember, according to The Economist, it doesn't vary all that much from official PPPs.
185. stostosto - Aug. 7, 1999 - 3:09 PM PT
Yes, pelle. Some people haven't got anything to get up for in the morning. Others don't have anything to go to bed for at night.
186. pellenilsson - Aug. 7, 1999 - 3:13 PM PT
sto
I'm presently in the second category because I'm waiting for my wife to get home from a ladies' dinner.
187. stostosto - Aug. 7, 1999 - 3:17 PM PT
pelle
I hope you won't have to wait as long as I usually have to at such occasions.
For me tonight is not one of those. The Mrs. is watching TV. (And I hope she doesn't see my message of having nothing to go to bed for. She might get the wrong idea).
188. pellenilsson - Aug. 7, 1999 - 3:23 PM PT
sto
I hear a key in the lock.
Good night to you.
189. stostosto - Aug. 7, 1999 - 3:29 PM PT
Godnatt, pelle. Sov gott.
190. ChristinO - Aug. 7, 1999 - 4:16 PM PT
Sto,
I couldn't remember the title either which is why I didn't put it on the list. However, it's off Born Again which I had to listen to once we started talking about Newman so I have it next to me. It's called Ghosts. I think this is possibly my favorite album of his. I don't know why I don't own more of them. This has also got Pretty Boy and Half a Man on it.
ahhh, aural paradise!
191. cdm1110 - Aug. 9, 1999 - 3:11 AM PT
Re Message #182: The Economist had an article on the value-subtraction problem in Russia on Oct 24, 1992 -- unfortunately well before their on-line archives. For a readable academic study of the Big Mac index, look here.
192. thoughtful - Aug. 9, 1999 - 5:04 AM PT
Note that issues around PPP arise not just due to exchange rates but to relative pricing. For example, cost of living and salaries are significantly higher in NY City or San Francisco than in Tupelo. So $50k in Tupelo may be a king's ransom, whereas in NY, it'll mean you're living in a box.
193. stostosto - Aug. 9, 1999 - 7:31 AM PT
Yes thoughtful, but some economists might argue that that is because New York City has something to offer that Tupelo has not and which the market is factoring into the general price level. Otherwise people would presumably move out of New York City and into Tupelo until the price level was equalized.
194. thoughtful - Aug. 9, 1999 - 9:02 AM PT
sto3, of course, but I'm often asked the question in my company by someone who's moving out of the country or even out of state about what a salary means in term of purchasing power. A buddy I know left our area to take a job in silicon valley and found out he'd have to spend over $1 million for a house that wasn't even equivalent to what he had here --
195. theDiva - Aug. 9, 1999 - 9:24 AM PT
I have a question.
If Sweetie wants to take some stock, sell it, and put the money into mutual funds, can he do it on-line and if so, what's the best site for that kind of thing?
196. uzmakk - Aug. 9, 1999 - 3:03 PM PT
What is the Raymond Chandler story in which a rare book store features prominently?
197. JJBiener - Aug. 9, 1999 - 3:20 PM PT
Uzmakk - Did they make a movie of it with Bogart? If I remember correctly, he used to book store to surveil the shop owner across the street. Is that the one?
198. uzmakk - Aug. 9, 1999 - 3:31 PM PT
Sounds promising, Biener. Name? I have never read any Chandler so I can't say, but if you can tell me the book with the rare book store in it I intend to read it.
199. allaneq - Aug. 9, 1999 - 5:08 PM PT
Existing Fraygrants;
We would like to invite you to try the new Fray, currently available in beta here. You should notice some significant changes, and we encourage you to read the FAQ available in the Fray Beta thread, if you have any questions. Over the long-term, Slate is working to provide a way let our readers provide feedback to the editors, and to build more of a sense of community among our readers. We hope that the newly redesigned Fray is a step in that direction.
You'll notice that the new Fray is structured around Slate itself, with a thread per department. After the beta is complete, you will be able to easily post feedback to an article, using a simple link at the bottom of each page. As the reader comment is added to each department's thread, we will select the best posts from each thread in the Fray and posting links to them at the bottom of the article itself, for other Slate readers to peruse and comment on. We have also made a Tech Support thread available here, and during the beta test, you can post your comments, complaints, or bug reports in our beta test thread, available here. Take a look around, test the waters, and let us know what you think.
Thanks,
Wes Miller
Program Manager
Slate Magazine
200. theDiva - Aug. 10, 1999 - 1:45 PM PT
*sigh*
201. uzmakk - Aug. 11, 1999 - 6:59 AM PT
Has anyone ever heard of "cow tipping"?
202. FreetoChoose - Aug. 11, 1999 - 7:02 AM PT
uzmakk
Of course
203. jonesatlaw - Aug. 12, 1999 - 7:45 AM PT
Cow tipping is a venerable midwestern folkway. Cow tipping season starts just after the close of the snipe hunting season. In fact, outsiders who are especially able snipe hunters are oftern invited to return for cow tipping.
204. uzmakk - Aug. 12, 1999 - 12:47 PM PT
Jones:
I never heard of it before, but a few weekends ago I was camping with a bunch of folks and one fellow mentioned that the used to cow tip. Then, while I am waiting for my car to be serviced a couple of days ago I see a commercial with cow tipping as the theme---
A dimly lit barnyard, whispers concerning the imposing tip, ...next shot...a barbeque grill has been tipped over and two cows run off into the darkness snickering and guffawing. I think the commercial was for NAPA auto parts?
205. jonesatlaw - Aug. 12, 1999 - 12:52 PM PT
Cow tipping is also popular in areas populated by Jackalopes. Jackalopes are a large rangey western jackrabbit that has horns much like a pronghorn antelope. They are prized by hunters for their racks as well as their challenge as a game species.
206. ChristinO - Aug. 12, 1999 - 12:53 PM PT
uzmakk,
Definitely read some Chandler---anything by Chandler. He's one of my faves and head and shoulders above Dash Hammett.
They tip cows in pretty much any rural area. It can be deadly for the cows----they often sustain massive internal injuries and hemorrage to death.
207. ChristinO - Aug. 12, 1999 - 12:54 PM PT
Jones,
A friend of my grandfathers actually had a jackalope head mounted on his trophy wall as a joke.
208. uzmakk - Aug. 12, 1999 - 4:15 PM PT
When one registers on Table Talk how does one get one's name to appear in Big Blue Caps and that neat little message to appear in bold black.
For instance, Ace's posts read as follows--
SIMON TEMPLAR formerly Ace of Spades, aka Ned Testicular
I already asked them this question and got a rehash of their standarde instructions. Can someone help me? Calgal? I would simply register, but I want to get it right.
209. arkymalarky - Aug. 12, 1999 - 4:26 PM PT
There's some info on the site and Cal also posted a link in either International or Travel that can help.
I've been wanting to tell you, Uzzmak, that you have a unique style of expression which I have really enjoyed. I hope to continue to read your posts elsewhere.
210. uzmakk - Aug. 12, 1999 - 4:41 PM PT
Gee, thanks Arky.
211. uzmakk - Aug. 12, 1999 - 6:41 PM PT
ChristinO:
Am going to check the local library for some Chandler tomorrow at lunch. Thanks.
212. allaneq - Aug. 12, 1999 - 7:01 PM PT
Message from Scott Moore - (Part 1 of 2)
I'd like to explain our recent decision to change the format and technology of The Fray. We realize the decision hasn't been popular with many of the most dedicated Fraygrants, and I believe you deserve an explanation. Not to mention a chance to respond or tee off on me.
Since we took Slate free in February, we've been very pleasantly surprised by the rapid growth of our audience. Monthly readers now total about 1 million, up from less than 250,000 in January. A key reason for the change in our business model was the belief that Slate is something a larger proportion of Internet users would enjoy, but they weren't visiting because of the subscription wall. We expected that if our audience did grow we would be in better position to build an advertising business. Indeed, our advertising revenues have dramatically increased over the past several months. Although Slate doesn't report revenues broken out from Microsoft's, we're on a pace to sell and deliver five or six times the ad revenue we did in our last fiscal year.
The lesson we've taken from our experience with dropping the subscription wall is germane to the decision to change The Fray. In its current form The Fray attracts a loyal following of roughly 150 regular readers (Fraygrants). But the Fray is almost completely disconnected from the daily editorial output of Slate. There are many interesting threads, and The Fray has truly taken on a life of its own as a community nestled inside Slate.com. The problem is that the current Fray doesn't do much to add to the richness or interactivity of Slate for the vast majority of our readers. It's hard to find, the technology is (I'm being polite here) antiquated, and even among our subscriber base of 30,000, it is woefully under-used.
When we started thinking about how to make The Fray better, and more broadly about how to introduce more reader interaction into Slate, we set two goals:
213. allaneq - Aug. 12, 1999 - 7:01 PM PT
Message from Scott Moore - (Part 2 of 2)
1.Integrate the BBS functionality more deeply into the editorial content of the magazine.
2.Draw many more Slate readers into the discussion by posting selected comments directly onto articles and tying threads to specific pieces or departments.
Another less critical objective was to upgrade The Fray technology to allow for multi-threaded posting. This model has been very successful at MSNBC. In fact we're partnering with them to provide our back-end. ZDNet does a nice job of integrating readers' comments into stories and we used that as a model too.
You can see the results of our planning at the beta site here: http://beta.slate.com/code/fray/fray.asp. I realize many of your will not like the changes and will miss the current Fray format. I'm sorry about that and hope you will give the new system a try. You can be sure your posts will have a much better chance of being read by a larger portion of our audience.
I also want to thank all our Fraygrants for your participation up to this point. I hope you'll continue to read Slate and will contribute to the next step in our evolution.
Sincerely,
Scott Moore
Publisher,
Slate.com
A thread just for feedback to this message has been set up here, if you would like to reply.