2. alistairConnor - 4/10/2003 6:47:58 AM
3. alistairConnor - 4/10/2003 7:18:34 AM
In the end, I just barely had the time to gobble down some lunch on the way, and I arrived bang on 5 pm (I don’t wear a watch, and there is no clock in the van. It seems radios don’t do time checks much these days, at least not when I’m paying attention. End result : in spite of my best intentions, I worried about being late.)
4. sakonige - 4/10/2003 3:16:30 PM
terroir
Interesting concept. This must be one reason wines from vinyards planted in Pacific Rim volcanic soil and watered with glacial melt taste better to me than those from any other region. The wines turn out clear, bold, fresh and fruity. Nothing musty or funky or even particularly subtle about Columbia Valley vintages, they have the quality of fresh, wholesome foods. I realize it's just a matter of taste, but it is a taste I like.
5. alistairconnor - 4/10/2003 5:09:32 PM
... or maybe it's the genetically-manipulated yeasts they add which give them that taste?
(just a cheap flippant remark about new-world wines.)
6. judithathome - 4/10/2003 5:36:26 PM
Keep up the flippancy; I can't abide American wines.
7. sakonige - 4/10/2003 6:54:31 PM
I don't know about the yeast, but Columbia Valley wines are winning a fair share of world class awards.
8. sakonige - 4/10/2003 6:55:30 PM
The Columbia Valley is also where most of the hops grown in North American come from, by the way.
9. vonKreedon - 4/10/2003 7:46:07 PM
In my experience the term terroir seems to refer to the essence or expression of a place or region. It can mean the micro-environment of a vinyard or refer to what seperates one regions artisans or writers from another. It is an excellent example of how French is different than English; French excels at describing a sense of a thing and English at describing the thing itself.
10. sakonige - 4/10/2003 8:23:52 PM
These are the Washington State wines that made the Wine Spectator list of top 100 wines for 2002, showing their ranks and scores.
16. 90 $11 COLUMBIA CREST Chardonnay Columbia Valley Grand Estates 2000
17. 94 $40 SPRING VALLEY Uriah Walla Walla Valley 2000
25. 92 $24 KIONA Cabernet Sauvignon Washington 1999
31. 92 $28 COLUMBIA CREST Syrah Columbia Valley Reserve 2000
32. 92 $30 L'ECOLE NO. 41 Cabernet Sauvignon Columbia Valley 1999
51. 91 $23 CHATEAU STE. MICHELLE Merlot Columbia Valley Canoe Ridge Estate Vineyard 1999
68. 90 $20 CHATEAU STE. MICHELLE-DR. LOOSEN Riesling Columbia Valley Eroica 2001
99. 93 $77 LEONETTI Cabernet Sauvignon Walla Walla Valley 1999
11. judithathome - 4/10/2003 9:25:09 PM
Well, even Gallo has produced award winning wines. ;-)
12. wabbit - 4/10/2003 11:09:04 PM
I had an ok, not great, bottle of Columbia Crest Cab tonight ($11), though in fairness to the wine, it wasn't matched well with food.
NYTimes article about pricing wine.
13. sakonige - 4/10/2003 11:11:22 PM
The Leonetti cabernet at the bottom of the list is likely representative of the best wines from the Columbia Valley region. Leonetti is kind of a micro-winery with a limited production, and their wines are usually very difficult to find. Restaurants snap entire bottlings up in a flash. But that makes a good excuse to visit the Columbia basin and buy a case of wine or two for the holidays.
14. sakonige - 4/10/2003 11:15:17 PM
Hi, wabbit. I'm really not that impressed with Columbia Crest wines. It tastes like average California wine to me, sort of artificial and too consistent. I've been puzzled about their high scores in wine tastings for the last five years or so. There is so much better local wine available.
15. wabbit - 4/10/2003 11:43:29 PM
Hey Sakonige,
I'd agree, I don't drink much Columbia Crest, but it's been a while since I had one and thought I'd give it a try. Can't say I'm unhappy to have bought just the one bottle though.
My ex and I had a small wine tasting many years ago and invited some wine salesmen we knew. We told everyone in advance what the various wines were, though the bottles were covered and nobody knew what one glass was vs another. A $25 1984 Buehler that had been opened the day before was everyone's favorite, followed by a $4 bottle of Glen Ellen Cabernet. The Buehler also got third (a bottle opened with the rest of the wines). A $75 1982 Montrose came fourth. The industry guys couldn't believe they preferred the Glen Ellen to the Montrose. In the end, we all decided way too much weight was given to reputation and price.
I never did a wine tasting with black glasses, but I keep hearing the rumor that some experienced wine drinkers have been unable to tell some whites from reds when they can't see the color.
16. angel-five - 4/11/2003 1:57:38 AM
I never did a wine tasting with black glasses, but I keep hearing the rumor that some experienced wine drinkers have been unable to tell some whites from reds when they can't see the color.M/i>
I've done one of those tastings. In the one I was in about 3/4 guessed correctly between white and red wine. The wines were chosen to be of similar character and intensity, and we wore black blindfolds. I guessed correctly, but it wasn't easy, at all, and I was by no means sure.
Wine's a poseur's field, to some degree. Knowing specific things about wine is a mark of culture, and astonishingly few people really do know specific things about wine, to the point that they, blindfolded, can pick up a glass, smell it, taste it, and accurately tell you all about it.
And even if you know something about wine (which is about the extent of my knowledge, I know more than average but certainly less than a full-fledged wine enthusiast or a viticulturalist) it's pretty easy to be wrong about what you're tasting. I'm lucky enough to know some of the better local vintners and occasionally get to taste their wares before they're released on the market. One time was for one of the better 2000 Cabernet Francs I've ever had. I was pretty familiar with this winery's cabernet franc, it's known for its oakiness. And when the vintner presented me with a glass of it I tasted it, and to this day I swear I could taste the oak. I said so, and then he informed me that there wasn't any oak in it -- it hadn't even gone into the oak yet. With wine your expectation can really trump what you taste sometimes, which is why people will rate a wine higher in a taste test if they're told it costs more than it does, or that it comes from a more prestigious vineyard than it does.
17. angel-five - 4/11/2003 1:58:21 AM
One post and I'm already missing the edit function.
18. sakonige - 4/11/2003 2:44:27 AM
I never did a wine tasting with black glasses, but I keep hearing the rumor that some experienced wine drinkers have been unable to tell some whites from reds when they can't see the color.
wabbit, that's just unbelievable! I'm sure I would never confuse a red with a white, and I'm no connoisseur. I can't believe anyone could not distinguish the difference in the acid levels between the two, and white wines have a very different texture from red. Red wine has.. grape crud (?) that sets your teeth on edge a bit, sort of like spinach. But a white wine is clear, sour, syrupy, and kind of gelatinous. The fragrances are different, too. Not the most poetic terms, but I know I could tell the difference between red and white wine blindfolded.
19. sakonige - 4/11/2003 2:48:16 AM
Of course, I don't like thin, reddish-pinkish wine, so I might not be able to identify something like that. I like icy dry whites and thick merlots.
20. alistairConnor - 4/11/2003 3:37:59 AM
Goody. They're coming out of the woodwork. And they all know more about wine than I do... this is going to be fun.
I have taken a resolution to drink more. Or, more precisely, to drink more often. This is vital to improving one's understanding of wine. One problem I have is that I am the only wine drinker in permanent residence at my place. A whole bottle is too much for me, on a regular basis; an intended half-bottle tends to stretch to two-thirds, because generally the wine improves as one drinks (one way or another); and the remaining third is not the same wine, the next day.
So I picked up some empty half-bottles last weekend, and I intend to immediately re-cork the surplus when I open a bottle. Except perhaps on Fridays.
Another technical problem is preparation. I just about never uncork a bottle early enough, or even bring it up from the cellar beforehand. I'm going to have to keep a diary, and plan my week. Goes against the grain, because like most people, I'm hedonist and event-driven, and this is turning it into work.
But am I serious about this thing or not?
21. angel-five - 4/11/2003 4:48:22 AM
So I picked up some empty half-bottles last weekend, and I intend to immediately re-cork the surplus when I open a bottle. Except perhaps on Fridays.
Another technical problem is preparation. I just about never uncork a bottle early enough, or even bring it up from the cellar beforehand.
Just pick up a decanter someplace. They don't cost too much and are the perfect lazy-man's way to let wine breathe, and if you aren't going to be finishing the bottle, it's pretty easy to pour half into the decanter and then just pop a cork back in. And the vacuum-pump corks are pretty useful too.
22. angel-five - 4/11/2003 4:52:56 AM
I have taken a resolution to drink more. Or, more precisely, to drink more often. This is vital to improving one's understanding of wine.
Well, I guess. It's also vital to, er, catching a buzz.
23. wabbit - 4/11/2003 9:25:34 AM
Those vacuum-pump corks are very good to have.
a5 and sakonige,
I used to have some 1982 Pavillon Blanc, a white Bordeaux from Margaux that I think could easily have been mistaken by many people for a red. It had tremendous body, was heavy and oily like a red, and smelled of violets. It was a wonderful wine, I'll have to scout through my diminishing collection next time I'm at the house and see if I might still have a bottle laying around.
24. judithathome - 4/11/2003 9:48:29 AM
It's not even 9am and I am craving a glass of that wine, wabbit...and I don't even like most white wines!
25. jayackroyd - 4/11/2003 10:04:22 AM
Alistair--
For people to really appreciate all this, you have to describe your cellar.
I used to get good wine. I still have a couple of bottles of LaLande Pichon 86, and some vintage port, mostly Warres, ranging from 77 to the early nineties. But the prices just got too obscene for me to stand. So now we drink CA plonk, and like it, with the odd Sancerre thrown in.
26. jayackroyd - 4/11/2003 10:08:46 AM
sakonige,
Before rejecting this hypothesis, do a really blind tasting yourself. A former colleague professes himself to be an expert on white wine. So I challenged him to a four brand tasting of Champagnes, ranging from a CA 12.99 bottle that I really like to Moet White Star.
There was no correlation between his preference and price, nor was he able to guess which was which.
Truly truly blind, like a5 says with black glasses and a blindfold? That'd be really hard. Expectations play an enormous role in our evaluations of everything, wine no less than other stuff.
27. Macnas - 4/11/2003 11:02:36 AM
Alistair,
See what you've started?
At any rate, as a whiskey drinker, my palate is unable to discern any nuance that might distinguish good wine from fair. I can tell the difference between dry and otherwise, that’s about it.
My interest will be more to do with your travels and experience of the different localities, as France is my very favourite holiday destination. Other than horsemeat, snails and certain parts of Paris, I have always liked what I have found there.
28. alistairconnor - 4/11/2003 1:07:55 PM
Actually I just poured myself a small Tullamore Dew, but this is not the place to go into that, now is it? Why don't you start a whisky thread? Talisker. Lagavulin. Laphroiag. Aaaaaar. I think it was Cigarlaw who inspired me to go upmarket.
29. alistairconnor - 4/11/2003 1:08:45 PM
Yes, I can imagine Angel5 drinking wine in black glasses. And doing everything else in black glasses too.
30. angel-five - 4/11/2003 3:52:27 PM
Well it depends what glasses you mean. The shades are black, the wine glass, cobalt blue.
Good whisky is something I a) like and b) know almost nothing about, only the bits and pieces you pick up listening to aficionados talk about their latest acquisition. I'm told that the best come from labels most Americans have never heard of, which sounds about right. The best I've ever had is Johnnie Walker Blue, the best I've ever bought was Johnnie Walker Gold with its oddly shaped cork, but on my next trip to the UK I'd like to make it to some of the smaller distilleries and see for myself.
31. angel-five - 4/11/2003 4:08:47 PM
As far as hard liquor goes, I never used to like any of it, period -- it was something to get drunk quick on. That was mostly because I had no idea what good liquor was like -- I used to consider Crown Royal to be, like, the cream of the crop.
Even now I rarely drink anything stronger than wine. Mostly Remy Martin and Courvoisier, an odd assortment of scotch. Gray Goose. Cabo Wabo tequila (yes, it's actually quite good).
For a dessert drink I like ice wine (readily available around here), or a rich sipping liqueur like Drambuie or Sambuca Black.
Anyways. This is the wine thread.
Upthread I saw some disparagement of American wine. Well, I've had some pretty fricking amazing American wine. There's a local winery, the first in the state to use vinifera; the guy's a purist and will not meddle with the wine at all. The wine ranges from 18 to 35 a bottle, one of those that would, were it in a trendier market, command four or five times that, and it's amazing wine. I'd stack it up against anything I've had in that price range anywhere in the world.
I do not want to inaugurate an American vs French wine debate; I just think that American wines usually get shorter shrift in that sort of discussion than they deserve. If you've had, say, Opus One, you know what I'm talking about.
32. judithathome - 4/11/2003 4:17:30 PM
I disparaged American wines but will admit I've had a few decent ones. I haven't been exposed to any "excellent" ones, I guess.
They seem thin to me but that's just my opinion.
For awhile, though, we bought some really good Gamay-Beaujoulais by Glen Ellen...bought it by the case, it was so good and the right price. Dirt cheap, in fact. But the year is long gone now and the last bottle we tried was not even worth saving for cooking purposes.
33. alistairconnor - 4/11/2003 5:30:19 PM
Old World / New World wine. This is not a strictly geographical thing : there is plenty of New World wine made in France these days.
Let me try a shonky analogy.
Old World wine : classical music. It's all been done before, the paradigm is centuries old, and it's a matter of creating the most perfect modern rendition of the well-known score. You get cheap perfunctory renditions, and dumbed down muzak versions, but you also have purists who will go to extraordinary lengths to re-create the original on period instruments. Personally, I love to listen to Monteverdi played on buzzing theorbs and asthmatic sackbuts in an old church with dodgy acoustics; but your mileage may vary.
New World wine : everything else. No rules. Jazz, contemporary, rock and roll. The floodgates of creativity are opened. Lots of influences, lots of borrowing, lots of very commercial stuff. And some of it is punk.
34. alistairconnor - 4/11/2003 6:25:08 PM
As I was saying.
Philippe Goulley has three wines : Petit Chablis; Chablis; and Chablis Premier Cru.
All Chardonnay of course. We are at the northern end of Burgundy, this is as far as Chardonnay will go, and is somewhat over-extended. The previous night, he had been out lighting diesel burners and turning on sprinklers, to prevent the frost from nipping the vines in the bud.
Thirty years ago, vines only covered a quarter of their former area in Chablis, and the locals generally had only a couple of hectares of vine, along with a dozen cows, and various crops. Very few people dared to try to make a living from wine alone, because about every second year, spring frosts would ruin the season.
A couple of things have changed. The climate, for one. Global warming or not, there is no disputing that the frosts are nowhere near as severe as they used to be. And they have found various systems, including the sprinklers, to keep the frost at bay.
One of the things they have worked out, is that if you disturb the soil, that worsens the risk of frost, by bringing the moisture to the surface. So instead of ploughing to control the weeds, they use herbicides. This is one example among many of how modern technology and chemistry have intervened recently, to make life easier and more profitable for winemakers, and to produce a more regular, standard wine.
35. vonKreedon - 4/11/2003 6:33:37 PM
AC - But your Phillipe is an organic vintner, correct? So how is he controlling weeds and avoiding bringing on the frost?
36. alistairconnor - 4/11/2003 6:46:27 PM
Petit Chablis : This is the low end stuff, generally from the plateaux rather than the hillsides. From my limited experience of the genre, I was expecting something rather thin and acidulous, a quaffing wine at best, quickly drunk and forgotten.
I was frankly gobsmacked by the first mouthful. Very mineral, very concentrated. And not at all ready to dring in my opinion. This is going to be a recurring theme...
The Chablis was OK, but five years away from its best. The easiest of his wines was the top end, Premier Cru Fourchaume 
which had enough substance to overcome the youthful acidity. The problem is, the more authentic and terroir your wines are, the longer they take to mature. Not good for the cashflow.
37. alistairconnor - 4/11/2003 6:50:14 PM
Kree : He's ploughing for the weeds, and taking other measures against the frosts. I wonder how he got on last Monday night, they caused huge losses for the fruit growers around here.
He admitted he machine-picks his grapes. This is definitely unusual among organic domains, except perhaps for the more extensive ones in the south, and underlines the fact that he's not a "mainstream" organics man -- he's not particularly into the ethics and the ecology, he's doing it for the quality, and I daresay, for a market niche.
38. alistairconnor - 4/11/2003 6:56:36 PM
My next appointment was in the evening, so I took a stroll around the town of Chablis. 
Unsurprisingly, it's pretty.
I noticed that a small street (really small, the style where the houses overhang and nearly meet overhead) was roped off for repairs, so I had a look. Rue des Juifs -- Jew Street. And there it is, the 14th century synagogue undergoing restauration 
(difficult to photograph, due to the aforementioned narrowness)
39. alistairconnor - 4/11/2003 7:12:09 PM
Second winemaker : Catherine Moreau. She's a much smaller operation, only 2 hectares of vine (1.99 to be precise), no fancy equipment or marketing, a robust peasant approach to the affair. She inherited the vines from her grandmother. She's had her ups and downs. Her first vintage of full production, 1996, was bought up almost entirely by a Japanese outfit. Then the following year, the crop was almost entirely wiped out by oidium while she was on holiday, and she lost the client... she now has plenty of wine in stock, as evidenced by the fact that she was able to offer three vintages for tasting.
Catherine moreau with her creations : left to right, 1997, 98, 99, 2000, 1993.
The fascinating thing is that they are three very different wines. I'm looking forward to following her progress in the future.
She lent me a bit of paddock to park the van. She was rather concerned that I parked it on a slope, and worried I wouldn't sleep well. And in fact I did wake up with a headache. The slope of the van perhaps; or bad feng shui? Couldn't have been the wine.
40. vonKreedon - 4/11/2003 7:47:57 PM
AC - She's not related to Jeanne Moreau is she? Very similar mouths.
41. Ulgine Barrows - 4/11/2003 9:52:13 PM
I was lucky enough years ago to hook up with a person who really enjoyed wines and wasn't a wine snob. This man was a biology something-or-other, and he owned a liquor store on the side so he could write off trips to Napa Valley. This was back in the early 80s, before Napa was what it was, when I saw it again mid 90s. The new Napa was full of pretension & marketeers and very few vintners who loved the art of winemaking. Plus they'd begun charging $6 a glass for a 'taste' and that riled me, cheapskate that I am.
My experience with wines, up until I met Mr. Biology, was mostly late 70s era Boones Farm, Mogen David, Riunite ...I don't even know if those brands are around anymore, but I think their ilk is what gave US wines a bad name? Rightly so, horrid, all of them, at the time.
Anyway, I signed up for my first wine tasting class and it was led by this funny man who loved looking at yeast, and we had blind tastings for all of the classes (the label was covered up and nobody knew the price, because Mr. Biology said that previous classes had always said they preferred the higher-priced wines).
I was very intimidated at first - I recall saying one of the selections 'tasted like dirt' and was informed by some 50-yr-old (with no sense of humor and an upturned nose) that it was 'earthy'.
Pelle's funny post in Feature Suggestions reminded me of that: the proper words one must use when discussing wine are always been a hoot. Earthy is OK, dirt is not.
42. Ulgine Barrows - 4/11/2003 9:52:59 PM
I hope you meet some more interesting folk that love the art, alistairconnor . Please do ask them about the Stelvin closures. Some good, accessible US winemakers are moving to the screwtops, yet I think their status will suffer, because wines are so image-conscious. DO French vintners worry about this? Is a poor-quality cork better than a screwtop?
When you taste, is it the custom to go from sweet to dry?
That's interesting, about not being able to tell red from white in a different kind of blind tasting, actually blindfolded.
The pictures are great; more, please.
43. alistairconnor - 4/13/2003 12:08:46 PM
Corks. I'm a cork man. Am I simply a snob? Well, let's see. (This post based mostly on blind prejudice and guesswork. I know nothing much about the subject.)
"Accessible" is the key. If the wine is ready to drink when it's bottled, and is not expected to improve in the bottle, then why waste a cork on it? That would be like corking lemonade. A screw top or plastic plug are good enough. Cork oaks are a limited resource.
The point is, that (as far as I know), without a cork, the wine can no longer evolve. The cork is a membrane, through which the wine communicates with the outside world. A bad cork can spoil a good wine, as we know; but even an average cork can improve an average wine, with time. If bottles are stored standing up for long periods, and the cork dries, that's bad news for the cork and for the wine.
Then again, if the wine is not stored in good conditions, that communication through the cork can be a bad thing. Smelly storage can influence a wine.
I don't know that I will be talking much about wines that don't require a cork. Perhaps Beaujolais nouveau, or Rhone valley table wines.
44. alistairconnor - 4/13/2003 12:09:25 PM
As Jay notes, I have a good cellar (I could take a picture of it, but I would have to tidy up a bit first -- which would be a good thing in itself but time consuming) -- cool, dark, damp and culturally evocative. My main problem with it is that wines evolve very slowly indeed. Some of them would probably be "ready to drink" earlier if there was greater thermal amplitude.
45. alistairconnor - 4/13/2003 12:58:44 PM
Saturday morning. I hit the road, south to Beaune. Phoned the next winemaker on the way, which is just as well, because there is another village called Nantoux, about 20km further south, and that's the one I was headed for. This is the right one. (hope that link works)
Christine and Didier Monchovet built their cellar and house with modern materials, but respecting the traditional layout of the Burgundy "maison de vigneron", slightly stylised, the effect is pleasingly cubist - it deserves a photo, which I didn't take.
Didier was a teaching oenologist before becoming a winemaker. 
I didn't try to bullshit him but acknowledged my ignorance about serious wine tasting.
46. alistairconnor - 4/14/2003 4:01:41 PM
I have the notes I took on the wines I tasted, but can I actually remember any of the wines? I need to write them up immediately. I need a laptop. Give generously to equip your roving reporter.
Hautes Côtes de Beaune, white (chardonnay) : good, but none for sale. Keep an eye on these There will be much greater volumes in future years, the vines planted in recent years are coming on stream.
The Monchovets plant their vines in double-lyre configuration, rather than the traditional Burgundy low, parallel to the ground style, as here : 
Better with respect to disease and frost, because the grapes are further off the ground; allows more leaf surface; but most of all, much more comfortable to pick. He has the welfare of his workers at heart.
The vines they have planted are all on traditional wine-growing land, but haven't had vines on them since the phylloxera wipeout of the 19th century (a parasite virtually wiped out French vines, until resistant American rootstocks were introduced). As a result, the grapes are purely organic, the land having never been subjected to "modern" chemical treatments. The older vines have been converted from "modern" back to organic. This requires following organic methods for a period of at least three years before the organic label can be used.
Over the last several years, they have planted a vine of 4 hectares in chardonnay : this is incredibly big by Burgundy standards, where tiny parcels abound. In the centre is a small orchard and horse paddock; they are very proud to be introducing a bit of biodiversity into what is generally a desperately bleak monoculture.
47. vonKreedon - 4/14/2003 4:09:57 PM
AC - You never answered my off topic question regarding Madame Moreau's potential relation to Jeanne Moreau. You of course may not have the faintest idea, just wondering.
48. alistairconnor - 4/14/2003 4:12:14 PM
Hautes côtes de Beaune red, good good, but the 2000 is way too young, I don't have the experience to taste this stuff and project it four or five years into the future. And there's the rub : there's practically no 2000 left, it's 2001 he's got in stock now. The more authentic the Burgundy, and the greater the wine, the longer the wait; and it seems to me that organics exacerbates this problem, making the wine still "longer" (Didier seems surprised at this idea, but I suspect his surprise is somewhat commercial in nature)
Oh yes, I do remember the Beaune Premier Cru Coucherias, red, 2001, truly a great wine, even I can tell that. (I don't know much about art, but I know greatness when it jumps up and bites me on the bum.) Hey, how come this stuff's drinkable? (though much better in 5 years) -- the secret seems to be in the "éraflage" (consists of separating the grapes from the bunches so that the twigs don't participate in the pre-press fermentation/extraction stage). This is a great wine -- have I said that? and only 14 euros.
All the Monchovet wines are kept in second-hand oak barrels (they buy them when they're well broken in, after three years of use, and keep them for four or five years. No new oak here. Don't get me started on vanilla-flavoured wines.)
49. alistairconnor - 4/14/2003 4:14:46 PM
Kree : Moreau is a desperately common name. I have met her father, a retired motor mechanic; so I think it rather unlikely. But I agree about the mouth.
50. robertjayb - 4/14/2003 5:41:10 PM
Eraflage, indeed. I must place a napkin over my tumbler of Gallo pinot noir, lest it evaporate in embarrassment...
51. arkymalarky - 4/14/2003 6:52:48 PM
Pinot noir? You Texans are so gauche. Pinot grigio is the only way to fly with Gallo.
I went to their website to look at their selection and they're subdivided into types of wine and price categories and I found a new euphemism for cheap there: Popularly Priced.
I love it.
52. Macnas - 4/15/2003 3:31:26 AM
Alistair,
Please include more pictures of la campaign, if you can.
Arky, rob-jay can't be that gauche if he's using a tumbler. Plus he has a napkin to hand.
53. alistairConnor - 4/15/2003 5:18:15 AM
Pinot noir, pinot gris, pinot cul...
(just thought I'd lower the tone)
Eraflage Aw, I apologise. I wonder what the English word for that would be.
That's a problem I have with specialised vocabulary, or just with stuff I first learned in French. Even quite common trees and animals, I struggle to find the names of in English.
There are some words that can't be translated (I don't believe there's a succinct way of expressing terroir in English) -- for the rest, I suppose I should get a dictionary.
Ah. Not hard to find : I'd better put up some links.
Multilingual glossary of Enology terms
Eraflage = destemming.
How prosaic.
54. Ronski - 4/18/2003 7:17:54 PM
Jeanne Moreau's sister is my late partner's sister-in-law's best friend. I could ask about the vintner. They would know, since they run a vineyard in England themselves.
But Moreau is indeed a common name, and a town in New York up the Thruway from me, for example.
55. Ronski - 4/18/2003 7:22:02 PM
56. Ronski - 4/18/2003 7:47:46 PM
I am drinking this right now.
The description of it as a good cocktail wine is apt. The 2000, which I have not had, is described as good with a meal, fish, poultry, etc.
I like a nice dry rose from time to time. Even a sweet one, sometimes, as an aperitif.
Does that make me a bad person?
57. arkymalarky - 4/18/2003 7:58:35 PM
I would say "not in my eyes," but I don't know that that would be reassuring to you. ;-)
58. alistairconnor - 4/19/2003 11:04:11 AM
There's a lot of prejudice against rosés. Mostly dating from the days when a winemaker would add a bit of red juice to a failed white wine. Personally, I haven't had a headache from drinking a rosé for years.
Perfect for an outside meal on a hot day. Though I've never met a rosé that I could fall into raptures about or spend time analysing.
59. alistairconnor - 4/19/2003 12:53:08 PM
Your wine primer is full of howlers, Ronski... I could take it apart almost line by line. I may come back to it, but for now... on with the story.
60. alistairconnor - 4/19/2003 12:57:34 PM
As I was buying a few bottles of Monchovet wines, I mentioned that I would be in Beaune that afternoon, at the annual shareholders' meeting of Bourgogne Avenir, a small company that owns some organic vines. Didier told me that he was also a shareholder (I should have known that), and that one of his wines is actually a "company" product : he manages a parcel, in exchange for rent in kind. He gave me half a dozen bottles to deliver to the chairman, and told me to tell them that he would be late.
61. alistairconnor - 4/19/2003 1:13:31 PM
After a picnic, 
I drove to Beaune along the Route de Bouze (pronounced : booze), to the meeting, held at the cellars of Jean-Claude Rateau. This is the centrepiece of the weekend, or at least my pretext for it.
There were about 40 shareholders present out of 60 or so. It's a small affair, put together by winemakers and friends to enable them to buy up parcels of land that they can't afford individually. I've had some money in it for five or six years, but I've never been to the meetings or met the people involved before. But they've seen my name, and I'm immediately accepted as part of the family.
The debts have been paid down, and for the first time, we will turn a profit this year. There is a long, confused and inconclusive discussion as to whether this should be paid out in cash or in wine. Everyone would prefer the latter, but it seems it would be a bookkeeper's nightmare. I think we decided on a cash payout, and the winemakers who farm our land -- I think there are five of them -- will be asked to make promotional offers for shareholders to buy their wines.
62. alistairconnor - 4/19/2003 1:29:38 PM
Next comes a fairly technical discussion on the rents paid on certain parcels which produce rather less wine than the norm.
In particular, a parcel of Haute côtes de Beaune known as "Lulunne", farmed by Emmanuel Giboulot, produces only about 25 hectolitres per hectare (the norm is 40). It's an old vine, producing a very rich, concentrated wine; the low rate of production would not be a problem in itself, in fact often winemakers will make efforts to reduce production to boost quality; but the problem is, the rent is based on market rates, currently 9.2 hectolitres per hectare. (Actually, it's expressed in pièces per ouvrée, these are specific Burgundy terms for volume and area, but they kindly translated these into French for us.) This means that on parcels like these, they are effectively paying out about 40% of the production in rent, which is excessive.
Now that we're out of debt, we will revise the rents downwards. This is in keeping with the general sentiment that the whole operation is more a mechanism for solidarity with the producers, than a money-making venture.
63. alistairconnor - 4/19/2003 1:54:11 PM
Next came the aperitif in the courtyard : Jean-Claude Rateau and Didier Monchovet proposed their wines ... 
as did Dominique and Catherine Derain 
(more on them later)
... then we descended into Rateau's cellar 
(By now, I am no longer spitting, and my notes and memories are getting progressively less reliable)
I do remember Jean-Claude's Hautes Côtes de Beane, white, which I just loved, simple and very typical, he has a large amount of it which he is considering selling off to a negociant, who would probably not even sell it as organic... He could let shareholders have it for five euros a bottle, which is immorally cheap. I find that I have exclamation marks for "Aux Coucherias", a Beaune Premier Cru, white. Ah. I just looked up the price, 19 euros, that's calmed me down. Likewise, "Les Bressandes", a Beaune Premier Cru red, at a similar price.
64. alistairconnor - 4/19/2003 2:03:37 PM
I just found some useful tasting notes on these wines :
(this site, eldenwine.com, seems to be out of date. A shame, as it might have provided American readers with a means to buy some of the wines I'm talking about.)
65. alistairconnor - 4/19/2003 2:10:48 PM
oops.
66. Ronski - 4/19/2003 8:03:20 PM
Your wine primer is full of howlers, Ronski... I could take it apart almost line by line.
Please do. I posted it as kind of a joke.
67. alistairConnor - 4/29/2003 8:12:02 AM
Last weekend was the Rhône valley. Five more winemakers, and I haven't finished writing up Burgundy yet.
Have I mentioned, I need to get a laptop?
68. alistairconnor - 4/30/2003 2:55:25 PM
... Back to the story. So we are Saturday 5th April, sitting down to dinner with the shareholders. To be frank, the wine is flowing freely. Though I remember much of the food and the conversation, both excellent, I have little memory of what we drank. Though I do not doubt that it was also good.
I was doing pretty well, I think my mistake was the rum after dinner. Anyway, the van was parked outside.
69. alistairconnor - 4/30/2003 3:05:24 PM
Sunday morning, I'm queasily thinking of breakfast when I hear the clock of Beaune cathedral striking nine. I have an appointment with the Derains, a few kilometres south in St Aubin. (I have a second appointment back at my starting point with J-C Rateau at 11.30, but I will not make it back in time. Hopelessly over-scheduled.)
Catherine Derain takes a motherly interest in my rather grey complexion, but I bravely prefer to face the tasting session with Dominique, which will turn out to last about three hours.
Dominique Derain's first trade was barrel-making. Everything is oak here : the fermenting vats, the storage. No cement, no stainless steel.
70. alistairconnor - 4/30/2003 4:42:47 PM
Rustic wines. Chock full of tannin, which takes years to digest and round out.
I've been reading about tannin. The name (as you surely know) comes from tan, the celtic word for oak. It's the substance tanners use to transform raw animal skins into leather. The quality of astringence that it confers on wines (is it a taste, or a tactile sensation?) results from its tanning action on the inside of our mouths : it combines with the collagens of the skin and with the glycoproteins of the saliva, which loses its lubricative properties.
Anyway. Lots of tannins.
St Aubin is in the middle of the Côte de Beaune, which produces the finest white wines in the world (don't take my word for it, ask Hugh Johnson) and some of the greatest reds too. The Derains have various parcels of vine, mostly in the appellation of St Aubin, 
but also some Pommard, Mercurey, and Gevrey Chambertin.
Dominique is waiting for some people from a Paris wine shop, but we start tasting in the meantime. As a result, I get a second try of everything when they show up. And then they start tasting "sur fût", drawing wines out of the barrel with a pipette. That's even harder for me to make any olfactive sense out of, because it's not supposed to be ready for drinking; but I nod my head sagely while they speak of raspberries, pepper, ginger, wild mushrooms and so on.
To tell the truth, I'm a sucker for the whites. Blown away by the St Aubin Premier Cru En Remilly. I just looked it up on the map, it's on the slopes of the Mont Rachet, a couple of hundred yards from the strictly-delimited Montrachet, Bâtard Montrachet, etc (the aforementioned best white wines in the world.)
71. alistairconnor - 4/30/2003 4:48:34 PM
So. I'm getting myself an education. And Dominique is taking the time and trouble to explain a lot of stuff. In particular, biodynamics.
I'm not sure whether I'm altogether convinced about biodynamics, as opposed to mere organics. The distinction requires some explanation, and that's putting the cart before the horse, because I haven't yet explained
72. alistairconnor - 4/30/2003 5:16:53 PM
There are the same range of reasons that motivate people to eat organic food : health; environmental concern; ethics; taste. There is another reason which is important for me, with respect to wine : it narrows down the field.
Eliminates 95% of winemakers, in fact. I honestly don't know where I would start otherwise.
And it doesn' just randomly eliminate 95% -- the ones that are left believe in what they are doing. They have to.
It's hard work growing grapes organically. No weedkillers : need to plough the weeds a couple of times a year at least. No chemical pesticides : need to use expensive plant extracts, carefully targeted, against the little beasts. Sulphur and copper-based treatments are OK, against the ubiquitous mildew and fungal rots. Mostly, the focus is keeping the vines naturally healthy and strong.
It's not only hard work, it's expensive. AND there is no price premium for the wine. That's right : all else being equal, an organic wine fetches the same price as its "conventional" equivalent.
That's not right, but that's how it is, over here, right now.
73. alistairconnor - 4/30/2003 5:40:53 PM
The 5% of French winemakers that do organic, are an interesting bunch. There's another good reason for you.
Having got to the end of the tasting session, the Derains' lunch guests have arrived, so we have an apéritif in the courtyard. And it's time I left, but I haven't even had time to buy anything left. I quickly make up a list, which I give to Dominique with a blank cheque. He'll put the wine in the van at some stage in the afternoon, while I take a hike to walk off the tasting, before driving home.
I find myself a picnic spot on the hillside, with a view of the village of Gamay 
(no, it's all chardonnay and pinot noir these days)
... and fall asleep in the sun.
I just looked up the amount of that cheque. 119 euros 89, for eighteen bottles. That can't possibly be right. The bastard's under-charged me.
Cheers.
74. alistairconnor - 5/2/2003 5:27:15 PM
So. Friday 25th April, and I'm heading south.
Another camper van (different cépage, but much the same vintage, mid-80s, of those that are no longer improving with age). Another headwind. Yes, I'm heading down the Rhone valley into a stiff southerly... there's a pattern here; but what does it mean?
75. alistairconnor - 5/6/2003 6:43:24 PM
Gah bugger. Haven't written up that weekend yet, and I'm off on another, extended one, tomorrow night...
Though the daughters will be with me in the van, so there will be more fun and games thatn "serious drinking".
Languedoc. Increasingly fashionable, powerful reds.
76. uzmakk - 5/7/2003 11:51:17 AM
AConnor:
Was there a scandal in the 70's because a number of French winemakers were adding antifreeze to their wine, or is this urban legend?
77. judithathome - 5/7/2003 2:41:24 PM
AC, is there no more Gamay Beaujolais?
78. uzmakk - 5/11/2003 5:28:14 AM
I am now told that it was Austrian sweet wine makers.
79. rdbrewer - 5/11/2003 6:12:06 PM
Howdy. I drove by an aluminum building between Tulsa and Muskogee last week that had a sign that said "Wine Tasting." Apparently we have grapes in OK.
80. magoseph - 5/11/2003 6:54:22 PM
81. alistairConnor - 5/12/2003 4:45:33 AM
A Brewer in the wine thread? Incongruous, but encouraging.
Full, glowing Languedoc report with photos coming up, some time soon.
("soon" is a relative concept.)
82. alistairConnor - 5/12/2003 4:54:32 AM
AC, is there no more Gamay Beaujolais?
Judith, yes there is : but the eponymous village is 100km or so north of the Beaujolais, in the heart of the world's finest Chardonnay and Pinot Noir climate, which is why they don't bother with mere Gamay any more. So you'll probably never see a Gamay Gamay.
I'll have words about the Gamay of the Beaujolais in due course, I've got a couple of excellent ones, including a superb Morgon.
Footnote : You can get Chardonnay Chardonnay. I used to buy my Chardonnay in the village of Chardonnay, north of Mâcon, from the winemakers' co-op. Ten litres at a time, and bottled it at home. Very good after a year or two of bottle, and dirt cheap.
Are you confused yet?
83. alistairConnor - 5/12/2003 4:57:38 AM
Thank you Uz, for retracting your libel.
There is plenty of adulteration about, mostly of the sugaring sort, in order to bump up the alcohol content of the more northerly wines in "difficult" years. Because of the repeated scandals, the problem has been largely regulated out of existence... by legalising it. (With strict guidelines of course.)
84. rdbrewer - 5/12/2003 10:40:37 AM
Thanks for the link, magoseph. I'm surprised, because we can have severe cold snaps in OK that could easily destroy the vines.
85. PelleNilsson - 5/14/2003 1:27:15 PM
alistair
Here an article that may gain you some oneupmanship points in your talks with wine growers.
French wines get hammered
86. alistairconnor - 5/14/2003 4:16:14 PM
There is probably a laborious pun to be made about œno-pemanship.
Indeed, France is not very competitive in the "two-buck Chuck" category. It's not a matter of being able to produce good wine cheaply -- there's plenty of it -- but a problem of doing it on an industrial scale, with modern branding and marketing.
Personally, I have difficulty seeing that as a "problem", any more than the fact that France has not produced the equivalent of a Coca Cola or a Macdonalds is a "problem".
The winemakers I've talked to who do business with the USA haven't had any bad feedback yet, the importers they work with are very supportive, on the contrary. But their wines are very much niche products.
87. alistairconnor - 5/14/2003 4:25:29 PM
One of the winemakers I met last weekend mentioned this San Francisco outfit, owned by friends of his, which offers several wines that I know intimately, and a few more that I have recently encountered... The prices look inflated to me of course, but I have no doubt that they are competitive with respect to American wines.
88. alistairconnor - 5/14/2003 5:03:44 PM
Anyway :
I'm casting my mind back to Friday 24th April, to continue the road movie last seen in Message # 74.
First stop is the Domaine des Treilles, where 
Patrice Méry introduces me to his very sound Côtes du Rhône. This winery has been in the family for about 250 years. According to my notes, his 98 is 60% Grenache, 40% Syrah (or Shiraz, if you prefer. Depends on which university you're from.) Whereas in the 2001, the proportions are inversed. He's been planting more Syrah, this is alleged to produce the classier wines. I have come to believe (anachronistic remark) that this is very far from universally the case. It seems that, forty years or so ago, a plague of agronomist missionaries descended on the poor peasants of France, to teach them modern methods. Winemakers were not spared, and both good and damage was done.
In this region, the message was "plant Syrah".
Well, I'll have to taste his wine again to know what I think. I noted : Drink young, for the fruit. No wood used. 
He also makes a white that I liked a lot. But it's practically all pre-sold for export, only 15000 bottles.
89. alistairconnor - 5/14/2003 5:23:59 PM
Here's a random bit of countryside, possibly the village of Taulignan, near the domaine des Treilles. 
Next stop is Jean David, at Séguret, a bit further south. In fact, I believe Jean had gone directly to bed after a hard day working the vines, and I spent a pleasant hour or so with Mrs David, 
and their young apprentice, and subsequently a restaurant owner who dropped by to pick up his montly thirty litres of red, plus a few dozen bottles. 
(I have not been to his restaurant, Les Ecuries de l'Evéché in Vaison la Romaine, but will do so at the earliest opportunity.)
Being into my second round of tasting their various wines by this point, I leapt at the opportunity to secure 11 litres (bag in box) for myself, and it sits on the end of my kitchen bench. In fact I think I've got half a glass to finish before I go to bed. 
... and so to bed.
90. alistairConnor - 5/15/2003 4:27:59 PM
... but I haven't finished with the Davids.
Seguret is an official Village of the Côtes du Rhône, i.e. the wines are officially "Seguret Côtes du Rhône Villages", to show that they are a cut above the ordinary Côtes.
They have been organic for 20 years now. Again, they have a white wine that I like very much; I am asked to identify the variety. I find it has a delicious aroma of muscat, but that's quite impossible (and I am told that the correct answers for the nose are : honeysuckle and rose). Turns out it's predominantly Bourboulenc, with a bit of Roussane. Almost a trick question. Very nice wine, but very small quantities, just recently bottled and it'll be sold out by the end of the summer.
Similarly, they do a very fine rosé, grenache/cinsault/mourvèdre, basically just for themselves and the regulars.
They have a reasonable quantity of "generic" red Côtes, this is the stuff I've got in a cardboard box, and it's full of sun, full of fruit, and probably works out to about the equivalent of $3 a bottle. About 70% Grenache with some carignan, cinsault, and a bit of young Syrah (they believe that their climate is too hot for Syrah, it produces lots of shoots and leaves but not very interesting grapes.)
They do the assembling directly at grape-picking time, the different varieties macerate together. Seems risky to me, but it certainly works for them.
Their Séguret is classy and very fruity, I bought some. Their top wine, Les Couchants, is slightly gassy at the moment. This is a turn-off for many, but I acquired a taste for it drinking Italian reds.
91. alistairConnor - 5/15/2003 4:35:01 PM
... So I staggered out the door...
into the sunset... 
(I had not been spitting, having gained the permission to leave my van where it was for the night, I could not have found a better place for it) 
and hopped on my bike, to visit the village of Seguret itself. Just one of those beautiful Provence villages, I stroll through the cobbled little streets enjoying the sounds and smells as the day dies. Then ride home to bed through the deepening dark, over gravelled lanes through the woods. Even with my eyes closed, the powerful perfume of the wisteria would tell me I've arrived.
92. Macnas - 5/16/2003 3:24:21 AM
You're making me wistfull about a place I've never even been to. You should work for Maison de la France.
93. PelleNilsson - 5/16/2003 11:56:46 AM
You caught him out.
94. alistairconnor - 5/26/2003 5:29:04 PM
Alright, so it's Saturday 25th April. My first stop after breakfast is at Domaine Roche Buissière, on the outskirts of the village of Faucon, very photogenic, which I inexplicably neglected to photograph.
A great location, and as I pull up, another camper van stops, with German plates. Luckily the hostess speaks German (Kein vrac... ich habe bag-in-box...)
Hosts Antoine Joly and Laurence Mezoudji give me a run-down on their operation. Antoine has taken over in the last couple of years from his dad, who has been organic since 1980. Laurence, whose name denotes North African origins, is more proximately from Saint Etienne, close to where I live. They have built up the winery from nothing (Antoine's father used to take his grapes to the co-op).
Down in the cellar, Antoine explains the working of the old-fashioned screw press, which he picked up for free (apparently they are coming back into fashion in Bordeaux)
95. alistairconnor - 5/26/2003 5:38:18 PM
The wines. Côtes du Rhone, red, Le Claux. 2001. Just bottled, so I will abstain from judgement. Will taste what I bought soon. Gaia : Same mix (75% Grenache, 25% Syrah), older vines, oak barrels. No specific memory. Damn, it was a month ago.
Vin de pays (in theory, a grade down from AOC wines such as Côtes du Rhône, but in practice, often bargains) : Coteaux des Baronnies, OK, Comté de Grignan : 90% Cabernet, good stuff.
The usual small quantities of white and rosé.
They also do olives, this must surely be the northern limit of olive production. The olives of the region of Nyons, where we are, are distinctive and famous : wrinkly, because they are harvested after the first frosts of winter. The oil is supposed to be pretty good too, but too dear for me, we consume quite a lot.
96. alistairconnor - 5/26/2003 5:50:04 PM
Here's one of their parcels of vine (generally, people have small parcels of an acre or so all over the place, often several miles apart. Not very efficient, but gives them a variety of micro-climates to play with.)
The parcel just above the trees, with grass growing in it, is theirs.
97. marjoribanks - 5/27/2003 11:38:26 AM
Great stuff, AC. The photos, particularly, are excellent.
But you need to use a quick service like shutterfly.com because the wait for downloads is just too long on your site.
98. marjoribanks - 5/27/2003 11:40:32 AM
Having said that, you really do deserve kudos for your illustrations for this wineblog thread. Good photos, AC, good photos.
99. alistairconnor - 5/27/2003 5:17:25 PM
The photos would probably load faster if you were in Europe.
I will not use a "free" (i.e. subsidised by advertising) service, I'll use the one I've paid for, however slow.
And I'm still a month behind. Tomorrow we're off again, to Provence this time, and I haven't even finished the Rhone Valley let alone Languedoc.
Continues...
100. alistairconnor - 5/27/2003 5:55:45 PM
Second stop of the morning (Saturday 25th April) is Domaine St Apollinaire, in the enclave of the Popes (an area of a few dozen square miles that was papal territory, and is still anomalously attached to Avignon, administratively). The view of the Mont Ventoux, the Giant of Provence, from there : 
Looks like snow on the summit; not impossible at that time of year, but it's an illusion : the sun reflecting off sand.
The master of St Apollinaire, Frédéric Daumas, is no illusion. 
Imposing, grave, ponderous, he could be called the Pope of biodynamics.
Well, actually, he has broken with Demeter, the German outfit who consider themselves as the inheritors of the agronomist and philosopher Rudolf Steiner. So that would make him a schismatic Pope.
The Antipope of biodynamics.
His difference with the mainstream concerns elements which I hesitate to describe as obscure points of doctrine. Differences of method. I am a profane, I will not rush in.
But what of the wines?
White : rather apricot. White grenache/Clairette. Perlant (English term? Almost fizzy. Small bubbles form in the glass.)
Reds : Cuvée Apolline. Grenache/Cinsault/Syrah. Feminine.
Cuvée Prestige : 80% Syrah. Masculine.
Côtes du Rhone Villages : oh very impressive. So is the price.
Some interesting notes about the costs of doing things right : Harvesting grapes by machine costs about 220 euros per hectare. Harvesting by hand : about 750. But at least, the wine you're drinking will not be a maceration of dead insects and rodents, which end up in the machine-picked vats along with a fair amount of wood and leaf among the grapes.
101. alistairconnor - 5/27/2003 6:03:43 PM
After which, I picnic in the village of Puymeras 
and think about what to do next. I don't have any more appointments arranged, not wanting to overdo it. I phone around, but it seems no-one wants to see me this afternoon. Slightly discouraged, I wonder if I should head straight home. It begins to rain. One last call, to a guy I've been wanting to see, but is rather further south than I wanted to go. He's happy for me to come, but rather disconcerted when I ask if I can park the van there overnight.
A stop in the village of Châteauneuf du Pape, which is actually rather unpreposessing, as Provence villages go. Two thirds of the shops are wine outlets.
Pope's Newcastle on Rhône.
102. ronski - 5/28/2003 8:49:27 PM
I am fond of sparkling wines, so perlant ones I enjoy as well. My late partner's brother, in England, has produced some. (I have to ask him whether it was on purpose or whether it just happened.)
If you all promise not to tell me how godawful English wines are (especially if you have not tried any), I would be delighted to post his website.
There are some pretty pictures of his vineyard, in the South Downs.
103. ranheim - 5/29/2003 9:29:03 AM
I have a daughter that recently spent 3 1/2 months in New Zealand and Australia. She enjoys wine and says that she enjoyed wines in both countries.
However, her favorite was Vasse Felix of Australia. They had a wonderful restaurant; as well as fine tasting wines. I have not been able to buy any as their wines have not been approved for sale by the powers-that-be in Louisiana. She is currently living in Austin, Texas and I will be able to taste some Vasse Felix wines in June or July.
A technical problem : today I am having trouble with this entire site. I had to wait for all 102 posts to download before I could see anything. In the health section it was ridiculous : over 5000. Anything I can do about that?
104. Macnas - 5/29/2003 9:57:00 AM
Sounds odd, perhaps Wabbit can shed some light? Try a post in the technical issues thread (if you manage to get in there).
105. ranheim - 6/1/2003 2:19:35 PM
I realize this thread came about due to Alistair and his discussion of French wines. However, I lost track of French wines when I left the USAF; and that was in 1970. Too expensive here in the USA. And you have to keep up with the vintages and vineyards.
For several years I drank mainly CA wines. They are now too expensive also. And it has been quite some time since I have drunk a decent tasting CA chardonnay.
I am currently drinking Australia reds : mainly shiraz. And Italian whites : pinot griggio and soave.
Do we have any experts on the subjects of Australian or Italian wines?
106. alistairconnor - 6/1/2003 5:30:03 PM
I spent a couple of weeks in Italy exactly two years ago, seeking out wines, among other things. My excuse was to pick up my mother in Venice and bring her to France, but we are both wine drinkers, so we made a few stops. I'll dig up a couple of photos... I particularly fell in love with the Barbera reds of the Asti region.
107. alistairconnor - 6/1/2003 5:46:39 PM
... also with the Brazzola sisters who own the Casa Montelio, in the Oltrepo Pavese, near Pavia in Lombardy.
A fabulous double act. One of them speaks English, the other speaks French...
They have holiday rental accomodation on the estate, too.
108. alistairconnor - 6/1/2003 5:51:35 PM
I have drunk a certain amount of Australian reds, in New Zealand mainly (where you have to be pretty patriotic to drink the local reds, not because of the quality - generally excellent - but because of the price.)
I have no strong opinions about Aus wines, except that the reds are generally excellent value for money.
[Tech note to Ranheim : try typing a reasonable number in the "posts/page" box, just above the posting window, and hit "Go".]
109. ranheim - 6/1/2003 6:33:27 PM
wabbit told me that in the technical section the other day. But, thanks, Alistair.
110. Penny - 6/2/2003 4:30:51 AM
I think lots of NZ sauvignon blancs are pretty good. But not cheap, probably far more expensive than your Californian chardonnays.
Alistair - where in France would I buy the wines you are talking about. Or find out where to buy them. I drink mainly white wine, and sometimes have something terrific (and local..) in a restaurant, then I can't find it in the wine shops, where the choice is mind boggling, and unlike in oz, seems to vary greatly from shop to shop even in the same area. What's the trick?
111. alistairConnor - 6/2/2003 5:54:19 AM
There's no trick, Penny... it's a jungle.
Firstly : I'm talking exclusively about organic wines. There simply isn't any organised distribution network for this stuff within France (I'm starting to think I'll have to organise one myself, one day... when I'm rich, and can afford to do it as a hobby...) -- as a result, most of it gets exported, mostly to European countries which have stronger demand for organics than France. (I think all the makers I've mentioned export more than half of their production). The rest is mostly sold at the cellar door, or to a few specialist wine shops or restaurants. The organic co-op shops have a few wines on offer, but it's poorly managed and prohibitively priced.
112. alistairConnor - 6/2/2003 6:08:18 AM
Even for non-organic wines, the situation, as you have noted, is extremely haphazard.
The fundamental issue, for the drinker who is used to a "new world" winemaking landscape, is the incredible multiplicity of small producers. The great majority of French wine is produced by artisans : the winemaker owns the land and the winery, and generally inherited it from their parents. In general, no more than a dozen hectares. The top vineyards, in particular in Bordeaux, Burgundy or Champagne, are often owned by companies, because the amounts of money involved put it beyond the scope of an artisan approach.
There are also the négotiants, companies who buy grapes or wine from the artisans, and blend, age and bottle it to produce a standardised product... and this supplies the bulk of exported French wines. These people are working on "branding" themselves, to improve their recognition, market penetration and whatnot.
But fundamentally, there is no answer to your question... You can't get there from here.
De Gaulle had a line on it : How can you expect to govern a country which has more cheeses than there are days in the year? The wine situation is much, much worse.
Or better, depending on your point of view.
113. alistairConnor - 6/2/2003 6:22:06 AM
Specifically, the only way to get your hands on the wines I'm talking about is to do what I'm doing. (Got back on Saturday night from a jaunt in Provence... Les Baux, Bandol, Côtes de Provence, Châteauneuf du Pape. All that.)
To do that, you will want to get the guide book, Les bonnes adresses du vin biologique, by Jean-Marc Carité. You can find it in organic shops, or at bigger bookshops such as the Fnac, or
online if you have an address in France.
114. alistairConnor - 6/2/2003 6:40:07 AM
I think lots of NZ sauvignon blancs are pretty good. But not cheap, probably far more expensive than your Californian chardonnays.
I wonder. Perhaps we should do some price comparisons.
When I was last in NZ, I was delighted with the quality of the whites I was drinking. But then I worked out that they cost about double the price of French wines of equivalent quality that I'd be drinking here. When you take into account that people in NZ generally earn about half to two thirds of what French people earn, that makes it pretty expensive.
I noticed that the French wines I saw in the shops there were sold at about double their French retail, which would make them competitive in price/quality terms.
I would be paying minimum $NZ 20 for something drinkable, with $30 being about my upper limit at the time. Say, 10 to 15 $US or euros.
What sort of a Californian chardonnay will that buy you, folks? I have to say that my experience with US wines is close to nil, because of my cheapness -- everything seems to start at $US20, and that's way too much for me for a stab in the dark.
The wines I buy these days are generally in the 5 to 10 euro range, with a few outliers at each end. On Friday, (here's proof of my cheapness) I bought a couple of bottles of Bandol -- at 24 euros apiece, I think it's the most expensive wine I've ever bought.
115. alistairConnor - 6/2/2003 6:55:31 AM
I'm getting ahead of myself here, but I bought some of this wine on Saturday (in the 1998 and 99 vintages), at 17 euros per bottle from the maker. They're proposing it for more than double that price in California ($39).
How about some knowledgeable commentary, or subjective speculation, on quality/price comparisons between French and US wines, from a US buyer's standpoint?
Come on, people, what's your price range? (I've shown you mine...)
116. Penny - 6/2/2003 7:41:31 AM
I'll take up the challenge : I spend 10% of my salary on wine.That's AUS/NZ$20 a bottle, @1/2 a bottle a night.Big bucks to me.
(Thanks for the book info. I'll try to get it next week, when I'll be in France).
117. alistairConnor - 6/2/2003 8:22:07 AM
What are you drinking, at that price?
It seems you're in France often : this site, Château Online, may interest you, if you have an idea what you like : way better than a supermarket, in any case. They have an extensive selection, and interesting reviews. It looks like they weed out the rubbish OK.
What are their prices like? I see they've got the Vacqueyras from Montirius at 11 euros. I'll have to check at home what their cellar door price is, that will give me a rough idea.
(I visited Montirius a couple of weeks ago, and I haven't written it up yet... Coming soon...)
118. judithathome - 6/2/2003 10:20:47 AM
What sort of a Californian chardonnay will that buy you, folks?
I had an excellent Ecco Domani Pinot Grigio over the weekend that we bought for $7.85.
We drink mostly reds and I love Louis Jadot Beaujalois; we get it by the case and it runs about $8 a bottle. We get it through the military base and get a 10% discount when we buy it that way.
If we find anything we like, we get a case...if it's Californain, it runs about $50-60 a case and the last one we got was 2 months ago, a good one from Chile, and it was on a special...case was $47. However, three bottles out of that case were vile and went down the drain. (That never happens with the Jadot.) A case will last us about 2 months. We go to two restaurants which allow us to bring our own so how long it lasts depends on if we eat out a lot or not. Also on how much company we have. ;-)
119. judithathome - 6/2/2003 10:23:12 AM
By the way, all the wine at the military base is cheaper than in the regular stores around here. I nearly faint when I see what others pay.
120. alistairConnor - 6/2/2003 10:46:13 AM
We get it through the military base and get a 10% discount when we buy it that way.
Ooooh boy... shouldn't someone tell Mr Rumsfeld about that? But seriously, are there any issues surrounding French wines at the military base?
At a guess, that Jadot (beaujolais villages?) would retail for 4 to 5 euros here. So $8 sounds like a decent price.
Hey, a Google on Louis Jadot brought up this, from Houston Wines.
121. ranheim - 6/2/2003 2:11:36 PM
JAH
I spent 9 years as an USAF Flight Surgeon. That is where I developed expensive tastes in booze, beers, and wines. At that time, we did not pay taxes : federal, local, or the country we were in at that time.
I remember paying about $2.50 USA for a fifth (in those days)of Johnnie Walker black label. Under $5 for a decent Chablis and Pouilly Fuisse. I cannot for the life of me remember any of the reds we drank at that time. That was a whole different world that the one I live in currently.
122. judithathome - 6/2/2003 2:56:18 PM
Ranhiem, I was shocked and amazed when Keoni and I married and went to Japan...the prices on base at the Class VI store were astonishingly low and I was expecting everyone to be a sot.
Only some were, thankfully.
123. judithathome - 6/2/2003 3:00:37 PM
Alistair, yes, the Louis Jadot I like is the Beaujolais Villages.
I used to like the Glen Ellen Gamay Beaujolais (California) and it was only $4.10 a bottle....rot gut prices if you ask me!...but the last year, it's been dreadful so we quit buying it.
124. Penny - 6/3/2003 7:44:43 AM
re 117 "What are you drinking, at that price?" - well, NZ sauvignon blancs (they call them sav blonks here)(truly)
125. alistairConnor - 6/3/2003 10:15:37 AM
Penny, how about some points of comparison between French and Aus reds? Chiraz and all that jazz?
A few years ago, I did a quick unscientific comparison of Sauv Blonks. Went to Marks & Spencers (there aren't many places in France where you can get foreign wines!) and bought one each from Chile, NZ, Seth Effrica and France. From memory, they were in about the 30 franc range, i.e. nz$10, definitely low end.
The French wine, a Sancerre, the cheapest of the lot, blew them all out of the water.
Unfair, arbitrary test.
126. judithathome - 6/3/2003 10:22:33 AM
I was nearly thrown out of my gym (slight exaggeration) the other day for saying I like French wine better than Californian wine. This shrew whined "But we hate them!!" meaning the French and I said "Maybe you do but not me!" and she said she would never drink French wine again...I said good, more for me. I doubt we'll be workout buddies after that.
You would expect the milityary base to be the one place where French wines weren't offered but they aren't stupid. They still sell plenty of them.
127. judithathome - 6/3/2003 10:23:44 AM
military...errant "y" in the above.
128. Macnas - 6/3/2003 10:31:09 AM
"But we hate them!"
Quell dommage.
129. Macnas - 6/3/2003 10:31:44 AM
"Quel" one "l" too many....
130. robertjayb - 6/3/2003 10:38:50 AM
CBS Evening News had a segment last night on the "popular" Charles Shaw wines...known as the two-buck chuck in California. One of the silly legends about its price and availability is that post-9/11 airlines were stuck with huge stocks rendered unusable by a ban on corkscrews.
131. alistairConnor - 6/3/2003 11:11:40 AM
Reading that discussion, RJB, it's pretty clear what happened : the CS outfit started off their two-buck Chuck as a loss leader, selling a good-quality wine at below cost; then, as the volume ramped up, they started buying in any old juice and shipping it out under the same label.
Fair enough. People are no doubt getting their $2 worth in any case. And a lot of them will have the satisfaction of believing they've got a real bargain, because of the good reviews of the initial batch.
And if it gets people drinking wine who wouldn't have otherwise, that's broadened the market, and they'll want to try something else next.
132. Penny - 6/4/2003 6:59:33 AM
"Penny, how about some points of comparison between French and Aus reds? Chiraz and all that jazz?"
Sorry, mate no can do - would like to, but only drink white wine, and don't know enough about it anyway.
133. alistairconnor - 6/4/2003 4:04:19 PM
"Knowing enough about it" is a complete joke.
The more I read about oenology, and specifically about wine tasting, the less inhibited I feel about expressing an opinion.
It is scientifically well-established that professionals --winemakers, critics, oenologists etc -- don't have any greater powers of discernment of specific characteristics than your average wine drinker. (And practice, oddly enough, doesn't help). What they may well have, is the technical vocabulary to describe them, and the confidence to embroider on that.
But as for qualitative judgement, that has a very large subjective component, and the experts are just as prone to "error" as any drinker.
What you get as you progress in wine tasting ("total immersion" is my preferred approach) is the ability to describe by analogy. That is the most powerful way of describing a wine (or anything else). No single taster, however expert, can really get the eight or nine characteristics of a particular wine (flint, prune, tobacco, almond, etc), but a given wine will evoke another, or several others.
134. Macnas - 6/5/2003 3:19:26 AM
Well then, there's hope for us all.
135. ranheim - 6/5/2003 1:10:18 PM
Alistair
You are absolutely correct.
I have been drinking wines for 40 years. I know what I like - when it is in my mouth. As to why I like - or dislike - a wine, I cannot put it into words.
Every time that there has been a truly "blind" wine tasting, the "experts" have been either fooled or wrong.
Drink the wines that YOU like!! Forget what "experts" advise.
136. alistairConnor - 6/6/2003 3:46:03 AM
I'm going to do an experiment to attempt to objectify my subjective impressions.
There is a dinner coming up in a couple of weeks, of my summer cycling companions, to plan our annual mountain biking jaunt. I will organise a tasting, with half a dozen wines that I have bought recently, and ask them to evaluate them, according to the rules of wine competitions.
These are a dozen guys (only one woman) who, like me, drink a fair amount of wine, have their personal knowledge and preferences, and have no pretense of being expert. With one exception : a wine waiter who is a regular jury member in real wine competitions. I'll get him to help me organise the tasting.
I will publish the results of course. For peer review by you other bozos.
137. alistairConnor - 6/6/2003 3:48:05 AM
Yes Mac, there is hope for all you sinners and unbelievers. Even if you only accept the sacrament of wine on your deathbed, you can be saved.
Though if you start earlier, you'll probably live longer.
(Though wine is more likely to save your heart, than your soul. Or your liver.)
138. Macnas - 6/6/2003 5:18:48 AM
I can tell the difference between red and white wine, and even go as far as to be able to detect if a wine is "dry" or not, as in "jesus christ on a bike! that stuff is like liquidised treebark".
Beyond that, it might as well come with a screw on cap.
139. arkymalarky - 6/6/2003 10:32:08 AM
Screw-on cap wines are highly underrated. I buy the corked bottles for the winerack in the dining room to go with the wine glasses that sit out, and the screw-on ones to go with the jelly jar glasses in the cabinet.
140. PelleNilsson - 6/10/2003 12:10:39 PM
Why a cult $2 plonk has America's wine industry in a spin
(Probably subscription only. Excerpts:)
WHEN Fred Franzia speaks, America's winemakers tremble—for he is suddenly the uncontested heavyweight of the industry. Mr Franzia is not, however, a dilettante maker of fancy $300-a-bottle Cabernet. His wine, sold under the Charles Shaw label, is rather more modestly priced. Each bottle—of Cabernet Sauvignon, Chardonnay, Merlot or Sauvignon Blanc—costs just $1.99. Hence its affectionate nickname: Two-buck Chuck.
Since it came on to the market last year, Two-buck Chuck has become the fastest-growing wine in the history of America's wine industry. Visit any California branch of Trader Joe's, a supermarket chain where the wine is sold, and you will see stacks of it piled in the aisles, and shoppers carting it away not by the case, but by the carload. (And these are American cars.)
How does it taste? This correspondent's verdict is: not bad at all. It is similar to the cheap plonk sold in France and other European winemaking countries. The appearance of such cheap wine in America, however, is something new, made possible by an unprecedented oversupply of grapes in California.
The success of Two-buck Chuck is a mixed blessing for the industry. It is cannibalising sales of mid-market wines below $10 a bottle, forcing producers to cut prices and prompting other supermarkets, such as Safeway, to introduce discount wines of their own. But at the same time, Two-buck Chuck's low price means it is reaching new markets and changing patterns of wine consumption. Young people are buying it instead of beer, and occasional drinkers can afford wine more often.
141. jexster - 6/10/2003 12:32:08 PM
Napa Valley
142. judithathome - 6/10/2003 12:33:14 PM
This is the same guy responsible for box wine.
143. jexster - 6/10/2003 12:38:06 PM
Grgich Hills Winery
St. Clement Winery
NBC11 San Jose - Wine Country Living
144. jexster - 6/10/2003 12:40:21 PM
Calistoga Winery Bike Tour by Cycle America
145. alistairconnor - 6/11/2003 1:39:47 PM
Thank you jex for the interesting links, but "Enough quotations. Tell me what you know", like that other guy said.
Tell me about your wine life.
146. Magoseph - 6/11/2003 6:00:38 PM
I just listened to the the legende of the Clairette de Die, Alistair. My father was born there and is buried there too. Have you heard of this wine yet? Côtes du Rhône: Appellation Laudun Village If you are ever in the neighborhood, see Laudun: My first eight years were spent there and all the summers after we left. Beautiful village! I have pictures of the Madonna and the Romane church with me in front of them , dressed up in white with a flower crown and a basket of flower petals, ready for the procession. It is very touristic now, though. In those days, many vignerons, fathers of my friends, had in their caves at home two barrels of vin blanc and vin rouge. I guess they invited prospective customers and let them sample the new wine. I remember the kids used to brag about that and let us try the wine, out of the faucets. That was living dangerously then.
147. jexster - 6/12/2003 5:28:24 AM
Non.
148. jexster - 6/12/2003 5:39:27 AM
Actually I did tell you what I know. Those are two of my favorite wineries and though Wine Country Living is a gross sales pitch for Napa and Sonoma County wines ( a magazine offshoot), I find it very useful for tourist trip planning.
I do have a bitch tho. California vinters really go in for big winemaking styles. Generally more bottle age is required than for comparable French or Italian wines even for Chardonnay.
The wines you get to taste though still free in most wineries are heavily tannic at 2-3 years. Pinot is a bit better as is Sangiovese and Sauvingnon Blanc but even they are too much.
I don't get up that as often as I once did. I HATE the summer/fall crowds. Winter/Spring are the only times I go and then mostly with visiting friends. In my youth, I could handle getting blitzed and driving. Not now. The return headache is too much. Best to stay overnight as I did in October with four friends out here for a wedding.
149. Macnas - 6/12/2003 6:01:00 AM
Speaking of American wine....
A History of American Wine making.
I've only read bits and pieces, but it's not bad.
150. jexster - 6/12/2003 6:02:52 AM
Though I have never tasted it, Quintessa is the best red California produces. Mondavi/Rothschild started a new trend in California premium wines with Opus I abandoning varietal labeling opting for the French practice, region/brand.
I cannot afford a hundred dollar bottle of wine that I have to lay down for 15 years so I have no idea how it stacks against the premier cru Bordeaux stuff or Romanee Conti quality Burgundies. Probably not quite there from what I have heard. Cabernet, cab franc, merlot blend.
Personally, I prefer French and Italian wines in all ranges except bargain priced. But the value isn't there. They aren't competitive especially in the $8-25 range - my max.
Interestingly enough, I have noticed an increase in the number listings of Freedom wines in upscale restaurants, a big increase. Must be the inflated dollar.
151. alistairConnor - 6/12/2003 6:53:34 AM
But the value isn't there.
Well, well, well.
The Wine Spectator doesn't agree.
I just ran a search of red wines in their tasting database, max price $20, minimum score 90.
I got :
From California : 3 (three) wines.
From France : thirty-nine wines.
Get a better shop, Jex!
152. alistairConnor - 6/12/2003 6:58:54 AM
... What I suspect this indicates is that you know your California wines, and know where to get value for money (and possibly even sweet deals), whereas for the Freedom stuff you're at the mercy of your local merchants.
(The Wine Spectator requires free registration to search their database.)
153. alistairConnor - 6/12/2003 7:02:15 AM
Interestingly enough, I have noticed an increase in the number listings of Freedom wines in upscale restaurants, a big increase. Must be the inflated dollar.
??? The dollar has lost about 20% against the euro in recent months, which will make French wines less competitive in the future.
So I dunno... Maybe importers are panicking and selling off, and restaurants are picking up bargains?
154. alistairConnor - 6/12/2003 7:27:07 AM
Magos,
I have a feeling that there's an organic winemaker in Laudun, I'll look it up. That would give me an excellent excuse to go there.
As it happens, my narrative is stalled at precisely the time when I'm driving past Laudun, on my way to Théziers(all of 36 km away, according to Mr Michelin.)
155. uzmakk - 6/12/2003 7:45:43 AM
Connor:
I don't have much to say on this topic, but I am really enjoying your Wineblog. My price range is the same as Jex's, $10-$25.
156. jexster - 6/12/2003 8:23:45 AM
AC you are right,but not quite for the reasons you suppose...
California wine shops do not, as a rule, have very good Freedom wine selections. I notice this every time I go back east where in Washington and New York (pre-old glorification age at least) selection and price for French, Iti wines are much much better.
I suspect Napa, Sonoma vintners and liquor wholesalers are conspiring to restrain trade.
157. jexster - 6/12/2003 8:36:29 AM
And perhaps you didn't enter the same search info...
10-25 range, Sonoma, Napa, Carneros - 72 score 90+, 1488 if I buy a subscription.
Again, my preference for French & Italian wine is more a matter of wine making style. They're generally drinkable at purchase. California winemakers keep contact with skin in fermentation longer and overdo their limousin oak barrel ageing somehow.
Some of it tastes more like oak tree more than vine.
158. jexster - 6/12/2003 8:52:45 AM
Even for "classic" rating, WS returns 31 reds from Sonoma, Napa, Carneros. 26 for Bordeaux, Burgundy, Beaujolais, Rhone...
IMO, CA wines in the 10-25 price range in California shops are the better value even though I prefer Italian and French generally. Even with the overvalued dollar, the French costs 10-15% more than local comparables
159. jexster - 6/12/2003 11:26:49 AM
Recent months Bush months...to be sure...I can't splain it but if you look at the restaurant price of a med burgundy and a pinot or cabernet from California, they are in same ballpark...
This is not the case with stores....Of course, a restaurant lays a 200-300% markup on a wholesale price...If it wants to beef up its French selection it has room to play...
Its not surprising though that California wines can now sit at the same table....the climate here and the soils are ideal, climate especially better than France....the industry has been protected by special agriculutural development district legislation....UC Davis has supported it with a huge agricultural research effort
Still winemaking remains an art and quality is very dependent upon soil characteristics and vine stock
It took two decades to get the industry rolling in Napa county so that it could compete since Andre Tchelistcheff turned BV from a jug wine operation to quality cab back in the 60's...the trend toward hiring expat French winemakers and investments by Lafite Rothschild and Domaine Chandon help too.
160. alistairconnor - 6/12/2003 3:59:06 PM
10-25 range, Sonoma, Napa, Carneros - 72 score 90+, 1488 if I buy a subscription.
You'll have to explain your methodology... I'm trying to stay polite...
Let's see. I search for "All wine types" (previously I searched only for reds), "UNITED STATES" (previously I looked only for California), scores 95-100 or 90-94, all prices up to $40 (my previous search cut off at $20), sort results by price (so as to cut off at $25)
I get exactly 50 wines at less than $26, all from California, Washington or Oregon.
Exactly the same criteria for France, gives me 80 wines.
This is all assuming, for the sake of argument, that the Wine Spectator's scoring is objective and their prices reasonably close to reality.
161. alistairconnor - 6/12/2003 4:43:23 PM
Awwwright...
162. alistairconnor - 6/12/2003 5:00:24 PM
His Côtes du Rhône is very very good, I need to drink some more, forgotten the specifics : 
A classic And at about 6.50 euros a bottle...
The other wine that leaps out and grabs you, is a mere "Vin de pays", that he calls "Arpèges". Dominant : Cabernet, 30% Mourvèdre. 4 euros... how much can I buy?
We discuss the ghastly 2002 vintage. Wherever I go in the Côtes du Rhône, they tell horror stories about it : heavy rain in September during the picking; rot on an epic scale. Many got only 50% of their usual yield, leaving on the vine what was unfit to harvest. Delacroix got only 30% on most parcels.
This entails rigourous selection by hand. What do they do when they pick by machine? Harvest rotten grapes, or declare an insurance writeoff.
There will not be any Arpège in 2002 : the quality is not good enough.
He makes very disparaging remarks about various wine growing regions and winemakers, including some mentioned here.
163. jexster - 6/12/2003 7:50:41 PM
I searched red because that's what I mostly drink. I searched Napa, Carneros, Sonoma because those are the top CA regions.
I searched Bordeau Burgundy Rhone Beajolais as the best french regions.
I checked classic in one and classic and the next lower category. I checked two price ranges covering 10-26 bucks between them.
I got the results reported.
I have no idea how a broader search returns fewer hits.
And coincidentally the SF Chron's Wednesday wine section has an article on a local vinter doin Rhone style red...again moving away from a rigid varietal approach...
Most vineyards in premier CA regions harvest by Mexican not machine....
164. jexster - 6/12/2003 7:52:04 PM
Beaujolais....beauxjolaix
165. jexster - 6/12/2003 8:01:36 PM
AC...be interested in your comments because outside of Chateau Neuf du Pape I don't know a helluva lot about Rhone wine...
This laissez faire "kind of there" approach to making wine got a big boost one day in 1987 when the wine merchant Lynch arranged for Edmunds to meet French winemaker Francois Peyraud. Edmunds was only in his second year of production; Peyraud was one of his heroes. Peyraud was from Domaine Tempier in Provence, known for its Bandol, an earthy, intense red wine made with the Rhone grape Mourvedre, arguably one of the greatest wines produced from that varietal.
WHEN THE EARTH SPOKE
Edmunds had made some Mourvedre that he was really happy with and wanted Peyraud to try. "When he got to the Mourvedre," Edmunds says, "he stuck his nose in the glass and he absolutely just stopped and stood there for about two minutes. And then very slowly he lowered the glass and his head came up and his eyes rolled back and he took this deep breath and he said, "La terre parle, " the earth speaks. And it was magic, it was a moment when I just felt, 'All right! Finally somebody who gets what I'm trying to do.' "
In that moment, says Edmunds, his winemaking philosophy came into focus. "Suddenly I found a way to think about what I was doing that wasn't so linear and mechanical, so cause and effect. I realized it was more about here," he says, pointing to his heart, "and not here or here," pointing to his mouth and to his head.
This guy uses Syrah
Vintner on a mission
Steve Edmunds makes 4,000 cases a year of brilliant Rhone-style wines, but in a mass-market world, is anybody listening?
What is Rhone style???
166. jexster - 6/12/2003 8:41:34 PM
Beats me how that thing works....as faras i can tell the database records are individual tasting notes...sometimes you get one guy's, then another's then no one's
To check I did a winery search for a winery that my mayoral candidate owns...Plumpjack...all ratings over 90 prices betwn 20-40...Never appeared in any search...
167. alistairConnor - 6/13/2003 5:43:37 AM
Hmmm. Sounds like Wine Spectator could use a wine-loving globetrotting database analyst, to fix up that search... I'll send a CV.
168. alistairConnor - 6/13/2003 6:50:18 AM
What is Rhone style???
Steve Edmunds has got it, no doubt about that... if his stuff can stand tasting against a Vieux Télégraphe (chateauneuf du pape), then he's doing it right.
First, geography : hot summers, plenty of sun, variety of soil types : generally clay/limestone, alluvial, or granite.
Then the varieties : Syrah, Grenache, Mourvèdre are the most common in reds (There are others, at least a dozen)
Roussanne, Marsanne and Viognier in whites, again, there is a long list of "minor" varieties.
The key element is that the wines are always a blend of at least two varieties. This is required by law.
The "generic" Côtes du Rhône is generally majority Grenache and the rest Syrah. A given Chateauneuf will typically have five or six varieties, out of the dozen authorised.
169. jexster - 6/13/2003 11:17:19 AM
Thanks! I should look for his wines...when I have a sou or tou
170. jexster - 6/15/2003 2:11:11 PM
Trois Buque Chuque?
Takin my life in my own hands, a bottle of Vin de Pays Vaucluse $2.99....stomach pumps standby
171. alistairconnor - 6/15/2003 5:41:31 PM
Wine tasting at lunch on Saturday was very successful... no duds out of the half dozen I proposed. The wine waiter friend is very enthusiastic. Here are his tasting notes :
(I guess I should translate them. Can't be any harder than Proust)
COTES DU RHONE SEGURET 2001
Rouge soutenu aux reflets violets
Assez aromatique, agréables notes de fruits rouges mûrs
Frais et fruité, tannins fondus, finale poivrée
Garde moyenne, viandes blanches rôties ou viandes rouges
LES BAUX DE PROVENCE Mas de Gourgonnier 2000
Rouge soutenu aux nuances grenat-violet
Nez agréable, fin et fruité marqué par la réglisse
Frais, tannins présents mais fins et fondus, fruité avec une pointe anisée et mentholée
Garde de cinq ans, viandes en sauce, canard
VIN DE PAYS DU GARD Cuvée Arpèges 2001
rouge soutenu
aromatique et fin, fruité mûr
ensemble souple, fruité et épicé, assez charnu
prêt à boire, garde de trois ans, charcuteries, viandes blanches
CABARDES Ch. Pons Loupia 2001
rouge soutenu, violet
très aromatique, nez floral et fruité intense, senteurs de crème de cassis et de mandarine confite
frais, souple et gouleyant, beau fruité avec une petite touche de violette
prêt à boire entre 12 et 15 ° avec des viandes blanches et volailles grillées, charcuterie peu relevée
VACQUEYRAS Montirius 1999
rouge grenat soutenu
aromatique, fruits rouges mûrs, senteurs de garrigue
frais, fruité, tannins assez fermes, ensemble corsé typique de l’AOC
viandes rouges et petit gibier, garde moyenne
COTES DU RHONE Domaine Roche Buissière 2000 Le Claux
robe rouge soutenue, légèrement grenat
aromatique et fin, nez de tabac, note animale avant aération évoluant vers les fruits rouges mûrs
fruité, beaux tannins encore un peu fermes, finale épicée
garder deux à quatre ans, petit gibier à plumes, canard
172. jexster - 6/15/2003 6:41:05 PM
Splain somethin AC...
I never have understood this tasting lingo..."fruity taste of pears with a hint of aspargus, flinty whiff of formaldehyde"
That last no joke..I heard it on Wine Country Living.
Do these terms have any meaning to anyone?
173. jexster - 6/15/2003 6:41:55 PM
quand on dit <
aromatique et fin, nez de tabac, note animale avant aération évoluant vers les fruits rouges mûrs
fruité, beaux tannins encore un peu fermes, finale épicée
garder deux à quatre ans, petit gibier à plumes, canard>>
Can you imagine the taste?
174. alistairconnor - 6/29/2003 10:01:26 AM
Terrible neglect. Open questions :
** The vocabulary is pretty much normalised, and objective. A taster may miss some of the components, but generally if one says "tobacco" or "preserved mandarin", then another taster will have a good chance of finding the same thing in an independent tasting.
Pears, asparagus, flint, formaldehyde : an experienced taster may well discern all this in a wine. This can be confirmed by chemical analysis, the phenols and whatnot which characterise the taste of pears or asparagus will actually be present in the wine, or something close enough to fool the palate.
** Now, can I imagine the taste? No, I'm not experienced enough. However, that description helps me to remember the taste of the wine. I found the nose unpleasant on first opening (the animal note I guess) but it soon passed. I remember the tannins, and the spice.
Again, an experienced wine taster will build a mental picture of the wine from this description; and will be able to determine whether it's a style that they are likely to like or not.
I intend to learn how to describe wines myself. For the moment, I'm pretty sure that I could identify wines that I know and like in a blind test (for example, the Séguret or the Cabardès among the six above), but I'm sure any wine lover can do that. Learning to understand a description is a good starting point on the road to learning to describe. You can't learn how to write until you can read.
175. alistairconnor - 6/29/2003 10:04:41 AM
To come back to Ranheim's comment :
Drink the wines that YOU like!! Forget what "experts" advise.
Sure. But an expert should only be describing, not advising. If you can take on board the vocabulary they are using, and recognise some of the stuff they talk about in the wine you drink, then you will be able to get some useful information out of wine reviews, and you'll be more likely to find the stuff you like.
But it's like art : you don't have to know anything about it to appreciate it.
176. alistairconnor - 6/29/2003 10:18:04 AM
To get back to the fragmented narrative, continuing from Message # 162 :
Michel Delacroix used to make an organic "Côtes du Rhône Primeur". This is a wine made straight after harvest, and released in November, in much the same way as Beaujolais Nouveau. I make a face when he tells me this : the only ones I've ever tasted have been frankly pretty awful, I had pegged the whole thing as a marketing gimmick.
But no, he said, his had been excellent, at least everyone, professional and consumer, had said so. And from a cash flow point of view, it's a winning formula : you get your money very quickly, no slow-fermented, barrel-aged capital tied up in the cellars for a couple of years.
So why did he stop, a couple of years ago? Basically he decided the grapes deserved better, I think. So he took an enormous income hit during the year when he had very little wine to sell (the previous harvest having been sold as primeur), and tax and social security to pay from the previous, big-income year.
Curmudgeon, misanthrope, temperamental, idealist. I like him a lot.
177. alistairconnor - 6/29/2003 10:26:20 AM
On Sunday morning, he takes me to have a look at a few parcels of vine. This is Grenache, I think, a couple of years old. He is explaining his technique for training the vine, which involves a couple of wires which can be raised now that the young shoots are spreading horizontally, in order to direct them vertically. This his stuff he learned from an unnamed oenologist he refers to as his guru. "The wind must go frrrrrrr through the vine!" he is saying. Something like that.
178. alistairconnor - 6/29/2003 10:34:40 AM
This is his favourite parcel, Merlot, the backbone of Arpèges. Magnificent microclimate, with this south-facing hunk of rock behind it, to warm the night and keep it free of frosts.
He took me up onto the plateau above the village, where he has a lot of vines which have recently been classed as Côtes du Rhône, meaning he can increase his production under this appellation, instead of selling it as Vin du Pays. This sort of stuff is bitterly fought over, there is much resentment when one village is "in" and its neighbour, just as good apparently, is "out"... The days of bribery and political influence are over in this respect, you need to present a very solid dossier, with guarantees of quality and typicity, to obtain a revision of the AOC boundaries.
Although my camera was full, he insisted that I should photograph this ladybird. Coccinelle in French, or "Bête à Bon Dieu" because they always go upwards.
179. alistairconnor - 6/29/2003 10:38:33 AM
CORRECTION : the parcel with the rock in Message # 178 is Cabernet, not Merlot. You could care less? Well, go ahead.
And that's the end of Wine Weekend number two (WWII?)
180. alistairconnor - 6/29/2003 11:07:39 AM
Fast forward a couple of weeks, and here's WWIII.
I have the kids on board this time. Delicate chemistry : this is a holiday, they have to be happy. I will try to get some serious drinking done without jeapordising this.
We leave about 10pm Wednesday night, 7 May. We've got a four-day weekend, and I want to cover a lot of ground.
I drive till I drop (about midnight), and park the van outside the cemetary of Montelimar, on the principle that the neighbours will not keep us awake. The kids are already sleeping in the back anyway.
We are in the same territory as for the previous trip, on the way to much further afield. Thursday morning, I phone a couple of the winemakers who couldn't receive me the previous time, and get lucky with one of them : Montirius. The site gives a wealth of detail about the wines, varieties, soils, history and whatnot.
Among the big names of the southern Rhône, Chateauneuf du Pape is the appellation which towers over the others. The second tier is composed of Gigondas and Vacqueyras.
There are only two organic makers of Vacqueyras : I have been buying wine from the other one for years. Montirius is the other, and they also do Gigondas.
The vineyard has been in the family for five generations, and here we have a typical example of how this works. French vineyards in their overwhelming majority are family businesses. There are exceptions : nearly all of the famous wines are owned by companies, because in general a family can't cut it financially at that level; likewise, at the low end, high-acreage bulk-wine operations tend to be companies too.
181. alistairconnor - 6/29/2003 11:20:42 AM
Until 50 years ago, the Saurels were basically peasants, unmechanised, producing rustic wines in the traditional manner, as was the case pretty much all over France. Then in the post-war glory years, they modernised, and started applying chemicals, to increase yields and save labour. But in 1980, the father of the current winemaker stopped the chemical fertilisers, because he didn't like what was happening to the land...
Eric Saurel, having got a degree in winemaking from Bordeaux, and his wife Christine, take over from his dad in the late 80s. Following their instincts, they used less and less chemicals, and eventually went full-on biodynamic in the late 90s.
They have made a huge investment in a complete, modern winemaking facility -- previously, the wine had been made at the local co-op.
Here are Eric, Christine and their youngest, Marius.
The name "Montirius" is an invention, made of bits of the names of their three children, Manon, Justine and Marius.
(Meanwhile, my kids are running riot all over the estate. Well, shall we say quiet riot. Eric and Christine don't bat an eye. I like that.)
The facility is brand-new. The volume of the vats is determined by a day's picking : each day's worth of harvest will be fermented separately, this gives great flexibility with respect to picking dates (optimum maturity), and also opens up infinite possibilities for assembling the wines.
In large part, the wine vats have not been used yet, due to low yields in 2002 ... Oh yeah, rot? I asked. No, they say : the problem was a cold spring, which meant that the flowering went poorly, and there were 40% less bunches of grapes. Yes, they had suffered from the heavy rains during the harvest period; no, they had no rot.
182. alistairconnor - 6/29/2003 11:32:40 AM
Yes, their neighbours had rot : one had a total writeoff. How come?
A student is writing her thesis on the subject. She took samples of Syrah grapes from Montirius, and samples from adjacent, non-organic parcels, and examined them under an electron microscope, among other things. It seems there are some striking differences, particularly with respect to the continuity of the skin, and the regularity of the cell structure. I asked if there were photos available, but the work hasn't been published yet... I'll let you know.
However, those 2002 grapes were rather cold and watery... Conventional wisdom is that you chuck in some yeast to get the fermentation started, if not every year, at least in a difficult year like this, on principle. No, say the Saurels, we'll just wait till the natural fermentation starts...
Three days later... no sign of fermentation. Friends are begging them to use yeast... Is that a whiff of acetic acid? You've built the world's most expensive vinegar factory!
But they hang on... thinking about the loan repayments, and sweating...
And on the fifth day, the natural fermentation started.
183. alistairconnor - 6/29/2003 11:51:41 AM
Eric Saurel, with the Dentelles de Montmirail in the background.
So what about the wines?
They have an excellent Vacqueyras Rosé, very gras (phat?) and a Grenache/Roussane white which I like a lot, these are micro-wines, they just make a few cases for the pleasure.
The business is in the red Vacqueyras and the Gigondas...
OK - so how are the wines?
[to be continued...]
184. PelleNilsson - 6/29/2003 2:27:52 PM
Keep going alistair. I don't understand a lot but it's quite interesting.
185. alistairconnor - 6/29/2003 5:11:17 PM
I find I have no labels to scan. I'll have to steal them off the internet.
This is the main wine, 70% Grenache, 30% Syrah. To be honest, this was the wine that my wine expert liked least out of the six we tasted -- and it's easily the most expensive. Though in truth he warmed to it as the bottle went on. I liked it very well. This wine is made with old vines, fairly typical of the appellation.
There is a second Vacqueyras, the "Clos Montirius", 
This is a parcel they bought, and built their house (and now their winery) on. It's surrounded by woods, so isolated from other, non-organic parcels, and has a particularly favourable micro-climate. However, the vines are young, and it seemed to me that I could taste that... I prefer old vines, but it's really a matter of taste.
And... the Gigondas. 80% Grenache, 20% Mourvèdre, that most difficult of Rhône varieties.
Is this an "Anglo-Saxon" wine? Is it made to measure to please nosy Parker and the Wine Spectator? In any case, it doesn't grab me by the collar and scream "Gigondas!" at me, like my favourite (non-organic) Gigondas does. It scored 94/100 on the Wine Spectator. Which, for the price, is a very, very good score.
I just came across this site, a Florida wine merchant had much the same experience as me, and describes the wines better.
186. PelleNilsson - 6/30/2003 1:58:58 AM
Keep going alistair. I don't understand a lot but it's quite interesting.
187. Time - 6/30/2003 2:08:32 AM
Keep going alistair.
I don't know how you fit those round bottles into your scanner, but it's quite interesting.
188. alistairconnor - 6/30/2003 4:49:16 PM
We picnic in the woods, and head south down the Rhône valley through the hottest part of the day. Stop at Tarascon, for ice creams and the imposing castle. 
Another old castle on Rhone
... and head west into Languedoc, the coastal region between the Rhone and the Spanish border. Next stop : Pézenas, between Montpellier and Béziers. When I stop to get detailed instructions from the next wineman, my phone card runs out before I get all the details.
Oh well, I know it's called Château du Parc, I'm sure to see a sign... I'm not expecting an actual château, that's just a fancy name to put on the bottles.
I get to a village, sure I've gone too far. Come to think of it, we did go through a sort of a park... there was an old stone wall with a broken arch over the top, and then the same thing a couple of miles further, when we drove out the other side. Having quizzed the natives, yes, the winemaker lives in the ... château in the middle of the park.
Arnaud L'Epine is his name, and his grandmother lives in the château, she's pushing 100.
He and his family live out the back, in what were formerly, if I understood correctly, the Duke of Montmorency's kennels.
For this here Château du Parc is an actual hunting lodge, created around 1550 by the Duke, who was the viceroy or whatever of the Languedoc. Being stuck in Pézenas most of the year, he had this weekend getaway pad. The old wall surrounds fields and forests which constituted his game reserve. Distinguished guests of course, including Louis XIII and XIV, and Molière.
As far as I know, the L'Epines are not direct descendants of the Montmorency, but Arnaud is clearly to the manor born. Affable. Common touch and all that.
189. jexster - 7/9/2003 11:11:31 PM
AC - The Red Burgundy Wine List at Jardiniere, one of SF's best and priciest tables....
Comments?
Clos Vougeot (LOVE IT!) Gevrey, Pommard, Beaune etc
190. jexster - 7/13/2003 12:57:04 PM
Drunken Goat
From the village of Jumilla in the Murcia region of Spain, Drunken Goat is a semi-soft artisan goat cheese with a smooth violet rind which has been soaked in Double Pasta wine for 48-72 hrs. Aged about 75 days, it has a sweet, smooth flavor.
It is most unusual, and in fact it is very difficult to find. The name Drunken Goat conjures up images of goats weaving about the pasture… perhaps even snoozing on their backs with their hooves pointed to the blue sky. But just in case you were wondering… wine, beer, or any other form of spirits are not fed to the goats. Rather the cheese is soaked in wine. The flavor begins as mild and sooo creamy, but finishes with a wonderful tangy sweetness and a fruity, lusciously, grapey aroma.
You can find on Castro Street...Rossi's
191. Magoseph - 7/13/2003 1:05:44 PM
In my view, no Spanish cheese can beat the Montrachet, Jex. Are you boycotting French products now?
192. judithathome - 7/13/2003 1:11:31 PM
In my opinion, goat cheese by any name is not that great. I just can't develop a taste for it...unless Feta is goat cheese.
193. Magoseph - 7/13/2003 1:19:30 PM
It is made from goat milk, I think, Juds.
194. Magoseph - 7/13/2003 1:29:54 PM
The smaller one is my favorites. It's called Fromage de Pyrenees
I won't look at the price. It probably would make me sick.
195. jexster - 7/13/2003 1:59:28 PM
Mais NON, except for Lavirot and Pont L'eveque!
I just love that one....
Drunken Goat used to go for 5 bucks/# now tres populaire at $8
Making the world safe again for French Fries.
196. jexster - 7/13/2003 2:00:27 PM
Besides soaked in wine, its on topic and the finish will put you in mind of the vineyard at crush time.
197. ranheim - 7/15/2003 7:29:55 PM
Somewhat off topic - BUT my daughter came back recently from a 4+ month trip to New Zealand and Australia.
She particularly remembers one vineyard : Vasse Felix. It is located south of Perth (Margaret River, I believe). She dined at a wonderful restaurant (which had a great view) at the vineyard and drank a few (her memory is foggy so it was more than a few!); both reds and whites. This past weekend, I tasted my first bottle of a Vasse Felix wine (a shiraz). It was pricey (about $30) and not aged enough (a 2001); but, it was very good.
198. Penny - 7/16/2003 7:30:03 AM
re 193 -I think feta is made from sheep(s).
Goat cheese is awful in Australia, but delicous, I think, in France - it is so varied, and comes at all levels of dryness. I like the crumbly dried out little rounds best.
199. Magoseph - 7/16/2003 7:37:39 AM
I like the crumbly dried out little rounds best.
Those are my favorites. They were called "tomes" if I remember correctly. You're correct about the Feta cheese. I like it in a Greek salad.
200. jexster - 7/17/2003 2:31:20 PM
Outside of college binges on Mateus(!) [Mah-tay-us, Bill Murray, SNL], I know nothing about Portuguese wine....
This from today's Wine Section, SF Chron:
Portugal is finally figuring out how to create beautiful wines
201. jexster - 7/17/2003 2:32:53 PM
I exaggerate...that 100 year old port & stilton at the Hong Kong Club was rather nice
202. Magoseph - 7/17/2003 3:15:26 PM
I wouldn't mind the old port from whatever provenance but the Stilton, no. Roquefort is better.
203. alistairConnor - 7/21/2003 7:30:06 AM
Oh lord. Stilton is what I like best about England.
Perhaps the only thing I like about England?
In fact I would put it at the head of my Top 10 of great blue cheeses. The NZ blue of my childhood next. Then Laqueille, when you can find a really good one (don't even try, it's hard enough for me). Then Roquefort.
To get back on topic : one of the great "strong" cheeses, perhaps the greatest, is Epoisses, affiné au marc
(from Burgundy, a soft cow cheese aged with brandy)
204. alistairConnor - 7/21/2003 7:32:00 AM
ranheim : I've never been to Perth (it's an extraordinarily out-of-the-way place) but I have done some memorable tasting around Adelaide and in New South Wales. There is definite bang for the buck in the aussie reds.
205. ranheim - 7/23/2003 2:39:52 PM
alistair
Is there something about Sydney at Christmas time? My daughter was staying, in the main, at "youth hostels". They all laughed at her, in addition to being rude. Everything was booked up!!
She got hacked off and flew to Perth. And had a great time at the vineyards in that area.
206. wonkers2 - 7/25/2003 12:08:36 PM
After trying a single bottle last week, I just picked up a case of an honest, red table wine featured currently at Whole Foods for $5.99 a bottle, less 10% by the case:
Rioja Vega Tinto
2002
Embotellado por Vinedos de Muerza
Viana Espana
207. alistairconnor - 7/26/2003 8:54:39 AM
Righto, back to the narrative, last seen in Message # 188 ...
So, the Château du Parc is the real thing. What about the wines?
The main product is the Coteaux du Languedoc, red. 
Very sound wine. It will cost you about $15 in the US : I wouldn't say it's widely available, but L'Epine is an exporter, rather than a sell-at-the-vineyard type.
There is also a special cuvée for Marks and Spencer's, the UK chain store. They send their own winemaker to supervise (he's a New Zealander apparently) and you can get it for £4.99.
208. alistairconnor - 7/26/2003 9:06:21 AM
These wines are a blend of Mourvèdre, Grenache and Syrah.
He also makes various varietals (sold as Vin de pays d'Oc), principally Syrah and Cabernet Sauvignon
(also a Grenache Blanc which I found delicious)
Discussion about terroir : L'Epine tells me that a few years ago, he started treating his vines harshly, to make them work harder. Every year, he uses a special machine, a sort of fork that thrusts deep under the vine, cutting half of its roots and lifting it somewhat. This apparently stimulates the vine, forcing it to send its roots deeper. Since he started applying this method, the characteristic taste of his particular terroir has become much more apparent... It's present in all the wines, but quite unmistakeable in the Cab. Sauv. I know what he's talking about, tasting the wine, but I'm struggling to put a name on it... He gives me ten seconds... Busy man... then gives me the answer.
It's cinnamon.
209. alistairconnor - 7/26/2003 9:14:34 AM
Historical notes :
Pézenas was the seat of the dukes of Montmorency, governors of Languedoc. Being stuck in this relative backwater most of the year, they had this hunting lodge built a few miles out of town, and entertained in fine style. Many illustrious guests, including the great Molière, a native of Pézenas, and his boss Louis XIV.
The advantage of owning the whole hunting park, with a wall around it (most of it is forest) is that L'Epine has no immediate neighbours practising chemical viticulture. So his organic grapes are quite untainted.
210. alistairconnor - 7/26/2003 9:22:59 AM
(Brief and inconclusive visit to the seaside... a promise to the kids... cool and windy. Silly place to park the van overnight, as it turns out : we were on the main drag between Agde and Sète, which runs alongside the beach, and it was a holiday night... the traffic never stopped. Didn't stop the kids from sleeping. Nothing does. But vroom, vroom, with just the thin canvas walls of the pop-up on top of the van between me and the road... Every time a truck went past, a few feet away, the van rocked.)
Next day : Trotte, trotte, camionette jaune, pour aller à Carcassonne.
211. alistairconnor - 7/26/2003 11:59:16 AM
The appellation Cabardès is deployed in an arc to the west, north and east (somewhat) of Carcassonne.
It's only been an AOC since 1999, and many serious drinkers are only just becoming aware of its existence.
What is unique is that it is on the cusp of Mediterranean and Atlantic climatic influences : the sun of the south, the temperate influence of the ocean, and the winds from all points of the compass; and at the meeting point of the Southwest/Bordeaux varieties and those of the Rhone and the Midi.
This is reflected in the allowed varieties that go into making a Cabardès wine : required is 40% minimum of Merlot, Cabernet Sauvignon and/or Cabernet Franc, 40% minimum of Syrah and/or Grenache.
Etymologically, the Cabardès is the fief of the lords of a now ruined castle called Cabaret.
Come taste the wine...
212. alistairconnor - 7/26/2003 12:17:42 PM
Of the couple of dozen makers of Cabardès, two are organic.
First up : Château de Brau. It is claimed that the owners have been farming here, father to son, since... the Neolithic. Hard to verify independently. In any case, the father of the current winemaker was a peasant farmer, who made wine along with his other productions. In a common pattern, the next generation took over with the intention of turning it into a full-time occupation with a reasonable income. This means acquisition of extra land and planting, modernisation of equipment and methods, and, in their case, conversion to organic.
Gabriel and Wenny Tari studied law and archaeology, and look where it led them...
Wenny is Flemish, which is handy for export... speaks at least five languages, as they all do up there.
Gabriel's father had planted a lot of Carignan, a variety which has gone out of fashion, and been eliminated from the AOC. Rather than rip it out and re-plant, they re-grafted it with cabernet. Very labour-intensive, but it gives you an instant "old" vine, since it's the age of the rootstock that makes the quality.
They have geared up for quantity, they now have 30 Ha of vines.
The wines :
A wooded chardonnay which they can keep (or rather, which they can export to places where they like the taste of the wood)
Another white "vin de pays d'Oc", made with roussane, that I liked a lot. Rather apricot.
The main wines : Cabardès red "cuvée Chateau", didn't leave a strong impression.
Cuvée Exquise : this is good. Aged in used oak.
213. alistairconnor - 7/26/2003 12:40:36 PM
Next stop, along the road in Pennautier.
Jean-Claude Loupia went organic back in the seventies. His daughter Nathalie, and her husband, have continued in something close to the peasant tradition.
They only have 7 ha of vines. They would like to buy more if they could, but they are not going to go all industrial on me.
The 2002 vintage, which was so wet in the Rhone valley, was problematic in a different way here : a cold spring affected the flowering ("coulure"), and reduced yields by about 20%.
They have almost exclusively Merlot and Syrah, if I understood correctly. Their main wine, Cabardès "Domaine Loupia"
is mostly Merlot, about 65%, though this varies from year to year, and it's a marvel. This is the one my expert found notes of violets in. I feel guilty for paying so little for this wine, I think it was less that 5 euros.
"Cuvée tradition", much the same wine but aged in wood,
and I do believe I liked it less. Perhaps the violets don't like wood.
They have a micro-brew, Cuvée des Hautes Pierres,
which is 70% Syrah.
They do export a little, but they prefer to sell as much as they can at the cellar door, where they have enough margin to just about make a living off their small quantities.
So don't expect to find it in the shops.
214. alistairconnor - 7/26/2003 12:52:28 PM
Here's Nathalie showing me the vines :
Next we trotted off to Carcassonne. The girls had been very good, but didn't find wine cellars always as entertaining as I did. Here is a visit that made everyone happy.
I suppose this must be the standard snapshot. It seemed the obvious one to me :
This young fellow is being ticked off by his dad for chasing my daughters with a battleaxe. He would have had a nastier surprise if he'd caught them.
After visiting the wonderful Cité and dining in a restaurant downtown, we decided to stay the night on the castle's carpark. Certainly a whole lot calmer than the beach.
215. ronski - 7/27/2003 11:02:13 PM
Stilton and roquefort are are course both blues, but the resemblance stops there.
With a gun to my head, I would admit that I prefer the latter, with all its richness.
But the former offers its own delights, and, for those who care, is vegan.
216. Penny - 7/28/2003 4:50:20 AM
It's stilton for me. It's cheaper too.
Alistair, for all of the above, thanks, it's great. I didn't find the organic wine book at the 2 organic shops near me in the 14th, and going into a FNAC makes me very bad tempered... (Im drinking "bubbly" right now, left over from our quart. juill. party)(In Australia)(loosened my fingers)
We have had a few years of drought here in OZ. Some wine "experts" say it has reduced the quality of the (red?) wine, but I heard a wine maker say it just changed the character of the wine, not necessarily for the worse. What do you think?
217. alistairConnor - 7/28/2003 5:07:36 AM
Ah, that I could not say Penny... I don't drink Aus reds. Not much call for it round here. (cue the Monty Python cheese shop sketch)
Climate change is a worry, and an especially huge one for Australia. But I'm sure that they'll adapt, there being not much in the way of tradition to prevent whatever changes in methods and styles may prove necessary.
But yes, surely the character must change. It stands to reason.
At least, if the change is fairly uniform and permanent, they have that advantage over Western Europe, where the huge climate difference from year to year presents such a challenge.
218. alistairConnor - 7/28/2003 5:11:44 AM
Do you have any wine-drinking to report from your French trip, Penny?
219. Penny - 7/28/2003 7:23:27 AM
Not really, a lot of the time it was Kir in bars, Beer in bars, and nice wine in some restaurants/brasseries which I can't remember at the moment. (I'm better at remembering food in detail).
But I remember a chardonnay type wine in the Lot, in a nice restaurant in a little village near Cazals,(it would have been local). Also a white wine called Jasnieres which I have liked a lot the last couple of years I had it in a restaurant in a village on La Sarthe (Fille), but it was disappointing this time, too old maybe? it was 2001 I think.
220. alistairConnor - 7/28/2003 7:56:56 AM
Jasnieres eh? Well I've learned something today. Just looked it up : Chenin Blanc from the Touraine. Might check it out next month, I'll be over that way, but there don't seem to be any organic makers...
The Chardonnay was probly a "vin de pays", nothing wrong with that. There are no AOC chardonnays down in the Lot.
Down that way, I like Gaillac whites, they are a complex mix of local varieties.
221. alistairConnor - 7/28/2003 8:02:34 AM
It says here that the most remarkable quality of Jasnières is its ability to age for decades, or even a century, while improving all the time... Maybe you hit a bad year.
222. Penny - 7/29/2003 7:28:35 AM
Good to know about the gaillac wines, thanks.
The restaurant in Fille (no accents on this keyboard) where we have the Jasnieres looks out over the Sarthe, it's a really pretty river here, and I think the food is surprisingly good and interesting for a modest place. Tres correct, you know the sort of thing.
We go au Mans (about 15 kms away) quite a bit when we are in France because there is a really good huge brocante there once a month.
223. alistairConnor - 7/29/2003 11:57:05 AM
Last night, my elder daughter's 10th birthday, we cracked a bottle from 1993 on principle. It was a minor Burgundy, a Santenay, and not good enough to be worth keeping that long. But still OK.
Taking stock in the cellar last weekend, I realised that I've got quite a few odds and ends that are far too old. I've been a bit anal retentive, keeping stuff which is past its use-by date. Time to clear it out.
So last night I also opened a bottle of Chardonnay, a Chassagne Montrachet, from 1989. Tasted OK, rather honeyed, it went fine with the dessert. I urged all to drink it quickly, but several people found that it was no good at all twenty minutes later. You get this with too-old wines, you really have to knock them off quick once they're opened.
224. Macnas - 7/29/2003 11:58:52 AM
Why is that?
225. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 7/30/2050 1:17:08 PM
Alistair FYI Dept. ROBERT PARKER, Wine critic on tonight's Charlie Rose
226. arkymalarky - 7/30/2050 3:34:00 PM
We have friends who have an art studio in Eureka Springs, and we visited them while I was up there for a conference a few weeks ago and they said Arkansas has a new wine company that is supposed to be pretty good, and they had tried some they liked--Chardonnay, I think. Weideker has been the only big wine company here for years, and it's generally agreed that it's not very good. I've never cared for it, but I don't know if that's because it's popular to dis it here and I've been influenced by that, or if it really is crap.
Lots of people make wine here from the variety of berries we have, especially elderberry, but people grow grapes for wine even here in the southern less hilly part of the state.
227. wabbit - 8/2/2003 11:45:50 PM
test
228. arkymalarky - 8/3/2003 8:42:19 PM
For the first time ever I poured out a bottle of wine. It literally stank going down the sink. It was Coastal Ridge Sauvignon Blanc, 1999.
229. alistairConnor - 8/4/2003 12:08:42 PM
Oh humbug. The Charlie Rose page wouldn't load for me the other day, and now it's been archived.
230. jexster - 8/13/2003 3:13:09 PM
AC...
Flashback Clos des Mouches Blanc, Drouhin. When M & Mme. Dumaine feted my grandfather and me at Hotel de la Cote D'or, they chose this wine. Believe it or not, though I was only 10 at the time, I have near total recall of the event, and of having to haul a case back for my father, all by myself, flight change, layover, and a strict charge not to screw this up...don't lose it, don't drop it,get the wine to your dad. Sheesh.
CM is to my taste & limited experience, an exceptional white wine but it is fairly rare in the US. I have seen it occasionally in wine shops here and in NYC and purchased a couple of times. No doubt there are other and perhaps better wines with which to illustrate the differences of winemaking styles and superiority of French whites over CA Chardonnay's, but if I were to set a tasting to demonstrate, Clos des Mouches would be my Freedom choice and perhaps a Chateau St. Jean, Clos Pegasse, or Lewis Chardonnay, the Californian.
What do you know of this?
231. alistairconnor - 8/13/2003 5:02:55 PM
Just looked it up... 85% of Drouhin's wines are exported. So I have no shame in confessing that I don't know them.
What can I say? That as Chardonnays go, Beaune and Beaune Premier Cru represent the top of my price range, and the best value for money... and wines that can be really seriously improved by oak, rather than just acquiring a cute vanilla flavour.
232. alistairconnor - 8/13/2003 5:15:21 PM
The week after next, I will be in the Bordeaux region. Camping with the kids. There are about a dozen organic winemakers I would like to visit, but I would settle for half of that number. The trip has been planned for a couple of months, but I'm in a quandary: due to the heat wave, which basically started in June, the harvest is the earliest in history, and will probably be in full swing, or even winding down, when I get there. In such circumstances, a chatty enthusiastic amateur is the last thing these guys need...
233. PelleNilsson - 8/14/2003 1:08:41 AM
It's amazing what power a single person can wield.
BORDEAUX: Accusations of skulduggery in the wine cellars here have stirred a chauvinism-tinged debate over a million-dollar American nose and its influence over determining what is a truly great French wine.
The nose belongs to Robert Parker, a mild-mannered Maryland lawyer who, for two decades, has been the most influential wine taster in the world.
Parker has not yet come here to taste the wine this year, ostensibly because of the trans-Atlantic tension over the war in Iraq.
[......]
Each spring, Parker, 57, travels to Bordeaux to sample the wine from the previous autumn's harvest while it is aging in casks in the winemakers' cellars. He grades the wines on a schoolmasterish 100-point scale and publishes the results in The Wine Advocate.
His nose is insured for $1 million because huge sums of money depend on his olfactory skills: The difference between Parker grades of 90 and 95 can mean as much as $10 a bottle for a vineyard producing 300,000 bottles of wine a year.
[......]
Parker's absence from the spring tasting threw the market for high-end Bordeaux wine into disarray, particularly hurting the smaller vineyards that have come to rely on his reviews to spur sales. Many of these vineyards have sold less than half of their 2002 vintage; with the help of a good Parker review, all that wine would normally have been sold by now.
Accusations of skulduggery at Bordeaux vineyards
234. alistairConnor - 8/14/2003 3:59:27 AM
It's rather overstating the case to say that the current disarray in Bordeaux prices results from Parker's absence. The whole Iraq war love/hate match between France and the US has been much more influential; US buyers in general have been circumspect, because demand for French wines is down in the US. (It's quite likely that Parker's no-show was simply pandering to US chauvinism at a delicate time.)
But I most certainly agree that it's absurd that one guy's tastes should have as much influence as they do.
In any case, considering that a major part of Parker's aura is his alleged incorruptibility, I can't really see that he can continue working with this Agostini woman, who keeps his diary in France, and has evidently being selling his address book.
235. alistairConnor - 8/14/2003 4:05:54 AM
Because of the weather, ripeness and sugar content are exceptional all over France. In general, quantities are down because of the lack of water, so the juice is concentrated... All the conditions are right for an excellent vintage, and there's a good chance of a really great one.
SO... with prices being generally somewhat depressed because of demand being down... I will risk a recommendation... this would be the year to invest in wines "en primeur" (you pay for the wines before they are made, you just pay tax and shipping when they are sent out a couple of years later). The major producers in Bordeaux and Burgundy offer this possibility
236. jayackroyd - 8/14/2003 9:07:38 AM
Any good wine store, in the Northeast anyway, will do this for you. Last time I did it was for a case each of Lynch Bages and Lalande Pichon of the 1986 vintage. That was a good investment.
237. alistairconnor - 9/8/2003 5:41:25 PM
I drank twenty-one bottles of Bordeaux tonight.
No : I have drunk from 21 bottles of Bordeaux tonight.
Um. Bottles. Drunken. Bordeaux. 21.
238. judithathome - 9/8/2003 5:43:36 PM
I know this isn't the Scotch thread but what is a good scotch? I mean, a nice one for someone's birthday present. Someone you reeeeally like!
239. marjoribanks - 9/8/2003 5:45:24 PM
Ha.
Mebbe you can rename this thread (temporarily) WineBlotto.
240. alistairconnor - 9/8/2003 5:54:31 PM
Laphroiagh (sp?)
Lagavulin
Talisker
Take your pick, Judith.
Marj : It was all in the line of duty. Now I must document my research.
241. alistairconnor - 9/8/2003 6:15:00 PM
Alain, my tame oenologist. 
Count 'em, 21.
242. rdbrewer - 9/8/2003 7:26:18 PM
The cat in the corner really makes that picture.
243. judithathome - 9/8/2003 7:33:32 PM
He looks possessed.
244. alistairConnor - 9/9/2003 3:29:18 AM
She is the daemon of the household. Spirit of place embodied.
245. alistairconnor - 9/20/2003 5:27:20 PM
Alright. I'm going to disrupt the chronological flow of the road-movie narrative -- last seen in Message # 214, and dating from May -- and fast forward to Bordeaux, which is already three weeks old.
It turns out that the blazing-hot summer has posed all sorts of problems for winegrowers. In the Bordeaux region, they got a lot of hail, which due to its very localised random nature, damaged some parcels and spared others. The general rain deficit makes the grapes smaller, with tough skins. Those that cut the leaves back to expose the grapes (rare among organic growers), saw them burnt by the sun. Rain in mid July stimulated the stunted vegetation, making the vines sprout fresh green leaves like springtime, and even new bunches of grapes, as in this photo.
246. alistairconnor - 9/20/2003 5:42:07 PM
We spent a week camping north of Bordeaux, and knocked off eight winemakers from my hit list of ten. 
(that's not an outsized halo behind my daughter's head, it's the neighbour's satellite dish.)
247. alistairconnor - 9/20/2003 6:12:58 PM
First stop was Paul and Pascale Barre's place at Fronsac. We're on the north bank of the Dordogne here, about fifty km north-east of Bordeaux, just west of Saint Emilion.
I was received by Paul and their intern, who's doing a BTS (two years post-high school diploma) in wine commerce, at Carcassonne. 
They have three main wines (a fourth one, a micro-brew with a horrendous price, I didn't even consider.
I'll refer to Alain's notes about them :
Aux Caudelayres, Fronsac 2001 :
Deep red, violet. Aromatic, rustic, tannic, ripe fruit. Very angular, acerbic.
He was quite offended by. Reckoned it shouldn't be allowed to carry the name of Fronsac, the AOC committee should exclude it. I think he's being harsh, but it certainly wasn't near the standard of the other two. To be fair, it was much cheaper.
Château La Grave, Fronsac 2001 : Very deep red, violet, limpid. Aromatic, fine, violets, liquorice, floral, original. Fresh, fruity, bois fondu (literally : melted wood. Meaning that the wine has had time to digest the tannins of the oak.) Supple ensemble. Wine for thirst. Grilled meats. (He actually said it would be a good barbecue wine, but thought that might sound disparaging). Can be cellared for four years. Retails for about 12 euros.
Third wine : Château La Fleur Cailleau. Canon Fronsac 2001.
Canon Fronsac is the hill in the middle of the Fronsac appellation, and the wines are generally a cut above the Fronsac.
Very deep red, violet. Not very aromatic, fresh, terroir, fine but still closed. Fresh and tannic, fruity, very firm tannins, terroir.
Ragouts. Should be decanted. Can be cellared for six years.
248. PelleNilsson - 9/27/2003 10:47:00 AM
Sedish company makes money in French vineyards.
Gilbert Michaud drove his car past the stone church of Bergères-sous-Montmirail, crossed a field of grazing sheep and stopped in a vineyard - to admire an oil well.
"That's my favorite well," said Michaud, the district manager for Lundin Petroleum, ignoring green countryside as he watched the well's lever move steadily up and down. "It produces 190 barrels a day with high quality and very little water."
It's not just nice scenery that is attracting oil companies to France. High oil prices, political stability and low taxes on small fields add up to profits for companies like Lundin, based in Sweden; Toreador Resources of Dallas, Texas; and the Canadian company Vermilion Energy Trust.
....
Lundin has oil fields in Indonesia, Tunisia, Iran and Sudan, yet last year it earned 37 percent of its revenue and 51 percent of its 2002 operating profit of 296 million Swedish kronor, or $37.5 million, from its French fields.
....
After no exploratory wells were dug anywhere in France in 2001 and 2002, Lundin spent about E2 million to dig one earlier this year in a rapeseed field 60 kilometers, or 38 miles, east of Paris.
Lundin's goal is to double its 13 million barrels of proven French reserves, and it could drill as many as three exploratory wells next year, Michaud said.
249. alistairconnor - 9/29/2003 4:52:06 PM
That's a bit tenuous, Nilsson. Bordering on deletion.
----------------
Another 23 bottles on the kitchen table. When a powerful aroma of celery permeated the room, from the evening soup my wife was preparing, we had to take refuge on the terrace, finishing the tasting in fading light and biting cold. Celery messes with the palate.
The wines were worth it. Though I had to endure hearing the bitter truth about some of the Burgundies.
250. jexster - 10/6/2003 4:33:16 PM
AC offerings from a newly opened corner wine merchant:
251. ScreamingSin - 10/7/2003 3:19:45 AM
Well, that swill I had at church benefit was less shocking than the post bordering deletion.
jexster, 'Nice shop...bi weekly tastings for $5-7?' Jeez, the shops around here try to make a social event of it and it's $60 minimum. There's a course of wines, some sort of theme to the tasting (wine region or distrubutor trying to break into the area), it always looks interesting but I never sign up.
252. jexster - 10/7/2003 11:38:09 AM
2-3 sips ...no big but nice themes and as you can see from the prices, one sale pays the cost
253. rdbrewer - 10/7/2003 5:56:32 PM
Alistair, here is the metal wine tasting building I mentioned last May. It's somewhere north of Atoka, Oklahoma. It's an odd sight right next to a lonely stretch of highway.
And here is part of their vineyard.
254. judithathome - 10/7/2003 5:59:55 PM
Is Atoka on the highway that goes to Lake Tenkiller and Tahlequah? If so, we'll stop in the next time we're up that way visiting my aunt and uncle.
255. rdbrewer - 10/7/2003 6:11:44 PM
JAH, if you're coming from Tejas, yes. I was just looking at the map, and I can't remember if the building was north or south of Atoka. I'll check with my friends. Also, it might be on the Oklahoma Wines website located by Alistair last May.
256. judithathome - 10/7/2003 6:19:08 PM
Checked the map and it's not there. I know we go through Atoka or thought we did...they were redoing the curbs through the main part of town and I had trouble getting to all the antique shops I wanted to. (This was almost 3 years ago...I'm sure they're done by now.)
Last year we went but we didn't come from Texas...we came from Arky's house! And after we left, we went north to Missouri. But I'm almost positive when we come from Texas, we go through there.
257. rdbrewer - 10/7/2003 6:23:21 PM
You went where? Atoka? The wine bibblers shop? Are you from Tejas? Where?
258. rdbrewer - 10/7/2003 6:29:53 PM
JAW, I found it. It's the Cimarron Cellars Winery, about 12 miles south of Atoka (at the 31 mile marker).
259. judithathome - 10/7/2003 6:34:55 PM
Oh shoot...I just looked that one up on the site map and we could drive up there for an afternoon of tasting! I live in Fort Worth and we take Hwy 69/75 when we go to Tahlequah all the time.
I haven't been to your friend's place before but I will certainly jot it down for a future visit. Should I say you sent me? ;-)
260. jexster - 10/7/2003 6:35:36 PM
an Okie!
That explains most everything don't it?
We don't smoke marijuana in Muskogee;
We don't take our trips on LSD
We don't burn our draft cards down on Main Street;
We like livin' right, and bein' free.
I'm proud to be an Okie from Muskogee,
A place where even squares can have a ball
We still wave Old Glory down at the courthouse,
And white lightnin's still the biggest thrill of all
We don't make a party out of lovin';
We like holdin' hands and pitchin' woo;
We don't let our hair grow long and shaggy,
Like the hippies out in San Francisco do.
And I'm proud to be an Okie from Muskogee,
A place where even squares can have a ball.
We still wave Old Glory down at the courthouse,
And white lightnin's still the biggest thrill of all.
Leather boots are still in style for manly footwear;
Beads and Roman sandals won't be seen.
Football's still the roughest thing on campus,
And the kids here still respect the college dean.
We still wave Old Glory down at the courthouse,
In Muskogee, Oklahoma, USA.
261. rdbrewer - 10/7/2003 7:09:48 PM
Well, the vineyard is not my friend's place. It's just an oddity on a barren stretch of road. I thought it was strange for several reasons. 1) Wine tasting by a highway (better watch that blood alcohol content); 2) it's a clean but ugly metal building, not exactly a romantic setting, and 3) I didn't know we had wine in OK until last may.
My friend's ranch is about 10 miles southwest of Bush's ranch in Crawford, Tx.
Why do you go to Talequah? Do you have a place there or relatives?
262. judithathome - 10/7/2003 7:12:02 PM
Relatives...they retired there and also have a beautiful cabin on the lake.
Are you from Texas, RD? 10 miles south of Crawford is in Waco.
263. rdbrewer - 10/7/2003 7:16:47 PM
The spirit spirit.
264. rdbrewer - 10/7/2003 7:21:27 PM
Crawford is north of McGregor and west of Waco about 20 miles. I went to school in at Baylor.
It has been a couple of decades since I've been to Tenkiller, but from what I remember, it is a beautiful, clear water lake. Do you go to the giant July 4th party where every boat on the lake lashes together into one great raft? I've heard about that fest.
265. rdbrewer - 10/7/2003 7:58:01 PM
Jex, the man who co-wrote that song -- the only 45 rpm record on the moon --with Merle Haggard was one of my clients. He was Merle Haggard's drummer Roy Burris. A nice man. Plenty of fascinating stories about being on the road with Merle.
266. alistairconnor - 10/8/2003 4:08:41 AM
You mean they took a juke box to the moon, and left only one record in it? What will the aliens make of that?
267. rdbrewer - 10/8/2003 9:32:58 PM
Maybe it will detur them from coming to Earth.
Okie From Muskogee was one astronaut's favorite song, so he left a copy under the American flag.
268. rdbrewer - 10/8/2003 10:54:26 PM
Strike that. Make it "deter." Crap.
269. ScreamingSin - 10/9/2003 1:40:11 AM
'We still wave Old Glory down at the courthouse'
Only in Oklahoma? I see that flag in almost every state I visit.
rolling eyes That whole previous exchange was more shocking than the post bordering deletion.
I met my lover for lunch and we had some Toasted Head Chardonnay to accompany our fine meals.
270. rdbrewer - 10/9/2003 10:01:46 AM
Screaming, we're talking about one of the flags on the moon.
271. judithathome - 10/9/2003 10:25:54 AM
I decided to take one for the team and bought two Aussie wines yesterday to try out. How can I say this without bringing heaps of scorn down on my head? They are both called Koala Blue and are from a vineyard owned by Olivia Newton John. Yes, I am going to drink Grease wine.
Even if it sucks, I still get something out of it...the Chard comes in a beautiful cobalt bottle.
272. alistairConnor - 10/9/2003 10:27:10 AM
Lover, chardonnay, toasted, head.
I see.
273. alistairConnor - 10/9/2003 10:28:04 AM
I did not say, "Eating ain't cheating". I didn't even think it.
274. PelleNilsson - 10/9/2003 12:40:05 PM
Oak and Wine - the horror story
In the future, will wine still be put in oak, or will the oak be put into the wine?
That is no idle question in Saint-Romain, population 300, in the heart of Burgundy wine country. The town is the headquarters of Tonnellerie François Frères, one of the world's biggest suppliers of fine oak barrels to wineries in Europe, the Americas and Australia.
Not surprisingly, France is home to some of the biggest makers of oak barrels. Yet while wineries here in Burgundy and elsewhere in France use oak casks to age some wine, winemakers outside Europe have increasingly used oak chips to save money. To the horror of many in Europe, where the practice is banned, the foreigners sprinkle the chips into stainless steel vats, or stand oak staves in the vats, to give the wine a hint of oak flavor.
If used judiciously, experts say, the result can be remarkably evocative of barrel-aged wine. If overdone, chips can make a good chardonnay taste like, well, hardwood flooring.
275. jexster - 10/9/2003 1:18:45 PM
You don't know the half of it...some even some pricey Napa wineries do that...many more leave their chardonnay much too long in very new oak casks...shit tastes like bark
276. alistairConnor - 10/21/2003 4:19:18 PM
So, the alea is jacted...
I've spent the day writing cheques and software. Fifty thousand euros or so will flow in and out of my brand-new business account over the next few days, and nine thousand bottles of organic French wine will be steaming out of Marseille in early November, thirty-two days at sea, and on sale in New Zealand in time for Christmas.
See what can happen to a harmless hobby.
277. Magoseph - 10/21/2003 4:43:45 PM
This is good news, Ali, so you're a wine merchant now and the right too, congratulations!
278. alistairConnor - 10/21/2003 5:01:13 PM
Not technically a wine merchant. Not yet anyway. I wasted a lot of time and energy on that aspect, finding a bank that would guarantee me for the customs people and all that, despaired of getting approval in time for Christmas and then realised it was completely unnecessary. It's far easier if my partners in NZ are the direct clients of the vignerons, and I just facilitate things. It means, for example, that I don't have to put up 19.6% sales tax, which would be refunded months later.
But I've denounced myself to the chamber of commerce, I'm on the register and paying a double dose of social security contributions for my pains (and for my old bones too I suppose).
But this is not a career move -- more like playing bass in a bar on weekends. Who knows, maybe we'll make it big and I can quit my day job.
279. Neato - 10/22/2003 7:06:09 AM
Alistair, is it true that you can't fill a container with wine because it's too heavy? An (obnoxious) wime merchant here told us that. In which case it must leave room for other things you could sell in NZ (e.g. old French leather arm chairs, which we find are doing well (in a small way) here))
280. Neato - 10/22/2003 7:18:30 AM
more : didn't mean to sound so pompous. It's the wine talking - an NZ sav blanc only $11.20 a bottle. (We are just so thrilled about the tatty old leather armchairs)
281. alistairconnor - 10/22/2003 8:23:53 AM
Oh bugger - a rival eh? You think I'm going to give you trade secrets?
You don't really want to ship French wine to NZ do you? Silly idea.
But seriously -- he was bullshitting you. I did the primary research on all this, from scratch. There is absolutely no weight problem with filling a container with wine. I've got the numbers somewhere.
Containers come in 2 sizes -- 20 foot and 40 foot. Either standard or refrigerated. We chose the latter because we're not planning on selling vinegar. It stays plugged in, at 14°C all the way.
You can fit 9000 bottles in the 20-foot reefer -- I worked this out from scratch, but the transport company confirmed it for me. The advantage of filling it up is that it keeps the cost per bottle down --freight from Marseille to Auckland, including insurance, comes to 34 euro-cents per bottle, which is less than the cost of transport within France to Marseille, believe it or not.
282. alistairconnor - 10/22/2003 8:28:08 AM
Cheap wine talking eh?
My starting retail price is about $NZ14 for a Rhone Valley rosé. But I presume you're talking Aus dollars?
And I bet it isn't organic. Nyark.
283. Neato - 10/22/2003 8:56:14 AM
(it isn't organic, and varies in price between $11.20 and $17).
You container info is very interesting. We got a 40 foot container of old stuff (the french translate it into english as "garrett equipment" in the documents)to sell, incl. the ubiquitous leather armchairs so dearly beloved of Melbourne tatterati)in July (Paris/Le Havre/Melb)and freight cost about Aus$6,000.
I do understand the advantage of filling up the container!
I hope your wine venture goes fabulously well!!
284. jexster - 10/24/2003 10:38:18 PM
Along with the return to school, the football season, and the inevitable Indian summer, one of the hallmarks of a Bay Area autumn is the annual crush, the harvesting of grapes in the winemaking regions of NorCal. Workers like Truchard Vineyards intern Peter Kirilov (above) go into a frenzy to finish the harvest.
285. alistairConnor - 11/3/2003 4:56:42 PM
I've been trying to get the blog up to date. The truth is, I've been using this thread as a practice run, and re-publishing on my blog site (many thanks for being such a great public).
Now I'm starting to do the opposite, the blog is more up to date than this thread. Here comes an update...
286. alistairConnor - 11/3/2003 5:01:58 PM
So. We left the narrative way back in Message # 214, in the Cabardès and Carcassone.
Carcasonne is, among many other things, the symbolic centre of Catharism, which is my favourite medieval heresy. The Pope, anxious to counter the spread of this precursor to protestantism which threatened the power and wealth of Rome, declared a Crusade, and called in the semi-savage hordes of Franks and Normans from the kingdom of France, who were eager to plunder the relatively rich and civilised South. (OK, vast oversimplification, but you get the general idea.) 
The landscape of Languedoc is littered with reminders of this period (here : the town of Lagrasse with its abbey), the golden age of the troubadours which came to such a sad end.
288. alistairConnor - 11/3/2003 5:03:29 PM
I can think of absolutely no way of linking this into the wine narrative, it's just a shameless bit of tourism. Worth a visit.
----------------
South of Carcassonne, we're in the Corbières. Once renowned for producing cheap plonk, the stock of Corbières has risen sharply in the last ten years or so. Powerful, sun-rich reds are very often fabulous value for money. The varieties are pretty much the same you find in the Rhône valley : Syrah, Grenache noir, Carignan, Mourvèdre. Often, the growers take their grapes into a local co-op, who employs a winemaker. This model tends to reach its limits when the push is on to raise quality. 
There's a cluster of organic producers in the village of Ribaute. Originally, the local co-op switched over to organic en masse; but when the going got rough (disease in the vine, I believe), they switched back to chemical, and those who wanted to stay organic broke away.
Three of them set up a common structure, le Cellier de Ségur. 
There is nothing flash about their operation : a rather unpreposessing winery, no glossy propaganda, very straightforward approach. And the wines are a bit like that : honest, solid, and good value! White, rosé and red all at the same price... I hadn't encountered a Corbières rosé before, and I was impressed. 
289. alistairConnor - 11/3/2003 5:08:50 PM
Another four-day weekend, another loan of the long-suffering Volkswagen camper van (I've been assiduously plying the owners with wine), and we're on the road again, me and the kids. This is the leading edge of the first of (what turned out to be) two heatwaves we had in France this year. But at the time, it just looked like a cracker of a weekend to go to the beach.
Which it was.
But first, we had to get there. Got some driving done on the Wednesday night, and parked when sleep set in. Strange noises in the night, and when we woke up, we discovered that we were parked beside some sort of private zoo. 
We soon arrived in the Alpilles, a rather surreal range of bare-stone hills in Provence : seen in the middle distance, they look extraordinarily like a big mountain range in the far distance. Or a film set, or something. 
290. alistairConnor - 11/3/2003 5:09:11 PM
More precisely, our first destination was Les Baux. This is a rapidly emerging wine appellation, similar to Côtes du Rhône in varieties, but with a very distinctive terroir.
Interesting Fact : As its name indicates, Les Baux is where bauxite comes from. Yes, those white hills are made of aluminium ore.
A high proportion of the vignerons of Les Baux are organic. We dropped in at the Mas du Gourgonnier, where the Cartier family have been making this gear for several generations. 
While I was tasting the excellent wines (a white Côteaux d'Aix en Provence, and various cuvées of the red Les Baux), quite reasonably priced, it turns out that the kids were pilfering cherries. I apologised; they said, think nothing of it... 
... but when we were back in the van, I discovered that they had filled a paper bag with the cherries, must have been a couple of kilos. I was furious, that's not pilfering, that's pillage... Then I tasted the cherries.
They were the best I have ever tasted. Every other cherry I eat will be measured against that standard.
That's the cherry tree on the right. I'll try to plan a visit for late May next year.
291. ronski - 11/3/2003 8:10:07 PM
Do you know what kind of cherries? What did they look like? Dark red to black, like "Bing" cherries, "Black Tartarian," etc.?
292. Al D - 11/3/2003 10:47:51 PM
alistair
Could you tell me the meaning of Pomard as to wine? Is that an area or a statement about the wine?
293. alistairconnor - 11/4/2003 5:50:01 AM
No, the cherries were not dark red, they were of yellow flesh. I get the varieties mixed up. Burlat?
294. alistairconnor - 11/4/2003 6:01:43 AM
Al :
Go here, and click twice on the "+" button underneath the map, and you've got Pommard in your sights.
It's a red wine, AOC, and it's a village in the Côtes de Beaune, within five miles of the vignerons I mention in Message # 45 and Message # 69. In fact the Derains have a small parcel of Pommard vines, and produce a paltry few thousand bottles a year.
It can cost you anywhere from $50 to $500 or more.
295. alistairconnor - 11/4/2003 6:14:46 AM
As a statement about a wine which is not from there, "Pommard" could be a metaphor, or an aspiration. In any case, it's Pinot Noir.
296. alistairconnor - 11/4/2003 6:32:27 AM
Way cool! My wineblog URL actually works.
(It didn't last night when I posted it. The domain wasn't yet registered, or propagated.)
297. arkymalarky - 11/4/2003 6:58:10 AM
Hey, nice blog, Alistair.
298. Al D - 11/4/2003 2:08:07 PM
alistair
Thanks, Evie and I were in this area, I believe. Is it just sud of Dijon? I have so many fond memories of our journey through France and feel sad that I cannot return since the French now hate us Americans. I liked it better when they just thought we were rather simple and amusing.
299. Al D - 11/4/2003 2:09:34 PM
alistair
I wish I could read French, but as you no doubt have noticed, I have a great deal of trouble comprehending written English.
300. alistairConnor - 11/4/2003 2:38:06 PM
Yes, south of Dijon, quite close to Beaune.
Al, you need to get over this idea that the French now hate Americans. That is neither more nor less true than it was when you were last over here. Certainly, people took note of the outpouring of hate of all things French which came from America a few months ago, but I don't know anybody who took offense. Who can really hate such simple, amusing people, after all.
301. ronski - 11/4/2003 4:08:10 PM
I don't know what varieties of cherries are grown in France, but I've read that U.S. cherries were largely brought to North America by the French.
Cherries grow so well in the Pacific Northwest that some good varieties have been originated there.
Burlat turns out to be a red cherry though. I've never seen it sold in a U.S. catalog. Light cherries in the U.S. are usually either "Queen Anne" (formerly "Royal Anne"), developed from a variety called "Napoleon," or "Rainier," itself developed from two red cherries, "Bing" and "Van." Thanks to googling, I learned that "Bing" was named after a Chinese worker.
The common pie cherry here (a sour cherry) is called Montmorency.
302. alistairConnor - 11/4/2003 5:53:11 PM
We found ourselves a place to park the van by the beach, at Six Fours, just west of Toulon.
The following day, we made a little trip inland to Sainte Anne d'Evenos, to visit the Château Sainte Anne.
Bandol is probably the most prestigious appelation of Provence. the Mourvèdre variety, the most difficult and unforgiving of cepages, is dominant, and when well-handled, it has extraordinary, brooding depth...
Château Sainte Anne turned out to be the real thing : a proper château, with titled people, if you please. And they know how to treat the mourvèdre. Noblesse oblige.
The young and energetic Françoise Dutheil runs the show these days.
They also do white and rosé Bandol, but the reds are the main event. 
The top of the line is the "Cuvée Collection", 98% Mourvedre (they are not allowed to make it single cépage, it's in the AOC regulations) is fabulous, but a wee bit out of my price range. Except maybe for special occasions.
The lad on the tractor is Françoise's little brother, the Marquis Dutheil de la Rochère.
303. alistairConnor - 11/4/2003 5:55:50 PM
I wouldn't be caught dead on the Côte d'Azur in summer. No room, and too hot anyway. But a heat wave at the end of May, that's the story. The water is not actually much colder than Normandy in August. 
Taming a seagull with potato chips. This photo also features the Wineblogger's toes.
Next : Côtes de Provence. This is a fairly vast "everything else" type AOC, covering all parts of Provence that make reasonable quality wine but don't have a right to a more prestigious name, such as Bandol or Cassis or whatever. That just means that there are a variety of different wines under that name, depending on the terroir, climate, varieties favoured etc.
Yves Gros and family, at the Domaine des Fouques at Hyères, do biodynamics. They have various sidelines, organic chickens and various stuff, also auberge style accomodation, or you can rent a holiday apartment. 
The wines are powerful, and very reasonably priced. The rosé is just plain delicious, dangerous stuff on a hot day, one tends to drink it like lemonade. Mostly Cinsault with some Grenache and Syrah. 
There are two cuvées of red : one with a majority of Grenache, for early drinking, and a longer one, called Aubigues, which is about half Syrah, with some grenache and Cabernet Sauvignon.
304. Macnas - 11/5/2003 9:04:41 AM
alistair, you have the stubbiest big toe's I've ever seen.
305. Magoseph - 11/5/2003 9:34:35 AM
Another trip down memory lane for me, Ali, you did that so much with this thread, you know, that I sometimes wish you wouldn't because I see in my mind vignettes of things and times that were long forgotten. You see, one memory leads to another and my husband has to listen to them. It's a good thing he is a patient man. Anyway, this morning I saw in vivid colors the family meal we had in the port of Cassis when we were all happy and experienced all over again how I just couldn't wait to grow up so that I could parade myself in Bandol where the nightlife was enjoyed so much by my older siblings. We used an apartment that belonged to a relative in La Ciotat where in those days families went.
306. ronski - 11/9/2003 5:16:11 PM
Nice blog.
I spoke today to my (half-French) English vintner brother-in-law, for the first time since the harvest. He holds it will prove the best vintage of the century, despite the century being so young. The grapes were clear and perfect, the right mix of sugar and acid, etc. (He is unusual in England in that he never adds sugar, but always has to pick late for that reason).
But the summer's warmth was great for his vines.
I gather that on the continent things were not so good, at least in Champagne, where there was a bad frost in April, and the heat of August was much more severe than in the south of England.
307. alistairConnor - 11/9/2003 5:37:40 PM
Yes, I guess in England they are never really short of water. Still. Most of the vignerons I've talked to have severely reduced yields, often only 50%, but the quality is generally pretty exceptional. There is a guy in the Mâconnais, I haven't written up that visit yet, who does Chardonnay and Gamay. I've tasted the Gamay 2003 from the barrel, it's very intense.
The wine is on the boat, by the way... left Marseille on Thursday. I now have thirty days to get the e-commerce web site operational.
308. ronski - 11/16/2003 8:29:27 PM
My (late partner's) sister-in-law brought us a bottle of the 1999 "fizz," which won the silver UK medal.
I suppose it's time to drink the 1994 I have in the fridge.
309. robertjayb - 11/20/2003 3:28:21 PM
But what does Alistair say...
PARIS (AP) -- They were pounded with icy wind in the spring, then baked by Sahara-like heat this summer. Only the strongest Beaujolais Nouveau grapes survived.
You could call it Mother Nature's version of tough love: The 2003 crop turned out terrific thanks to this year's punishing weather, wine-lovers said Thursday at the first ritual tastings.
Beaujolais Nouveau is uncorked worldwide at midnight on the third Thursday of November every year -- a clever marketing trick that gives the wine its cachet abroad.
310. alistairConnor - 11/20/2003 4:46:24 PM
Well, I'm waiting for mine to be delivered. Probably tomorrow. I've been getting mine from the Château de Boisfranc for about the last 10 years.
I am expecting it to be exceptionally good this year.
Most Beaujolais is rubbish, and most beaujolais nouveau doubly so. What gets exported is probably better than average. Last year was a very poor one, lots of rain and not much flavour, and 10% of the production of Beaujolais was boiled down to alcohol, that's the first time it's ever happened. This year is just the opposite, they only got 50 to 60% of the usual yields, but intensely concentrated.
So, if you like Beaujolais, be sure to buy some this year. If you're not sure, or if you've never tried, this is definitely the year to have a taste.
311. alistairConnor - 11/20/2003 4:48:28 PM
The "third Thursday in November" thing is not a clever marketing trick -it's a demonstration of the French obsession with bureaucratic regulation of everything.
On the other hand, as a marketing gimmick, it works OK.
312. jexster - 11/20/2003 8:11:25 PM
313. alistairConnor - 11/22/2003 7:54:40 AM
I visited that region, between Asti and Alba, a couple of years ago, but I was obsessed by the red Barbera wines at the time, and have no memory of whites. Besides, I tend to avoid high-tech wines from high-tech wineries.
Quite likely the local reds suffer from no longer having a proportion of the white Arneis. Similarly, there is often a certain proportion of white Pinot Beurot in the great wines of Burgundy, it's just a sort of unofficial local tradition which makes the wines rounder and more fatty. I've drunk some wonderful pure Pinot Beurot white, produced in microscopic quantities. I hope it doesn't become fashionable.
314. Magoseph - 11/23/2003 1:32:10 PM
Crest, Drôme, Alistair, did you ever go near that place? I was talking about it once and you told me to post a picture of the donjon, the highest in France. Anyway, I was born at the bottom of the tower and I have still old aunts around the place.
315. rdbrewer - 11/23/2003 1:45:58 PM
What a pretty picture, Mago.
316. Magoseph - 11/23/2003 2:21:06 PM
It is a pretty town, rdb, overlooking the Rhône river. The donjon dates circa 1215. The chateau was destroyed by a vengeful seigneur (lord) of the time. I don't remember the history exactly but I do remember a couple of verses that my grandmother taught me one summer: Oh, noble et majestueuse tour/que chaque enfant de Crest contemple avec amour. (Oh, noble and majestic tour/that each child of Crest contemplates with love.
317. ronski - 11/23/2003 6:14:56 PM
Lovely photo. And to have born there.
Curiously, it reminds me of a town in the south of England I've passed through, whose name should come to me eventually.
318. Magoseph - 11/24/2003 7:07:40 AM
The picture comes from a site about the town. I do have pictures of the tower but none depicting the scenery as realistically as this one in my view.
319. alistairConnor - 11/24/2003 5:24:55 PM
I do believe I've been up there with the kids, Mago, a couple of years ago. Quite a view.
Did you see the film, Conte d'Automne, by Eric Rohmer, a few years ago? I was in New Zealand when I saw it, and I felt homesick.
320. Magoseph - 11/28/2003 11:10:57 AM
No, I never saw the film. Was it on location in Drôme?
321. jexster - 11/28/2003 11:13:51 AM
California Barefoot Cellars
Barefoot on the Beach Red
11.49
1500 ml
Impertinent. Flinty eucalyptus with a hint of currant and paint thinner
322. jexster - 11/28/2003 11:16:03 AM
Our Barefoot on the Beach premium wines are all 100% Californian. The label depicts a couple strolling down the California coast line, which perfectly emulates the California dream.
Barefoot on the Beach wines have all been awarded GOLD medals. These wines are soft, approachable and fun to drink.
323. alistairConnor - 11/28/2003 6:44:43 PM
You want tacky? I can do tacky.
Kitty wine. From Japan, obviously.
324. alistairConnor - 11/28/2003 6:47:11 PM
320 - Yes, it was about a winemaker (vigneronne? Viticultrice?) - hey, we're on topic! and her love life, usual gossipy Rohmer stuff, I've forgotten the story, but superb landscapes. Nuclear power station steaming in the background. All that.
325. robertjayb - 11/28/2003 7:16:26 PM
Beaujolais Nouveau (Georges Dubceuf) has arrived in the wilds of central Texas at $9 the bottle. It went well with our ham Wednesday night. But what do I know? Like the guy in Auntie Mame: "Bring me a can of Schlitz---open it with a hatchet!"
326. rdbrewer - 11/28/2003 7:37:27 PM
AC, there was a rumor of pig blood in certain wines in the late 80's, I think. Do you remember that, and what was the story?
327. alistairConnor - 11/29/2003 4:30:02 AM
No, I remember a scandal about antifreeze in certain Austrian white wines (ethylene glycol or something) but the pig blood thing passed me by. People put all sorts of additives in wine. I wonder 1) what would the pig blood be for and 2) why would it be particularly a problem?
You can find vegetarian wines, and kosher wines. i.e. certified to be such. Though in the general case, I don't know why wine would pose a problem in either respect -- what are the additives which are so widely used?
The only animal product that I can think of off-hand is egg white, commonly used to clarify wines by taking particles out of suspension. More common with organic makers than others, who use more filtration and possibly chemical or other animal products?
On first principles, wine ought to be made out of grape juice. Any additives ought to be clearly defined, and the list ought to be very short. And written on the label. I'm for transparency and authenticity. Winemakers who can't deal with that should call their stuff "Wine-flavoured novelty drink" or "grape-based alcoholic beverage".
328. rdbrewer - 11/29/2003 8:54:17 AM
Lol. I agree. I'd like to know what I'm drinking too.
A friend of mine is a purist golfer who cannot abide so-called winter rules or lift, clean, and place rules. He says such rounds should not be referred to as golf. They should be called "lift, clean, and place."
I think the pig blood was added for color.
329. alistairConnor - 11/29/2003 7:44:31 PM
Sounds like an urban legend to me. The haemoglobin, a protein, is strictly incompatible with the polyphenyls and whatnot. Wouldn't stay in solution.
330. rdbrewer - 11/29/2003 7:49:58 PM
Sangria doesn't really have blood in it, does it?
331. robertjayb - 11/29/2003 9:08:41 PM
See? You try to have an intelligent conversation with an Okie and this is what happens.
332. rdbrewer - 11/29/2003 9:21:14 PM
Heh. (As if the Texan ever had sangria.)
333. rdbrewer - 11/29/2003 10:19:04 PM
Found this on some mailing list. It suggests blood is/has been used for clarifying. I'm looking for a better cite.
Is blood used in wine in current times? First off, it is EXPLICITLY illegal to use blood in both the US and France, and is extremely uncommon in other countries. Most wineries choose to use other agents, such as egg whites. Bordeaux is known for its use of egg whites.
My source said, "Blood is not used, "fining" is something done only to certain wines, and the fining agents are removed anyway." Vegans might be concerned over the use of egg whites as a fining agent, as some small amount of egg white might remain in the wine.
334. rdbrewer - 11/29/2003 10:21:18 PM
Found it:
House Speaker Dennis Hastert, R-Illinois, is considering a bill that would require labeling on French wine using bovine blood to make murky wine clearer. The European Union banned bovine blood in wine a half-dozen years ago, but older vintages might still contain the material.
335. rdbrewer - 11/29/2003 10:24:55 PM
And this from about.com:
First, let's explain what blood was historically used for in wine, centuries ago. Wine back then, just like beer and cider of the age, was extremely cloudy and full of extra 'stuff'. To drag out the extra proteins, wineries would use a clarifying, or fining agent. This agent could be clay, egg whites, or yes, sometimes blood. The substance would fall through the wine, attracting the proteins as it went. The resulting larger clumps could then be kept separate from the wine.
336. rdbrewer - 11/29/2003 10:26:25 PM
It also says:
So drink your French wine without fear! Blood is not used, fining is something done only to certain wines, and the fining agents are removed anyway.
337. rdbrewer - 11/29/2003 10:26:40 PM
merde
338. rdbrewer - 11/29/2003 10:26:57 PM
merde
339. rdbrewer - 11/29/2003 11:00:36 PM
And here, a WaPo article says:
The speaker also is exploring whether the United States should require "bright orange warning labels" on French wines that are clarified with bovine blood, a top aide said.
"People should know how the French make their wine," Hastert spokesman John Feehery said. Republicans are trying to determine how much French wine on the market has been clarified, or essentially made clearer, by using bovine blood, a process banned after the scare involving bovine spongiform encephalopathy -- or "mad cow disease" --in the late 1990s.
Two U.S. wine experts contacted by The Washington Post said a few French wineries used bovine blood as a clarifier before the ban.
It appears the current talk about blood in wine is geopolitical baloney based on a smidgeon of fact.
When I first heard about the practice, there was a big fuss. This must have been before the ban, sometime in the late '80s. In fact, I bet it was this fuss what resulted in the ban.
Now I'd like to know which wineries used blood, because we have some very old wine.
340. alistairConnor - 11/30/2003 10:52:33 AM
Hey, we're off topic, RD...
If you want to discuss the tide of anti-France/Germany hysteria in the US -- golly, how quickly that has dated, those articles are fun to read -- there are other threads for that...
As for worrying about blood in older wines -- heck, do you never eat any processed foods in the US? Ever look at the labels? Able to identify every ingredient, and feel happy about it?
341. ronski - 11/30/2003 11:57:19 AM
(Our vegan neighbors tell us that all German beers are safe for them to drink, there being a German law forbidding the use of eggwhites to clarify the brew.)
342. alistairConnor - 11/30/2003 3:01:26 PM
It's not so much that there's a specific law against the use of eggwhites, it's just that, in Germany, beer is made with water, malt, hops and (is there a fourth ingredient? perhaps not) - the relevant law dates from the 15th century or something.
I seem to remember there was a fuss over normalising the European definition of beer, English and French manufacturers protesting that they were forbidden to sell into Germany. Well, if they didn't put all sorts of crud in their brew...
343. rdbrewer - 11/30/2003 4:33:08 PM
Hey, we're off topic, RD...
If you want to discuss the tide of anti-France/Germany hysteria in the US -- golly, how quickly that has dated, those articles are fun to read -- there are other threads for that...
Ha! Nice deflection but no cigar. You're the one who said blood in wine was probably an urban myth. And I added that it is now political baloney anyway. Finally, there was no hysteria.
As for worrying about blood in older wines -- heck, do you never eat any processed foods in the US? Ever look at the labels? Able to identify every ingredient, and feel happy about it?
Good point. I wonder why the thought of blood in wine is so much more revolting than a rare steak.
My worries about sangria, btw, concerned the bottled variety from Spain. I've made tubs of the stuff that don't concern me. When you know some have used blood in wine, and there is a bottled wine whose name translates into "blood," it's only natural to make the connection.
344. rdbrewer - 11/30/2003 4:34:23 PM
Ditto, Tex.
345. ronski - 11/30/2003 5:48:32 PM
alistair,
...water, malt, hops and
yeast, I suppose.
346. wonkers2 - 11/30/2003 6:16:46 PM
Attention Moties who watch their pennies--drinkable wine at Trader Joe's for $38 a case.
Charles Shaw 2002 California Chardonnay
Charles Shaw 2002 California Merlot
347. judithathome - 11/30/2003 6:22:41 PM
House Speaker Dennis Hastert, R-Illinois, is considering a bill that would require labeling on French wine
Yes, because Hastert is SUCH a wine expert...
Deliver me from stupid politicians!
349. alistairconnor - 12/1/2003 11:56:49 AM
Wahoo! We're in business.
So to speak. Just checked my email, and
1) e-commerce banking approval will come through next week
2) my NZ partner's liquor sale license likewise
3) the temperature in the warehouse we've rented is 14° C. It may go up a couple of degrees by mid-summer but... that's cool.
350. alistairconnor - 12/1/2003 11:59:13 AM
... of course, there's still a fair amount of programming work I have to do before the boat comes in... 9 days...
Plus, the web site redesign to slot into place...
Plus, about half of the site content still to be written...
And I have to turn up to work every day and administer databases. Tedious and time-consuming.
Christmas shopping is going to get very short shrift this year.
351. Macnas - 12/1/2003 12:02:47 PM
Many cheese on toast suppers as well I'd imagine.
352. alistairConnor - 12/6/2003 7:42:57 PM
It's starting to look like something...
Organic French wines
Boat arrives in a couple of days, liquor sales license has come through, we're cleared by the bank for e-commerce, advertising will be out on Friday, we have to be ready for a Christmas rush (whether it happens or not is a different story)
Just one snag... about half of the site's content is not yet written.
Any feedback about look and feel, useability, etc would be warmly appreciated.
353. arkymalarky - 12/6/2003 9:17:58 PM
I love it. I really do. It's instantly pleasant and appealing to look at and all the parts of the page with links are clear and well arranged (the opposite being a common complaint I have about shopping sites).
354. Absensia - 12/6/2003 9:22:52 PM
I agree with Arky. It's a wonderful site! I found it easy to use!
355. Macnas - 12/8/2003 5:30:50 AM
It looks good.
Maybe include some more rustic scenes/background, have more than one sampler offer, include a glossary (or link to) for wine dummies such as myself.
Whats with the latin?
356. alistairconnor - 12/8/2003 5:35:11 AM
The latin is placeholder for the blurbs I haven't yet written.
What is fun about the whole venture is that covers a lot of ground : I'm writing the code, doing commercial negotiation, helping with the marketing, and providing the informational content too.
What is stressful is that there isn't time to do it all, and there is nobody else who can do it for me.
(The stuff that can be done by others is being handled admirably well, in particular this weekend's HTML reshag.)
357. Macnas - 12/8/2003 5:48:32 AM
Well I wish you all the very best with it.
I love it when people go off and do their own thing, even more so when they're successful.
358. alistairconnor - 12/8/2003 5:57:00 AM
Successful? We'll see about that in a couple of months.
My main concern is not to lose the money of those who have backed us. Family and friends. To repay their confidence with a dividend would be nice.
After that, if I make enough to pay for the plane tickets to NZ... now that would be successful.
359. Magoseph - 12/8/2003 11:11:25 AM
Ali, you'll be successful! Do you intend to advertize your site in this country? Very nice site, I agree with Arky that It's instantly pleasant and appealing to look at and all the parts of the page with links are clear and well arranged.
360. alistairConnor - 12/8/2003 6:53:05 PM
Advertise in the US?
Well, I'd need a US distributor...
Open to offers.
(Talk about it in 6 months, if the business model holds up)
361. alistairconnor - 12/12/2003 7:54:30 AM
The boat has docked, 6pm Friday NZ time. Two hours earlier, I had at last got to bed (4am my time) after getting sign-off from the bank for the hook-up to their live payment system.
I'm at work and, frankly, I'm simulating. I can't sit still.
The plan is to go live when the advertising hits the streets - we have a third of a page in the country's highest circulation magasine, right under this column -- we are of course hoping that he'll talk about us at some point.
So. Live on Sunday was the plan, when the magazine hits the shops. Somebody just pointed out that subscribers get theirs on Saturday morning... that's Friday evening my time... i.e. in about eight hours. Is the site within 8 hours of being ready? No it isn't.
And I'm still at work (did I mention that?)
It's going to be quite a weekend... I may have to skip choir practice tonight.
362. jayackroyd - 12/12/2003 9:26:26 AM
Links and Contact Us craps out. You probably know that, but I'm sure you'd prefer it fail more gracefully than they do now.
363. Magoseph - 12/12/2003 10:57:31 AM
Great picture! 
364. jexster - 12/12/2003 8:26:23 PM
Having dinner next Friday at Cote Sud, a French Fag Restaurant in the Castro...cassoulet YUM ...annual Christmas dinner I have with two friends..
One of the most enticing parts of the dining experience at Cote Sud is the wine list. Leaning heavily toward French, to match the classic nature of the food, the list offers some out-of-the-ordinary selections from excellent producers. Prices are also very good, below those of its competitors.
One of the top picks is the 2000 Domaine Philippe Naddef Gevrey-Chambertain ($26 for a half bottle) or, if you want to pay less for twice as much wine, the 2000 Chateau de Premeaux Bourgogne Rouge ($23) is a quaffable choice that goes with the rustic dishes. In Rhone wines, many priced in the $20 range, you'll discover three choices of Chateauneuf du Pape, two of Gigondas and one each of Vacqueyras and Lirac. In addition there's a fine selection of Provencal wines and around 20 from Languedoc-Roussillon. The 1999 Chateau Lamargue Cuvee Prestige is a great deal for only $17.
So what should we go with AC??
This a special annual Left Coast Elder Sons (and wife) Black Sheep of Family Dinner in honor of the Marquis de Lafayette, my Louisiana French heritage, and the Brave Jacques Chirac
365. jexster - 12/12/2003 8:34:09 PM
This Holiday Season let's all toast our New Maire and the toasting of the Greens with a glass of M. Le Maire's very own....
NEW RELEASES
2001 Merlot
2000 Reserve Cabernet Sauvignon
(Packaged in a custom wood box set, with cork and screw cap finish.)
CURRENT RELEASES
2002 Reserve Chardonnay
2000 Estate Cabernet Sauvignon
2001 Syrah
PREVIOUS RELEASES
Cabernet Sauvignon
1999 Reserve Cabernet Sauvignon
1999 Estate Cabernet Sauvignon
1998 Reserve Cabernet Sauvignon
1998 Estate Cabernet Sauvignon
1997 Estate Cabernet Sauvignon
1997 Reserve Cabernet Sauvignon
1996 Estate Cabernet Sauvignon
1996 Founders Reserve Cabernet Sauvignon
Chardonnay
2001 Reserve Chardonnay
2000 Reserve Chardonnay
1999 Reserve Chardonnay
1998 Reserve Chardonnay
1997 Reserve Chardonnay
1996 Reserve Chardonnay
Merlot
2000 Merlot
1999 Merlot
1997 Merlot
Syrah
2000 Syrah
1994 Petite Syrah
Sangiovese
1998 Sangiovese
1997 Sangiovese
366. alistairconnor - 12/12/2003 8:40:23 PM
Cassoulet? Go with a Languedoc wine. A Cabardès if they've got one.
367. jexster - 12/12/2003 8:43:04 PM
Thanks AC...supposedly excellent Cassoulet...it had better be...I am a tough critic
368. rdbrewer - 12/22/2003 7:49:13 PM
Alistair, don't you have a wine blog thingy? What's the url? And, if so, you ought to link it on the right.
369. alistairconnor - 12/23/2003 6:21:46 AM
Quite right. it's here.
In fact, most of the material was first posted in this thread.
370. Neato - 12/23/2003 6:49:24 AM
Alistair, have a great time in NZ, drink lots, and blog lots on that wizz-bang laptop.
371. alistairconnor - 12/23/2003 9:32:24 AM
Hey, surely you've got some friends and relatives in NZ you should be sending wine to?
We're not racist, we even accept Aussie credit cards...
But seriously... we're going to have to do some heavy marketing. All suggestions welcome.
372. Neato - 12/26/2003 1:30:49 AM
Will do (send some of your wine to a friend or relly)
Hell's teeth, the links don't work on your wine site.
Re marketing - there is a very glossy popular NZ lifestyle mag called "Cuisine" - lots about wine in it, and I saw a letter to the wine guru in the Jan 2004 issue asking where to buy wine that was low in preservative. Get yourself a plug in that?
373. alistairConnor - 12/28/2003 5:28:18 PM
?? What links don't work?
Yes, everyone says "Cuisine". We need to talk to the journalists and do a combined advertising/editorial hit I guess.
We'll have a serious sit-down about marketing strategy in a couple of days, lots of people to see. Everyone says that the key to any new business is being solid enough to last until the idea catches on. We've always said we'll give it a year, and it's only costing us (time and) warehouse rent so far. (and the time doesn't count, as long as it's fun)
Eldest brother has a van he wants to lend me for January. That suits very well indeed. (in particular we can drive down to the Levin organics festival with samples, and see if that particular market segment is interested in us)
374. alistairConnor - 12/28/2003 5:30:25 PM
As one of our backers said the other day, we have three constituencies : Organic, French, wine.
We'll see how that plays out.
My instinct is that the core constituency for the starting business model is : people who are already in the habit of buying wine over the internet. Need to reach these people first.
375. Neato - 12/29/2003 2:15:41 AM
re links - sorry, Alistair, it was the links on the right (who are we etc), and they are fine now. The site is great.
Wow Levin ... visit Otaki, 20k south, we had the bach there for 35 years, my parents sold it a couple of years ago, but the beach is lovely, dear old Kapiti island, the sunset beside it ...
If there isn't much organic wine in NZ I reckon the organic market could be just as important a target as people who buy via the internet. NZers are big on Organic. As you know of course.
You could blog (unorganically probably)from the brother's van going down the north island?
376. Neato - 12/29/2003 2:32:54 AM
Hey Alistair - Levin = Le Vin !!
377. rdbrewer - 1/1/2004 11:07:33 PM
Anyone know about pinot noir wine? I understand the grapes are grown in colder climes.
378. alistairConnor - 1/2/2004 6:03:06 AM
Yes, New Zealanders are now convinced they can do Pinot Noir. I have not yet studied the subject, but this may turn out to be the saving grace... Logically, central Otago, with its Burgundian climate, is the leader within NZ.
The Wine Spectator is all excited about them.
Burgundy is the home of Pinot Noir of course, and whatever tomfoolery they get up to in the New World, will continue to be so.
379. alistairConnor - 1/2/2004 6:07:43 AM
I think we may have difficulty selling our white wines. The NZ whites are all primary colours, completely in your face. Passionfruit, pineapple, celery, lemon, whatnon. Personally I don't like to be shouted at by a wine, but that's what they are used to here.
Our whites are all subtlety and nuance. They may appear dull and drab to the average punter.
380. rdbrewer - 1/2/2004 9:21:02 PM
Alistair, is there any way to stick a needle through the cork of old bottles and test for vinegar? (w/o ruining it)
381. jexster - 1/2/2004 9:42:30 PM
Great laydown over the holidays...finally opened a gift of over a year ago...Saintsbury "carneros" Pinot Noir 2000...
Very yummie especially with New York Cut Mad Cow
382. angel-five - 1/3/2004 2:28:18 AM
Am I to understand that Alistair is now involved in viticulture?
383. alistairConnor - 1/3/2004 3:30:46 AM
Nuh. Just trying to spin a hobby into a business case.
Check the links, you'll get the idea: organicfrenchwine.co.nz
I learned this morning that we will be featured in a feature in Cuisine magasine, which is what the silly hip people with lots of money read. This is the sort of stuff we need. My assignment for the next few weeks : visit restaurateurs, wedding planners and the like and ply them with wine. What a chore.
For the moment, I'm too busy having a holiday and keeping the kids happy.
384. alistairConnor - 1/3/2004 3:33:28 AM
RDB : no point in leaving the cork in it if it's off. If the wine is no good when you uncork it, then send it back. No need to resort to radiography or anything. People selling wine count on a certain percentage of returns for corked or oxidised wine, and they will refund or replace.
385. Neato - 1/3/2004 4:16:06 AM
Don't be too holy and elitist about Cuisine's readers, Alistair, the mag is available in every public library and every supermarket in NZ, so while it may be a superficial lifestyle glossy, it is read by all sorts and any of them could be your customers!
386. angel-five - 1/3/2004 4:24:05 AM
a) He is in the wine business
b) He is in the organic French subset of that business.
It'd seem to me that 'holy and elitist' are, in this venture, de rigueur and probably even good for sales. It's not as if he's selling Two Buck Chuck.
387. Neato - 1/3/2004 4:29:41 AM
yeah, you may be right, but that's a shame, because his wine is no dearer than most NZ wine, and should appeal to supermarket shoppers and library goers, all of whom read the mag.
388. angel-five - 1/3/2004 4:33:36 AM
I propose, in fact, that while he is schmoozing these people and drinking wine with them, he should wear long white flowing robes and have some properly penitent wench cleansing and then anointing his feet. He should also say things like 'Some people, of course, cannot afford this Beaujolais, but, then again they probably weren't meant to be able to' and 'Ah, yes, once you clear out the rabble from this place it will look splendid' and 'I say, you do appear to have a strong strain of inferior DNA judging by the shape of your forehead. Perhaps these wines are not for you. May I interest you in some pork rinds and beer?' The penitent magdalen should murmur things like 'Let them eat cake' and 'You shall address him as Your Excellency'.
389. rdbrewer - 1/3/2004 11:46:07 AM
AC, I was wondering if you could put something like a syringe through the cork without pulling the cork out.
390. angel-five - 1/3/2004 11:21:19 PM
You'd likely break the needle unless it was big enough, and if it was big enough, you might as well just uncork it and be done with it.
391. jexster - 1/20/2004 12:30:15 PM
You Won't Find THIS in Napa Valley - Ohio Winemakers Hard at Work - Ice Wine
392. jexster - 2/2/2004 1:20:57 PM
My how the French have fallen to Creeping Californication
On the shelf of the corner store..
WILD PIG
Vin Blanc de Pays d'Oc
Francophiles of the World Unite!
Vive Jean Le Pen
393. alistairConnor - 2/4/2004 5:16:21 AM
Yea verily spake the Angel.
394. Neato - 2/4/2004 5:19:14 AM
At Levin? (or should that be au Vin?) A success?
395. alistairConnor - 2/4/2004 5:23:53 AM
Well we sold about a hundred bottles, and gave away about 40 in free samples... a qualified success in commercial terms.
But a hell of a good weekend.
Moral of the story... need to go upmarket. This new age bunch are fine people, but they tend to top out at $25.
396. Neato - 2/4/2004 5:31:33 AM
Is the website doing Ok, or does the need to go upmarket mean a different approach?
397. alistairConnor - 2/4/2004 5:33:22 AM
More wine fun in nz :
Waiheke Island, in the Hauraki Gulf near Auckland. Reputed for its dry Mediterranean climate and red wines. Here, Cab.Sauvignon and Merlot. My importing partner Barry posing proudly as proprietor (actually that's only one seventh true.)
398. alistairConnor - 2/4/2004 5:35:41 AM
Having experienced something of an epiphany there last weekend, I'm going back this weekend -- they are pouring the slab of the winery floor, so it must be anointed with the appropriate holy libations.
399. alistairConnor - 2/4/2004 5:36:56 AM
The web site is doing very little for us so far -- it will be very slow to build traffic. No problem. We can sit and wait, while the effects of various promotional efforts kick in.
400. HCaulfield - 2/5/2004 1:53:56 AM
OK, you fakers,
I say "Quercus suber" is history within 10 years.
I just wanna say one word to you. Just one word.
Are you listening?
Plastics.
401. Magoseph - 2/5/2004 2:13:03 AM
Plastics? That'll take forever where Alistair does business.
402. HCaulfield - 2/5/2004 3:18:40 AM
Magoseph --
I pray you are right.
But I know how pop-cult tramples all before it.
Viz. Baywatch.
403. Magoseph - 2/5/2004 3:28:35 AM
Do you live here or in Europe, HC? Alistair deals mainly in organic wines so I don't think the growers would ever cap their bottles with plastic.
404. HCaulfield - 2/5/2004 3:49:36 AM
Magoseph --
No, I don't live in Europe. But there is a meme that synthetic corks are superior to natural corks, for two reasons:
1) It's good for the cork trees.
2) Synthetic corks have all the qualities of natural corks, and are more reliable.
I admit I am an ignoramus regarding wine, so please tell me where I'm wrong.
405. Magoseph - 2/5/2004 4:12:03 AM
HC, I couldn't tell you if you were wrong or not. I'm a philistine about wine. I like after-dinner liqueurs and my favorite is Grand-Marnier. All I remember about wine is that when I was a kid and lived in Provence, in the basement were two big vats with faucets, one with red wine, the other with white. It was considered an honor for us to go down there and fill up two one-liter bottles. If we managed to overcome our fear of the dark cool shadows and came back without breaking the bottles, we were cheered. As kids we always followed the vendangers and picked whatever they left.
Maybe it's a miracle that not one of us ended up an alcoholic.
406. HCaulfield - 2/5/2004 4:25:33 AM
I go for the big floral liqueurs, like Cuarente y Tres and Benedictine. And even though Jagermeister is a big frat slammer, I like it too.
407. alistairConnor - 2/5/2004 5:23:29 AM
Screw caps. Why bother with synthetic corks?
No, I don't know of anything other than cork that has the properties of cork. People use something else to close their bottles because they believe that it's better for the particular wine they made. And that's fine with me.
But if you want tell me that plastic is better than cork for *all* wines, then you better tell me what my religion should be too, and what sort of sex I'm allowed to have.
You're wrong about the cork trees too.
408. alistairConnor - 2/5/2004 5:25:01 AM
I just wanna say one word to you. Just one word.
Are you listening?
Plastics.
I'm in the wrong movie.The graduate?
409. PelleNilsson - 2/5/2004 6:24:14 AM
I heard this about plastics replacing cork 20 years ago. It's not only practicalities that count. Who wants to buy a $25 wine with a plastic cork?
410. jayackroyd - 2/5/2004 7:16:49 AM
The claim is that plastic corks breath as well as corks, and can't leave you with corked wine.
My palate is sufficiently poor that I have never identified a wine as corked, although I'm told that as many as one in twelve bottles is. I've wanted to take a wine tasting course for that one reason--so I can see what is meant by corked wine.
411. PelleNilsson - 2/5/2004 11:06:06 AM
If you ever hit on a corked wine you will know it, No course needed. But if yoor palate is poor, like mine, you probably drink young wines which have a rather low risk of being corked.
412. jayackroyd - 2/5/2004 11:18:59 AM
Well, that's true. And my usual wine drinking companion gets migraines and does not drink red wine, so the odds are quite low for me these days.
I do have a bottle of '86 Lalande Pichon tucked away, bought when the prices were not quite so outrageous. Maybe I'll find out when I open it. It needs to be drunk soon, or perhaps I'm too late.
413. wabbit - 2/5/2004 11:22:27 AM
One in twelve? I've tasted corked wine (and Pelle is right, you'll know it when you taste it), but not anywhere near enough to be 8% of all the bottles I've opened. Does that make me a wino?
Some old cork articles:
414. HCaulfield - 2/5/2004 1:51:16 PM
AC -- Yes, The Graduate. I admit my complete ingorance of the subject of corks, but that's never stopped me before. I believe in the fantastic possibilities when monomania meets science, so even though I know that only God can make a flower, I still have faith that someone will lick this cork problem.
Here's one thing I still can't wrap my brain around: why does sparkling wine need to "breathe"? It seems to me, you don't want anything going in or (especially) out.
415. jexster - 2/5/2004 9:13:43 PM
AC - You gotta figure our a way to penetrate the Organic Heart of the Planet - NoCali
And can you do something about the oak??
Playing with fire
Love it or hate it, oak adds a dose of character to wine
Sparks fly out of a barrel being toasted at Demptos Napa Cooperage
416. jexster - 2/6/2004 9:57:22 PM
AC-
I was hoping to find a URL for SF Real Foods Markets... would jump at Organic Wines stuff..
But check this out... Real Foods, in fact all major stores of its type in this area (upscale Greenie Weenie) are listed in this hard cider Site
417. alistairConnor - 2/9/2004 5:32:47 AM
Murcan oak. New Zealand winemakers look down on it, only French oak will do.
Australians though...
418. Neato - 2/9/2004 5:55:09 AM
We do love things Murcan. Do we use American oak? In my chardonnay-drinking days I preferred unoaked.
419. alistairConnor - 2/9/2004 6:03:59 AM
I have grown to tolerate the passionfruit and capsicum flavoured Sauvignon Blancs, but I have yet to meet a NZ chardonnay that I can like. Sawdust flavoured. Bleah.
Good Rieslings. I rearranged the bottles in my mother's wine cupboard yesterday, and found some frighteningly old stuff. Among the middle-aged stuff was some 1993 Malborough Riesling, I thought it was our patriotic duty to try it, even if we had to pour it down the sink... Damn good it was, quite fresh and limey. Shingle Peak, a Matua label.
420. Neato - 2/9/2004 6:14:37 AM
I was of course speaking as an Aussie in 418.
Interesting your comments on the rieslings in NZ.
I don't like Aussie or NZ Chardonnay now. To me it's petrolly or resinny or something like that.
But (like NZers you mentioned some posts ago) I can't appreciate French white wine as I should (except the rieslings) I'd like to! It's too flavourless (i.e. subtle) for me.
421. wabbit - 3/27/2004 1:06:03 PM
I've opened a couple of non-organic wines in the past week that I thought I'd mention here. A 1983 Gruaud Larose was well over and not really drinkable. It will do for cooking. A 1982 Sociando Mallet was past its prime, but still full of flavor. Then there was the 1976 d'Yquem I opened last night, my last bottle of d'Yquem. What a delight. Orange in color, sweet, thick almost like honey, a real treat.
422. concerned - 4/2/2004 10:24:20 AM
423. jexster - 4/13/2004 2:58:02 PM
A Wine Soaked Tour of Bordeaux
424. alistairConnor - 5/3/2004 5:05:38 PM
Well this thread is looking a bit neglected! I'll soon get around to filling in some of the New Zealand stuff.
But I just got an excellent report of the vintage on Waiheke Island, and I wanted to share it...
Hi all,
All the grapes are in! The cabernet came in (24th/25th April) at 24.2 brix (13-13.5% alc). It was a big job picking. By the end on Saturday there was a big team in action picking and foot stomping but at times during the day there was only a small team going and it seemed a bit daunting. An excellent effort by all! It took a bit longer then anticipated and we had to pick again on Sunday. All up we brought in 2 tonnes of cabernet and 1 tonne of merlot and syrah, 3 tonnes in total (50% more then we thought). Should end up with around 8 barrels. The reflective cloth rows were around 24.4 brix with rest at 24 brix. Some of the top rows were around 23 brix and could perhaps have been left out a bit longer although the weather hasn’t been brilliant this week.
The cabernet is fermenting at the moment. It’s looking pretty good already, lots of blackcurrent flavour and fine tannins. Perhaps our best yet. The syrah is looking fantastic. I’m confident that it will be a great wine. Tried Passage rock 03 & 04 syrah last nite. The 03 is looking very good. Both Dave and I reckon that it could be gold medal depending on the whims of the judges. The 04 will be even better. Inky black (like Rockfords- Dave reckons). Lots of flavour. Ours will be right up there as well I’m sure. Great pepper and liquorice flavours already, similar to some of the 02 Hawkes Bay syrahs. Totara merlot is looking good as well. Derek reckons its aroma is the best of all the wines down in the winery.
425. alistairConnor - 5/3/2004 5:06:51 PM
Most people on the island are pretty happy with the vintage. Herb who makes the wines for Kennedy point, Te Whau and Christensen estate and used to make Stonyridge reckons it’s the best vintage he’s ever seen in the 10 years he’s been on the island. Dave also reckons it’s the best he’s seen. For us it’s certainly up there with 2000 and could even be better. Cable Bay sound like they have a pretty impressive cabernet. The block above the golf course with new clones of cabernet came in at 26 brix with 6g of acid. Interesting enough 4 g of that was Malic which is very high. After Malolactic fermentation that converts to lactic dropping the titratable acidity- 1.8g TA of Malic ends up as 1 g TA of lactic (which is also a very soft acid). This is probably true in general for the vintage which means that all our acid levels are pretty good. Eg. Our Syrah at 8.6 g TA will come down below 6.5g TA after malo. Our new clones of Cabernet also looked fantastic. They came in at 25 brix and we could have gone higher if we left them a bit longer, unfortunately we only got 50kg. Neil from Cable Bay is very positive about them, the same as the top clones in Napa and oz. Much riper flavours in general.
426. alistairConnor - 5/3/2004 5:11:43 PM
One pleasing factor this year has been the end block. Half way thru the season I was ready to graft over the whole field to white varieties since it was so late. In the end it looks like our best grapes have come from there. While it is a bit later it got there in the end and the dry rocky soil has resulted in very small grapes which translates into wine with great concentration and flavour.
A very odd year in many ways. After the end of February it looked like it was going to be hard graft and indeed it was. After a warm Jan very cold temperatures persisted right thru Feb, March and April with maximums at least 2C below the long term average for each of these months. Feb rainfall was over 200 mm. The total growing degree days was around 1520 (cf 1650 average) the second lowest in the last 8 years. The key plus however was the rainfall at the end. 12mm in March and 6 mm in April, about 160mm less then normal. This meant that we could hang the grapes out and slowly get the flavour accumulation. By the time we picked the merlot and most of the cabernet the leaves were yellowing off pretty quickly so we just managed to get everything ripe before running out of time. For us a compounding factor was the prevalence of W/SW winds for most of the season which put us behind other vineyards like passage rock which were more sheltered. Still despite all this the vintage is looking pretty impressive. It’s been a bit of a rollercoaster but we got there in the end!!!!
Till next year.
Ciao steve
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