6001. Ms. No - 4/7/2002 11:40:26 PM
It never pays to be too grown up.
6002. judithathome - 4/7/2002 11:42:26 PM
Yeah, I felt the same way earlier when I grabbed it in the Inferno...
CONGRATS!!
6003. Ms. No - 4/7/2002 11:53:52 PM
thankyaverrahmuch
6004. betty - 4/10/2002 7:12:17 PM
I'm listening to:
Frank Zappa & The Mothers of Invention: We're Only in it for the Money
I LOVE this album...I love Frank Zappa.
6005. judithathome - 4/10/2002 7:13:29 PM
Me, too....
Dynamo, Hum!
6006. theDiva - 4/10/2002 7:13:49 PM
watch out where the huskies go....
6007. betty - 4/10/2002 7:25:52 PM
reading about Judith's persuit of art for Keoni's office, I realized how lucky we are to have friends who are good artists and people who have otherwise been generous to us. Several years ago we were given an Isabel Bishop aquatint and a little over a year ago a semi-established artist friend did a portrait of alfred...completely for free. we have excellent pieces despite no ability to pay for such things. I suppose if the art is something you value, it has a way of finding you.
anyway, I am a firm believer that we are all artist and was thinking maybe some of us who are so inclined could do an art swap...it could be small stuff and sketches...just a way for us all to get something different and interesting. If anybody's interested let me know.
6008. theDiva - 4/10/2002 7:29:01 PM
That's a nice idea, Betty.
6009. betty - 4/10/2002 7:36:56 PM
Oooh, thanks Deev.
there's no reason everybody can't play. Even if you can't draw or make collages or weave or whatever, everyone's taken at least one really good photo in their life.
6010. theDiva - 4/10/2002 7:40:34 PM
you bet, sweetie.
6011. judithathome - 4/10/2002 7:45:23 PM
I like that idea, too....
6012. judithathome - 4/11/2002 5:55:33 PM
NPR: A Sudden Shift In Cultural Programming
National Public Radio is cutting jobs in its cultural programming division, gutting its classical music program "Performance Today" and shifting some of its emphasis to the West Coast entertainment industry.
Once a bastion of the traditional high arts, NPR is working to reshape itself to appeal to an audience it perceives as more interested in news and talk shows than in classical music and jazz.
6013. Property of Jesus - 4/11/2002 6:07:06 PM
Per direct orders from the DNC, NPR goes to an ultra-liberal talk/news format.
Air the same "news" programs on all the NPR stations at the same times, even when the market has two or three powerful college FM radio stations, plus Congressional-run government outlets.
All Things Considered, my backside.
6014. theDiva - 4/11/2002 6:47:36 PM
"The new Arts unit will have 16 positions. That is about twice the size of the current cultural desk, which created arts and culture segments for the network's news programs."
and
"We want to tell stories about jazz artists, and actors and poets and writers and musicians. If we turn our ear to popular culture and do it well, that's not hurting anything."
That doesn't sound so awful. Plus, they're keeping CarTalk and Prairie Home Companion. As for the jazz change, it's not much of a blow if there is already a jazz station in a particular market.
6015. Rivendell - 4/11/2002 6:49:23 PM
That is at least as honest as O'Reilly's claim to No Spin.
6016. judithathome - 4/11/2002 6:50:34 PM
I think what some are fearing is that it is going to go more Pop culture...how long before Terry Gross is interviewing Brittnay Spears about her alleged virginity? Or maybe she already has, I don't know.
6017. Rivendell - 4/11/2002 6:51:18 PM
Div(ine),
You beat me to it. I can't remember the last time I listened to a nationally produced NPR broadcast about jazz. But the local university version is itself the best jazz station in this area. So no loss there.
6018. Property of Jesus - 4/11/2002 6:52:33 PM
Most cities don't have jazz, folk, bluegrass, blues, or even classical music programs (let alone stations? anymore, Diva.
Lots of leftist talk on "public" radio paid for from taxpayers thanks to the DNC, though.
6019. Property of Jesus - 4/11/2002 6:53:19 PM
stations)
6020. theDiva - 4/11/2002 6:57:57 PM
Riv
Hello, precious! SMOOCH! GMTA.
PoJ
I'd think the major markets at least have jazz and classical outlets, no? But take heart re: leftist talk radio, good old Pacifica accepts no government funding, do they?
6021. Rivendell - 4/11/2002 6:59:19 PM
St. Louis has separate stations devoted to jazz/blues and classical. I find it hard to believe cities our size (we are only something like the 25th media market) or larger aren't the same.
6022. Rivendell - 4/11/2002 7:01:39 PM
Everyone knows those radical right mouth breathers have enough money to pay for their own damn media.
Besides - aren't they the ones who complain about too much gov't anyways?
Except, of course, when it comes to regulating sex, drugs and rock and roll.
6023. theDiva - 4/11/2002 7:06:50 PM
hey, some of my best friends are mouth breathers.
I have to go find some radio and market rank listings. Here in DC we've only got the one station doing jazz, WPFW (Pacifica affiliate), but they also do a smattering of talk, news, and world music. Saturdays are devoted to blues and R&B. There's a couple of NPR affiliates, too.
Quite honestly, I can listen to the public affairs on none of the three stations. I always end up shouting at the radio.
6024. Rivendell - 4/11/2002 7:16:06 PM
Yes, I know you have friends who are Yankee fans.
Shouting at your radio is no big deal. The radio shouting back might be.
6025. theDiva - 4/11/2002 7:20:06 PM
Ha. Ha. Ha.
Anyway.
Non-commercial stations in North America, etc.
This is a very interesting list. Do you know, Huntsville, Alabama, has two stations that play jazz?
6026. betty - 4/11/2002 7:21:20 PM
Philly is (I believe) the fourth largest radio market in the US. there is no all classical station and no all jazz station (I think there's some lite jazz station but they play Kenny G and Anita Baker...No Miles or Coltrane or Vaughn or anything I would recognize as jazz.) Temple Radio Station used to be all Jazz, but picked up the classical programming when the classical station went under. Temple is an NPR affiliated station as is the Penn station which plays a variety of pop/folk music. I suspect the new model for NPR is gonna be something akin to Penn's format because XPN has been rather successful where a lot of "member supported" and "public" radio has had difficulty.
6027. theDiva - 4/11/2002 7:24:04 PM
"I think there's some lite jazz station but they play Kenny G and Anita Baker..."
(hurl)
6028. Rivendell - 4/11/2002 7:27:31 PM
That surprises me about Philly.
Diva's list has my two favorites on it. WSIE is almost all jazz of the not smooth variety. KWMU is lots of talk.
It occurs to me our classical station is not even an NPR station. It is a commercial one. I suppose the supporters of the St. Louis Symphony are a desirable enough demographic to keep the station on the air.
6029. theDiva - 4/11/2002 7:30:19 PM
There is at least one commercial classical station in this market. I'm surprised there isn't one in Philly...you'd think there'd be the demographic to support it.
6030. Rivendell - 4/11/2002 7:32:13 PM
Exactly. Eugene Ormond and all those guys were lots bigger than the SLSO for a long time. Is the Philadelphia Philharmoic still viable?
6031. betty - 4/11/2002 7:33:17 PM
Rive,
you'd think with the Philly Orchestra classical music might have some staying power there...but no.
Honestly, I could care less about most classical stations, they don't play the kind I like very often.
and let me just say, the radio stations here in bumfuck, er rochester, is a whole lot worse!
6032. Rivendell - 4/11/2002 7:37:17 PM
So, betty, what kind of stations do they have in bumfuckrochester?
Britney Spears type stuff?
Achy-breaky country?
Hobbit rock?
6033. theDiva - 4/11/2002 7:41:08 PM
hobbit rock
hahahahah
6034. betty - 4/11/2002 7:41:49 PM
x-post.
the orchestra is still wonderful, I think the classical station got bought by infinity or some such conglomerate and folks scrambled to get classical shows on their stations but there still has been a full-time replacement.
6035. PelleNilsson - 4/11/2002 8:40:26 PM
We are listening to Don Williams doing "Living on Tulsa time". What's so special about Tulsa time?
6036. judithathome - 4/11/2002 8:45:15 PM
You know how people in this country ask "Where does the time go?"
Well, it goes to Tulsa.
6037. Rivendell - 4/11/2002 8:46:45 PM
Juditha,
That would make Tulsa a black hole - no?
6038. judithathome - 4/11/2002 8:49:20 PM
Guess so...although the original joke punchline was "Cleveland".
6039. PelleNilsson - 4/11/2002 9:31:10 PM
Is that so? But what is Tulsa in the first place? And why should time go there?
Now listening to Edmundo Ross. Takes you back to the time of dinner jackets and long dresses.
6040. theDiva - 4/11/2002 10:31:38 PM
Tulsa is a town in Oklahoma, and my guess is that the song refers to a slow and lazy pace of life.
6041. arkymalarky - 4/12/2002 12:14:01 AM
Tulsa is probably the nicest town in OK. Pretty laid back yet with a progressive feeling for its location.
6042. Property of Jesus - 4/12/2002 12:34:58 AM
Back on topic:
Weekend CD purchase: Tom Waits USED SONGS 1973-1980.
At least three classics, one that I can even play on piano. "Ol' '55," "(Looking For) The Heart of Saturday Night" and "Tom Traubert's Blues (Four Sheets to the Wind in Copenhagen)".
6043. arkymalarky - 4/12/2002 12:42:44 AM
You like Ricki Lee Jones, PJ?
6044. Property of Jesus - 4/12/2002 3:40:56 AM
Of course. I saw her at the real Cellar Door nightclub in Georgetown, DC, sometime in the late 1970s.
I remember the singer saying on stage that Joni Mitchell hated her first album because the cover photo was to similar to her's.
6045. arkymalarky - 4/12/2002 4:36:48 AM
Sorry Joni, but it was a much more attractive cover, imho.
I envy you having seen her back then. I only have the one album, but it's very dear to me.
6046. Property of Jesus - 4/13/2002 3:11:27 AM
Shadow and light.
A Joni Mitchell web site
6047. wonkers2 - 4/13/2002 3:16:24 AM
As I posted somewhere else I saw Joni when she was still Chuck and Joni Mitchell. And it only took one song to make me sure she'd make it big. She's the closest anybody ever came to turning me into a groupie or a stalker.
6048. arkymalarky - 4/13/2002 3:26:39 AM
Bob too. He loves Joni Mitchell, but his all time favorite album of hers (and probably favorite, period) is Miles of Isles. I don't know that he even owns another of her albums now, but when we began dating we listened to it a lot.
6049. wonkers2 - 4/13/2002 3:28:23 AM
I don't know that one. I am in a time warp with her early ones like "Both Sides Now."
6050. arkymalarky - 4/13/2002 3:49:41 AM
It's her double live album. I don't know how old it is, but it has BSN and the early stuff on it, not her second wave of hits.
6051. arkymalarky - 4/13/2002 3:52:47 AM
I once had a friend who played piano and we'd do "Carousel of Time" together.
6052. Property of Jesus - 4/13/2002 3:56:36 AM
Do you mean THE CIRCLE GAME?
6053. arkymalarky - 4/13/2002 4:06:08 AM
Yeah!
6054. wonkers2 - 4/13/2002 4:32:32 AM
Cap'n Dirty sez, "I ain't never heard it called a circle GAME!"
6055. fiddlercrab - 4/13/2002 9:15:38 AM
An exceptionally gifted songwriter.
And the seasons they go round and round
And the painted ponies go up and down
We're captive on the carousel of time
We can't return, we can only look behind
From where we came
And go round and round and roundIn the circle game
6056. fiddlercrab - 4/13/2002 9:17:32 AM
An exceptionally gifted songwriter.
And the seasons they go round and round
And the painted ponies go up and down
We're captive on the carousel of time
We can't return, we can only look behind
From where we came
And go round and round and round
In the circle game
Corrected.
6057. arkymalarky - 4/13/2002 6:58:12 PM
Yes, it's a pleasant and sad image at the same time, to me. I had those lines in my mind when I got offline. Much nicer than a lot of songs that tend to get stuck in my head.
Welcome to the Mote!
6058. judithathome - 4/13/2002 11:39:11 PM
Jenerator:
The International Poster Fair is comeing to Fair Park in Dallas April 26-28...it will he held in the Tower Building and to view the posters that will be for sale, go HERE.
6059. judithathome - 4/13/2002 11:40:39 PM
Drop the 'e' from coming.
6060. Rivendell - 4/14/2002 7:56:33 PM
fiddlercrab,
I was gone for most of February and March so forgive the welcome if you are not new.
Be that as it may, welcome to the FAPA thread and hope to see you again.
6061. Rivendell - 4/14/2002 7:57:23 PM
"Tulsa is probably the nicest town in OK."
How hard can that be?
6062. betty - 4/14/2002 8:27:37 PM
Read "A Movable Feast" this weekend. I didn't like Hemingway when i was in Highschool and forced to read whatever short story of his that I never did. before Sofi was born I read a ton of Henry Miller and though i liked him at the time by the time i was done with one of his tombs, I hated him. I came away from Feast rather fond of Hemingway the person and Hemingway the author. though i tend to like the imaginal...borges, pynchon, etc...there was in indescribable "good" about Hemingway's stuff that made me sure it is ok to like him. I want to say it's really clean. It's a quality that I strive for in my own work.
I've had three good books in a row...it's been sometime since i've read this much fiction.
6063. betty - 4/14/2002 8:28:01 PM
oops, wrong thread...sorry.
6064. arkymalarky - 4/14/2002 9:27:36 PM
Riv,
True, not very. It's unique, though, even without considering the relative blandness of OK.
6065. PelleNilsson - 4/14/2002 10:00:28 PM
There is a new biography of Hoagy Carmichael. I don't know much about him (except some of his songs) but I like the melody of his name. It matches, I think his songs, kind of slow and relaxed. I was surprised to see that he was born in Indiana. I had always associated him with the South.
6066. fiddlercrab - 4/16/2002 7:37:34 AM
Thanks for your kind "Welcomes".
I heard about The Mote from one of your frequent posters who also posts at another forum. I've enjoyed browsing the various threads here during the past few weeks. So, hello, Everyone.
6067. fiddlercrab - 4/16/2002 8:12:57 AM
Oh, sorry, I meant to say I've enjoyed browsing the various threads except for that Inferno thing, which seems to be populated by incoherent crazy people.
(A hundred years ago, when families had crazy members they didn't want to institutionalize, they put them in the attic. Is the Inferno your attic? Ok. I will just stay downstairs.)
6068. Property of Jesus - 4/16/2002 1:47:32 PM
Welcome, fiddler. The Inferno is where thread hosts re-position posts they can't stand. It's a power play.
It's the punishment thread, perfect because its thread host no longer reads mote.
6069. theDiva - 4/16/2002 1:59:10 PM
Welcome, fiddlercrab! Nice to 'see' a new face here.
6070. Frankster - 4/16/2002 2:35:56 PM
Welcome aboard, fiddlercrab!
For the Diva:
La-lalalala-la-la-lalalala
Te quero
enamorado
enamorado con pasion,
mira estoy loco por tu amor
los hombres
lo lloran
Y tu me haces llorar, ay, yay, yay, yay, yay, yay
No sabes como te quero ...
I'm too sleepy to decipher the rest, but you get the gist of it, right, Deev ? I'll sing it to you in person the next time we get together. Hee-hee.
...I came home for a quick nap, and what do I do ? I turn my computer on. Sheesh.
Why hasn't this thing wanted to post ? I keep hitting the post button and get squat. It's been 10 minutes already.
6071. theDiva - 4/16/2002 2:43:03 PM
Frankie
you make it soooo hard for a happily-married woman to be good! Ai-ai-AI!!!!
swoon!
6072. Frankster - 4/16/2002 2:48:10 PM
I like that song too. It was recorded by the Sandpipers about 33 years ago...I wish I had the original.
... Hey, maybe I can be your west coast cyber husband, huh ???
Shoot! I have to head back to work now...uuurrrrr.
6073. theDiva - 4/16/2002 2:56:21 PM
Er, one husband at a time is enough. You can keep singing to me in Spanish, though.
6074. Cellar Door - 4/20/2002 2:21:31 AM
The Dark Drag Queen of the Sonnets
6075. PelleNilsson - 4/26/2002 9:18:32 PM
6077. wabbit - 4/26/2002 10:09:57 PM
9. Taj Mahal (or was that a different song?)
12. Little Richard
Pelle, if you are still around, do you know of a model of the town of Göteborg, supposedly in the town hall or somewhere public?
6078. PelleNilsson - 4/26/2002 10:33:44 PM
Not Taj Mahal but Little Richard.
There is a fine model of Göteborg in the 18th century in the Museum of Architecture in Stockholm. There are less elaborate, but instructive, models of the different stages of its development in the City Museum in Göteborg, in Kruthuset ("the Gunpowder House"), a 17th century Government warehouse and one of the oldest preserved buildings.
The reason I know this is that I am from Göteborg.
6079. wabbit - 4/26/2002 10:41:40 PM
Thanks, that will help. The reason I ask is because a model of the city was made by my great uncle. My father's family is from Göteborg. I've heard about it from family members but have been unable to track it down.
6080. PelleNilsson - 4/26/2002 10:55:21 PM
You mean that model is possibly still extant somewhere in Sweden? If you e-mail me the name of your great uncle and whatever else you know about him I'll try to help.
6081. wabbit - 4/26/2002 11:16:23 PM
I think it was my Great Uncle Evald, but I'll get as much information as I can from his sister or daughter who are living near here and will forward it to you. Supposedly it was a fairly complete model of the city and was quite large, given to the city (I think) and was something of a local attraction. We thought it was still in Göteborg, but perhaps not. I'd appreciate the help, my father would be as excited as I would be to know that it is still being exhibited somewhere.
6082. Snowowl - 4/26/2002 11:17:08 PM
1. Connie Francis
8. The Everly Brothers
10.Johnny Tillotson
11. Del Shannon
I feel ancient knowing these.
6083. Snowowl - 4/26/2002 11:19:58 PM
7. Helen Shapiro
I know the rest will come to me gradually - unfortunately. I now have all this lousy music running around in my brain.
6084. PelleNilsson - 4/27/2002 9:19:55 AM
Snowowl is correct.
6085. JJBiener - 4/28/2002 1:29:52 AM
2. Neil Sedaka
9. I have a version of this by Muddy Waters, but I think someone else did the pop version of it.
6086. alistairConnor - 4/28/2002 1:37:51 AM
Hey JJ. Welcome stranger.
I'm afraid I'm just slightly too young for the quiz.
6087. JJBiener - 4/28/2002 1:39:51 AM
You are never too young to appreciate music from the past. Most of it is from before I was able to pay much attention to music, but I still know most of the songs.
Where are you these days?
6088. PelleNilsson - 4/29/2002 6:01:39 PM
There hasn't been a lot of interest in my quiz. I attribute this to Moties' phony high-brow pretensions and denial of popular culture. Here are the answers:
6089. TabouliJones - 4/29/2002 6:07:50 PM
"There hasn't been a lot of interest in my quiz. I attribute this to Moties' phony high-brow pretensions and denial of popular culture."
Or, maybe, you are just really freak'n old. :)
6090. betty - 4/29/2002 6:26:57 PM
My Mom! wasn't born when several of those songs were released.
6091. betty - 4/29/2002 6:28:28 PM
6092. PelleNilsson - 4/29/2002 6:38:52 PM
Tabouli
I am freaking old, but these songs are part of our Western heritage. Can you imagine America without the memory of Conway Twitty? Of course not.
6093. TabouliJones - 4/29/2002 6:43:24 PM
Who the hell is Conway Twitty. Kidding.
Hello darling, nice to see ya, it's been a long time, you're just as lovely as you used to be . . .
6094. PelleNilsson - 4/29/2002 6:51:41 PM
Conway Twitty:
6095. betty - 4/29/2002 6:53:16 PM
I can't possibly be american.
6096. theDiva - 4/29/2002 7:47:00 PM
Pelle
Good quiz, you had me stumped on a number of those. Thanks for posting it.
6097. glendajean - 4/29/2002 9:31:56 PM
Cliff Richards never had a presence in the United States except when he participated in televised Billy Graham crusades.
6098. OhioSTOPAS - 4/29/2002 9:33:47 PM
Didn't he have a comeback in about 1980 with a hit or two? ("It's so funny/ How we don't talk anymore . . .")
6099. OhioSTOPAS - 4/29/2002 9:38:30 PM
For the record, I'm nowhere near old enough to have ever heard of any of these people.
(That's my story and I'm sticking to it.)
6100. rubberducky - 4/29/2002 9:57:48 PM
no, but i bet Gene Shalit is...
6101. theDiva - 4/29/2002 9:59:55 PM
you mean
GENE FUCKING SHALIT
don't you?
6102. rubberducky - 4/29/2002 10:00:48 PM
ah, yes, that's the one.
i wondered why my post looked wrong somehow.
6103. theDiva - 4/29/2002 10:02:23 PM
it's all in the wrist....
6104. Frankster - 4/29/2002 10:05:41 PM
Shoot! I missed a pop music quiz I would have done well in. The stumps would have been numbers "3""4" and "5". And, that Twitty coif just gets to me everytime.
... I never quite understood the appeal of Cliff Richard ? He's very big across that Atlantic pond, you know.
Didn't he have a comeback in about 1980 with a hit or two? ("It's so funny/ How we don't talk anymore . . .")
Yep, that was it.
... Last night I was in some weird melancholic instrumental mood for some reason and sat on the loveseat for an hour listening to the likes of:
Horst Jankowski
Perez Prado
Percy Faith
Mr Acker Bilk ( [ahem] That's MISTER Acker Bilk )
Bill Purcell
Henry Mancini
(snif)
;)
6105. rubberducky - 4/29/2002 10:08:22 PM
yeah, you'd think i would know that, eh?
6106. rubberducky - 4/29/2002 10:08:53 PM
er, that was to diva, btw
6107. OhioSTOPAS - 4/29/2002 10:09:29 PM
All right, you two - I didn't come here to be insulted.
That's what the Politics thread is for.
6108. Property of Jesus - 4/30/2002 9:27:18 PM
I just read that Joni is a heavy smoker. No wonder her voice has changed.
6109. betty - 4/30/2002 9:58:45 PM
today was listening to Devine and Statton's 1990 "Prince of Wales". It is a masterpiece, unfortunately they are completely unheard of by most people. D&S are a jazzy folky Duo, Devine provides the exquisite guitar work and Statton sings like an angel. More specifically a Welsh Angel. There is an odd bit of Welsh Nationalism thrown about and when Allison Statton sings "I wish I was/the Prince of Wales" i'm pretty sure it's not about wanting big ears and a big bank account.
All of the material is orginal except the radically sweet rendition of Bizarre Love Triangle, one of the album's highlights. Picking a personal favourite from this consistently amazing album is difficult, but I would highlight "Friend of the Family" and "Break Up Your Heart".
We literally spent years searching for this album, the copy we had was almost completely worn out when we finally located a tape of it in the Netherlands. We are still actively searching for a CD because we fear that the tape will disintegrate or wear out.
If you are ever lucky enough to stumble upon this gem pick it up.
6110. theDiva - 5/1/2002 6:08:59 PM
6111. betty - 5/5/2002 7:43:15 PM
ten bands I never get tired of listening to (in no order)...
the Beatles
the Who
Rolling Stones
the Police
Nirvana
Mercury Rev
The Jam
the Clash
Crass
Parliament/P-funk
6112. Cellar Door - 5/7/2002 10:43:49 PM
I'm going to be be doing a panel discussion on Warhol on May 24th and the Museum of Contemporary Art here in L.A. -- which is hosting a giant Warhol show. The panle discussion will be broadcast live on KPCC-FM's "Air Talk" show.
I'll let y'all know more of the details as they become available.
6113. Daniel Sickles - 5/14/2002 8:46:43 PM
Ten Artists/Bands I Never Get Tired of Listening To:
Steve Earle
X
Lucinda Williams
Bruce Springsteen
The V-Roys
Dave Alvin
The Beatles
Son Volt
Wilco
Kim Richey
Speaking of Wilco
The New Wilco - Maybe the best record in a decade
6114. Daniel Sickles - 5/14/2002 8:48:28 PM
Bob Mould. I never get sick of listening to Mould.
6115. betty - 5/14/2002 10:53:16 PM
One of my bands was touring in support for one of your bands this last year...Mercury Rev for Wilco.
If I was going by solo performers or including anything other than R&R my list would be VERY different. (In fact I doubt more than two or three of them would be on the list)
Showed your list to one of my co-workers and she said "Oh My GOD! Those are great bands!"
My list is pretty "safe" but it's really honest. I can't say that I never get tired of listening to Dave Carter and Tracy Grahmar(sp?), for example because i've only heard them for about a year and a half...In a decade my list may look very different.
6116. Daniel Sickles - 5/15/2002 11:22:12 PM
betty
My list is pretty much a roots rock, alt-country tour de force, with the exception of Mould, early X (they later became very alt-country, Alvin was in their lineup for a record, and they had an alter-ego -The Knitters - that was very good and very non-electric) and the Beatles.
How would you describe Mercury Rev?
6117. betty - 5/16/2002 1:44:30 PM
by complete coincidence I got a box of tapes from a friend in the biz yesterday and one of them is Son Volt...I will check out.
Mercury Rev...hmmm...anything i say about them will do them an injustice. They have some prog rock feel...think Dark Side of the Moon...with a jazz fusiony sound...think Steely Dan...with a very Noisey sensibility...think MC5 (gosh how come they didn't make it on my list...guess it wasn't completely honest). Now add two doses of lush harmony and melody...yes, Pet Sounds...and Frappe. They aren't derivative (sp?), they are literate and use the work others have done before them to venture into the fringes.
Their guitarist studied with legendary Minamalist composer Tony Conrad and they can really play the hell out of their instruments. There are some comparisons to be made to Can (gosh they were left off the list too?), classically trained and in their heyday appreciated by a small group of people but as they matured they found a larger audience and started making music that was lush, orchestrated and could pass for movie scores.
This all makes them sound like snobby fare...they might be, but it's not an intellectual appreciation for me, there is something soulful about them. I found them when I was a teenager and completely unable to be sophisticated about my choices in RnR...Obviously, I adore them.
6118. Daniel Sickles - 5/17/2002 2:14:06 AM
It's interesting you brought up Steely Dan. I'm generally not a fan, but at the same time, I'll fight over many, many beers and unfortunately, cigarettes, that Ricky (Rikkie?) Don't Lose That Number is the best pop song ever recorded.
6119. Cellar Door - 5/17/2002 2:56:23 AM
Among my Faves:
Dusty Springfield
Nico
Pet Shop Boys
Nick De Caro
Beach Boys /Brian Wilson
Van Dyke Parks
Randy Newman
Rufus Wainwright
Bob Dorough
Lena Horne
Annie Ross
Helen Merrill
Eva Cassidy
Maria Callas
6120. Property of Jesus - 5/17/2002 6:06:06 AM
Terrific article on LOVE & THEFT
BOB DYLAN: "He steals what he loves and loves what he steals."
6121. PelleNilsson - 5/22/2002 7:06:40 PM
I mentioned somewhere that Stockholm celebrates its 750th anniversary. The year 1252 is somewhat arbitrary based on the fact that the first extant letter released by a regent of Sweden, Birger Jarl, and datelined Stockholm is from that year.
The white tower in the center of the picture, known as "Birger Jarl's Tower" was long thought to be from that time but is now known to be a couple of centuries younger.
The church tower (made of cast iron) in the background belongs to the royal burial church. Birger Jarl, who died in 1266, is not buried there, however. He is buried in this church in the west of Sweden.
It dates from the 12th century and belonged to a Cistercian monastry, now in ruins. The Stockholmians have never liked the idea that their founding father is buried far from Stockholm. The grave is now being opened in order to determine the age of the remains. It was last done in the 1920s but dating techniques have improved since then. The opening is sponsored by a TV production company making a documentary about early Stockholm.
The people whose parish church it is, and who were not consulted about the operation, are aghast at what they see as a violation of sacred space for commercial purposes.
6122. PelleNilsson - 5/22/2002 7:23:01 PM
The area was rich, as it had to be in order to support a monastry, and it had been rich for a long time. This hoard of gold, weighing about 7 kilos (15 pounds) found just a few miles from the church is from around 450 AD.
This kind of unworked gold provided the raw material for things like this double necklace weighing in at one kg:
Detail:
But there were smaller decorative pieces too:
6123. betty - 5/22/2002 7:31:19 PM
Pelle,
your cast iron church tower interests me Pelle, the Swedenborgians in Bryn Athyn (sp?) PA have this very peculiar church (I can't seem to find a picture of it one the web) made of some odd metal, can't remember the name of the metal, but it's a really good conducter of electricity and this church has been hit by lightening an unimaginable number of times...and it has hydraulics to raise and lower one room...and nothing is symetrical, it is just weird...might you know something about this?
6124. betty - 5/22/2002 7:33:35 PM
6125. PelleNilsson - 5/22/2002 7:54:48 PM
betty
Swedenborg is much better known abroad than here in Sweden, where he was branded as a heretic and practically forgotten until this century. His writings are considered fairly impenetrable.
That cast iron tower is from the late 19th century. The technique for casting huge structures was developed in England. If you (or anyone else) ever visits London, spend half a day to look at some of the 19th century railway stations. They are almost unbelievably slender and graceful constructions in cast iron and glass, now cleaned from soot and grime.
But maybe you have those in the US as well?
6126. PelleNilsson - 5/22/2002 7:58:14 PM
Here is a pic of the church:
The structure in front is a later addition.
6127. PelleNilsson - 5/22/2002 8:09:51 PM
In fact, it is the burial chapel of the Bernadottes, the current royal family.
6128. Property of Jesus - 5/24/2002 5:19:43 PM
"SHAKEY": Neil Young Keeps on Rockin'
6129. wabbit - 5/27/2002 9:05:17 PM
CNN has a nice piece on Les Paul today. He's still performing and will be 87 years old in a couple weeks. I posted briefly about seeing him in February, but let me once again encourage anyone in NYC to try to get to The Iridium Jazz Club on a Monday night to see him play. You won't be sorry.
6130. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 6/5/2002 5:01:29 AM
6131. judithathome - 6/5/2002 5:31:17 AM
Too cool! Is that a triptych or three separate pieces shot close together?
6132. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 6/5/2002 6:17:50 PM
Thanks for the response, Judith, It's a four foot digital painting--my first. It is a triptych entitled: Lazarus Creamated.
6133. judithathome - 6/5/2002 6:22:45 PM
It is extremely striking and the coloration is beautiful. The colors look like his spirit or essence leaving the body...my favorite take on what happens to us after death. His colors become part of the existing whole and are taken up by everyone.
6134. marjoribanks - 6/5/2002 6:23:47 PM
Wiz,
Your art is becoming more significant, even important. All of which may be a pompous way of saying I like it more as you've developed.
More comments in The Good Life please. Besides photographing those places very very well, what did you think of them? I'm touched and happy that you followed my recommendation to check out Camden (not to mention my old haunt of Fitzroy Sq.)
6135. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 6/5/2002 6:52:03 PM
Thanks marj. We had a very inspirational stay and I adored the area around Primrose Hill--in fact I'd love to move there. I'll post more In TGL about it, later.
6136. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 6/5/2002 6:57:48 PM
Judith, thanks again. I decided to see what would happen if I took a digital shot of a sculptural figure and meld it in Photosop with other images that occupy my sense of mystery and wonder.
For example the figure on the right is illuminated by a galaxy in space that reminded me of a kind of cosmic vagina.
It would have been impossible to have conceived that look (for me at least) without Photoshop.
6137. marjoribanks - 6/5/2002 7:02:36 PM
Wiz,
Just for you, I will post tomorrow a photograph of my paintings (by a great Indian artist) which meld Christian iconography of religious implements with Tantric symbolism of vaginas and penises.
6138. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 6/5/2002 7:09:01 PM
Fab-I'm intrigued!
[I also struck by how much the shrouded figure looks like it's in a burka.]
6139. CalGal - 6/5/2002 10:33:56 PM
Dee Dee Ramone, founding member of Ramones, found dead
6140. Ms. No - 6/5/2002 10:59:36 PM
Sad, but not surprising. I caught DeeDee at a small club in Venice (California, not Italy) about a year ago. He was supposedly clean at the time, but he was so fried from the years of abuse that he couldn't even remember the tunes.
This is tough, because as everyone knows, he never wrote a song with more than 3 chords, you scream all the lyrics so they're unintelligible anyway and none of them are of more than 3:15 in duration.
You should be able to fake your way through it....unless of course you happened to be DeeDee. He would stop in the middle, yell at his wife---who was playing bass for him---and then launch into the next tune which he would forget halfway through.
It was actually a very cool show.
6141. theDiva - 6/6/2002 1:54:57 PM
Wiz
Thanks for posting the image....I'm sorry I didn't respond sooner. It's beautiful and intriguing. Also, could you please explain the technique of digital painting?
6142. betty - 6/6/2002 3:24:28 PM
this is a beautiful tribute to Joey Ramone that appeared on HipMama but it's impossible to link directly to it so I wanted to post it for DeeDee...they only played one song but it was the best damn rock song anyone ever played!
RIP Joey Ramone
by Bee Lavender
In 1984 I was thirteen years old and my neighborhood consisted of three streets of low-income tract housing dropped down in the middle of a forest in the far southern end of a militarized county on the Puget Sound. I was recovering from a series of opportunistic infections following a cancer diagnosis. I was lying on my couch, still sore from surgeries to remove cancer from my lymph system and a cyst from my jaw, drifting in a suicidal depression. The most interesting things on my horizon were radioactive isotope therapy and surgery that would require popping my right eyeball out of the socket to tinker with some muscles. My doctors had scheduled the surgeries to coincide with winter and spring break, so I wouldn't miss school.
There may have been some anecdotal value in having a macabre illness, if I had lived in a civilized society. My reality was that kids on the bus tried to set my hair on fire, and my childhood friends threw rocks at me as I walked home from school. My only remaining friend in the neighborhood was a boy profoundly damaged by grand mal seizures, who no longer knew his own name.
I was on the couch with the remote control, flipping through channels and hit Showtime, and a movie called Rock 'N' Roll High School. I remember the feel of the movie-- the dumb, funny, aggressive, loopy, hyper, disaffected emotions expressed at great speed. The anti-authoritarian call to revolution broke through my depression and I sat right up.
6143. betty - 6/6/2002 3:25:08 PM
I saw a blueprint, a plan, a way to escape, a way to scream fuck off to a world that hadn't given me much to be thankful for.
This wasn't my first exposure to the music coming out of New York and CBGB; as a little kid I used to play my parents Blondie records on a portable Disco Sound Machine, singing along on the attached microphone as the lights on the console flashed. I loved Joan Jett and at age ten, my gang of girls ran through the streets screaming I love rock and roll, put another dime in the juke box baby... But it was the first time I noticed a political message in the music, and a way to find community.
I didn't fit in with my peer group, didn't wear the standard tight jeans and sweaters patterned with little dogs, or jean jackets with wooly collars. My grandmother was a junk hound, and we spent endless days and weeks picking through thrift stores and yard sales and free boxes. By the fourth grade I was wearing high top Converse and polyester castoffs, ancient silk, old man hats, random tattered assortments of clothing that irritated my mother and made my classmates wonder. The clothes were bad enough, but the cancer meant that I could never pass as normal, never find a place in the straight world.
But I still believed in a couple of apparent truths. That my parents had the right to tell me what to do. That school was important. That teachers and doctors and parents knew best, even when they were demonstrably wrong.
Know someone who would be interested in this topic? Send the page to a friend.
Rock 'N' Roll High School showed something that made more sense- that parents and teachers were often not only wrong but sometimes crazy and dangerous. That we shouldn't accept institutions that tried to annihilate our youth and what we knew to be true. That we should just blow the whole thing up, and dance.
6144. betty - 6/6/2002 3:25:20 PM
Maybe that wasn't the intended message of the movie. But I went in to the bathroom and shaved half of my head. That week, I calmly explained that I was going to drop out of school, and when my doctor and mother resisted I shrugged and said I would burn the school down.
Thanks to the Ramones, I became an eighth grade dropout, another punk kid railing against society, and through that found a real community and way to exist that was true and right and beautiful. I gave up the costume and went back to school eventually, and was never ideological enough to claim association with the larger punk movement. But if not for that movie, that week, I might have just given in to the disease or sped up the process with an overdose of pain medication or a few judicious cuts to arteries. I was saved by punk rock, my life was saved in a real way.
6145. theDiva - 6/6/2002 3:28:00 PM
RIP DeeDee
Ah, fond memories of my misspent youth. CBGBs and the Palladium on 14th St.
6146. theDiva - 6/6/2002 3:34:46 PM
Sickles, re: Steely Dan's 'Ricky, Don't Lose that Number' - opening riff is lifted directly from Horace Silver's Song For My Father.
6147. betty - 6/6/2002 3:42:52 PM
steve burns (from blues clues) is making music (for adults)! and it's not terrible!
there's a great, and really funny interview with him at hipMama...I think I'm in love!
6148. marjoribanks - 6/6/2002 3:56:45 PM
In 1982, I was a freshman in high school, a posh establishment where I was required to be blazered and tied all day, a place which served as my uncomfortable crucible for American inculturation. At home, I still ate as I had in India two years ago, still bossed around the same servant we'd had two years ago, still obsessed about cricket.
But school had its own social and cultural logic. I became a Yankees fan because I had to in a sea of Mets fans, I too loosened the required tie and wore colorful t-shirts underneath the formal cuffed shirt. I feigned disinterest in our lessons, preferring instead to pretend total obsession with basketball, because the basketball team had cheerleaders.
There was a kid in my class, a Mohawked kid just like the one in the story above. He was a disaffected half-Greek whose older brother played drums for the Bush Tetras (a punk band those in the know in 1982 idolized). He ignored the mainstream avenues to acceptance in high school, but he had a girlfriend, a luminously pretty girl, also half-Greek. I wanted this girl, more than anything else in my life.
The rest is a sordid but short story. I found out that the girl loved the Clash and the Ramones even more than the Bush Tetras, then insisted that my bewlildered-but-travelling Dad bring me back Clash shirts from the UK. Then, using my mom's hairdresser as go-between (this whole story takes place in Queens) I got DeeDee Ramone's autograph and displayed it around at school while pretending to be a hard-core Clash and Ramones fan.
I got the girl. Thanks, Dee Dee. Rest in Peace.
6149. theDiva - 6/6/2002 4:04:51 PM
How cool! I remember the Bush Tetras! Very cute story, Banks, you smoothie.
6150. marjoribanks - 6/6/2002 4:20:49 PM
Ah, 1982, Diva, a year that does yearn to be addressed as 'back in the day'.
On a Fine Arts note, I have again flipped through a book entitled 'Back in the Days'. It consists of photos from those years at the beginning of the hip-hip era. The photos make me laugh (Members Only jackets, the first poplar ranges of Kangol Caps, the postures) and also nostalgic.
Back in the day, on the basketball court, who knew that the styles around us were going to become iconographic.
6151. theDiva - 6/6/2002 4:22:26 PM
oh my Lord, Kangol caps. Hey, you ever play at the West Fourth street court back then? Those were a buncha trash talkin somebodies.
6152. marjoribanks - 6/6/2002 4:26:19 PM
Diva,
That is a high court you're talking about. I could never have played there in my teens, the pressure was far too great and my game not up to it.
I've since played there, though never on those summer weekends when suddenly that little court becomes the center of the basketball universe. No, I have respect for that shrine.
6153. theDiva - 6/6/2002 4:34:56 PM
I love it.
Oh, I know what I wanted to ask you. Is Googies still open? You know, on Sullivan Street?
6154. betty - 6/6/2002 4:35:33 PM
Shit, that court ain't nothing...I can take you to at least five courts in Philly that've got better action. ;-)
one of the things I remember about my first trip to NYC was seeing a commercial or movie being shot on that court...It was the first time I had seen a professional set up and it looked so much more EVERYTHING than what I had done/seen in college.
6155. betty - 6/6/2002 4:39:10 PM
I'll have alf tell his CBGB and Ramones stories when he gets back from the gym.
6156. theDiva - 6/6/2002 4:40:55 PM
how old is alf, about my age? I wonder if I ever ran into him a time or two back then.
6157. marjoribanks - 6/6/2002 4:45:13 PM
Dunno, Diva.
Betty,
I am a big fan of John Edgar Wideman. Are you familar with him? A Philly ghetto kid made good, Rhodes Scholar and Oxford teammate of Bill Bradley, one of the premier African-American writers, a basketball man. He has written about the Philly courts.
Don't be overestimating Philly in comparison to NYC.
In any case, I highly recommend his recent 'Hoop Roots'.
6158. betty - 6/6/2002 4:49:04 PM
No, he's a bit younger than you, closer to Marj's age, 34...he wasn't really a punker though, he was the OW (Original Wigger). Dj'd a lot down around alphabet city...to here the stories he was really fucking good.
He has a great book he's working on at the moment with a really funny chapter about how the other white kids in his projects used to make fun of him for going up to Harlem to buy "disco" records, but those kids wound up breakdancing and all that shit.
6159. theDiva - 6/6/2002 4:55:36 PM
oh, he's just a whippersnapper! He's even younger than my husband. I sort of remember your saying he was so old, though I guess you're pretty young, aren't you.
Interesting, though. Where I came from, the Italian, Spanish and black kids went to the same clubs and listened to the same music.
6160. marjoribanks - 6/6/2002 4:56:08 PM
I'm 34 too, by the way. February 1968.
6161. betty - 6/6/2002 4:56:18 PM
marj,
really, you can't overstate the argument for Philly's street game. It's just not possible.
I haven't ever heard of Wideman and really, I have a certain distaste for sports writing or writing that relies on sports as metaphor.
6162. marjoribanks - 6/6/2002 5:03:26 PM
Sigh.
John Edgar Wideman's writing is not per se about sports. He is simply a great American writer. Please do look him up, I submit that you will be surprised.
Secondly, betty, I never accused you of 'overstating' merely 'overestimating'. I know from all sources that there is very quality ball played in Philly, it is just that the Mecca of street basketball does happen to be the blacktop of NYC.
6163. betty - 6/6/2002 5:04:29 PM
He's 8 years older than I am...I wouldn't say he's a whipper snapper.
Alf's project was mostly Irish kids...and you know how relations are between the Irish and the Italian...Alfred went to LaSalle High School (right around the corner from CB's) and most of his friends were black or Puerto Rican...I mean there used to be an Italian neighborhood in Harlem...anyway, i think the Italian/Spanish/Black polyglot was true for New York then too, just alf was not in an Italian neighborhood...He lived in Yorkville, right on the edge of Spanish Harlem.
6164. betty - 6/6/2002 5:10:15 PM
Marj,
regarding New York/Philly street ball...they are two different animals which reflect the realities of living in those cities. Because I prefer Philly as a place to live, I prefer Philly basketball.
I'll look up Wideman if you really think i'll like it.
did you ever get into the hip-hop/rap scene?
6165. theDiva - 6/6/2002 5:13:37 PM
34's on the edge of 'snapperhood.
Ah, and his being in Yorkville does put a different spin on things.
6166. betty - 6/6/2002 5:18:08 PM
yeah, a real different spin...just wait till his book is done.
6167. marjoribanks - 6/6/2002 5:22:05 PM
I got into it, Betty, to the extent that it was the soundtrack to my teenage years including all the time I spent playing basketball on playgrounds around NYC.
Philly ball. Hah.
6168. betty - 6/6/2002 5:30:10 PM
Philly ball. Hah.
That's all right marj, you stay in New York, and make sure you tell all your friends to stay right the hell out of Philly, I don't want them ruining it. ;-)
i was just asking 'bout rap and all cuz i was wondering if maybe you and alf had crossed paths, but it seems unlikely if your exposure was through basketball courts.
6169. ivan osokin - 6/6/2002 6:15:06 PM
hi...
yes, i grew up in manhattan and spent the early/mid 80s as a village/alphabet city staple.
somewhere around 80-81, i discovered a radio station, WHBI, coming out of newark...it was Mr. Magic's Disco Showcase, i learned about it because one of the bigger kids in our projects (right up on the edge of spanish harlem) was going uptown and buying tapes of this stuff called "rapping"...grandmaster flash, kook herc, grandwizard theodore...and i liked it. the kids who were my age...angry irish boys...made fun of it and subsequently made fun of me for liking it. so i listened in secret, alas, and snuck uptown myself to buy records.
around 1982, the angry irish kids had all started breakdancing...even though they still called me names and made fun of me for already being a few years into the music.
i started DJing in 82 as well, doing jams in playgrounds uptown and downtown, though mostly alphabet city. had some interesting stories. did some club work occasionally in 85-86, but then i gave up on it all because i couldn't afford to buy equipment or records at the pace i would need to. being a club DJ would have helped, but they found out how young i was and stopped hiring me...then i couldn't get into the record pools cuz i wasn't in a club, etc..
here's me in 1982: i'm a skinny sicilian who looked hispanic, wearing a le tigre shirt with matching LEE jeans (with permanent crease), a name-belt-buckle, matching puma sneakers (kept impeccably clean), fat laces, and a 6 inch blond rat-tail coming down from my neat, jet-black hair.
god i was a geek.
6170. ivan osokin - 6/6/2002 6:16:27 PM
...and i sucked at basketball and hated to dance, so DJing gave me an excuse to be cerebral and aloof...to stand on the sides and just observe.
it's amazing when i hear kids talking about "old school rap" and referring to people who started rapping in the 1990s, when there had been 10-15 years of stuff going on before.
guess ya hadda be there.
6171. theDiva - 6/6/2002 6:17:12 PM
oh, how I remember that look.
6172. theDiva - 6/6/2002 6:17:53 PM
yeah, it's funny, my daughter's eyes bugged when I told her I was dancing to rap back in 1978.
6173. ivan osokin - 6/6/2002 6:18:40 PM
i had all those great records, diva...i know them well. in recent years i have lost those records, sadly...i had some doozys.
6174. TabouliJones - 6/6/2002 7:16:25 PM
I envy all of your youthful music experiences. You were all lucky enough to stumble onto or be lead by your crotches to music scenes that have credibility to this day. Where marjori had the good fortune of falling for a Ramones fan, I fell for a Duran Duran fan and became a Durannie in earnest and without payoff -- my Simon Lebon do not being enough to lure my beloved from her Nick Rhodes clone of a boyfriend.
Then after that sad episode, another wayward crush led me to the dreadful bubblegum sounds of Platinum Blonde -- a band most here have unlikely heard of, but whose godawfulness can easily be gleaned from the fact that they once performed an encore version of Twist and Shout, featuring John Stamos -- yes, John Stamos! -- of all people on guest vocals.
My next musical phase was that staple of suburban teenage boydom: the Led Zeppelin obsession. Which was then followed by a late teen fixation on the maudlin tunes of The Smiths and Morrissey.
Fortunately, my twenties were a high point of good music and great concerts that I should be able to brag about in my George Kostanza years and beyond.
6175. CalGal - 6/6/2002 7:29:56 PM
I saw Van Halen in 1978, which was pretty early. But generally I have no taste in "cool" music. How I ended up with a son in a punk rock band is more than I can figure.
6176. TabouliJones - 6/6/2002 7:39:03 PM
I also envy New Yorkers in general for their unrivaled music scene. Toronto actually ranks as one of the better music cities in N. America, especially in terms of alternative pop and rock music and the amount of local talent. But, New York dwarfs it and all other cities on all fronts.
My two New York music experiences were both excellent: Catpower (aka Chan Marshall) at the Bowery ballroom and The Tom Tom Club at Tramps (I think) -- both on Halloween weekend of 1998 or 1997.
This summer I have one overriding objective, and that is to see The Rolling Stones pending 'secret' bar gig in Toronto. The Stones are rehearsing in Toronto for their upcoming world tour and it is expected that they will play a surprise gig at a local bar -- as they have done the past three or four times that they have rehearsed in Toronto. The venue is always kept secret until the last minute and there is always much speculation and jockeying among local scenesters for the inside dope. This year, I think I have an inside edge on the likely venue (which isn't one of the usual suspects, but will appear obvious in retrospect) and am determined to catch the show.
6177. ivan osokin - 6/6/2002 7:54:43 PM
ya know...most of the great bands that came out of NYC were not made up of people from manhattan itself...many were kids from queens and brooklyn and often long island.
new york serves the purpose of being the place where people from the outer lands can meet and converge...it's the island that's not an island.
growing up in manhattan, i met fewer and fewer people actually from manhattan as i got older. by the time i was 22, i don't think i had any friends who were from manhattan originally.
6178. arkymalarky - 6/6/2002 7:59:39 PM
The straight parents are always the ones with the punk rock sons. Kids with freak parents rebel by becoming geeks.
Seriously, though, it does amuse me to see a cleancut conservative kid whose dad has hair halfway down his back. I've encountered quite a few of those over the years.
I have never liked the Stones or Led Zeppelin.
There. I said it.
The most out-there band I liked in high school was Sparks. I don't think I could sit through one song, now.
Bob is 8 years older than I am and he's had better concert experiences than I have. The best stuff to come to AR was when I was a bit too young (12-14) and had fuddy-duddy parents who wouldn't let me go, so I had to hear about David Bowie and the like second hand.
The concert Bob reminisces about the most was James Brown back in the late '60s when he and his friend were the only two white people in the whole concert--don't remember where in AR it was. He loved that concert from start to finish, and he's not that much of a James Brown fan wrt his recordings.
6179. betty - 6/6/2002 8:00:50 PM
it's easy to have great stuff in New York...I'm infinitely more impressed by how fucking cool the music coming out of Detroit is. and I must add, Buffalo has had a consistantly impressive music scene since Terry Reilly, Tony Conrad and other minimalists came there influencing a rather wide range of musical genres.
Stuff from those cities is less likely to be heard because there isn't an A&R fuck-nut on every corner.
6180. arkymalarky - 6/6/2002 8:01:10 PM
I had tickets to see Lynyrd Skynyrd when their plane crashed and the concert was cancelled, and I can't for the life of me remember what I did with them. They ought to be worth something to someone, shouldn't they?
6181. betty - 6/6/2002 8:02:53 PM
arky,
E-BAY!
6182. arkymalarky - 6/6/2002 8:06:42 PM
If I can find them I will. They're not that sentimental to me--obviously, or I guess I'd know where they are.
Y'know, some popular music is getting bearable for me again lately, from what I've been catching on tv, after about five years where the only person of interest (baggage and all) was eminem.
And I melt like a teenager over Chad Kroeger.
6183. ivan osokin - 6/6/2002 8:18:39 PM
speaking of eminem, who i have little familiarty with other than hearing about him...i heard the new single from his latest cd and i actually liked it! jeeeezzz....go figure.
6184. arkymalarky - 6/6/2002 8:19:36 PM
I love the Marshall Mathers LP, PC or no.
6185. CalGal - 6/6/2002 8:21:50 PM
The straight parents are always the ones with the punk rock sons.
Fortunately Spawn doesn't look like the kid in that commercial about talking to your teens. But that's a good commercial anyway, and I like to think I'm like the mom in that one.
6186. PelleNilsson - 6/6/2002 8:23:01 PM
ivan
Off-topic time test. I reckon it is 2.22 pm EST now. Correct?
6187. ivan osokin - 6/6/2002 8:23:26 PM
yes
6188. arkymalarky - 6/6/2002 8:27:13 PM
Mose tickles me. She's more conservative than I am, but she's been wanting her navel pierced and Bob and I said ok, but when we took her to the only place where she could get it done--a tattoo and piercing parlour in Hot Springs, she took a gander at the clientele outside and changed her mind.
6189. TabouliJones - 6/6/2002 8:30:35 PM
Speaking of contemporary music and a propos of our friend Pelle, tomorrow I will be seeing The Hives -- A Swedish garage rock band (of all things) that is apparently all the rage in England and currently attracting a following among Toronto music buffs, who are always keen to glom onto the latest London music fads. Look for my report Monday.
6190. betty - 6/6/2002 8:33:01 PM
Tabouli,
I've heard good, good things about the Hives.
yer not a Mercury Rev fan by any chance are you?
6191. CalGal - 6/6/2002 8:33:59 PM
Arky,
Ha! I'd be fine with ear piercing in the lobe, could maybe be swayed towards piercings up the ear--but not easily. Other than that, I'd get squicked quick. Fortunately, Spawn has never even asked.
6192. TabouliJones - 6/6/2002 8:36:24 PM
Actually, I haven't even heard of them. I will check them out, though.
My best friend usually introduces me to new bands and points me in the right direction when it comes to concerts. If it weren't for him, I'd probably warp my brain listening to Leonard Cohen all day, every day.
What's the skinny on Mercury Rev?
6193. TabouliJones - 6/6/2002 8:45:26 PM
I just checked and Mercury Rev will be playing in Toronto in August. I am tempted to see them on your say-so. Unfortunately, though, their show is part of a larger show featuring Oasis (a band I am indifferent to) at one of the shittiest venues in the city -- the dreaded Molson Amphithatre. If they add a club date, I promise to check them out, however.
6194. betty - 6/6/2002 8:47:51 PM
odd mixture, early stuff was noisey as hell but extrodinairy melody. their newer stuff is really plush and orchstrated. very dreamy but also dynamic. People who like them tend to like Radiohead's newer stuff but i find Radiohead boring as hell.
they usually have free mp3s and such at their website .
If you like Radiohead you should check out my Steve Burns link up thread. He had Dave Friedman producing some of his stuff and Rick Rubin doing other stuff. weird.
6195. betty - 6/6/2002 8:48:49 PM
ugh, spelling.
6196. TabouliJones - 6/6/2002 9:03:05 PM
Thanks for the link betty. I am listening to them now. They sound great. Its a really trippy, mellow, sound mixed in with a nice pop flavouring. It reminds of some of the Brit Pop I have listened to over the years -- Radiohead (like you said) being the most obvious comparison.
I see they are from Buffalo. Another Buffalo success story that comes to mind is Ani DeFranco. I never got into her myself, but she used to play Toronto all the time and she receives consistant raves in these parts.
6197. betty - 6/6/2002 9:12:11 PM
Ani DeFranco...well, she's not really my thing, but yes she has been wildly successful on her own terms, more or less...i do find that admirable, but I'd rather not listen to her music if i don't have to.
the local classical station is offering some sort of "get away" package and they keep playing a few licks from Vacation in the background of the ad...it's just an odd juxtapostion.
6198. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 6/6/2002 11:18:39 PM
Yikes--lot's of activity around here!
Thanks for the response Deev.
" . . . Also, could you please explain the technique of digital painting?
Any image digitized or pixelated in a computer can be printed now, on a variety of materials, including canvas. So think of the photo-silk-screens of Andy Warhol and Robert Rauchenberg which used new technologies from the sixties to express a Pop look.
They passed ink (thick paint) through a screen on a canvas surface and then, when the ink was dry, painted over the various images allowing some of the original silk-screen to show through the subsequent layers of paint.
The triptych image was first printed on a five foot wide, 8 color, ink jet printer using archival inks and a large roll of canvas instead of paper.
My long term goals have to do with public art commissions, and this has been an experimental part of the evolutionary process to learn what's doable . . . combining the documentation of my inner life (my brother's somewhat recent death), expanding my so called oeuvre to include the figure . . . and hopefully to eventually provide an income outside the very rigged university/gallery/museum system.
It's all a ridiculous long shot, of course, but what would you expect from the son of a bookie?
One of my first goals began at The Fray, years ago, that is to say, to really master Photoshop so I could manipulate any image available in unique and powerful ways. I think my patience and tenacity is beginning to be rewarded--I'm encouraged at least--but all is writ on water, as the saying goes.
6199. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 6/6/2002 11:20:23 PM
By the way, I loved the Ramones story, marj!
6200. godlessclif - 6/7/2002 12:43:16 AM
I can't beleive Dee Dee Ramone is dead. I want to be sedated.
6201. theDiva - 6/8/2002 5:52:44 PM
Wiz
amazing and very, very cool. Please keep posting your images...I never tire of them. Gracie is here with me and she is mightily impressed. We're off now to look at your site.
6202. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 6/8/2002 8:21:21 PM
Thanks . . . and I never tire of your unique spirit and grace.
6203. judithathome - 6/8/2002 8:35:26 PM
This city is being hit by a plague of loss of support for the Arts...I hadn't realized how widely spread it had become until I attended my first board meeting for Fort Worth Theatre the other night. Some organizantions have lost 50 to 70% of their support and at our theater in particular, we've lost tremendous backing from season ticket holders. Other theaters in the area have lost a per centage of the season ticket base, also.
I know times are tough but aren't we being told everything is rosy and to just spend and be happy but vigilent? I think the reality of it is, people are not too intent on support for the arts.
6204. Property of Jesus - 6/8/2002 8:42:05 PM
Translation: The "arts" aren't what they used to be, considering the trash that's considered art.
People are too smart to follow the lead of idiots and phonies.
It's all over now, baby blue.
6205. wabbit - 6/8/2002 8:48:02 PM
Judith,
Sunday Morning had a piece on the new Cowgirl Museum in Ft. Worth. Did you catch it?
6206. Property of Jesus - 6/8/2002 8:52:20 PM
See what I mean? In Dallas, no less.
As if Judith would know anything about cowgirls, let alone how often they get the blues
6207. judithathome - 6/8/2002 8:57:34 PM
No, but I have friends who attended the private opening earlier in the week and at dinner last night, they told all of us about how nice it is so I'm not too upset to miss the report on it...though I love Sunday Morning. I was fearful it would be a little corny but have been assured it's not. Plan to go maybe next weekend.
That is one example of when money talks in this town in support of the arts; another is the Bass Performance Hall. POJ's attitude notwithstanding, I think we have the very opposite of trash to offer in the theatre community here. He seemed somewhat smitten with Shakespeare lately; we have a season of Shakespeare which has been canceled due to lack of funding.
Though I've no doubt he woud be the first to recoginze idiots and phonies.
6208. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 6/8/2002 9:02:04 PM
Here's some ammo, Judith, in the war against the impoverishment by the ugly-minded -- an affliction that Rosie so felicitously illustrates.
6209. judithathome - 6/8/2002 9:02:44 PM
Idiot Savant:
The museum is in Fort Worth. I've seen it. I drive by it at least once a week.
6210. Property of Jesus - 6/8/2002 9:11:36 PM
"...go the way of Detroit."
What a racist thing for Salon to say.
6211. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 6/8/2002 11:51:31 PM
How does the creative class fit into or define the future?
The basic challenge is that the society is splitting into the creative haves and have-nots by region. We're getting regional winners and losers. As the creative class migrates to the places that provide the economic and lifestyle options they desire, this could be very threatening to national unity. As the creative class concentrates in ethnically diverse, racially diverse ways, the people that are left behind are resentful. And that's a powder keg. [Like PoJ]
Also, right now the creative class is inward-looking and selfish. For years members of the creative class thought they could just live the good life, with their SUVs, fantasy kitchens and designer clothes. However, in the past the great emerging classes -- whether that was the bourgeois, the nascent capitalist class overthrowing the old feudal monarchy and ushering in a period of maker-driven capitalism and democracy, or the working class unifying to demand an eight-hour workday, higher wages, health benefits -- the creative class has to take responsibility and develop a vision in which all members of society can participate and benefit. It's an obligation.
They have to grow up and take responsibility. We can't just point our finger at Bush or at Congress or at local political leaders and say, "They just don't get it." We have to take responsibility for the society we're driving. If not, the social and political consequences are dire. The creative class has to look beyond itself and offer members of society a vision in which all can participate and benefit from. That's the challenge of our age.
6212. judithathome - 6/9/2002 12:11:41 AM
Wiz, the following article was in our Sunday paper and you'd think any website worth it's salt could link to the pictures that ran with the article but of course, our winkydink on-line paper is the pits and can't accomplish that. Anyhow, this guy has covered our city with his designs and some of them are nice, some are beautiful, some are bizarre and some are just too too twee, if you know what I mean.
Have you heard of him or seen any of his work?
David Schwarz
6213. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 6/9/2002 3:48:38 AM
J@H- Yes, I have and I'm not a big fan of the POMO crowd, which is very close to passé (if not there already)--though I've met Michael Graves and he's a really nice guy.
I have trouble with the Yale Arts crowd they are thick as thieves and will promote the brotherhood before merit almost always--a fatal flaw in the arts. My wife and I have seen countless examples of it here in Connecticut.
Post Modernism was a welcomed antidote to the impotent hegemony of Modernism (IMHO), but it was also a superficial movement by a sincere bunch of admirers of the past . . . without an adequate dosage of talent or originality. Hence a burlesque look to a lot of their efforts because they could only ape the classics.
6214. judithathome - 6/9/2002 4:24:51 AM
Yes, our library looks as though it would be at home on the Las Vegas strip.
6215. wabbit - 6/9/2002 5:02:41 AM
Between ice packs...WoW, I had a teacher who once told me she did PoMo style paintings just to get her MFA from Yale. Her heart was in landscapes, but the profs wouldn't accept any of her landscape work, so she did what she had to do to get out of there.
I really like your new work. You were just starting this series last time we spoke, I think. It's come such a long way and still you are finding new ways to go with it. Wonderful stuff. A small confession. I always think of April Gornik and Richard Serra when I think of you. More Serra than Gornik. Thought you should know.
And with no shame of repeating myself, anyone who has the chance to see WoW's work in person should do so, it is very impressive to see in the flesh.
6216. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 6/9/2002 6:13:35 AM
Wabb- Thanks for the kind words. That story rings a bell and I don't know if it's that you once told it to me or if it's SOP for the Yale treadmill.
I had a friend from undergraduate art school daze, who is now teaching at Yale in the photography program. He shows at Pace in NYC, Beverly Hills and London. I still see his sister from time to time at various markets (she's a chef). We were all in a kind of Italian-American clique in the 80's local art scene. She's pretty blunt and candid when she speaks about him.
I visited him when he was in graduate school at Yale. He's handsome, charming and knew exactly how to exploit it. He married a unbelievably beautiful European countess (who was studying there too--he had gotten her pregnant.)
After Yale, he went to Manhattan with his wife and son and hung out with his brother a mover and shaker in the gay community (now dead from aids) and Nan Goldin with her crowd of misfits. This eventually took them to Naples where the heroin and food were plentiful, good and cheap.
Well to make a long story short, I bumped into his sister at an organic plant sale last week and she said that his wife divorced him and married a "rich computer guy" in L.A. and, that he was now living alone in a house in N.Y. state, commuting to New Haven a couple of days a week "for the young Yale pussy." (A pleasant thought for you Ivy League parents out there!)
Anyway, when we were pups we worked at the Wadsworth together as curatorial assistants and lackeys. Every week he would lift something in the basement of the museum that wasn't yet cataloged, things that were small and easy to conceal--political buttons, Hartford memorabilia and Samuel Colt gun-stuff were his favorites.
I always Knew he'd go far! ;-}
6217. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 6/9/2002 6:15:19 AM
Ice your hands and don't bother to respond--I was in the mood to reminisce.
6218. TabouliJones - 6/9/2002 3:24:05 PM
Friday I said I would report today on The Hives concert I was supposed to attent this weekend. Well, due to a ticket snafu I was unable to attend the show. I spoke with several who did, however, and all were unanimous: The Hives rocked and were surprisingly hilarious for a bunch of Swedes. I am sorry I missed the show, but these things happen.
On the upside, I saw a band from Tel Aviv on Friday by the name of Rock Four. They are a mix of Pink Floyd, Bowie and grunge. Their show was excellent. The lead singer of the band, Eli Lulai, is very charismatic -- sort of like the bald headed lead singer of Midnight Oil in terms of physical presence. I hope to catch this band live again sometime soon.
6219. Ms. No - 6/11/2002 7:09:42 PM
To All Hosts:
I regret to inform you that the privelege of changing thread titles at will is now revoked until further notice. Most of you this will not affect at all so I apologize for the interruption to your thread.
6220. judithathome - 6/14/2002 12:41:20 AM
Mick Jagger is now Sir Mick Jagger.
This seems so very funny to me.
6221. judithathome - 6/14/2002 6:40:05 AM
We've just returned from a play that was just about the most enjoyable of the year thus far... The Complete Works of Shakespeare and three men performed in a little over two hours. My favorite parts were the "Othello" done as a rap tune and "Hamlet" in which they pulled out a lady from the audience and had her enact the Id, Ego, and SuperEgo of Ophelia. (No, I was not the volunteer.)
This was the most inventive night of theatre I've been to in a long time; these guys were brilliant and the audience gave them several standing Os.
6222. Snowowl - 6/14/2002 10:02:55 AM
It sounds tremendous, Judith. This is my favourite version of Othello. Unfortunately, I can't add the soundtrack, but it's sung in broad Glaswegian.
There was a king nodding in his garden all alone,
When his brother in his ear poured a little bit of henbane,
Stole his brother's crown and his money and his widow,
But the dead king walked and got his son and said, "Now listen kiddo,
I've been killed and it's your duty to take revenge on Claudius,
Kill him quick and clean and tell the nation what a fraud he is."
The kid says, "Right I'll do it, but I'll have to play it crafty,
So that no will suspect me I'll kid on that I'm a dafty."
So for all except Horatio, and he counts him as a friend,
Hamlet, that's the kid, he kids on he's 'round the bend,
And because he's not yet willing for obligatory killing,
He tries to make his uncle think he's tuppence off a shilling.
Takes a rise out of Polonius, treats poor Ophelia vile,
Tells Rosencrantz and Guildenstern that Denmark's blooded bile,
Then a troupe of traveling actors local seven eighty four,
Arrive to do a special one-night gig in Elsinore.
Hamlet, Hamlet, acting balmy,
Hamlet, Hamlet, loves his mommy,
Hamlet, Hamlet, hesitating,
He wonders if the ghost's a fake,
And that is why he's waiting.
6223. Snowowl - 6/14/2002 10:04:47 AM
So Hamlet wrote a scene for the players to enact,
So Horatio and he could see if Claudius cracked,
The play was called "The Mousetrap" (not the one that's running now),
And sure enough the king walked out before the scene was through.
So Hamlet's got the proof his uncle gave his dad the dose,
The only problem being now that Claudius knows he knows,
So while Hamlet tells his mother her new husband's not a fit man,
Uncle Claude takes out a contract with the English king as hit man.
Then when Hamlet killed Polonius, and the corpus was delecti,
Was the king's excuse to send him for an English hempen necktie,
With Rosencrantz and Guildenstern to make quite sure he got there,
But Hamlet jumped the boat and put the finger straight on that pair.
When Laertes heard his dad's killed in the bedroom in the arras,
He came running back to Elsinore tout-suite hot-foot from Paris.
When Ophelia heard her dad's killed by the man she was to marry,
After saying it with flowers, she committed hari-kari.
Hamlet, Hamlet, no messin'
Hamlet, Hamlet, learned his lesson
Hamlet, Hamlet, Yorick's crust
Convinced him all men good or bad,
At last must come to dust.
6224. Snowowl - 6/14/2002 10:05:30 AM
Then Laertes lost his cool and was demanding retribution,
The king said keep your head and I'll supply you a solution.
So the king arranged a swordfight for the interested parties,
With a blunted sword for Hamlet and a sharp sword for Laertes.
And to make double sure (the old belt-and-braces line),
He fixed up a poisoned sword-tip and a poisoned cup of wine.
The poisoned sword got Hamlet, but Laertes went and fluffed it,
Because he stabbed himself and he confessed before he snuffed it.
Then Hamlet's mommy drank the wine and as her face turned blue,
Hamlet said, "I think this king's a baddie through and through."
"Incestuous, murderous, damned Dane," he said, to be precise,
Then made up for hesitating once, by killing Claudius twice.
He stabbed him with his knife and forced the wine between his lips
He said, "The rest is silence," and he cashed in all his chips.
They fired a volley over him that shook the topmost rafter,
And Fortinbras, knee deep in Danes, lived happily ever after.
Hamlet, Hamlet, end of story
Hamlet, Hamlet, very gory
Hamlet, Hamlet, I'm on my way
And if you think that was confusing,
You should read the bloody play
6225. Property of Jesus - 6/15/2002 6:48:55 PM
I have that show on videotape. Excellent and very funny. We're going tonight to see free Shakespeare in the Park in DC. TWO GENTLEMEN FROM VERONA.
Want to thank my kids for the great Father's Day gift of a concert DVD of Joni Mitchell's Painting With Words & Music. (Produced in 1998)
Includes her cover of Frank Lymon's WHY DO FOOLS FALL IN LOVE? and Marvin Gaye's TROUBLE MAN.
And lots of material from the HEJIRA album.
6226. arkymalarky - 6/15/2002 7:31:13 PM
We had a really good AR Shakespeare group that performed Twelfth Night outdoors, and it was a riot. They were led by a husband and wife team and did all their own creative work on settings, etc, but the husband died very suddenly of a heart attack not too long after that production. I had heard his wife was still carrying on, but I haven't kept up. He was a friend of Bro's from old performance days in Hot Springs and when he was doing the Shakespeare theater his day job was working with a group of "patient actors" at UAMS who would visit and get diagnosed by the interns.
Bob would be very jealous about the DVD. He got a "Happy Fathers Day," after reminding me of what day it was. I'll take him out or cook him a meal or something later.
6227. arkymalarky - 6/15/2002 7:31:57 PM
That wasn't the only thing they performed, btw, just the only thing by them I saw.
6228. thoughtful - 6/16/2002 8:45:50 PM
Wiz, help refresh my aging memory...was it the Chesterwood in Stockbridge you said I had to go see? The sculpture garden?
6229. theDiva - 6/16/2002 9:08:06 PM
Judith
I LOVE that play...it was performed at the local h.s. a few years ago, and was screamingly funny.
6230. judithathome - 6/16/2002 9:18:49 PM
These guys were terrific...naturally, they updated a lot of the "asides". It was hysterical.
6231. theDiva - 6/16/2002 9:20:14 PM
so much fun!
6232. thoughtful - 6/16/2002 10:10:21 PM
Nevermind, Wiz...found the old post. Chesterwood it was.
6233. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 6/17/2002 12:17:02 AM
thoughtful- It's a great place for a picnic--especially an anniversary picnic. Gargantuan congrats--btw !
6234. Indiana Jones - 6/17/2002 3:07:45 PM
6235. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 6/17/2002 4:55:05 PM
Jones- Captivating read--many thanks.
I also think that last paragraph is dead nuts on!
6236. godlessclif - 6/17/2002 5:00:20 PM
Not everone can be Dave Mathews.
6237. marjoribanks - 6/17/2002 5:12:08 PM
Oof. That is a tough reading of Chet Baker's life, but more importantly his music.
I buy it, but only to a point. I was given that Chet Baker Sings album, and will listen to it again tonight, but I'll be surprised if the result is as scathing a condemnation as emerges from that article.
6238. thoughtful - 6/17/2002 5:18:25 PM
Thanks, Wiz. We're going to try to make it to the Mount (edith wharton's home) as well. Apparently they recently reopened it after a lot of restoration. Should be a good day.
6239. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 6/17/2002 7:36:14 PM
Enjoy thoughtful, and by the way, there's always a summer contemporary sculpture show at Chesterwood--I don't know if it's started yet. There are lots of disappointing efforts of course, but the occasional piece of poetry makes it worthwhile.
Marj- At first read, I thought the same, but the reviewer won me over with utter elegance of phrase and sensitive awareness. Like me, I'll bet you feel that way cuz, at heart, you're a melancholy romantic. But one can still enjoy "torch songs on dead batteries" without feeling guilty.
I think, in the last analysis, it should be about musicianship and courage rather than charm and despair.
I'd love to know Diva's take on it.
6240. thoughtful - 6/19/2002 4:18:37 PM
Good news, and bad. Didn't get to Chesterwood, but that's OK as we went to see Edith Wharton's the Mount instead...just reopened for the centennial and what a beautiful home and beautiful setting. Hard to believe she went through all the effort to design it (she was sort of the martha stewart of her day decorating wise) build it and leave it after 10 years to move to france, but I guess failed marriages will do that to you. They "restored" the main floor and the contrast with the unrestored bedroom areas was stark. For example, the beautiful tapestries were sold at auction and have not yet been located or returned, so they had an artist recreate them in paint. Lots of photos of the before and after too. Amazing amount of work has been done with much more to go. They are in the process of restoring the gardens too. So exciting to see in the unrestored area rows of peonies peeking up through the tall grass.
We also stopped at BashBish Falls, short hike to lovely falls with idiot college kids swimming in that icy cold water...so cold their flesh was red as they emerged. Needless to say there was a lot of screaming going on. Ah, youth.
Decided we'll save chesterwood and the hike up mt everett for another trip to the area.
6241. judithathome - 6/19/2002 4:21:52 PM
How is your ankle holding up?
That sounds like a lovely afternoon...
6242. thoughtful - 6/19/2002 4:26:20 PM
Hi Judith, ankle is managing. See doc next week with mri results to see what's what. The mri films are most interesting...seeing your own anatomy sliced and diced just like they do at the butcher shop. Fortunately, it's virtual!
Thanks for asking.
6243. marjoribanks - 6/19/2002 4:26:45 PM
Final comment on Chet Baker:
We all knew about most of his past, but I reject the total condemnation of his music. Besides the whole "he popularized the music, turned new audiences on to it" angle, the man had some chops and he used them, not only in a predictably romantic fashion, but with awareness of the medium.
I will not be consigning Chet Baker into the rubbish bin just yet.
6244. marjoribanks - 6/19/2002 4:29:55 PM
No, I'm not a melancholy romantic though can be susceptible to that mood.
In terms of Jazz, I'm interested in the innovation, the straight-ahead application of genius improvisation, in pure sound and tone and (yes) melody.
Ellington rises above all as a colossus, in my mind, but there many other favorites. Of late, for instance, I've developed a real affection for Sonny Rollins.
6245. TabouliJones - 6/19/2002 4:56:39 PM
Marj,
It seems you are not alone in your appreciation of Chet Baker.
Here are some favourable comments re: Baker's music, from The Globe and Mail's review of Gavin's biography:
This was Chesney Henry Baker Jr. one August night in 1982 in a concert hall in downtown Edmonton. He was only 52 then, but he looked 20 years older and eons away from his halcyon days as Chet Baker, the prettiest, sexiest, most in-demand white trumpeter of the West Coast Cool School of 1950s jazz. Bad dentures, ceaseless travel to often poor-paying one-nighters and 30 years of injecting heroin into any available artery can do that to a person, I guess.
And yet, when Baker started to sing the lyrics to The Touch of Your Lips and exhale its tender melody into his horn, magic happened. The audience grew very quiet and still; surrendering to the spell of Baker's "junkie reverie," they fell into slow-motion remembrances of seductions accomplished and loves lost. Wiping the tears from my then-young eyes, I could only think: Out of such emaciation, such beauty.
. . .
Indeed, hardcore Baker aficionados know that their hero did much of his best work in his final six or seven years, at the same time as his drug addictions worsened; just check out Chet Baker in Tokyo, two hours of focused, inspired blowing, recorded in concert a mere 11 months before his death plunge.
What Baker I have heard, I have generally liked. Mind you, I don't listen to much jazz, so my ear is hardly sophisticated.
6246. Indiana Jones - 6/19/2002 6:17:11 PM
I know very little about Chet Baker and have just one album by him. The reason I linked the article was that it was damn persuasive writing. Aside from the annoying references to "Chettie", I agree with Wiz's "the reviewer won me over with utter elegance of phrase and sensitive awareness."
It's the best written book review I've read in a good while.
6247. theDiva - 6/19/2002 6:35:22 PM
It is a well-written article, and thanks, Indy, for linking it in.
Now.
I have no Chet Baker recordings nor am I well versed in the West Coast school; thus I do not feel fit to comment on the writer's take on Baker's art. My impression of Baker is that his singing is pleasant enough, his playing unobtrusive.
I do have a bone to pick: if one more jazz writer trots out this kind of hackneyed crap, I am going to scream.
"I wish he (and other people) had noticed, though, the odd way in which jazzy inspiration is automatically linked to drugs, while the transcendence or the concentration or the "zone" of great classical musicians somehow seems to avoid such things."
First, why is jazz always contrasted with classical as a means to demonstrating the 'legitimacy' of jazz? Second, why do so many writers fall prey to the notion that every damned jazz genius/artist on the planet was hopped up? I mean, Duke Ellington? Sarah Vaughan? Clifford Brown? Wynton Marsalis? Cyrus Chestnut?
Moreover, there was nothing 'automatic' about the inspiration of those artists who did have substance problems. The argument also misses the fact that jazz grew up as a 'nightclub' music in a certain milieu, in which the occasional joint was smoked. However, tales are rife of players being high and NOT being able to play, not being able to exercise their chops and their inspiration.
Anyway, rant over. It just bugs me that jazz is so often linked to drug use. That argument just misses the point.
6248. Indiana Jones - 6/19/2002 6:53:43 PM
Diva: A grad school friend of mine ("Cynthia") had aspirations of being a poet and her Master's thesis was a collection of her poetry. Of the three members of her committee, one was a frequent cocaine user who asked Cynthia if she could help her get some coke. This professor believed that drug exploration was absolutely essential for Cynthia to achieve her maximum level of poetic creativity.
Another committee member was the total opposite and said poets should be in it for the long haul and that substance abuse was a good way to burn out early. According to Cynthia their argument even flared up in her thesis defense.
Cynthia had enough problems on her own, BTW, and didn't need anyone encouraging her to abuse drugs, as she was already on meds for a mental disorder (mild schizophrenia).
If I have a point, I guess it's that jazz isn't alone among the artistic endeavors in that struggle (i.e., are drugs beneficial or necessary for enhancement of creativity?). Within music, rock & roll comes to mind, which is perhaps why the author brought up classical music as a contrast. Country music is rife with substance abuse as well, though it's generally alcohol.
If poets and other writers--alone at a desk with the only performance anxiety being the blank sheet of paper or blinking cursor at the top of a blank electronic screen--need a creativity "crutch," then how much more so those who practice their craft on stage and in bars and dance halls, where social drug use is handy and in some cases acceptable?
6249. theDiva - 6/19/2002 7:06:17 PM
I don't know that I buy the argument that it's necessary. Ella Fitzgerald had hideous stage fright initially and had to be shoved onstage in her first appearance at the Apollo. There is all evidence that she overcame this obstacle without the use of controlled substances. Moreover, with those artists who did have problems, i.e., Billie, Prez, Bird, the drug use was more (if you believe the bios) to dull the pain of racism and a hard life than it was to enable creativity.
6250. theDiva - 6/19/2002 7:19:23 PM
Oh, and one other thing. How appalling that a professor would tell a student to use drugs.
6251. Indiana Jones - 6/19/2002 7:20:32 PM
I wouldn't say it's necessary either, Diva, because there are too many counter examples. (In poetry, for one, I don't think anyone's ever accused Robert Browning of being a dope fiend.)
On the other hand, the relationship between an artist and his or her art is so complex it's difficult to say just what effect drug abuse has and differentiate between what the drug does and doesn't do. Even if the drug abuse is caused by environmental conditions rather than a conscious decision to "invoke the Muse," those environmental conditions, the drug abuse, and the art that results are still an intertwined brew--at least in some cases. Richard Pryor comes to mind. I don't remember Lennie Bruce, but my impression is the same could be said of him.
Johnny Cash supposedly took his own pulse to get the beat for "I Walk the Line." I imagine that some chemical substance is at least partly responsible for the fast rhythm that resulted.
6252. Indiana Jones - 6/19/2002 7:24:10 PM
How appalling that a professor would tell a student to use drugs.
I was appalled at the time too. The woman still teaches and when I think of her I wonder how many other would-be poets she's mentored in the ways of cocaine. On the other hand, it's also possible that the entire incident was imagined or just fabricated by Cynthia. On that occasion I think she was telling the truth, though.
6253. theDiva - 6/19/2002 7:31:09 PM
"Even if the drug abuse is caused by environmental conditions rather than a conscious decision to "invoke the Muse," those environmental conditions, the drug abuse, and the art that results are still an intertwined brew"
I can't argue with this.
But your Johnny Cash anecdote reminds me of a little fact that a choirmate shared with me at rehearsal.
Every single Emily Dickinson poem can be sung to the tune of 'The Yellow Rose of Texas'.
6254. OhioSTOPAS - 6/19/2002 7:42:21 PM
All bazillion of them.
Diva, here's another: The words of "Amazing Grace" fit very nicely into the Gilligan's Island theme song. Some Sunday your choir should try it!
6255. theDiva - 6/19/2002 7:44:39 PM
dammit, so it does. hahahahaha
6256. OhioSTOPAS - 6/19/2002 7:45:56 PM
And another:
Wanna sing along to "Purple Haze", but can't remember the lyrics?
No problem: substitute the words from the Beverly Hillbillies theme song.
6257. judithathome - 6/19/2002 7:45:57 PM
Every single Emily Dickinson poem can be sung to the tune of 'The Yellow Rose of Texas'
That is too, too funny. I doubt many Texans even know who Emily Dickinson is; probably think she's a member of the Dixie Chicks.
6258. theDiva - 6/19/2002 7:48:59 PM
Indy
any speculation as to how many Ohio law school graduates used drugs?
(snicker)
6259. OhioSTOPAS - 6/19/2002 7:51:33 PM
If only the lyrics of "Purple Haze" were the ONLY thing I can't remember from the Sixties . . .
6260. Indiana Jones - 6/19/2002 7:53:36 PM
Diva: It's to dull the pain and hard life of being a Red Sox fan.
6261. theDiva - 6/19/2002 7:57:29 PM
Bingo!
6262. OhioSTOPAS - 6/19/2002 8:01:31 PM
You both should be sentenced to eternity with nothing to read but Emily Dickinson poems.
6263. theDiva - 6/19/2002 8:12:33 PM
or at least until the Sux win the World Series, whichever comes first.
BWAHAHAHAHA
6264. OhioSTOPAS - 6/19/2002 8:20:35 PM
Oh YEAH?
Why, you . . .
Uh . . . uh . . .
WAIT 'TIL NEXT YEAR!!
6265. theDiva - 6/19/2002 8:36:24 PM
geesh, give up on yer team, why doncha?
6266. judithathome - 6/19/2002 8:37:04 PM
Go to Notices & Queries for news of Maria Gleason's passing...sad day for all of us here and on other forums where she contributed so very much.
6267. theDiva - 6/19/2002 8:38:21 PM
WHAT?!
6268. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 6/19/2002 8:57:11 PM
thoughtful- I thought the same thing with regard to only enjoying the place for a short time.
marj- " . . . I reject the total condemnation of his music."
He didn't totally reject his music--he focused on Baker's limitations compared to a Miles Davis and he spoke about the hype that propelled him to a quicker fame.
As far as the admission that some of Baker's spellbinding reveries may have been drug induced (or any other artists' escape of self under a chemical influence) seems more honest than the pedestrian sidewalk psychology of all too many critics.
Artistry is a convincing illusion, but an illusion nonetheless and it can collapse all too easily like a house of cards. To a fear ridden self-doubter, drugs can offer a false courage that can help one temporarily escape the tyrannies of the ego.
Creativity is jujitsuing the moment into something transcendent and memorable--drug induced or not.
I enjoy some of Chet Baker, but I find myself wading through a lot of tiring stuff to get to the better efforts--unlike others that I can listen to most everything and constantly. I guess that's why the article resonated with me.
6269. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 6/19/2002 9:00:14 PM
What? X2!!!
6270. wabbit - 6/22/2002 6:11:06 PM
6271. marjoribanks - 6/23/2002 6:50:05 PM
Wiz,
A very compelling post on the nature of artistry.
I've promised you the following photos, I'm afraid they don't do the paintings justice but it's the best I can manage right now.
These are paintings which audaciously impose tantric Hindu symbols on the depictions of the ornaments of a Catholic Mass mass. They resonate with me partly because these were rendered in the 50's, by an Indian, thinking way before his time either at home or abroad.
6272. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 6/23/2002 7:25:16 PM
Marj- Thanks so much for the effort and the sharing.
I can easily see why you resonate with them and it also looks like the artist was influenced by Picasso or African masks.
There are wonderful artists, underappreciated and unrecognized the world over.
I'm about to submit a proposal for a Veteran's Memorial (in a local park) called Spiral Obelisk and I just know the selection committee won't get it.
It has a big budget allocation and every sleezeball architect with political pull will be bidding on it.
The sad fact is that this is a country on fast forward and there isn't time anymore to contemplate still objects--creating objects for contemplation is going the way of barrel making--don't get me started!!!
6273. marjoribanks - 6/24/2002 4:48:32 AM
Wiz,
I like your Memorial idea, it looks surprsingly light and elegant for such a large object, and those curves do something for me emotionally, don't ask me what exactly.
You're quite right about the Picasso and Paris influences, in fact those two were painted in Paris itself. The artist strenuously and rather flamboyantly rejected accusations that his work was derivative, claiming instead (and variously) that he and Picasso were simply influenced by the same stimuli, and even that Picasso was derivative in the first place, having ripped off Asia and Africa, and that at least he (the artist) was authentically from India and thus came of his influences more honestly.
6274. marjoribanks - 6/24/2002 4:50:05 AM
By paris influence, in this instance I mean the famous museum exhibits of African art, masks, etc, which affected Picasso and his cohorts so much.
6275. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 6/24/2002 5:38:18 AM
Thanks marj and yes, I understood what you meant. It reminds me of the work of a few Brazilian artists I know as well.
I wonder what that artist is doing today and if he's still at it.
The budget for this memorial is $250,000 and if I were to get the commission, it would open up a whole new avenue of focus--especially if it were to be executed in granite--about 30 feet high.
The idea is meant to morph into various shapes engaging the viewer's eidetic vision/memory. That is to say, from one angle it looks like the prow of a ship, from another it resembles a propeller and another a scabbard.
An obelisk's original intent was that of a defensive symbol or warning to repel evil.
The maquette shows more than a 2d still of course.
6276. PincherMartin - 6/24/2002 2:22:20 PM
Does anyone here collect antique furniture? If so, can you tell me if there is a uniform or standard way of proving the piece you want to buy is antique (or of a certain age or certain quality or made from a certain wood), or is it pretty much "buyer beware"?
Over the last few years, I've bought a few pieces of Qing dynasty furniture as well as some 19th century Tibetan pieces (mainly cabinets and altar tables). To the best of my knowledge, they are antiques. They were all bought from long-time dealers of antiques, and most of the pieces also appear to be made of the wood the dealers claim they are made of.
But after some research, I've discovered that some types of wood used to make Chinese furniture only existed during certain periods of Chinese history. After that wood disappeared, the common practice was to use another similar type of wood and pass it off as the same kind. In questioning dealers, I've discovered that many of them aren't any sharper on the subject than I am. Are there certified agents an owner can go to to have their pieces appraised?
6277. judithathome - 6/24/2002 3:08:44 PM
Yes, there are but even they may have blind spots in their knowledge.
The person to ask is the guy who used to post here who has 2 or 3 books published on antiques and on Shakespeare...Pelle knows his name, I'm sure. I do, too, but it escapes me at present.
6278. judithathome - 6/24/2002 3:10:26 PM
CMBoyce!!
6279. PelleNilsson - 6/24/2002 5:44:33 PM
But Boyce does not, I think, know a lot about Chinese antiques; he is an American furniture connoiseur. For Chinese stuff there is another guy who also doesn't post anymore: ScottLoar.
6280. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 6/24/2002 5:57:58 PM
Pincher- This link may help a bit:
Wood Used In Chinese Antique Furniture
6281. judithathome - 6/24/2002 6:31:50 PM
Well, that's no help to Pincher...is it? Anyone know how to contact either one of those specialists? Too bad the people we need are no longer here...two of many.
I know CMBoyce is more American furniture but possibly he knows of someone who is acquainted with the Chinese type.
6282. judithathome - 6/24/2002 6:33:00 PM
I didn't mean your link was no help, Wiz.
6283. ivan osokin - 6/24/2002 6:44:23 PM
marj:
i LOVE those paintings! since hindu tantra is the area of scholarship which i will be following towards a life of abject poverty, i really appreciate the work. can you tell me more about them? who's the artist? how did you find them? etc..
6284. marjoribanks - 6/24/2002 7:26:33 PM
Those paintings are by this guy.
6285. thoughtful - 6/24/2002 8:13:33 PM
interesting link, wiz, but didn't see the wood we have...called nara wood. Not sure how much we have or what condition it's in, but a friend of the family who traveled extensively overseas brought some back with him and gave it to us about 35 years ago. We're hoping our cabinet maker will be able to put it to good use in the new house.
6286. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 6/24/2002 8:29:23 PM
I wonder what that artist is doing today and if he's still at it.
Well that question is answered!
thoughtful- Narra (Naga, Apalet, Daetang Sanque) Pterocarpus Santalinus - This favorite hardwood is red and sought after for most furniture and is most enduring. This is similar to Sandalwood and is often known as "red Sandalwood."
6287. judithathome - 6/24/2002 8:34:23 PM
I'd love to have the sandalwood box I was too chicken to buy at an antiques market in Metz, France several years ago. Opening it up was a feast for the sense of smell...
6288. thoughtful - 6/24/2002 8:44:29 PM
These same friends gave me a lovely carved statute of krishna out of sandal wood and a packet of sandalwood powder which I've never opened. Lovely stuff. They travelled overseas for 13 years ere and through WWII. Fascinating life and stories they had to tell. They are both gone now.
6289. betty - 6/24/2002 9:15:30 PM
Wiz,
there is something about your comment: To a fear ridden self-doubter, drugs can offer a false courage that can help one temporarily escape the tyrannies of the ego. That really bugs me. It says to me that you feel drugs are a less real way of achieving transcendance or something of the sort. I feel like you are discounting the work of Van Gogh and Poe and Coltrane.
I don't think drugs are essential to the creative process but they are an effective means of reaching altered states and in a culture which has debased religious and psychic experience they often offer the only imaginable tool for exploring the edges of ourselves.
6290. judithathome - 6/24/2002 9:18:23 PM
I don't know, Betty...sometimes in the wicked light of dawn, that drug induced poetry is just plain bad. ;-)
6291. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 6/24/2002 9:23:59 PM
No betty, I was saying that drugs don't provide transcendence, but they can help, sometimes, in removing the obstacle illusions to it--but they can also hinder one as well, IMO anyway.
6292. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 6/24/2002 9:24:49 PM
xpost with J@H XOX!
6293. betty - 6/24/2002 10:13:36 PM
Wiz,
well that makes a lot more sense.
6294. PincherMartin - 6/26/2002 3:17:12 AM
Wizard's link in Message # 6280 is first-rate. I have three books on Chinese furniture, none of which has the kind of clear pictures of the varieties of Chinese wood as those given in Wiz's link.
However, it still doesn't solve my problem, or even answer the question of whether my problem is solvable.
6295. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 6/26/2002 5:36:22 AM
Pincher- Buy or borrow a decent digital camera and take lots of detail images (in natural light) of the piece you are interested in acquiring.
When this is accomplished, send the images, via attached emails, to some curators of museums that have extensive Asian collections, for their advice or appraisal.
I've found the Brits to be the most obliging--try The V&A in London or The Stackler in DC-- which as a tax payer, you're probably entitled to be accommodated.
6296. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 6/26/2002 8:20:33 PM
Opps! I meant The Sackler, not 'Stackler'!
6297. theDiva - 6/26/2002 8:22:52 PM
and here I was scrambling for my map....
6298. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 6/26/2002 8:38:48 PM
}:-}
6299. Property of Jesus - 6/26/2002 9:10:38 PM
One of the reasons I don't want Salon to go under. Well is a goldmine.
Crosby, Stills & Nash conference on the Well
6300. arkymalarky - 6/27/2002 2:05:50 AM
The bassist for The Who died.
And casual observation: the System of a Down video "Toxicity" is just too cool.
6301. PincherMartin - 6/27/2002 2:06:50 AM
Wiz --
Thanks for the tip.
6302. arkymalarky - 6/27/2002 2:07:03 AM
PJ,
Don't you still have to pay for The Well separately?
6303. Property of Jesus - 6/27/2002 2:13:29 AM
Don't think so, Arky. It's part of the TT membership.
The fun part of the CSN thread at the Well is that David Crosby is participating in the discussion.
6304. arkymalarky - 6/27/2002 2:29:55 AM
Well, tell him Arky said hello and I loved their concert at Riverfront in Little Rock a few years ago, lightning and all.
6305. arkymalarky - 6/27/2002 2:30:37 AM
I guess I shouldn't say that, since the person the speaker fell on probably didn't like it too well.
6306. Property of Jesus - 6/27/2002 2:46:00 AM
I was always a Steven Stills man myself, Arky.
Meet him a couple of years ago when one Sunday afternoon I went into our club's bar to gets some free cheese/popcorn for the kids after swimming and he was there drinking and watching a NFL football game after having played some golf.
I was very cool, as usual.
6307. arkymalarky - 6/27/2002 2:47:47 AM
You have just rubbed those pointy elbows with the most interesting people.
I'm envious.
BUT did you meet Judy Collins in an airport bathroom? HMMMMMMM?
6308. arkymalarky - 6/27/2002 2:48:26 AM
And have your husband tell her he loved her in your presence? (not in the bathroom, obviously)
6309. Property of Jesus - 6/27/2002 3:30:07 AM
No airport bathroom stories. Sorry. I did see Judy Collins in concert in the mid-1960s--but never looked into those sweet blue eyes.
But I did meet Joni Mitchell and Buffy St. Marie/husband and others when I was a busboy at my uncle's steak house in Florida.
I was very cool, as usual.
6310. arkymalarky - 6/27/2002 4:10:37 AM
Well that goes without saying.
6311. OhioSTOPAS - 6/27/2002 4:44:31 AM
John Entwistle R.I.P.
6312. Property of Jesus - 6/27/2002 5:22:31 AM
Just finished reading a magazine called Dirty Linen: Folk & World Music and I got the web address to one of my favorite folk musicians.
Gordon Bok
6313. judithathome - 6/27/2002 3:40:07 PM
I'm watching the guys who did the music for Oh Brother Where Art Thou? perform on GMA and in spite of myself, I'm liking this music.
6314. arkymalarky - 6/27/2002 4:04:33 PM
I love it. Bob gets his fill of it pretty quickly, but it's what Bro makes a living on (outside band directing). Bro emailed me about it the other day.
6315. Property of Jesus - 6/27/2002 4:09:44 PM
I know it's Clinton's Arkansas, but are "Bob" and "Bro" one and the same?
6316. judithathome - 6/27/2002 4:11:16 PM
Don't answer, Arky...let him stew.
6317. arkymalarky - 6/27/2002 4:13:20 PM
I'll put it this way. In some Arky circles it can be.
6318. theDiva - 7/2/2002 8:17:38 PM
Oh dear.
Rest In Peace, Oh Sublime One
6319. glendajean - 7/2/2002 8:36:43 PM
Diva -- Indy killed him. The college jazz radio station was playing Ella singing that great ode to co-dependency, "Ain't nobody's business if daddy beats me" or something like that. R.I.P.
6320. theDiva - 7/2/2002 8:41:51 PM
sigh.
I saw them together at Carnegie Hall, back when I was a mere slip of a girl.
6321. betty - 7/2/2002 9:54:52 PM
my silence isoriginal silence, not a quotation from his silence.
6322. theDiva - 7/2/2002 10:08:44 PM
(mouth agape)
6323. judithathome - 7/4/2002 3:41:32 PM
Watching the creaky BeachBoys singing Surfside USA on GMA, I am suddenly depressed.
6324. betty - 7/4/2002 3:46:49 PM
There, there Judith. that's why its better for rock/pop stars to die young in tragic transportation related accidents. Even better if their deaths are from drug overdose or suicide.
How much would the world have suffered if "Kokomo" had never been foisted upon us?
6325. judithathome - 7/4/2002 3:53:42 PM
They sang that one, too. I always considered them to be Bubble Gum music people. Now they sound more like denture cream people.
6326. betty - 7/4/2002 4:00:06 PM
hehe!
6327. theDiva - 7/4/2002 4:53:41 PM
BeachGeezers, more likely.
6328. TabouliJones - 7/4/2002 6:55:16 PM
I just found this interesting NY Times article about the jazz singer Jimmy Scott -- note: free registration required. I saw him at a club about 8 years ago and adore his rendition of Unchained Melody.
6329. Property of Jesus - 7/8/2002 11:08:23 PM
Sony Hits Jax Back
Pedophilia charges ruining
his career, says music exec
By ISAAC GUZMAN
Daily News Feature Writer
ichael Jackson has ruined his own career with his bizarre antics and reputation as an accused child molester, a top honcho at the pop superstar's record company said yesterday.
Sony hit back at Michael Jackson yesterday, accusing him of playing the race card to cover the flop of his latest record.
"Charges of pedophilia have really spooked a lot of American record buyers," said the top-ranking Sony Music executive. "There are a lot of parents who don't think he's a wholesome entertainer. It's shadowed him."
Pedophilia allegations against Jackson first surfaced in August 1993, when a then 13-year-old boy complained to a therapist that he had been fondled and sexually molested by the entertainer. The therapist took the information to the cops, who investigated but declined to file charges because the alleged victim refused to testify.
6330. Property of Jesus - 7/8/2002 11:10:11 PM
The boy's father later filed a civil suit against Jackson, who settled the case out of court, reportedly for $15 million to $24 million.
The exec also accused the Gloved One of playing the race card against Sony chief Tommy Mottola — who has a track record of backing black artists — to wiggle out of financial woes stemming from the flop of his latest release, "Invincible."
"He's trying to wage this bizarre campaign to rearrange his financial obligations," said the Sony executive, who asked not to be identified. "It's not going to happen."
Orchestrating a Summit
The remarkable counterstrike came as Jackson prepared to attend a music biz "summit," along with lawyer Johnnie Cochran, at the Rev. Al Sharpton's Harlem headquarters this morning.
Sony boss Tommy Mottola was defended yesterday against charges by Michael Jackson.
The three and a panel of musicians, including rap artist Doug E. Fresh, will discuss how best to end what they see as inequities in record labels' treatment of musicians.
Jackson repeatedly accused Mottola of being a "devilish" exploiter of black talent Saturday, once at Sharpton's headquarters and again at a rally with about 150 of his fans outside Sony Music headquarters on Madison Ave.
The superstar held up a sign depicting Mottola with Devil's horns.
Sharpton backed away from Jackson's outburst yesterday, saying racism "has never been my experience with Tommy Mottola."
But the activist added: "Jackson has a right to speak his mind, and Tommy Mottola should answer."
6333. Cellar Door - 7/9/2002 3:13:23 AM
Nice to see SONY striking back after paying through the nose for that freak.
And the blow they've rendered is quite accurate.
I was tracking that story back in '93 for the L.A. Times. But it evaporated when Jacko came up with a payoff and the parents didn't press charges. The D.A. and the cops were itching to nail him, and they had plenty of evidence.
6334. marjoribanks - 7/9/2002 3:16:34 AM
It is sad, in my opinion, to see Jacko play the race card in his battle with Sony, whether or not it is justified. It must be difficult for him to look in the mirror and note that he has done so very much to eliminate every visible attribute of his genetic heritage, even as he now claims that racists have acted against him at Sony because of that very genetic heritage.
6335. Cellar Door - 7/9/2002 3:34:05 AM
Nobody forced him to dye his skin white or put himself through so much plastic surgery. Once upon a time he was a handsome young black man. Now he's the Phantom of the Opera.
6336. theDiva - 7/9/2002 2:04:43 PM
6331 and 6332 have been moved to the Inferno, and the authors thereof ought to know better than to make posts like that in one of my threads.
6337. theDiva - 7/9/2002 2:05:58 PM
The entire Jackson thing is ludicrous. How dare he play the race card and cry about exploited black artists! What a disgrace.
6338. Property of Jesus - 7/9/2002 2:50:10 PM
MICHAEL JACKSON: "They hate me because I outsold Elvis"
6339. theDiva - 7/9/2002 3:08:00 PM
well, that's certainly an enlightened group over at that forum.
6340. judithathome - 7/9/2002 3:11:10 PM
I thought we weren't supposed to link to other forums?
6341. theDiva - 7/9/2002 3:16:07 PM
I have no problem with it in my threads but will defer to the forum administrators if they wish to overrule me.
6342. judithathome - 7/9/2002 3:19:51 PM
I guess it's no big deal...and we can always shower after. ;-)
6343. theDiva - 7/9/2002 3:23:44 PM
judith
who, you, me, and Keoni?!? Gracious, dear.
6344. judithathome - 7/9/2002 3:41:40 PM
Well, I meant anyone reading Lucianne but you have given me an idea!
6345. theDiva - 7/9/2002 3:50:17 PM
er, you guys go ahead.....
6346. judithathome - 7/9/2002 3:56:18 PM
Hey, you brought it up!
6347. theDiva - 7/9/2002 4:00:55 PM
ya know, I always suspected you had a wild side.
6348. judithathome - 7/9/2002 4:09:33 PM
I used to....tamed now.
6349. Property of Jesus - 7/10/2002 8:32:11 PM
I would have posted this in the media thread, but that one has been deleted by that mean, old Arky.
Black is beautiful
6350. judithathome - 7/10/2002 8:39:58 PM
To wit, she tells everyone else to get a life so she can get on with hers.
Get on with the cocaine induced freefall she's been in for some time? Get on with publicly brawling with her drunk husband in public? Get on with losing so much weight from drug abuse she looks like a survivor of Dachau?
Whitney Houston is lucky anyone still cares if she has a new album in the works; she's very close to hasbeen status.
6351. theDiva - 7/10/2002 10:09:47 PM
don't care much for Miss Whitney, do ya?
6352. ivan osokin - 7/10/2002 10:18:12 PM
judith...
you are so right on it's frightening!
(from your biggest fan!)
6353. judithathome - 7/10/2002 10:30:53 PM
No, Diva, nor do I care for any public personality who whines about being noticed for doing truly stupid things but doesn't have enough sense to realize that without media hype they would be just another shlub singing in the shower.
And I don't have much admiration for someone who probably spent enough on substances that went up her nose to suppport a small third world country or at the very least, a program to help with the care of crack babies in the local hospital.
6354. theDiva - 7/10/2002 10:44:33 PM
don't hold back, tell us how you really feel. (G)
6355. judithathome - 7/10/2002 10:55:46 PM
I might let it all out, later. ;-)
6356. theDiva - 7/10/2002 10:59:32 PM
ha!
I have to admit, I am quite disappointed in Miss Whitney. As a Mt. St. Dominic girl, she knows better than to carry on in such ways.
6357. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 7/11/2002 11:30:40 PM
6358. Property of Jesus - 7/12/2002 2:18:27 AM
LITTLE CHILD
MICHAEL JACKSON: It's all about Sony wanting to own the Beatles catalog
6359. betty - 7/12/2002 2:31:02 AM
Wiz,
that piece is stunning! I wish i had time to comment...just thinking about how it comments on the play of individual/inevitable in relation to death.
6360. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 7/12/2002 4:24:41 PM
Thanks betty--it's a work in progress and I'm not quite sure yet, exactly, how the carving will proceed. My sister-in-law is visiting us from Northern California and she's just delivered some of my brother's ashes for placement inside the figure.
6361. arkymalarky - 7/12/2002 6:28:47 PM
What an intense experience that must be for you. I agree with Betty on its impact. Stunning is the word.
6362. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 7/12/2002 8:32:01 PM
Thanks too for the response, ark. It is kind of strange, but I like the continuity with the past and my recent trip to The British Museum.
Look at the mystery and incantational appeal of these bindings and vessels for the human spirit . . .are they about liberation or internment?
And what, exactly, is in this wrapping?
6363. thoughtful - 7/13/2002 4:49:45 PM
Hey Wiz. Yesterday was beautiful so we took the day off and headed to Chesterwood. We were so glad we did. The place, the setting is lovely. The tour very nice. Took the walk through the woods and shook our heads at most of the modern sculpture. Definitely not my thing. One was of copper tubing sort of wrapped and meshed all around the walk way....hubby and I both decided it looked like a plumber gone mad. Another of groups of primary colored rods stuck in the ground. Very very odd. I don't get it. Never will.
However, they had Andrew DeVries there demonstrating bronze casting and I fell in love with one of his pieces. I think I'm going to buy it....need to find a special place for it in the new home. Funny how that is when you know you just have to have something.
6364. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 7/13/2002 5:44:26 PM
thoughtful- It was indeed a beaut of a day--I'm glad you enjoyed it. And yes, when the spirit resonates with an object, it's usually a significant sign that some deeper aspect of the psyche is being accessed.
What piece did you find so compelling?
With regard to "modern sculpture," one should always keep The Emperor's New Clothes in mind. There's a lot of regurgitated art theory out there that has become the new academy--often mistaking the menu for the meal.
6365. Property of Jesus - 7/13/2002 7:33:55 PM
Sony boss Tommy Mottola steps up SPIN WAR on Jacko, implicates producer
6366. theDiva - 7/14/2002 3:21:42 PM
Wiz
the sculpture is very arresting and very powerful, thanks for posting the photos. How about some closeups and some explanation of technique?
=====
In other news:
RIP Yousuf Karsh
6367. theDiva - 7/14/2002 3:23:00 PM
6368. theDiva - 7/14/2002 3:24:31 PM
6369. theDiva - 7/14/2002 3:29:33 PM
6370. theDiva - 7/14/2002 3:30:11 PM
6371. theDiva - 7/14/2002 3:31:07 PM
and of course, one of his most famous images:
6372. TabouliJones - 7/14/2002 4:21:32 PM
It may be apocryphal, but the story I recall about the famous Churchill portrait (below) is that Karsh provoked Churchill's ire by yanking his omnipresent cigar from his mouth just prior to the shot.
6373. theDiva - 7/14/2002 4:28:59 PM
Tabou
Evidently it's a true story! From a Karsh bio:
It was the portrait of Winston Churchill visiting Ottawa in 1941 that catapulted Karsh into international fame as a portrait photographer. Canada’s Prime Minister Mackenzie King arranged for Karsh to set up his equipment in the speaker’s chamber and to photograph Churchill following Churchill’s speech in the House of Commons. Not forewarned, Churchill lit up a cigar and growled, “Why was I not told of this?” but consented to a brief session. Karsh asked him to remove the cigar and, when he didn’t, stepped forward and gently removed it with the comment, “Forgive me, Sir.” Churchill glowered as the shot was taken, then permitted Karsh to take still another, jokingly commenting, “You can even make a roaring lion stand still to be photographed.”
6374. TabouliJones - 7/14/2002 4:42:23 PM
Cool. Thanks for the confirmation and extra detail.
6375. theDiva - 7/14/2002 4:46:45 PM
and in the How Juicy is THIS? department....
6376. judithathome - 7/14/2002 4:47:39 PM
I've always loved his picture of Ernest Hemingway...it shows him as an outdoorsman, all ruddy and seemingly smoke-scented from a campfire but in the eyes and about the mouth, the insecurity and sense of failure that oozed from him for all his bravado in public.
6377. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 7/14/2002 10:42:19 PM
Karsh was a sculptor with light--the best!
Deev- Thanks, it's just some cedar boards glued together, cut and carved out to accommodate the lead figure. Cedar is a nice soft wood (easy to carve) and it doesn't rot.
6378. Cellar Door - 7/15/2002 1:54:44 AM
Did everybody see this in the NYT? Absolutely amazing! Never dreamed I'd live to see the day. My first thought was "Abe Rosenthal must be rolling over in his grave," until I remembered that he's still alive.
My second thought: "Sully's definitely not coming back there."
6379. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 7/15/2002 10:43:51 PM
P.S. Diva-- I'll take close-ups when it's finished. There's way more to do (and miles before I get there).
6380. thoughtful - 7/18/2002 3:08:33 PM
Wiz, 'This Man Who Flies' on the home page. Rec'd a signed print yesterday. Will place order shortly. Don't understand it, but it's love at first sight. Go figure.
6381. Property of Jesus - 7/18/2002 3:55:49 PM
More gossip on Michael Jackson
6382. theDiva - 7/18/2002 5:43:54 PM
thanks, Wiz, I look forward to it.
6383. Property of Jesus - 7/19/2002 4:18:39 PM
A real historian...
Alan Lomax. who raised voice of folk music in U.S., dies at 87
6384. Property of Jesus - 7/21/2002 2:27:43 AM
10 Essential 1960s Folk Albums
6385. arkymalarky - 7/21/2002 3:34:06 AM
What an interesting list. Thanks for posting it, PJ.
I don't have any of those, but I'd love to get the Richard and Mimi Farina album. Joan Baez did a couple of his songs that I really loved. You probably already knew, but Mimi Farina died not very long ago.
6386. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 7/22/2002 11:17:03 PM
6387. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 7/22/2002 11:18:05 PM
6388. marjoribanks - 7/23/2002 12:00:42 AM
Very nice, wiz. That first one is one of the very best things you've posted of yours in this forum.
6389. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 7/23/2002 2:49:21 AM
Thanks Marj--they're both guardian figures--the first is a watercolor with Caran D'Ache and the second is a four-color Silicone Intaglio print.
I'm putting together a new website and it helps to see how they look on a screen.
6390. ronski - 7/23/2002 2:56:34 AM
PoJ,
I would not entirely have expected us to be musical soulmates. Thanks.
Wiz,
Also nice. Thanks.
6391. theDiva - 7/23/2002 1:44:11 PM
Beautiful work as ever, Wiz, thanks for posting.
Thanks, also, to POJ for those two very interesting links. I appreciate the diversity of your contributions.
====
Listen, gang, my dear cohost, Riv, has asked me to explain his absence. I, in turn, will ask you for your prayers/good thoughts/spiritual strength/healing vibes.
My dear friends the Rivs have had a difficult time. Mrs. Riv has been battling heart problems for years, and earlier this year took a turn for the worse. Long story short, she had a mechanical heart implanted last Friday and has been approved for a heart transplant. Because she exercises and takes good care of herself, her prognosis is generally good. However, she will be in the hospital for about a month, and will have to be ready at a moment's notice for the transplant.
Again, please keep these very dear people, and their children, in your thoughts. Thanks.
6392. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 7/23/2002 4:08:48 PM
Thanks ronski & Diva . . . and industrial strength prayers to Mrs. Riv.
6393. theDiva - 7/23/2002 5:27:54 PM
Thank you, Wiz. I know they will both appreciate it.
6394. marjoribanks - 7/23/2002 6:18:36 PM
Ah, my sympathies to the Rivendells. I miss talking baseball with him, especially since I shifted my NL sympathies to his team when Tino signed up.
--
On a thread note, I'm going to see Cornershop on Aug 4 in Central Park. I don't know if any of you have encountered the hip Brit-Indian pop set-up, the ones who made a top 10 hit in the US and UK out of a paean to Indian playback singer (and Goan) Asha Bhonsle, but it is a fab group in the vein that only the UK seems to produce, and it promises to be a tip-top Central Park experience.
Naturally, photos will follow, in this thread.
6395. theDiva - 7/23/2002 6:30:50 PM
oh my goodness.
This one goes under the heading of miracle.
When I posted this morning, I'd last spoken to Riv Saturday afternoon, and we've been playing phone tag since Sunday.
We just caught up with one another.
Mrs. Riv received a heart transplant early Sunday morning. It just happened that the heart was available in that very same hospital within hours of their discovering that she would need it ASAP. Another woman was first in line to receive the heart, but was doing so well that the doctor made the decision to give the organ to Mrs. Riv instead. Her prognosis is good, however please keep them in your prayers of healing and thanksgiving. I will, of course, pass along the good wishes.
I have chills just thinking about this.
6396. thoughtful - 7/23/2002 6:48:43 PM
My best to the Rivs.
6397. arkymalarky - 7/23/2002 7:57:26 PM
Oh my. My prayers for them, too. That's wonderful that the transplant is already done.
6398. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 7/24/2002 10:16:03 PM
6399. judithathome - 7/24/2002 10:20:36 PM
I love the way the light comes down from above on this one, Wiz.
My best to the Rivs, too.
6400. judithathome - 7/24/2002 10:21:16 PM
Has anyone ever been to see the Neville Brothers in concert? We are going on August 12.
6401. betty - 7/24/2002 10:23:51 PM
Wiz,
I'm taken with this whole series. I love the color trying to escape the black.
6402. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 7/24/2002 10:51:48 PM
Ooooh--thanks for the responses, Kids!
[I'm gettin' crazy for tomb art.]
I've not seen their show, Judith, but they play Connecticut often because they're so popular.
Coincidentally, I just thought of them because I recently saw a trailer for the new Austin Powers movie in which a prominent mole is one of the primary gags . . . and I just wondered what effect it might have on Aaron Neville.
6403. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 7/24/2002 11:10:15 PM
6404. marjoribanks - 7/24/2002 11:15:55 PM
The tomb art is good, Wiz, I particularly appreciate seeing the creative line that follows from your visit to the Brit museum and ends up in these pieces.
--
Judith,
I've seen the Neville Brothers live half-a-dozen times, though the last time was about 10 years ago. For a while, they were one of my favorite acts, their live performances are good, low-intensity, fun. Be prepared to stand and dance the whole time, in a laid-back Mardi Gras-type atmosphere.
By the way, I highly recommend their double album of greatest hits, a nice trajectory from straight New Orleans sound to more straightforward pop music.
And that Aaron Neville has a simply glorious instrument, wrapped up in that unlikely beefy frame of his.
6405. judithathome - 7/24/2002 11:24:04 PM
Thanks...I wasn't the one instigating the concert going; our friends wanted to go and wanted us to join them. At first, I didn't want to go but called about tickets and found out what good seats we could get so we're going...and I'm looking forward to it now.
We're even going for cajun food before the concert!
6406. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 7/24/2002 11:29:34 PM
Thanks again marj, and while you're around, I wanted to ask you why you thought the Guardian Figure (in #6386) was the best?
6407. marjoribanks - 7/24/2002 11:33:53 PM
Wizardo, it's partly to do with the fact that you've not cropped the image in any way, simply let it struggle there with itself, with a clear internal tension, in that pupa-like manner.
But that's a one second answer, since i'm out the door. I'll look at it again later (tomorrow) and tell you why, in more detail. It certainly remains my favorite.
6408. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 7/24/2002 11:38:43 PM
Thanks--I look forward to it.
6409. Greyfriars Bobby - 7/25/2002 12:35:10 AM
The two funerary figures were nicely painted.
6410. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 7/25/2002 12:56:23 AM
Thanks Bobby and welcome!
How's Oxford?
6411. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 7/25/2002 2:40:53 AM
6412. Greyfriars Bobby - 7/25/2002 6:42:55 PM
Pleases post more of the talisman figures, I find them ver' stunning. Yes I am a painter and new to this Mote.
6413. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 7/25/2002 7:20:15 PM
Welcome again and please do share your efforts as well, Mate!
6414. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 7/26/2002 4:54:38 PM
6415. agm - 7/27/2002 10:18:56 PM
Re arts related links, we include the following among recently discovered favorites(not "great" nor "best" -- just preferred):
News
6416. arkymalarky - 7/28/2002 12:33:51 AM
Thank you very much and welcome to the Mote!
6417. Property of Jesus - 7/28/2002 2:55:25 AM
Yes, welcome to mote, bro. But don't share any personal information because it will be used to attack you politically by the leftists here.
Bob Dylan returns to Newport Folk Festival
6418. wonkers2 - 7/28/2002 3:26:40 AM
Podge, your'e an awful crybaby!
Great article on Dylan. What an artist! The big three: Dylan, The Beatles and Elvis. Why am I surprised you're a fan?
6419. Greyfriars Bobby - 7/28/2002 1:44:32 PM
Can't ya just invision one of W of W's wrapped, talisman figurines adorning a compilation CD of Elvis. Call it the "Shroud of Memphis."
6420. Cellar Door - 7/28/2002 3:34:03 PM
6421. Greyfriars Bobby - 7/28/2002 3:43:32 PM
"Birth of the Cool" is a stunning book of Bailey's mostly black and white photos. I think that title has been remaindered and can be had for half of it's original price.
6422. theDiva - 7/29/2002 1:39:31 PM
Welcome to the Mote, agm! Thanks for the links.
Wiz, marvelous images as ever. Thanks for posting.
PoJ, thanks for the link, but what did I tell you about that other mess? (smack, smack)
6423. theDiva - 7/29/2002 1:40:16 PM
And thanks, too, to Cellar for his link.
6424. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 7/29/2002 6:51:12 PM
Sure Deev and agm, thanks, indeed, for those links--they'll come in handy.
6425. DanDillon - 7/29/2002 8:36:34 PM
Anyone have any remarks on the new Springsteen album? Please respond only if you've actually heard it.
6426. betty - 7/29/2002 8:36:56 PM
Dan,
my officemate has been downloading songs all day (she has it pre-ordered), she said it's really excellent though very sad. Apparently a lot is inspired by his personal experience of the WTC, blah, blah.
Frankly, it sounds boring as hell to me, but I'm not really a fan.
6427. betty - 7/29/2002 8:37:23 PM
I will relay all questions and comments you may have for her if you like.
6428. DanDillon - 7/29/2002 8:39:16 PM
Me neither, but this effort sounds refreshingly different. I like Asbury Park, but not a huge admirer otherwise. From what I've read, it's the understated phrasing and the contemplative lyrics that make me curious to hear it and decide for myself.
6429. DanDillon - 7/29/2002 8:40:35 PM
That's okay, betty. Thanks anyway. She sounds like too much of a huge fangeek to be able to offer any real critical perspective.
6430. betty - 7/29/2002 8:43:35 PM
Well, it doesn't rock! that's for sure. Nice song writing, and all, but not terribly compelling unless you go for that type of stuff I suppose.
you can download stuff off Kazaa.
6431. betty - 7/29/2002 8:48:42 PM
she is a huge geek, she's got plans to go to no less than three shows on this tour...I can't think of any band I'd be willing to shell out 50 bucks plus three times! Ok, if Hendrix comes back from the grave, I'll consider it.
6432. DanDillon - 7/29/2002 9:14:20 PM
Whaddya mean "if Hendrix comes back from the grave"? He's alive and well on that distant tropical isle.
6433. betty - 7/29/2002 9:26:20 PM
Ok, Dan, but we need to get you some vitamin b6 before this turns ugly and you don't ever come down.
6434. thoughtful - 7/30/2002 3:46:25 PM
I'm pleased to announce I am now the proud owner of "This Man Who Flies." Arrived yesterday. It's beautiful. I love it. I have no place to put it in this house that does it justice, but I will be designing a specific space in the new house.
It's most exciting to have it...in a very deep and mysterious way.
6435. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 7/30/2002 5:26:49 PM
Happy contemplations, thoughtful!
6436. thoughtful - 7/30/2002 5:47:16 PM
Thanks Wiz and thanks for pointing out chesterwood to me...would've never gone if you hadn't mentioned it.
Friend also mentioned St. Gauden's place which I haven't been to. His 1933 double eagle made the ny times today as the only one known in circulation just sold for $7.6 mil!!!
6437. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 7/30/2002 6:39:29 PM
That's a nice day trip! Good gossip about his model/mistress (a stunningly beautiful woman) and a wonderful view of Mt. Ascutney from St. Gauden's porch.
If you have time after, cross the river and drive up to the summit for some more delightful views.
6438. Property of Jesus - 7/30/2002 7:00:59 PM
A CD worth buying. And listening to more than once.
Solomon Burke---DON'T GIVE UP ON ME
Fat Possum Music
6439. thoughtful - 7/30/2002 7:15:21 PM
I have a St. Gaudens from 1908...family gift via my FIL...that was the year he was born. It's a necklace which I wear occasionally...very heavy.
6440. Dr.XavierTColtrane - 8/1/2002 4:51:41 AM
6441. Dr.XavierTColtrane - 8/2/2002 5:53:15 PM
6442. betty - 8/6/2002 9:42:42 PM
DanDillon,
I was thinking of you when I read this review of the new Springsteen album at the Onion.
6443. judithathome - 8/12/2002 3:32:16 PM
Last night, we stayed out late and enjoyed The Neville Brothers tremendously...the review I've linked in is really balnd compared to the fantastic music we heard last night.
What the reviewer failed to mention, or may have missed due to deadline, were the excellent saxophone solos Harlam Nocturne and Besame Mucho(not sure on that spelling) wailed out by Charles Neville who is a little wisp of a man but he has lung power to spare and can hold a high note forever. And Ivan Neville is a multitalented guy who has great stage presence.
But it was Aaron who drew the most interst and applause with his wonderful voice; women were swooning but I was disappointed he didn't do Tell It Like It Is. However, he did one that sent chills up my spine called, I think, Ariann or something like that...very etheral and moody and done to perfection by this huge hulk with the voce of an angel.
6444. judithathome - 8/12/2002 3:33:10 PM
review was bland, not balnd. Jeez....
6445. judithathome - 8/12/2002 3:45:24 PM
Okay, I just looked up the song title and it's Arianne . It's a beautiful song.
6446. Dr.XavierTColtrane - 8/12/2002 10:16:36 PM
The good doctor is humming it now.
6447. jayackroyd - 8/15/2002 5:19:39 PM
Janis Ian on copyright and the internet.
Janis Ian
6448. jayackroyd - 8/15/2002 5:19:43 PM
Janis Ian on copyright and the internet.
Janis Ian
6449. arkymalarky - 8/16/2002 12:44:51 AM
That was really a thorough and reasonable defense of sharing music, imo. I've had mixed feelings about all of that, and I know many musicians come down very strongly on one side or the other (there have been good discussions on it in here), but I didn't find anything she said that I disagreed with.
6450. Dr.XavierTColtrane - 8/16/2002 5:26:09 PM
6451. Dr.XavierTColtrane - 8/16/2002 5:26:50 PM
6452. judithathome - 8/16/2002 5:29:21 PM
Miss Divine Reason has some fairly hammy hands.
6453. Dr.XavierTColtrane - 8/17/2002 4:06:31 AM
The good doctor suspects Judy either majored or minored in art criticsm. WHat what hey hey?
6454. judithathome - 8/17/2002 7:57:36 AM
Judy never went to college but she knows art when she sees it and Divne Reason has a pair of hands that look like hams, no matter what the good Doctor has to say.
6455. Dr.XavierTColtrane - 8/17/2002 7:28:56 PM
The Divine Ms. R appears to have two left hands.
So the vixenish Judy ne'er went to University. Why, pray tell? Was that before they started letting women in?
6456. theDiva - 8/18/2002 2:27:41 PM
is #6450 a study for a painting?
6457. Dr.XavierTColtrane - 8/18/2002 2:52:19 PM
The good doctor suspects tis related to Francisco Jose de Goya y Lucientes' more famous work El sueno de la razon.
6458. Dr.XavierTColtrane - 8/18/2002 2:53:06 PM
The good doctor's favorite:
6459. theDiva - 8/18/2002 3:04:30 PM
so the good doctor is a Goya fan?
6460. TabouliJones - 8/18/2002 3:34:11 PM
Well, I failed in my summer mission to see the Rolling Stones at a local gig. I actually forgot about my mission (fickle as I am), until I read in the paper Saturday that it would now be impossible to fulfill. Oh well. Here are the details of my failure:
ROLLING STONES
Palais Royale, Toronto
Friday, August 16, 2002
Call them rock music's Royale family.
Sir Mick and The Rolling Stones last night played their third Toronto club gig in nine years, hitting the stage at Palais Royale on Sunnyside Beach at 10:42 p.m.
They dazzled a star-studded crowd of about 1,000 -- which included actresses Sharon Stone, Kate Hudson and Liv Tyler -- literally until "just around midnight" with their encore song, Brown Sugar. . . .
6461. TabouliJones - 8/18/2002 3:34:53 PM
[cont.]"It was great fun. We had a laugh. Thanks, everybody," singer Mick Jagger said at the end.
The Stones opened their set with a searing version of their 1974 classic It's Only Rock And Roll, amid deafening cheers.
After the opening number, Jagger took off his jacket to reveal a sparkling turquoise tank-top with silver sequins that spelled out 'LICK' - and asked the crowd, "Are you okay?" They responded in the affirmative, despite the suffocating heat that drove many to seek cooler temperatures outside -- on the dance hall's wooden deck and below on the pavement.
Jagger, guitarists Keith Richards and Ron Wood, and drummer Charlie Watts -- with help from bassist Daryl Jones, a keyboardist, three backup singers and a four-man horn section -- then launched into Sad, Sad, Sad, a song from their 1989 Steel Wheels album.
Among the 700 invited guests in the 80-year-old lakefront dancehall was a slew of star actors, also including Dennis Quaid and James Spader. An additional 300 people bought tickets early yesterday morning.
The Stones' third song was If You Can't Rock Me, a staple of their '70s shows, and it was followed by such crowd-pleasers as Honky Tonk Woman, Wild Horses, Heart Of Stone, Can't You Hear Me Knocking and Jumpin' Jack Flash.
Whenever the band did attempt a more obscure tune -- such as Torn & Frayed -- Jagger joked sarcastically: "I'm sure it's going to sound perfect."
6462. TabouliJones - 8/18/2002 3:36:03 PM
Not to be outdone in the vocal department was Richards, dressed in his trademark bandana with matching purple shirt and tank top, who took over the microphone for Happy much to the pleasure of everyone assembled.
"We are rehearsing," he emphasized with a chuckle before doing the song proud.
The Stones have been in Toronto since late July, rehearsing for their fall North American "Licks" tour, which coincides with the release of their 40-year retrospective, double-CD Forty Licks.
"It's great to get out here and play, I tell you that," said Jagger early in the hour-and-20-minute set.
"We've been here four weeks, but it sounds like four days," he added self-deprecating.
Doors at Palais Royale opened last night at 8:30 p.m., later than expected as concert-goers milled about on the dance hall's back deck that opened onto the lake.
Opening act Danko Jones didn't go on until 9:10 p.m., playing 12 songs in 35 minutes.
It was the gig of a lifetime for the Toronto hard-rockers and they were fearless in their approach, playing a confident, cocky and generally intense set.
The oozing-with-personality lead singer -- after whom the band is named -- obviously takes his on-stage cues from Gene Simmons of KISS, for he was wagging his tongue as much as he was singing.
One of their songs, Papa, fittingly included the lyric, "Papa, I'm a Rolling Stone."
END
6463. theDiva - 8/18/2002 4:06:43 PM
Now, was their tour sponsored by Geritol and the AARP?
6464. TabouliJones - 8/18/2002 4:22:45 PM
I know, it is easy to poke fun at their withered old bones. But, blues musicians typically toured into their dotage, so I think the Stones are just sticking with tradition -- mind you, in an overblown, we rule the world, sort of way.
6465. theDiva - 8/18/2002 4:28:44 PM
hey, I'm all for the rock-on ethic, being a geezer myself and all.
6466. judithathome - 8/18/2002 5:26:23 PM
Hey, one of the most energetic members of the Neville Brothers the other night was Charlie...when I first saw him, I thought he was the group's granddad and he was just out there to bang on a few rythym instruments but then he picked up the sax and literally blew everyone off the stage... for several songsworth. At the end of 2 hour show, he was still blowin' and goin'. I don't know how old he is but he looks aged and not like someone who can knock your socks with his lung power.
6467. Dr.XavierTColtrane - 8/19/2002 10:59:34 PM
Ask Dr. Coltrane
An operatic fan writes, "Handsome Dr. Coltrane, as an art connosewer, how would you rate Francisco Jose de Goya y Lucientes, also known (simply) as Goya?"
The good doctor prefers the apelation aficionado to fan.
The painter was a mad genius.
6468. theDiva - 8/19/2002 11:02:00 PM
I do love how you turn a phrase, Good Doctor.
6469. theDiva - 8/19/2002 11:02:22 PM
But kindly do close your tags.
6470. theDiva - 8/20/2002 4:48:20 PM
Happy birthday to the Kid from Red Bank.
6471. JJBiener - 8/22/2002 7:57:46 PM
I posted this in the Cafe, but I thought it would be appropriate to post it here as well. I have a new song on MP3.com. It is called The Boardwalk. You can find it at MP3.com. While you are there, check out The Bridge as well.
Please tell all your friends, neighbors, coworkers, etc. I would like to make a decent showing on the Charts with this release.
Thanks
6472. theDiva - 8/22/2002 8:26:31 PM
Thanks for posting the link, JJ. I've added it to news on the front page.
It's a charming composition, too. And when did you move to Sarasota?
6473. OhioSTOPAS - 8/22/2002 8:35:06 PM
I'm all for Count Basie, but there is only one "the Kid."
6474. theDiva - 8/22/2002 8:55:52 PM
ah yes, Teddy Ballgame.
I suppose we could talk baseball in here. It's an art form, after all.
6475. Dr.XavierTColtrane - 8/23/2002 3:45:23 AM
The good doctor has been unable to mortify a discussion of the late Washington Senators manager in the Sports Domicile.
Anon the missive should have been esperantoed in a new topic, peradventure "Freeze drying dead corpses for deoxyribose nuclear atom extraction--hagiographic fad or sprouting medical disipline?"
6476. RickNelson - 8/24/2002 8:06:21 PM
JJ,
Those two are very soothing and upbeat. Thank you.
6477. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 8/25/2002 5:09:37 AM
6478. theDiva - 8/25/2002 2:21:19 PM
oooooohhhhh....Wiz. Wow.
6479. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 8/25/2002 9:54:43 PM
Thanks Deev--I thought it promising too.
[What's up with the sluggish response time and the kaploowey Politics Thread?]
6480. theDiva - 8/25/2002 10:02:06 PM
Server issues, methinks.
6481. RickNelson - 8/26/2002 5:05:47 AM
Wiz,
The tornadic action with that aura really gives it energy. That solid base works well toward that effect. Those mummy like wrappings and the shape give it a sense of mystery and awe.
6482. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 8/26/2002 7:13:44 AM
Thanks Diva.
Rick--nice of you to respond. I stumbled upon the idea, really. A friend from Brazil sent me some images he took of a waterspout in a harbor.
So now the ideas of hovering and spinning are growing fixations.
Serendipity is such a friend to the arts--if not the National Endowment. All, therapy in my cell!
6483. theDiva - 8/26/2002 1:20:13 PM
It's a tornado of resurrection. Very Catholic. I can't stop looking at it.
6484. theDiva - 8/26/2002 1:39:38 PM
Happy Birthday to Pres, surely the sweetest, coolest tenor ever to live.
6485. theDiva - 8/26/2002 1:43:14 PM
I am reading this right now:
Great book. Daniels 'gets' jazz, and Pres, in a way that I've only previously dreamed possible. When I read the first chapter, standing in Borders, I nearly jumped out of my skin with joy. I bought a copy for my dad for his birthday...and serendipitously, a pal bought me a copy for my birthday.
Check it out.
6486. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 8/26/2002 4:50:03 PM
Indeed I will and I have a friend who'd love it also.
6487. theDiva - 8/26/2002 5:45:45 PM
Wiz
so your painting...is that a completed work? What is the actual size?
6488. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 8/26/2002 6:52:56 PM
It's a small watercolor about 8 inches and it is finished--I didn't want to over work it, Deev.
6489. theDiva - 8/26/2002 7:07:49 PM
Oh good, I was hoping you'd say that. It's perfect the way it is.
6490. marjoribanks - 8/26/2002 7:23:14 PM
6491. marjoribanks - 8/26/2002 7:23:55 PM
6492. marjoribanks - 8/26/2002 7:24:38 PM
6493. marjoribanks - 8/26/2002 7:25:19 PM
6494. marjoribanks - 8/26/2002 7:27:38 PM
Those were photos from the new MoMA space in Queens.
Bye bye for now.
6495. theDiva - 8/26/2002 7:35:58 PM
I love how he relates to things. I'm glad you are already bringing him to such places instead of 'waiting until he's old enough.' It makes all the difference in the world. Good work, dad.
6496. Property of Jesus - 8/27/2002 8:37:26 PM
Review in Washington Post
There was a time not too long ago when the Dixie Chicks, that Texas trio with great hair and greater pop sensibilities, seemed a mere Revlon ad away from turning into a three-headed Shania. Of course, that was before they bumped off a violent husband, stuffed him into the trunk of a car and dumped his good-for-nothing corpse into a lake.
Cold-blooded justice had never sounded so fun -- and so unlike the commercially safe Twain. Indeed, these were not your typical sweethearts of the pop-country rodeo.
By infusing their cowgirl-power anthems with equal parts hooks, tradition and swagger, the Chicks -- singer Natalie Maines and sisters Martie Maguire and Emily Robison, who can play just about anything with strings -- have sold more than 20 million copies of their first two albums, the second of which included "Goodbye Earl," the rowdy stomp about domestic abuse. And any cries of crossover -- that C&W curse word heaped on gone-MTV stars Twain and Faith Hill -- have been waved off by the Chicks with a flirty wink and a smart, sly comeback.
6497. Property of Jesus - 8/27/2002 8:39:03 PM
Three years have passed since their last album, and in the interim, each Chick has gotten married, two have joined the ranks of motherhood and the collective mood of the nation has shifted. The gorgeous new "Home" is a 12-track response to the changes, and the acoustic album -- absent arena-ready keyboard lines and randy electric licks -- is the trio's least pop-minded product yet. Still, the endless outpouring of tough-love honesty more than makes up for the lack of silly singalongs.
With her thorny red rose of a voice, Maines is the radiant star of the band, a punkish presence with perfect phrasing who can cover Fleetwood Mac's "Landslide" -- and make it even better. As Maines outsings Stevie Nicks, Robison drives the ballad with her ruminating banjo plucks and Maguire provides a swooning mandolin-solo centerpiece. The Chicks flaunt their strengths, working in unison to seamlessly blend rock, pop and bluegrass.
The women farm out a good deal of the songwriting chores on "Home," and the hired hands hold up well. Patty Griffin's "Truth No. 2" is a more legally responsible, but no less defiant, portrait of a black-and-blue marriage than "Goodbye Earl." On Bruce Robison's Vietnam-set "Travelin' Soldier," Maines is unflinching in delivering the downer denouement. And Radney Foster's "Godspeed (Sweet Dreams)" is a sepia-toned lullaby that Maines's delivery saves from being a Mommy-loves-you cheesefest.
6498. Property of Jesus - 8/27/2002 8:39:51 PM
Penned partly by the Chicks, the album's best cut, "I Believe in Love," may sound simple in its second-chance sentiment ("I made a promise to myself / Locked it deep away inside"). But there's nothing simple about the million-dollar moment in the chorus, when Maines wishes for a "love that lives on and on" and stretches those last three syllables to an emotional breaking point.
And lest anyone think the Chicks have matured entirely past their party-girl ways, "Home" does have a smattering of sassy bluegrass burners. First single "Long Time Gone" laments Nashville's yesteryear, then breaks down into a back porch pickin' party. The instrumental "Lil' Jack Slade" is a furious hoedown showdown. And the naughty "White Trash Wedding" follows the travails of a pregnant trailer park denizen who just wants a ring on her finger. For the Dixie Chicks, a double-wide in Dogpatch is truly where the heart is.
(To hear a free Sound Bite from this album, call Post-Haste at 202-334-9000 and press 8153.)
6499. wonkers2 - 8/28/2002 12:09:19 AM
Marj, Great pictures, especially the one of the little boy and the disembodied leg.
6500. Property of Jesus - 8/28/2002 2:17:58 AM
Pervert.
6501. arkymalarky - 8/28/2002 3:07:08 AM
The Dixie Chicks are just too dadgummed loud.
6502. wonkers2 - 8/28/2002 3:10:56 AM
I prefer "prevert" if you don't mind.
6503. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 8/28/2002 10:56:42 PM
6504. wabbit - 8/28/2002 11:18:03 PM
Beautiful, Wiz.
6505. glendajean - 8/28/2002 11:33:43 PM
Wiz -- very nice. Reminds me of the shroud covered figure in DC at the Henry Adams & wife gravesite.
6506. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 8/28/2002 11:42:04 PM
Ha! [Geez Wabb, it must be--to bring you out of that reclusive warren of yours!] It's a fertile time for me--all this despair ;-!
Thanks for the encouragement . . . and I hope all is well witchyou!
6507. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 8/28/2002 11:43:13 PM
One of my favorite--thanks gj!
6508. wabbit - 8/28/2002 11:52:18 PM
Wiz, the last picture made me think that you might be coming out of the despair, but this one makes me think it's still feeding you. Both a blessing and a curse (a curse emotionally, not for the work, though). Darker than the landscapes (which you know I loved), but more open and less spooky than many of them seemed to me. Anyway, this has been quite a stunning series for you.
6509. Dr.XavierTColtrane - 8/29/2002 12:58:25 AM
6510. iiibbb - 8/29/2002 3:53:24 PM
*sniff*... these music awards are always so *sniff* touching. The musicians just give so *sniff* very much to their fans *sn9ff*
“When I was a little boy growing up in Gary, Indiana,” Jackson said softly, “I never dreamed of getting the Artist of the Millennium award.”
6511. rubberducky - 8/29/2002 4:16:31 PM
i wish they'd quit putting that freak on stage
6512. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 8/29/2002 5:45:43 PM
wabbit- Like the mystics say: "The world is in a mess and all is well." Thanks for the response and input--as you know, it's such a losing game.
I thought of you when I read this Roberta Smith review and wondered if you'd read it.
6513. wabbit - 8/29/2002 11:35:28 PM
Wiz, I missed that article, thank you for posting it. I've been rather focused on my left boob of late, of all things, poor thing starts radiation on Tuesday (no biggie, in every way, just an inconvenience). If someone had told me years ago that my breasts would become such a focus of attention, I would have laughed.
These watercolors are gorgeous. I will save this last one and print myself a shirt, if you've no objection (credit to you included, of course). The intensity is right up my street.
6514. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 8/30/2002 12:00:11 AM
All best wishes, Wabb and I'd ride on your boobs with udder pride! anytime! Good luck.
I was so taken with the watercolors that I decided to jujitsu them into a grandiose whimsy. I exercise to Cspan in the morning and today they featured a NYC public hearing on what should be done at the WTC Memorial Site.
Could you imagine this . . . or two of them book-ending the plaza?
Yes I know--I'm completely nutz!
6515. wabbit - 8/30/2002 12:22:28 AM
Maybe, but you are my kind of nutz!
Can you believe some of the schemes? Heart-shaped buildings?? CNN has a link to reader/viewer submissions - some are interesting, but some of the designs must incorporate physics from another dimension.
You've got my vote!
6516. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 8/30/2002 2:54:03 AM
Oh wabbit, that's a great link and your right--some of them are hysterical.
Do you think McDonalds would go for this one? 
6517. betty - 8/30/2002 3:16:09 AM
hey all.
ivan very recently (this week) decided he wanted to try painting. So he took some canvases we had aroudn the house and some of Sofi's tempera paint and here's a couple he did of me. He has no idea I'm posting them here so shhh! They are obviously amateurish, but I'm amazed that he can get it to look like anything...
http://www.unbearables.org/images/betty1.jpg
http://www.unbearables.org/images/betty2.jpg
6518. betty - 8/30/2002 3:17:00 AM
hey all.
ivan very recently (this week) decided he wanted to try painting. So he took some canvases we had aroudn the house and some of Sofi's tempera paint and here's a couple he did of me. He has no idea I'm posting them here so shhh! They are obviously amateurish, but I'm amazed that he can get it to look like anything...
6519. betty - 8/30/2002 3:19:02 AM
And wiz...I really, really love this latest watercolor.
6520. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 8/30/2002 3:36:36 AM
Bravo to Ivan, Betty. I like the blue drape that looks like a lascivious tongue. Tell him to go to the library and get a book out on George Rouault.
6521. wabbit - 8/30/2002 4:51:50 PM
6522. RustlerPike - 8/30/2002 11:12:02 PM
I FART on you, wabbit, arky, Ms.No, PenislessOne!
(For not implementing the facelift).
This website is u-g-l-y.
Farty-fart.
6523. RustlerPike - 8/30/2002 11:20:46 PM
Ooops. Just read about your boob, wabbit.
I take back the fart.
Pfffwthwthwthwthwkk!!
6524. wabbit - 8/31/2002 2:22:09 AM
Pike,
What is it that you and several others don't understand about this: THE FACELIFT HAS TO BE IMPLEMENTED BY ALISTAIR. He is the ONLY ONE who has access to it, none of the rest of us have anything to do with the server. CalGal couldn't have implemented it either. I've said all this about a hundred times by now.
6525. theDiva - 8/31/2002 3:17:56 PM
Spike
This is my thread. Now behave.
Wabbit
Prayers for you, sweetie.
6526. Dr.XavierTColtrane - 8/31/2002 5:46:18 PM
Can one of the constambulary who are normally so eager to throw their weights around do something about this farty-fart fellow?
The effrontery and cheek of going from domicile to domicile with such vaprid comments should be cause for a sound thrashing of his person.
6527. judithathome - 8/31/2002 5:51:55 PM
Ahem.
6528. arkymalarky - 8/31/2002 6:24:01 PM
"Treat every man after his desert and who should 'scape whipping (including XTC)?"
(from Hamlet, mostly, thus topical) ;-)
On the popular front, did anyone catch the MTV awards?
6529. theDiva - 8/31/2002 6:25:26 PM
I didn't, but I heard Vin Diesel was on...was he toothsome?
6530. arkymalarky - 8/31/2002 6:26:58 PM
I didn't catch them either, actually. It sounded like there were some interesting moments of Enquirer-type stuff.
Who's Vin Diesel?
6531. judithathome - 8/31/2002 6:28:56 PM
Vin Diesel is the heir to the AHnold throne...the latest thing in Action Movies! He has a dreamy voice and looks very menacing.
6532. theDiva - 8/31/2002 6:29:23 PM
Some bald and hunky Blatalian™ actor. I've never seen him in anything.
6533. theDiva - 8/31/2002 6:32:26 PM
6534. arkymalarky - 8/31/2002 6:33:12 PM
Aaaah. Is he the guy that was in that movie that they have the cool video by Godsmack for with the desert and scorpions?
If so, he's somewhat too too for me. He doesn't say anything in the video, though--just silent clips from the movie.
6535. arkymalarky - 8/31/2002 6:33:51 PM
Oops. That ain't him.
6536. theDiva - 8/31/2002 6:35:17 PM
Godsmack?
I am so out of it.
6537. arkymalarky - 8/31/2002 6:35:39 PM
That picture isn't clear, but he looks like a football jock.
6538. theDiva - 8/31/2002 6:37:58 PM
Well, ya know I like those bald, hunky, ethnic types. (G)
6539. arkymalarky - 8/31/2002 6:38:16 PM
I'm out of it where movies and music are concerned, but I like watching music videos, except the awful ones, which comprise 95% of the ones that are shown.
6540. theDiva - 8/31/2002 6:38:22 PM
apropos of nothing, last night I dreamed I gave birth to sextuplets. Dear Lord.
6541. theDiva - 8/31/2002 6:40:12 PM
Generally I enjoy a good music video, because they remind me of the form of films we made in sophomore filmmaking...I mean in terms of length and storytelling (via pictures and music) within a precise period of time.
6542. arkymalarky - 8/31/2002 6:40:41 PM
Yes, they do have an irresistable appeal, but he doesn't look ethnic in that picture. He looks like a white high school qb with reddish hair fuzz--at least on my cheap little monitor.
6543. arkymalarky - 8/31/2002 6:41:40 PM
I'm slow today. '42 was to '38.
That sounds like a nightmare rather than a dream.
6544. theDiva - 8/31/2002 6:45:34 PM
oh Lord, I tell you, I woke up going 'What the hell?' Then I dreamed I gave Riv a ride home from my house by way of upstate New York.
I think it's the antibiotics, I swear.
6545. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 8/31/2002 11:21:32 PM
Heads Up Department:
wabbit- This review of E. Gombrich's last book (about Primitivism) by Bruce Boucher is worth reading, IMHO.
Boucher also wrote a wonderful book about terra-cotta sketches by Italian sculptors (pre-lost-wax methods) and another reason I journeyed to London to see this show at The V&A.
[This image is linked to the book.]
6549. wabbit - 9/1/2002 3:11:24 PM
6546 and 6548 are in the Suggestions thread.
6550. wabbit - 9/1/2002 3:39:09 PM
Thanks, Wiz, both books look interesting.
Unfortunately, I saw the name Boucher and immediately thought of this: 
6551. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 9/2/2002 4:20:11 AM
Rococo is a million years ago!
6552. Dr.XavierTColtrane - 9/2/2002 4:29:05 PM
6553. wabbit - 9/2/2002 6:47:49 PM
Wiz, about 9' tall and in bronze, please!
The Penis Garden yielded a nice list of links.
6554. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 9/2/2002 8:06:28 PM
Sure wabb--maybe the Mortician's Guild of America will commission me.
What matter, the dream is always better than the reality . . .
6555. Cellar Door - 9/5/2002 7:18:17 AM
6556. Cellar Door - 9/6/2002 8:49:41 PM
And now Ladies and Germs, the subtle vocal stylings of -- ANN COULTER!
I'll plant my own tree And I'll make it grow
My tree will not be Just one in a row
My tree will offer shade when strangers go by
If you're a stranger, brother- well so am I!
Come tomorrow, all that I see is my tree
Oh Lord- what a sight!
Let someone stop me And I will put up a fight
It's my yard so I will try hard To welcome friends I have yet to know
Oh, I'll plaaant, my own treee My own treee and- I'll make it grooow!
6558. Dr.XavierTColtrane - 9/7/2002 12:11:44 AM
6559. wabbit - 9/7/2002 12:57:40 AM
Aside from screwing up the margins, the flash movie linking to Madame Tussaud's in London in post 6557 never actually opened. I've deleted it. Dr.X, if you want to try that again, try it in the HTML practice thread.
6560. Dr.XavierTColtrane - 9/7/2002 1:05:27 AM
Perhaps twas a problem with your browser.
6561. Cellar Door - 9/7/2002 1:08:02 AM
Lovely pic, Doc!
6562. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 9/9/2002 3:12:28 PM
Final carving/3D stage—now on to decoration . . .
6563. theDiva - 9/14/2002 2:35:55 PM
marvelous, Wiz. Thanks for showing us the progression.
Just an update on my illustrious cohost and his lovely wife, the Rivs. She has had no problems thus far with the new heart, and biopsies are all coming back clean. She did have to have an operation Friday because there was some infection at the incision site, and they had to remove her sternum. However, she is off the ventilator and will be okay. This has delayed her return home, but the return is nonetheless coming. Please keep them in your thoughts.
6564. RickNelson - 9/14/2002 2:57:40 PM
Thanks for the update Deev. I'll say a prayer for Riv.
6565. RickNelson - 9/14/2002 2:59:22 PM
Whiz,
Have you considered contacting Steven King about using your razor toothed painting on a cover?
Thank you for the wonderful tour of your work.
6566. RickNelson - 9/14/2002 3:01:30 PM
Oops, as I hit to post I recalled Steven is spelled Stephen.
6567. theDiva - 9/14/2002 3:12:05 PM
thank you, Rick dear. And good morning.
6568. arkymalarky - 9/14/2002 3:40:07 PM
That is amazing, Wiz.
Diva, congrats to Mrs. Riv on her progress. I hope it continues and she's home soon.
On music news, I meant to link the other day that Warren Zevon has terminal lung cancer.
6569. betty - 9/14/2002 3:52:28 PM
My best to the Rivs
Wiz,
I can't wait to see that completed. I'm actually getting anxious over it.
arky,
but the good thing about Zevon's terminal illness is that we are getting a new record out of it, one he's been dragging his feet on for a long, long time and one we may have never gotten if he wasn't aware of his impending death.
6570. theDiva - 9/14/2002 4:01:45 PM
thanks, darlings, I will certainly pass your wishes along. I talked to Riv last night, and he sounded better than he has in months. I even spoke to the Mrs. last weekend, and although her voice has changed somewhat from having the ventilator tube in for so long, her spirit and humor were intact.
I'd heard about Zevon, such a shame.
Speaking of music, I got the new Kevin Mahogany album yesterday. It is orgasmic. Stop what you're doing and go get it right now.
6571. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 9/14/2002 6:27:23 PM
All best wishes for Mrs Riv and especially for a speedy recovery.
I appreciate the responses, everyone--I was going to wrap the sarcophagus in various strips of old olive oil cans, but they'd rust over time and I'm now thinking of a varnished, rusted-iron patina (painted over the wood) and a greenish patina for the lead mummy figure inside—with interior decoration on the wood, maybe? I just don't know yet and I guess I'll have to let it percolate until more molecules move at greater velocity in my brain.
Rick, thanks & FYI Dept: The Cording book is finally out (click image). I received a $100 honorarium—poetry is a profitable endeavor—not!
By the way, should I change my name to Cheese Whiz?
Deev, "Pride & Joy," or is there a newer one out?
6572. theDiva - 9/14/2002 6:32:22 PM
Pride and Joy. Do you have it? Is it not incredible?!
I will pass along your wishes as well.
6573. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 9/14/2002 6:45:01 PM
Yes, utterly exuberant, and I can see how it's right(eously) up your spiritual alley.
My fav is: "The Hunter Gets Captured By The Game."
6574. Cellar Door - 9/15/2002 8:20:52 PM
I'm listening to the sublime Lambert Wilsons' album Musicals. Recorded for Angel it 89, Wilson with the orchestre Philharmonique de Monte Carlo conducted by John McGlinn does a number of totally teriffic songs including "Never Will I Marry," "The Way You Look Tonight," "Johanna," "Aont Together," "Finishing the Hat," "It Must Be So," "You Do Something to Me," "Silly People," and "Night and Day."
My fave is "Love Song," from Kurt Weill's most obscure musical "Love Life" -- lyrics by Alan Jay Lerner.
6575. theDiva - 9/15/2002 8:30:59 PM
Cellar Dear, speaking of musicals, I want your opinion on something.
Riv and I have this running argument about the value of 'Send In The Clowns'.
Your thoughts?
6576. judithathome - 9/15/2002 8:32:29 PM
Wiz, I like the painting on the cover of that book...I love scenes like that.
Diva, send my by wishes to the Rivs, also, and thanks for the update.
6577. theDiva - 9/15/2002 8:34:02 PM
thanks, Judith, I certainly shall.
6578. judithathome - 9/15/2002 8:41:39 PM
Maybe you should link it on the front page; I almost missed it, myself.
6579. judithathome - 9/15/2002 8:42:30 PM
Oh, and I'll admit it: I love Send in the Clowns. ;-)
6580. theDiva - 9/15/2002 8:45:46 PM
That's a good idea, Judith. Thank you, I will.
p.s. Oh Lordy. Not you, too.
6581. judithathome - 9/15/2002 9:12:15 PM
Well, I only like it by certain people. I can't think of anyone specific right now, though. Ha!
I like it sung by a guy, gravelly voiced and with a catch in the throat. Someone like that.
6582. Cellar Door - 9/15/2002 9:13:47 PM
"Send in the Clowns" was a throwaway that Sondheim worte at the last minute because they suddenly noticed that Glynnis Johns didn't have a number to herself. He works well under pressure, of course, but I'm sure he's as surprised as anyone that ut became a standard. I've always loved Sarah Vaughan's rendition. But it's not top-drawer Sondheim.
Of his ballads my fave is "So Many People" from Saturday Night
6583. theDiva - 9/15/2002 9:14:00 PM
Riv sucker punched me.
He recommended the Dianne Reeves tribute to Sarah Vaughan The Calling, but neglected to mention that it featured Send In The Clowns. I couldn't hit the stop button fast enough, and haven't listened to the CD since.
I'm still trying to recover.
6584. theDiva - 9/15/2002 9:14:36 PM
well, that's the only version (Sassy's, that is), AFAIC.
6585. Rivendell - 9/15/2002 10:42:36 PM
Thank you all for the good wishes. The Mrs. is indeed doing well and should be home soon provided God has no more surprises.
6586. judithathome - 9/15/2002 10:43:34 PM
That's wonderful, Riv. I'm happy for you both.
6587. Rivendell - 9/15/2002 10:44:42 PM
Diva,
Sucker punched you my ass.
BTW - I never claimed it was Sondheim's best. Hell, its not even from one of his better shows.
All's I was trying to say is you need to get over this Judy Collins trauma.
I mean... it is Diane Reeves after all. And the rest of the album is good.
PS - loved the Kevin Mahogany you sent. That was one of my favorite songs when I was in grade school.
6588. theDiva - 9/15/2002 10:45:51 PM
hahahahahaha
smoked out
6589. Rivendell - 9/15/2002 10:46:13 PM
Juditha,
Thanks hon.
6590. Rivendell - 9/15/2002 10:48:13 PM
Yea,
smoke this.
6591. Rivendell - 9/15/2002 10:50:05 PM
Putting Suite Judy Blue Eyes on the jukebox. Goes with the smoke.
6592. theDiva - 9/15/2002 10:51:09 PM
oh, hurl.
I'm outta here.
6593. judithathome - 9/15/2002 10:54:53 PM
I nearly cleared out a country and western bar one afternoon when I played Sweet Judy Blue Eyes over and over...it had been installed on the jukebox by mistake.
6594. Rivendell - 9/15/2002 10:55:12 PM
So am I. Gotta get back to the hospital. Will see you all later.
6595. theDiva - 9/15/2002 10:56:04 PM
SMOOCHES honey to you and your lovely ones.
6596. theDiva - 9/15/2002 10:56:55 PM
every time that song is installed on the jukebox, it's a mistake.
Maybe I'm just traumatized by anything using the name Judy. Judy was my first husband's first wife.
6597. judithathome - 9/15/2002 10:59:21 PM
Well, damn, woman...there ARE other Judy's in the world.;-)
6598. theDiva - 9/15/2002 11:01:48 PM
You're not Judy, you're JuDITH. Very, very different. Believe me, all you and that ex have in common is your first name.
6599. ronski - 9/17/2002 6:18:32 AM
Love and Payne (Darlene and Freda), were great. Better than I imagined they would be.
Darlene is as good as she always was. Freda has really matured as an artist. A wonderful show.
6600. judithathome - 9/21/2002 5:04:41 PM
We went to a play Friday night that was astonishing.
It was called For Lindbergh and was a one woman show. It was written by one of our favorite actresses from the local live theatre scene. She's multitalented and very expressive and witty via the written word.
It was about 3 weeks in her life one month after 9/11 and what she experienced flying to New York with her son when he enlisted in the military and flying a week later to California with her daughter to check out colleges. It was fanastic...she noodled on the piano at times throughout the two acts and in two instances did some Erik Satie. That would've won me over if the wonderfully written script hadn't already.
6601. ronski - 9/21/2002 11:27:25 PM
You have to read this one, if only for the lead itself.
"Some people can take more abuse than other people."
6602. RickNelson - 9/22/2002 2:24:24 PM
I wish they had quit around the time of "Tatoo You". "Steel Wheels" and "Lick" are like listening to restaraunt napkin lyrics. This is a point where I'm a minority, their fans transcend all such negatives.
I recall listening to Mick during an interview where he stated they have and do use napkins or spontaneous lyric creations. That's Ok, but what I get from it is mediocre rock, not worth my time.
6603. RickNelson - 9/22/2002 2:44:44 PM
As far as music goes, I'm not really into them. My first choice will be certain early alternative pop genre such as Joy Division, New Order, The Cure, The Pet Shop Boys, etc... Second would include the harder edged of the same such as Jesus and Mary Chain and Sonic Youth.
Most of my change from old rock like Led Zepplin started in 1982 with U2 "WAR". Then experiments started. Like delving into the Talking Heads, Joy Division, Siouxie and the Banshees, Tones On Tail, and Rap. back then the cross over Rap band was Public Enemy and some NWA. I had listened to the Sex Pistols, God Fathers hardly finding it worthy save it's protest appeal. Having heard and missed the 60's to early 70's my thoughts about anarchy were skewed by ignorance and music. Just like most unguided 20 something, ignorami.
I've wondered when I would settle down from my mantra of rock and pop. Well it's happening, slow as it is. I do enjoy something symphonic and light cool jazz. I like to hear culturally diverse music, such as the Sape' of Borneo and drums of Japan, and the Aussie didgeridoo.
6604. arkymalarky - 9/22/2002 3:59:04 PM
There's hardly a type of music I don't at least like some of any more. It's either racket to me or vacuous tedium or it isn't. I've never liked the Stones and I've never been too crazy about Led Zeppelin with the exception of a couple of songs. Jimmy Page is great, but I can't stand Robert Plant's affectations most times.
6605. Ms. No - 9/24/2002 6:26:45 PM
So we kind of got talking about the punk and new wave music scene over in Movies and I thought maybe we should bring it over here.
There are a lot of tunes that I love simply because of WHEN I heard them. If I were to hear them for the first time today I'd probably think they were rot. There are other tunes, however, that I know I used to love---bands as well----but they haven't held up over the years.
What makes a song or a band lasting to you?
6606. judithathome - 9/24/2002 6:34:02 PM
Associations...hearing it at a certain time or with a certain someone. Or being able to tolerate it over and over.
6607. RickNelson - 9/24/2002 7:08:50 PM
For me, it's the sound and lyrics for short lived bands and consistant imagination and sound+lyrics for long lived bands.
The Cure is a good example of imagination. As is New Order.
Siouxsie and The Banshees (Now called The Creatures with release "Anima Animus", The Pixies with "weird Al" Frank Black. Make up some good examples as well.
Sonic Youth is a great experimental band. With Cicone Youth a bizarre twist.
Tones On Tail, the Love and Rockets genre is actually really good music. Unique and tasteful to that style. I really like Love and Rockets, so one does not have to live an alternative arrangement to enjoy the music of the an alternative culture.
Nitzer Ebb was not the best, but gave some interesting stuff along with the hateful KMFDM. Many a weirdo allowed that they stood for "Kill Mother Fucking Depeche Mode", which is a farce. They're just like the Rolling Stones. Out to make a buck of Braindead, acid users of the industrial rock set.
I've a lot of old industrial lieing around. Skinny Puppy is my favorite. Ogre and Ogilvie are masterful toward that sound. What sound should come to mind and the answer is,
'Exactly!'
FLA, Finitribe, Front 242 all interesting in their own way.
Ever listen to Pigface?
I really like Jesus and Mary Chain. Barbed Wird Kisses was so new, so raw.
I still like a good "the london bridge is falling down" Sex Pistols.
The Clash, Ok, but Big Audio Dynamite! Oh, Yeah, Mick made a hit. "Lost Treasures" is a treasure among my collections.
Ever listen to "The Sisters of Mercy", "Moev", or the serendipitous Cocteau Twins with the likes of "Carolyn's Fingers".
6608. theDiva - 9/24/2002 7:17:06 PM
I am way out of the pop music loop.
6609. Ms. No - 9/24/2002 7:21:08 PM
Diva,
Don't worry, most of those bands are out of the Pop music loop. They were the mostly part of the British invasion of the late 70's and early 80's.
6610. theDiva - 9/24/2002 7:26:03 PM
well, I have heard of the Clash and the Sex Pistols. I even have a Clash album (as in LP.)
Now, by 'lasting', do you mean 'will listen to it over and over throughout the years'?
6611. Ms. No - 9/24/2002 7:41:15 PM
Rick,
God, your post just brought on a flood of auditory and other memories. At this moment I'm listening to the Police - Bring on the Night- one of my all time favorite bands and one my most favorite tunes by them.
I've heard OF Pigface but never heard anything by them. It's been 12 years or more since I heard any Skinny Puppy. I was a total glutton when I first discovered Napster-----I had hundreds of cassette tapes that I couldn't play anymore and LPs that God only knew what had happened to--- and most of what I wanted was impossible to find in stores anywhere.
I recently heard of a band out of Seattle called Hot Hot Heat (sounds like a take on the Cure song Hot Hot Hot) They're a modern band but the influence of the 80's New Wave sound is very definitely there. I only heard a single track by them but it was very good and now I'm all amped up to find an album by them.
I wonder if it was just getting older or if maybe with the end of the 80's music stopped being such culturally identifying thing.
Wait, I didn't explain that right....lemme think...
Okay, everyone knows that the music of the 60's and 70's defined the generation. Even disco carved a niche out of the population. Punk and New Wave also had their movement and an identity that lingers in those who lived through it and serves as a recognizable beacon for disaffected youth today who weren't even born when most of those bands broke up.
I don't think Grunge had "people" though, did it? I mean, yeah, there was a scene, there's always a scene, but I dont' think there was a national identity that sprang from that music. We got Gap ads and bad haircuts at $120 a piece and clothing bought new made to look like we fished it out of a dumpster. It was a trendy marketing thing----regardless of the quality of the music.
Or maybe I'm just too old to see any of it any more?
6612. Ms. No - 9/24/2002 7:47:59 PM
Diva,
Yes. I might get a kick out of hearing a tune from my highschool days that I haven't heard since then, but whether or not I'll go out and try to find the album and listen to the whole thing and really dig the band still is another thing entirely.
Or whether I'll play the song over and over 8 or 10 times in a row.
6613. theDiva - 9/24/2002 8:00:10 PM
well, I'll tellya. I feel as though I've outgrown a lot of the pop music from my misspent youth, and definitely haven't made any moves to acquire CD versions of all that stuff I have on vinyl. I don't much listen to what I've got on cassette, either.
I do, however, get a huge, huge kick out of the fact that Gracie went out and bought a double Ramones CD because she is now into 'punk'. (Today's 'punk' isn't what punk was when I was in college, but they sort of nod towards it.) I even showed her how to pogo as we blasted 'I Wanna Be Sedated'. Greg just shook his head.
I'd probably replace my Talking Heads vinyl with CDs, but there's so much jazz I need to catch up on first.
As for generational identity...hm. I was so schizo, musically, back then. It was an either/or proposition with most people - either you were into punk/new wave, 'rock' (as in Bruce Springsteen et al) or funk/dance music. I was into all three, as well as a whole lot of other stuff. As a result, I recognize those tunes as being part of my life, yet I don't define myself by that time of my life.
Does that answer your question? I think I wandered.
6614. theDiva - 9/24/2002 8:01:06 PM
wait. I'm schizo now, musically. Naw. Just eclectic.
6615. TabouliJones - 9/24/2002 8:05:40 PM
Rick,
You're list also brought back a flood of memories for me. I like pretty much all of the bands you listed, and at some time was really into several of them. The Cocteau Twins were great to mellow out to, and I used to think that a song from Victorialand (probably Fluffy Tufts) would be played at my wedding as the first song for me and my bride.
I sometimes wonder when I will get out of my "pop" and rock music phase, but doubt that I will. I will listen to anything from any genre or era of music, so I am not closed minded; but I just seem to be a "pop" and rock kind of guy.
I tend to get fixated on certain bands and albums for months, sometimes years on end (I have done this with Bob Dylan and Leonard Cohen for big chunks of time, for example). These days, when I am not listening to Unknown Pleasures, I have been listening to plenty of Cake and Pulp. I think, Pulp has some of the best lyrics going these days; at least, in terms of caustic rock and roll wit, and they are a quintessentially British band in their talent for great hooks.
I also keep hearing some really great, largely ignored and forgotten, glam rock stuff from the 70s and 80s at this one club I go to and really want to pick up some of the tunes; but never seem to catch any band names or song titles.
6616. Ms. No - 9/24/2002 8:26:23 PM
Deev,
Yes, eclectic, I like that much better than schizo especially since I tend to fall that direction as well.
Off the top of my head these are all songs that I've had multiple play sessions of in the last couple months----when I say multiple play I'm talking about upwards of four times in a row maxing out at...uhm....I think about 7 or 8 times for a couple of these.
Bring on the Night - Police
Don't Mean a Thing if it Ain't Got That Swing - Ella Fitzgerald w/Dizzy Gillespie
Surf Medley - Junior Brown and his lap steel guitar
Love Me or Leave Me - Nina Simone
Outside - The Fixx
E=mc2 - Big Audio Dynamite
New Years Day - U2
They Just Got Married - Randy Newman
Duodenum - The Persuasions
Peaches en Regalia - Frank Zappa
Distractions - Zero 7
Foggy Bottom Breakdown - Flat & Scruggs
Seven Bridges Road - The Eagles
Easy Money - Lowell George
Stand and Deliver - Adam and the Ants
The Passion of Lovers - Bauhaus
I'll listen to a really good album for hours on end or days in a row. Then there's stuff that I like fine or even like a lot but I "max out" on it after one or maybe two plays.
6617. RickNelson - 9/25/2002 4:11:24 AM
Deev,
wrt to 6610, for me the answer is yes. I'm out of the Pop music loop too. But, the music I've been talking about I listen to over and over.
Tab,
I'm glad you dig C.T. The mellowness is exactly why they're so appealing. I'm getting to dang old.
6618. RickNelson - 9/25/2002 4:34:38 AM
The music that I listed isn't very mainstream. Some was, but most of it was specific to a few groups of friends and those who liked to watch bands down at the strip in Carbondale, Il. That was the thing to do, there wasn't much else. Watch the bands battle and drink.
My circle got into the music I mention. Some were far more alternative than I would ever be. But, friends they were. I miss one of them very much. One other I still see once in a while. That one was and is still a scenester.
I dig listening to old Bauhaus and Joy Division. The Mighty Lemon Drops, Echo and the Bunnymen, Depche Mode, older Heads and TT Club, Pop Will Eat Itself (P.W.E.I.), REM, U2, Older Flaming Lips I remember buying "Telepathic Surgery" when it came out. We all thought they were great. Experimental and we had another band with a raw edge. I tried LOOP with their mesmerizing long winded electric guitar.
Some of these bands had releases in the 90's. New Order just released a new title this year. "Get Ready" and I like it as a fan. It's a newer sound for them.
Souxsie and the Banshees Now "Creatures" released last year, or maybe the year before. The Cure with "bloodflowers", supposedly their last. REM of course is still around as is U2. I've listened to U2 since 1982 with "War". Man that was a great hit that winter.
We tried bands like the Dead Kennedys with our Scorpions and Robin Trower.
Moby, Cold Play, and Stretch Princess are some of the newer bands I like.
6619. betty - 9/25/2002 6:09:09 AM
We borrowed the "Gimme Shelter" video from the Library and the whole time I was watching it thinking, "Good Gods, I'd much rather see a video of MC5's preformance at the '68 Democratic convention"...Punk starts in 1968 for me.
Rick you have just listed all of my fave bands from High School...I came of age in the grunge era, but I'd listened to proggy arty alternative music since I was 11 or 12. We had two college radio stations that we could occasionally pick up on our good stereo. I'd sit in my dad's office listening to all these bands you named completely shocked because all i'd heard was the local AM station that played songs that were never cool.
6620. RickNelson - 9/25/2002 3:29:27 PM
College radio is an excellent source for newer and indie alternative music. I can't stand top 40 Pop, nor anything out there of the Britany variety. She's hot, but with her money and the work done to make her that way along with her youth, it cannot be that hard to accomplish. Try for the staying power of Madonna and then well talk.
Madonna will always be my music Diva.
6621. TabouliJones - 9/25/2002 3:29:42 PM
Betty said when she was just five years old
You know there's nothing happening at all
Every time she puts on the radio
There was nothing goin' down at all
Then one fine mornin' she puts on a New York station
She couldn't believe what she heard at all
She started dancin' to that fine fine music
You know her life was saved by Rock 'n' Roll
Despite all the amputations
You could just dance to a rock 'n' roll station
Betty said when she was just five years old
My parents are gonna be the death of us all
Two TV sets and two Cadillac cars--
Ain't gonna help us at all
Then one fine mornin' she puts on a New York station
She don't believe what she heard at all
She started dancin' to that fine fine music
You know her life was saved by Rock 'n' Roll
Despite all the computations
You could just dance to a rock 'n ' roll station
And it was alright.
6622. TabouliJones - 9/25/2002 3:30:06 PM
Good old Lou.
6623. RickNelson - 9/25/2002 3:30:31 PM
However,
Janet, oh la la, Ms. Jackson is my all time favorite to watch and hear when it comes to female Pop stars.
6624. TabouliJones - 9/25/2002 3:54:32 PM
I dunno about Ms. Jackson (and, yeah, I'm nasty), but these days, when it comes to pop chicks, I am all about Shakira -- and am only slightly ashamed.
6625. Ms. No - 9/25/2002 7:07:11 PM
Hey, I've heard exactly one Shakira song and I thought it was pretty cool. She's got a different and more mature, soulful sound than the likes of Aguilera, Spears and Carey. Aguilera and Carey have the pipes, but they're totally without soul.
6626. Ms. No - 9/25/2002 7:18:05 PM
I keep waiting for Sophie Barker to cut an album. She's been on a bunch of other people's stuff. I first really noticed her on Zero 7's Distractions off their new album. Very distinctive voice. One that you'll either love or hate I suppose, it's that unique. I think she's awesome, but I have no idea whether she's a songwriter or has her own project or anything.
6627. TabouliJones - 9/25/2002 7:20:01 PM
Shakira also does this sublime, jiggly-shakey, thing with her ass and hips in her videos. So, she's got that going for her, too. And, the songs I have heard, have actually been quite catchy -- but not in a sacharine, pop bilge, kind of way.
And, because I am a straight guy and required by law to keep up with such things, I have viewed Jennifer Love Hewitt's video. I happen to think Hewitt is adorable and sexy; but, ye-gads, she has no voice and -- worse, for a video maven, at least -- she cannot dance and has absolutely no dancing or slither-to-the-music ability whatsoever. Her video is all cutesy preening and, really, embarrassing for her. Although, a couple of shots of her holding a big, thick, microphone in her itt-bitty hands, have artistic merit and a certain je ne sais quoi that nearly redeems the whole venture.
6628. Ms. No - 9/25/2002 7:23:09 PM
If you go here you can play clips from the album. Track #7 gives you a taste of Sophie Barker. Not really much at all and nothing showing of where her voice can go, but better than nothing.
I also notice that this is last year's release from them, not their most recent. Two albums I need to get. Wheeee!
6629. betty - 9/25/2002 8:07:31 PM
Tabouli,
if i didn't think you'd take it as an invitation I'd say "Fuck You!"
I am not a rock and roll cliche!
6630. TabouliJones - 9/25/2002 8:44:09 PM
betty,
Lou Reed does not do cliche. The chick Lou sang about was decidedly cool and with it and al-right (in that metaphysical Lou Reed way) and into rock and roll when it was cool and out there and al-right (in that metaphysical Lou Reed way). I thought of updating the lyrics, but "proggy arty alternative music" didn't really substitute well.
6631. betty - 9/25/2002 9:01:04 PM
You're right, Reed doesn't do cliche, he just asks strangers to place a clear plate over his mouth and shit on it.
(Actually, I saw Lou Reed on the street one day and had to do everything in my power not to run up to him and say "Wow, yer so cool, can i have your autograph?". It was an empty street, nobody else would have known what a dork i was, why not do it, just to say i'd met him? Because then Lou Reed wouldn't think I was cool, and we can not have that.)
6632. TabouliJones - 9/25/2002 9:10:35 PM
Well, Reed does have his eccentricities; but generally he is great. I haven't followed him much since his wonderful Magic and Loss album, but did see him in concert in 1996. Reed was phenomenal in a fairly large venue, but much cooler and significantly more brag worthy was seeing John Cale play at a converted Church with maybe 40 people in the audience -- which was way, way, way al-right.
6633. Ms. No - 9/30/2002 8:05:46 PM
Go here to download a little Nina Simone. One of my favorite of her tunes.
damn, she's smooth
6634. JJBiener - 10/1/2002 9:36:13 PM
I recently had an interesting musical experience. I had to make a cross-country road trip (Florida to St. Louis to Florida again). I didn't have access to my CD collection for reasons to complicated to explain, so I grabbed a couple of handfuls of cassettes to listen to on the trip. Most of these tapes dated back to my college days and I hadn't listened to them in nearly 20 years.
I found myself singing along rarely missing even a word. When I stopped and concentrated on remembering the words, I came up blank. No clue. But when I relaxed and watched the scenery, all the words came back.
6635. Andonly - 10/2/2002 3:29:05 AM
I saw John Cale twice, once in 1979 and once in the early eighties some time. In the earlier performance he was skinny and did a walk on during an Elvis Costello show in Austin, where he played his whispery song, "Antarctica." The other time he was heavy and violent and strung out in a small club in Dallas, where he did a frighteningly good set off his then recent album, whose name I forget just now, but which included the song "Ready for War."
"Well, Reed does have his eccentricities; but generally he is great."
Reed hasn't been able to sing for at least two decades, but he is a brilliant songwriter, and back in the day he could deliver the goods. If you're going to shoot speed, doing it to "White Light White Heat" is the way to go.
Lately, I've been listening to two albums by a terrific and strange band out of (I forget) Nashville or Louisiana called Lambchop: Is a Woman and What Another Man Spills.
Check them out on Amazon, listen to their clips. The juncture of lyrics and laid-back melody is like some Velvets descended thing, though I can't explain why I think so.
6636. Cellar Door - 10/5/2002 4:45:48 PM
6637. theDiva - 10/5/2002 6:29:16 PM
Oh my goodness!!!! That piece was written by my oldest friend on earth. Thanks for the link, Cellar! Now I have to go read it.
6638. Cellar Door - 10/5/2002 7:00:05 PM
You're welcome.
Of course you realize I worship Kay Thompson like a God.
6639. theDiva - 10/5/2002 8:01:59 PM
and why wouldn't you?
6640. TabouliJones - 10/6/2002 7:48:17 PM
An important release for all you Glenn Gould freaks.
6641. RickNelson - 10/6/2002 7:55:41 PM
Tab,
Do you have a site handy where I could listen to newer Cocteau Twins? If it's not handy don't bother.
6642. TabouliJones - 10/6/2002 7:58:32 PM
Rick,
Sorry. I don't know of any Cocteau Twins sites. Good idea though. If I find any I will be sure to let you know.
6643. Cellar Door - 10/22/2002 6:39:45 PM
Christmas is coming, and my advice to everyone is to get all your shopping done by simply going here. and purchasing as many copies as possible of Rain Sometimes: Vocals by Pinky Winters, with Richard Rodney Bennett on piano, produced by Bill Reed for (wait for it!) Cellar Door Records.
6644. glendajean - 10/22/2002 8:30:05 PM
Cellar -- nice recording. I listened to the snippets. She has a lovely voice. I've never heard of her, but she's a great singer. Is the producer Bill your Bill?
6645. Cellar Door - 10/22/2002 8:53:07 PM
Yep!
6646. glendajean - 10/22/2002 8:56:04 PM
congrats. You are not only a writer but a muse.
I enjoyed the Eloise link, too. One of my best friends died this year, and she was was a major Eloise fan. Alas, another thing where I think of her and wish I could see her reaction.
6647. JJBiener - 10/22/2002 9:39:46 PM
Cellar - Is there anyway you could get Bill to listen to my stuff on mp3.com? I would be interested in his opinion. I am interested in your opinion as well.
6648. Cellar Door - 10/22/2002 10:57:51 PM
Well he's quite tied up at the moment, but send me a link.
6649. arkymalarky - 10/22/2002 11:29:55 PM
Bro has gone gaga over Eva Cassidy, and has sent Mose several CDs. I haven't had a chance to sit down with one, but from the little I heard she was really something.
6650. Ms. No - 10/22/2002 11:31:40 PM
I just got one of her CD's from my dad and, yeah, the girl is awesome!
6651. arkymalarky - 10/22/2002 11:37:48 PM
What's made her so prominent lately? Hasn't she been dead several years?
6652. Ms. No - 10/22/2002 11:51:36 PM
I have no idea. I didn't know she was dead. Hell, I didn't know she was a white girl 'til I saw the CD cover.
6653. Cellar Door - 10/23/2002 3:17:31 AM
It's quite a story. Eva Cassidy struggled for years, playing in various places (tiny clubs) and had a strong but loyal following. But she wouldn't conform to the standards required by record companies that she present herself as a particular kind of singer: Jazz, pop, C& W, et. al. She wanted to sing a little bit of everything. After her death a radio station in Britain played her version of "Over the Rainbow" and got an avalanche of requests. Soon her records, barely known in her lifetime, shot to the top of the charts in the UK, and then over here as well.
It's an entirely populist phenom. No music industry "mastermind" created her. She was a real singer. And the fact that people have responded so overwhelimingly to her music -- most without knowing anything of th "back story" -- proves that there's an audience for real music out there. A large one.
But you guys know that anyway, right?
6654. theDiva - 10/23/2002 2:28:22 PM
I hope they did, I've been talking about Eva for years. I even played her CD for Ms No when she came to visit last year. Eva was a DC area singer who died in '97. She made some amazing music.
6655. JJBiener - 10/23/2002 3:22:33 PM
Cellar - Here is the link to my mp3 page. I would email you, but I don't have your address handy. I would appreciate any feedback you and Bill can give me.
6656. betty - 10/23/2002 3:57:56 PM
Tony Conrad is gonna be playing in Buffalo this weekend and i can't go. i just want somebody to say "poor betty".
*whine*
6657. theDiva - 10/23/2002 4:01:50 PM
POOR BETTY!
(who's Tony Conrad?)
6658. betty - 10/23/2002 5:26:10 PM
thank you Diva, I'm glad somebody understands my pain.
(Tony Conrad is a minimalist composer/violinist. basically, all the Naive rock that you hear is a product of listening to his work in a basemant in the dark with headphones on...he was also one of my professors in film school, but i had no idea who he was at the time. KurtMondaugen from the Fray was the one who told me Conrad was a musician...I wish i knew what happened to Kurt, I owe him big time.)
6659. theDiva - 10/23/2002 5:29:45 PM
glad to help, dear.
6660. Cellar Door - 10/23/2002 5:34:51 PM
Conrad made The Flicker, and created the soundtrack for Jack Smith's Flaming Creaures.
He is married to "underground" film star Beverly Grant.
6661. Cellar Door - 10/23/2002 5:42:46 PM
Thanks J.J.
I'll check out your stuff. But be advised, we know nothing about the record industry. This CD we're doing is strictly a seat-of-the-pants operation. And we have no future plans at present.
6662. JJBiener - 10/23/2002 6:55:00 PM
CD - Understood. These tracks were produced in a small home studio with a computer, a couple of keyboards and a handful of external boxes. It was a minimalist operation to say the least. In spite of this, I think the tracks hold up well.
I am interested in how someone who has just gone through a similar situation views my work.
6663. Ms. No - 10/23/2002 7:07:19 PM
Diva,
Yes!!! I KNEW I'd heard of her before my dad mentioned her.
6664. Cellar Door - 10/23/2002 10:00:23 PM
6665. concerned - 10/23/2002 10:46:55 PM
Who is going to going to be marked with the quad number of the beast?
MUWAHAHAHA!!
6666. theDiva - 10/23/2002 11:16:23 PM
concerned, sometimes I'm concerned about you.
6667. concerned - 10/23/2002 11:19:29 PM
Noooooooooo! Not the Diva!:)
6668. theDiva - 10/23/2002 11:29:57 PM
6669. arkymalarky - 10/24/2002 1:57:56 AM
Thanks for the info on Eva Cassidy. I knew she'd gotten popular in Britain, but didn't know much more than that until Bro began raving about her. Mose loves her CDs and has already been playing Over the Rainbow on the piano since she got them a week or so ago.
It's funny, Mose ran out and bought that young Vanessa Carlton's album and was much less impressed after she found the piano playing was really easy and had learned all the songs she liked within a few days--besides the fact that all the songs sound the same.
6670. thoughtful - 10/28/2002 3:41:25 PM
Hey Wiz if you're around...did you see they're going to have a show of Escher at the Bruce Museum in Greenwich CT? It's supposed to run through 2/2/2003 before they permanently ship the collection to Greece or somewhere.
6671. judithathome - 10/28/2002 3:42:50 PM
I love Escher...
6672. betty - 10/30/2002 7:37:35 PM
Which Wax Trax! Artist Are You?
brought to you by Quizilla
6673. Ms. No - 10/30/2002 9:28:50 PM
Oooh, this is fun!
Which Wax Trax! Artist Are You?
brought to you by Quizilla
6674. theDiva - 10/30/2002 10:24:40 PM
Which Wax Trax! Artist Are You?
brought to you by Quizilla
Who are these guys?
6675. concerned - 10/31/2002 7:44:25 AM
'Work' by 'damiki'
6676. concerned - 10/31/2002 7:47:32 AM
Re. 6674 -
I've got an album by KMFDM. Synth/rock with lots of sampling, as I recall.
6677. theDiva - 10/31/2002 2:34:02 PM
oh dear. That is just not me at all.
6678. arkymalarky - 10/31/2002 4:17:24 PM
I did that quiz and I was Ministry. Ironically, I caught (for the first time ever if I recall correctly) a video of them last night. It was all in black and white and looked like a hallucination of a schiz on a bad trip--a very long bad trip. I was wondering who it was and when the video would ever come to an end (the music was noisy and frantic and repetitive) when their name came up.
I don't really think that's me, either.
Of course I never think who I dial up in those quizzes is me, and I rarely find choices that seem to fit me in the questions. They're fun to read, though.
6679. transient1a - 11/5/2002 5:13:26 PM
For those in the New York area interested in:
NORTHERN DECO: Art Deco Architecture in Montreal
My sister, Sandra, will be lecturing on the subject tomorrow night (Thursday, November 7, 6:30 PM) under the auspices of the Americas Society in conjunction with the Art Deco Society of New York.
For more information go to:
Americas Society Lecture Series
6680. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 11/8/2002 2:25:07 AM
Diva or Riv, would you please delete the Benton Link in the butternut-squash-bar ASAP.
Thank you.
6681. Ms. No - 11/9/2002 7:06:46 PM
Mission accomplished, Wiz!
6682. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 11/9/2002 8:22:20 PM
Many Thanks!!!
6683. RickNelson - 11/11/2002 5:06:01 PM
That Wax Trax site is kinda f'ed up. It's a cookie monster, laying down to much crap in my bin. Bringing a lot of crap I have to get rid of.
That aside, it thinks I'm like Coil and know a lot of crap I don't share and don't care I don't share.
Bwwwwwwwuuuuuhahahahahahahahaaaaa!
I've listened to the music of all but Coil so I don't know if I like them. I've probably heard their stuff somewhere, but wasn't looking for it.
KMFDM is like a coorporate created boy band. I've listened to there stuff since 1988 and I have some still. I like UAIOE the best, but there are others. They put out some singles that suck, like "SUCK".
6684. theDiva - 11/11/2002 9:03:04 PM
Thanks for taking care of that, Ms. No. Sorry I missed your request, Wiz.
6685. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 11/12/2002 5:46:24 PM
No prob, my Pretty!
Now that we have an RV, I dipped my toe into an RV Forum and got a bunch of right wing trailer-trash stalking me. I had the outrageous audacity to imply that they were unfair in their relentless bad-mouthing of Democrats.
You know, the “If-you-tell-me-the-truth,-I’ll-kill-you-”crowd!
6686. judithathome - 11/12/2002 6:07:44 PM
Cushy digs, Wiz!
6687. theDiva - 11/12/2002 7:02:24 PM
okay, so when does the Wiz Tour of America begin, and what do you want for dinner?
6688. judithathome - 11/12/2002 7:11:55 PM
He's getting poached salmon at our house. ;-)
6689. theDiva - 11/12/2002 7:13:44 PM
we want Wiz
we want Wiz
we want Wiz
6690. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 11/12/2002 8:28:10 PM
Yeah sure, NOW I get the invites cuzya know ya don't have to clean your bathrooms!
Ackzuwally, my wife has a conference next June in Portland-O and we're tinkin' about a Southwest-out/Canada -back sojourn--but her vacation time cuts it very close.
Judith, his "unit" is the same cost as a VW Camper (--I always wanted to say I owned my own "unit!").
Convection microwave oven, 3-burner gas cook top, A/C, onboard generator, separate bath&shower and gas/electric frig and color TV.
Now all we have to do is avoid 6 million right wing RVers!
Deev, this shot was taken before we took the plastic of the rug--how un-Italian!
6691. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 11/12/2002 8:29:38 PM
his=this
.
.
of=off
6692. theDiva - 11/12/2002 8:38:14 PM
dear God, you took the plastic off?!
6693. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 11/12/2002 8:41:38 PM
Yeah, and I don't carry a twelve gauge around in it--like all the other 'Murkin RVers!
6694. arkymalarky - 11/12/2002 11:29:43 PM
Ooooh, you'd be the envy of all the deer hunters around here. In fact, I'd love to have one of those. That's super nice.
6695. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 11/13/2002 2:25:32 AM
Thanks ark; let me know when you want to see a Nascar race!;~¢
6696. concerned - 11/13/2002 9:53:16 PM
Nice ride, Wiz. Did you post any of your GWB graphics on that RV forum, perchance?
6697. concerned - 11/13/2002 10:01:54 PM
Btw, AFAIC, keep the graphics coming. Regardless of ideological content, I appreciate whatever creativity is required to create such things, as contrasted with the stereotypical Leftist blather that infests these threads.
6698. concerned - 11/13/2002 10:06:24 PM
Not saying that Leftward postings offend me, just saying that I'm less impressed by them, in general
6699. judithathome - 11/13/2002 10:16:03 PM
I share the feeling but in the other direction.
6700. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 11/15/2002 5:07:41 PM
thanks, concerned--we all just breathe in the sole hope of impressing you!
6701. judithathome - 11/16/2002 8:27:28 PM
Last night, we attended this event (listed at bottom of page) and it was a huge success. Being on the board, I helped with the desserts and we had quite a spread laid out for the attendees...cheesecakes, gourmet cookies, tiramisu, cakes, fruit trays, and cheese trays. It was an elegant evening and we made a lot of money for both our theatre and for the student scholarship program at the college.
The one man performance by Jerry Russell as Clarence Darrow was one of the best I've seen. He may be a local guy but his talent far extends the bounds of this town.
6702. marjoribanks - 11/19/2002 4:48:26 PM
I've been avidly going through Steven Pinker's new 'The Blank Slate'.
The best chapters are those on so-called hot button issues related to human nature, and perhaps the funniest and most cogent of these is on the Arts. I highly recommend that chapter to all those interested in the Arts and especially to those (like me) who have remained hostile to much of what is called post-modernism.
6703. marjoribanks - 11/19/2002 4:49:25 PM
I'd also recommend (off-topic) the chapter on child-rearing, it's sobering and essential reading.
6704. sakonige - 11/19/2002 6:56:27 PM
I'm reading the book also, but I've only gotten as far as the third part. At this point, Pinker still comes across as deeply defensive about the unavailability of hard scientific evidence supporting his controversial theories. I am enjoying his lively, contemporaneous writing style as he is establishing his premises, but he is still expending more effort trashing his opposition than he is presenting his own case. I'm looking forward to him getting down to the business of laying out his own views in more detail.
6705. sakonige - 11/19/2002 7:31:31 PM
off topic, I smiled at Pinker's slight acknowledgement of "matrilocal" societies in his litany of the diversity of human cultures. As backhanded as it was, it was the most direct acknowledgement of a significant existence of such societies I have yet seen in popular science.
"In some societies, men live with their paternal families and support their wives and children; in others, they live with their maternal families and support their sisters and nieces and nephews. The second arrangement tends to be found in societies where men have to spend long periods of time away from home and adultery is relatively common, so they cannot be sure that their wives' children are theirs. Since the children of a man's mother's daughter have to be his biological kin regardless of who has been sleeping with whom, a matrilocal family allows men to invest in children who are guaranteed to carry some of their genes."
6706. thoughtful - 12/1/2002 5:18:08 PM
We went to see Escher at the Bruce Museum in Greenwich, CT and enjoyed it as well as the rest of the museum..hadn't been there before. Wonderful show of the "joys of collecting" art from the renaissance through the impressionists out of private collections in the area...names you're all familiar with like monet, manet. Also a wonderful display of doll houses that were most incredible...miniatures of everything from portraits to cutlery to meat grinders. Fascinating.
6707. Cellar Door - 12/3/2002 4:00:07 PM
6708. theDiva - 12/3/2002 4:47:14 PM
Pinky Winters, is that yours, dear?
6709. Cellar Door - 12/3/2002 6:17:00 PM
Yep!
6710. PelleNilsson - 12/3/2002 6:58:38 PM
Yours in what sense?
6711. theDiva - 12/3/2002 7:07:22 PM
kewl! I'll have to get a copy.
6712. Cellar Door - 12/3/2002 9:42:44 PM
My boyfriend Bill produced it, Pelle. "Cellar Door Records" is Me!
Go to www.pinkywinters.com
for more info
6713. Cellar Door - 12/4/2002 12:03:08 AM
6714. theDiva - 12/4/2002 3:08:02 PM
I listened to the clips...she is marvelous! Thanks for posting this info.
6715. Cellar Door - 12/4/2002 4:10:20 PM
You're welcome. (I knew you'd like her.)
6716. JJBiener - 12/4/2002 4:11:31 PM
Cellar - Did you and Bill ever get a chance to check out my mp3 page?
6717. theDiva - 12/4/2002 4:45:35 PM
Looking at her earlier work, I see she played with Chico Hamilton and Zoot Sims. Gosh, I bet she's got stories to tell.
6718. Cellar Door - 12/4/2002 6:34:36 PM
Not yet JJ, but I haven't forgotten you.
6719. JJBiener - 12/4/2002 7:30:21 PM
CD - Yeah, I am pretty unforgettable. Just let me know when you get a chance.
Thanks.
6720. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 12/10/2002 12:34:51 AM
KUNSTBAR
[Worth downloading FLASH for]
6721. rubberducky - 12/10/2002 9:32:07 PM
hilarious:
This Is Why the Germans Love Hasselhoff
6722. JJBiener - 12/10/2002 10:17:25 PM
Ducky - That was so funny I nearly wet myself.
6723. theDiva - 12/10/2002 10:19:39 PM
it doesn't work for me.
And why does he have such a strangely elongated forefinger?
6724. rubberducky - 12/10/2002 10:35:08 PM
JJ: thanks! i had no idea the man could sink so, so low...
diva: what error did you get? as for the finger, i have no
idea
6725. Ms. No - 12/10/2002 10:42:18 PM
I think it's part of the mic, Deev, but I can't figure out the purpose of it.
As for the video....what in the heck was that all about? The man is tall, well-built, good looking and wears leather pants very nicely. All he really needs to do is stand around and keep his mouth shut, but nooooooo, he's got to go and dork it up but good.
oh.
my.
gawd.
6726. judithathome - 12/10/2002 10:42:53 PM
Looks like lobster claws.
6727. theDiva - 12/10/2002 10:44:27 PM
It just doesn't work. The player just sits there, even after I click play.
I'll try again.
6728. theDiva - 12/10/2002 10:48:15 PM
damn, I got it to work.
Kinda wish I hadn't.
6729. Ms. No - 12/10/2002 11:42:42 PM
best have a cool drink and a lay down.
6730. theDiva - 12/11/2002 6:23:37 PM
alone?
6731. judithathome - 12/11/2002 6:37:26 PM
So is the new Broadway musical by Baz Luhrmann going to be any good? Isn't it just another Rent all tricked out to look like Moulin Rouge? I'm guessing it will be a very frantic updating of a perfectly good opera, with lots of movement and lurid color and maybe a few good arias.
I guess I just like my La Boheme straight, no chaser.
6732. betty - 12/11/2002 7:32:51 PM
judith,
RENT is shit AND they tried to claim no lineage from La Boheme...you just have better taste than most.
6733. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 12/16/2002 11:58:31 PM
A gift that keeps on giving . . .
6734. judithathome - 12/17/2002 12:05:52 AM
Wow...someone could claim they got an Infiniti for Christmas!
Wiz, I missed a great opportunity to post an article by my friend the sculptor yesterday. He wroet a piece for the paper about his piece of public art that is being installed tomorrow downtown.
When you come through with the Great Watercolor Tour, I'll introduce you to him and we'll show you the piece.
6735. judithathome - 12/17/2002 4:17:05 AM
This is the article written by Deran Wright, the man who sculpted the Sleeping Panther of Fort Worth in bronze. I hope to be able to link to a picture of it tomorrow.
When I first heard the full story of the sleeping panther close to 17 years ago, I knew it would make a great sculpture for Fort Worth. Actually the story is really not about a panther at all. It’s about ordinary people responding to adversity in an extraordinary way, and the unlikely source of their inspiration.
In fact, the panther stands as a symbol of all that is best about our city and its people. Grit & determination in the face of adversity, an unwillingness to accept defeat, and fierce self reliance combined with an ability to laugh at ourselves. It is the human dimension in the story that makes The Sleeping Panther of Fort Worth sculpture important.
Fort Worth almost didn’t make it into the twentieth century. Shortly after the Civil War, Railroad over-expansion and loan defaults triggered a nationwide depression, which lasted more than five years. Wall street trading stopped completely for ten days. Banks, railroads and other companies went bankrupt. The Texas and Pacific Railroad, which was promised land grants from the State of Texas if the railroad reached Fort Worth by January 1, 1874, simply stopped laying tracks a few miles east of Fort Worth. The population dwindled as people went looking for work. Fort Worth suspended city government as much as possible. The city teetered on the brink, a near ghost town.
Enter Robert E. Cowart, who had lived in Fort Worth briefly before moving to Dallas to practice law. Cowart wrote the editor of the Dallas Herald that he “had been to a meeting in Fort Worth the other day and things were so quiet, he
had seen a panther asleep on Main Street, undisturbed by the rush of men or the hum of trade.” This was based on an actual event, though the facts are unclear.
(cont')
6736. judithathome - 12/17/2002 4:19:45 AM
(cont')
Motivated by this gibe the remaining citizens of Fort Worth took up the abandoned tools and materials of the railroadmen and, with herculean effort, completed the tracks themselves, just before the deadline. The city’s future was secure, and the nickname “Panther City” stuck. Amused rather than offended by the new ‘moniker’, Fort Worth fondly embraced the panther as a mascot, which it remains to this day. Displayed proudly on newspaper banners, Police badges, public buildings, high schools, and baseball teams, it has become an enduring if somewhat overlooked icon. That same spirit of our pioneering forbears lives on in the people of Fort Worth today. Compare our thriving downtown with the deserted cityscapes across the country. And today the Sleeping Panther of Fort Worth has returned, and rests again on Main Street, in sculptural bronze.
The sculptures we create as a society will tell our descendants much about us. The Lincoln Memorial and Mount Rushmore are tributes to some of our noblest countrymen. The Statue of Liberty and the Mustangs at Las Colinas both represent the pure spirit of freedom upon which America was founded. Sculpture is a three dimensional way of honoring our myths, legends, history, and the men and women whose worthy actions exemplify the values of our culture.
6737. judithathome - 12/17/2002 4:20:11 AM
(cont)
All cultures, from the strangely cold but beautifully idealized sculpture of ancient Greece, and the ultra realistic portraits of Roman citizens, to the Egyptians, Indians, the Aztecs, have left a sculpture record that give us insight on what kind of people they were. We are no different. The Sleeping Panther of Fort Worth sculpture will remind us and our descendants for generations to come about the men and women who beat the odds and built a great city.
Creating art is a complicated and solitary business. The inspiration comes from deep inside, flowing from the subconscious directly to the hands. When the artist is in the arms of the muse, the hours pass, the work progresses, and the mind is free to roam. Working in bronze, a medium whose lifespan can be measured in hundreds and thousands of years, one cannot help but wonder where this sculpture will be in 300 years? 500 years? A thousand? I would bet that Fort Worth will still be around, facing and overcoming challenges, and the panther will still be sleeping on Main Street.
6738. judithathome - 12/17/2002 4:21:05 AM
I know that was a long article but I couldn't link to it.
6739. judithathome - 12/17/2002 4:59:01 AM
As a footnote to this artistic story, tonight's news brings the sad note that Fort Worth public schools are going to cut art and music from their curricula along with library assistants and funds for field trips. Bad management on the part of the school boards? Or education cuts all over?
6740. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 12/17/2002 5:21:07 AM
Thanks Judith, I enjoyed the story and look forward to seeing it and maybe meeting your friend.
Art & Music are always the first to go.
[Check out the "Senate Homeboy" in Politics!]
6741. JJBiener - 12/17/2002 7:34:29 PM
From NY Times:
Bob Berg -- Tenor Saxophonist, 51
Bob Berg, the tenor saxophonist, was killed in a traffic accident yesterday in East Hampton, N.Y., where he lived. He was 51, and had played with Miles Davis, Horace Silver and Chick Corea, among others.
His solo albums included ''Enter the Spirit'' and ''Back Roads,'' which was nominated for a Grammy Award in 1993. The album was inspired by the East End, he said. Mr. Berg was born in New York and attended the High School of the Performing Arts and Juilliard. His wife Arja, 52, was injured in the crash.
6742. betty - 12/17/2002 7:44:22 PM
it is absolutely repugnant to me that arts and music are cut over science and math, but then you can't blow up entire civilizations with a color wheel...
6743. JJBiener - 12/17/2002 7:49:37 PM
Betty - You and I seldom agree, but we agree on this. Art and music are as critical to education as math, science, literature or anything else. No one has ever died from the circle of fifths.
To answer Judith's question, I will lay good money on mismanagement. We spend a hell of a lot on education and far too much of it never makes it to the classroom.
6744. theDiva - 12/17/2002 7:53:08 PM
Hard to say without a closer look. It is sad that the arts are seen as expendable. How many studies exist showing the correlation between high academic performance and strong arts interest? They are interdependent, AFAIC.
6745. betty - 12/17/2002 8:07:38 PM
this is one more reason that rich kids do better than poor kids academically, even when they are in the same school. rich parents can send their kids to private music lessons from a very early age while poor parents can not. the best thing we ever did for sofi was get her in a toddler music program.
6746. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 12/17/2002 8:11:18 PM
If art mirrors culture, what does it say about ours?
I forget who said it, but "I am interested in art as a means of living a life; not as a means of making a living."
[Was that from Frida?]
6747. judithathome - 12/17/2002 8:11:32 PM
But you take her to museums and concerts in the park and read wonderfully illustrated books to her and get her helping you with projects like the garden stones you two did...I think you do a lot to further her appreciation of arts and music but I do agree that kids with rich parents have the advantage of getting expensive lessons.
6748. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 12/17/2002 8:11:41 PM
toys!
6749. judithathome - 12/17/2002 8:12:07 PM
Wiz!
6750. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 12/17/2002 8:19:47 PM
Judith!
6751. theDiva - 12/17/2002 8:22:05 PM
betty, I don't know that I agree this splits along economic lines. Plenty of WC and poor kids grow up in homes where the arts are emphasized. Look at the African-American and Italian-American communities.
6752. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 12/17/2002 8:34:22 PM
Yeah, I can still remember our 12 inch ceramic Christmas tree that had gold sparkles and played Silent Night.
Then there was the picture of the dogs drinking at the bar hanging over our bar.
And how can I ever forget the bobblehead Jesus watching over our crèche?
6753. theDiva - 12/17/2002 8:40:31 PM
oh, stop.
6754. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 12/17/2002 8:43:24 PM
Smooch!
[My mother was into painting ceramics as a hobby for about a year--I couldn't resist, Deev!]
6755. betty - 12/17/2002 8:43:35 PM
Diva,
Well I agree that it's not a definate split, more a vague generalization. But thinking about it, I bet art and music education makes a bigger difference for Working Class kids than it does for wealthier people. Looking around at my friends from high school the ones who "got out" came from houses where arts were valued and appreciated.
6756. betty - 12/17/2002 8:50:21 PM
judith,
Being an art lover myself, of course I take my daughter to those type of things. I mean, I go without convienence foods to make sure that my girl has access to art and music, but then I had excellent art and music education in my public school. In her pre-school class I would be very willing to wager she is the only kid who saw the Degas exhibit at our local Museum. I would bet a batch of cookies we are the only parents that have a Museum membership.
(I was feeling really bummed this morning because we can "only" get Sofi a few art supplies for Christmas but I'm getting a better perspective right now...thank you Judith)
6757. JJBiener - 12/17/2002 9:01:49 PM
Betty - Going without convenience foods is probably the best gift you can give Sofi and yourself. You should not feel bummed about "only" getting her some art supplies. They are a great gift and I have never met a child who didn't love to create. If you want an good, inexpensive gift, get her some clay. You don't have to spend a fortune on play-doh. Go to the art supply store and buy her 5 pounds of modeling clay. She will have a blast.
6758. theDiva - 12/17/2002 9:17:50 PM
Betty
JJ and Judith are right, Sofi will love the art supplies and the intangibles she will gain will last forever.
6759. betty - 12/17/2002 9:23:50 PM
JJ,
we recently made our own "play-doh" ornaments and painted them funky colors for our Solstice tree. We had a blast...I just get tired of being resourceful mama sometimes.
*sigh*
6760. betty - 12/17/2002 9:26:46 PM
maybe i really should be an elementary art teacher...it just seems like I'd be running away from unemployment an awful lot.
6761. arkymalarky - 12/18/2002 9:47:43 PM
I've heard it all now. Y'all just don't know what you're missing not listening to country radio: Leroy the Redneck Reindeer.
6762. judithathome - 12/22/2002 6:00:13 PM
Here's a great one, too, Arky:
Eric Burden and the Animals doing Oh Little Town Of Bethlehem to the tune of House of the Rising Sun.
It's so easy to sing...try it.
6763. PelleNilsson - 12/22/2002 7:46:17 PM
Swedish pop group wins prestigeous award.
LEAST ESSENTIAL ALBUM
A*Teens
Pop 'Til You Drop! (Buy It!)
In 2000, the year's Least Essential Album was A*Teens' The ABBA Generation, a collection of note-for-note ABBA covers by a group of photogenic Swedish teenagers. In 2001, A*Teens released Teen Spirit, which replaced the ABBA covers with unbearably sugary originals, thereby proving the existence of something less essential than a soundalike tribute band's collection of faithful covers. (Due to an arbitrary and since-discarded one-year term limit on the title of "Least Essential Album," Teen Spirit was given the copout prize for Least Essential Album By An ABBA Tribute Act.) So, what does 2002 bring? Why, it's Pop 'Til You Drop!, another collection of non-ABBA-related material, culminating in a cover of Alice Cooper's "School's Out" that trumps Michael Jackson's antics in the battle to be named 2002's most morbid music-related atrocity. How? Well, not only does Cooper himself guest on the tinny dance-pop desecration of his song, but he also allows a lyric change—from "school's been blown to pieces" to "I'm bored to pieces." Coming in 2003: an A*Teens cover of Nirvana's "Rape Me" called "Date Me," with disco beats punctuating a sampled Kurt Cobain wail. Really, how much lower can the bar be set? It may be redundant, but nothing else can touch Pop 'Til You Drop!'s claim to the hotly contested title of 2002's Least Essential Album.
(the Onion)
6764. vonKreedon - 12/22/2002 8:11:05 PM
Shit, Joe Strummer died.
6765. judithathome - 12/22/2002 8:15:41 PM
Clash Drummer Dies
Here's the report, VonK.
6766. vonKreedon - 12/22/2002 8:22:46 PM
Judith - the link should read "Clashe's Strummer Dies", Stummer having been the lyricist, lead singer, rythm guitarist and mouthpiece, but never the drummer.
6767. vonKreedon - 12/22/2002 8:23:23 PM
And my post should read "Clash's Strummer..."
6768. judithathome - 12/22/2002 8:27:49 PM
Ah well, shows how much I know about that group. Sorry.
I thought that was an awfully clever and convenient name fot the drummer. ;-)
6769. vonKreedon - 12/22/2002 8:30:21 PM
One of the Clash's drummers did have a truly fabulous name, Topper Headon.
6770. Ms. No - 12/22/2002 8:32:50 PM
I am most sincerely bummed. All my rock Icons are dying.
6771. vonKreedon - 12/22/2002 8:35:07 PM
'Cos - I know, everytime our classic rock station plays two or more Who songs in a row I fear for Townshend.
6772. vonKreedon - 12/22/2002 8:35:45 PM
To be more clear (hopefully), I fear that Pete has died and I'm listening to a memorial set.
6773. seadate - 12/22/2002 8:37:18 PM
I hate reminders of aging. The three stooges look young and trim.
6774. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 12/23/2002 7:26:15 AM
I don't think so!
6775. Cellar Door - 12/26/2002 1:41:10 AM
6776. seadate - 12/26/2002 2:09:33 AM
Thanks, Wiz. I feel much younger and more in touch with my left side.
6777. Cellar Door - 12/27/2002 6:15:17 AM
6778. Cellar Door - 12/28/2002 6:50:07 PM
Nice Hank Stuever piece on Herb Ritts.
6779. Cellar Door - 12/29/2002 2:33:26 AM
6780. judithathome - 12/29/2002 4:38:43 AM
Nice entry, Cellar...like you say, two readers might not have known but gad, they'd have to be rather thick headed, right?
6781. Cellar Door - 12/29/2002 5:26:50 AM
You're telling me! What do they want? Flash cards?
6782. judithathome - 12/29/2002 5:31:05 AM
I knew with the first book of his I read... The MAgic Mountain and that led me to Buddenbrooks and then Death In Venice. I read all these in my twenties for fun, not for school, and I would think you'd have to be very dense not to know after the first book.
Flash cards sound like a good idea, though...ha!
6783. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 12/29/2002 9:12:36 PM
The Lower Manhattan Development Corporation WTC site proposals
6784. judithathome - 12/29/2002 9:18:16 PM
I don't like any of those. I suppose it's to much to ask they build a park with trees and fountains and public space.
6785. theDiva - 12/29/2002 9:29:47 PM
wow, are they supposed to be ugly and jarring and probably unbuildable?
6786. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 12/29/2002 9:31:38 PM
They don't know a good thing when they see it, Judith!
6787. judithathome - 12/30/2002 5:37:44 PM
Diva, I read your question someplace else but will answer it here: last week, on CNN, several New Yorkers discussed the new plans for buildings in the WTC space and one guy said office space in all of NYC is occupied at about 75-80%. When you consider the size of NYC, that's a lot of empty offices.
Building something this huge is a waste of money and effort. And you wondered if some of those designs can even be built...my fear is that the answer is an unqualified YES.
I think a memorial park and public space is the way to go but I'm sure the man who owns that property wouldn't agree with me...it would be quite a memorable donation to the city, though!
6788. theDiva - 12/30/2002 7:02:16 PM
A 20-25% vacancy rate is rather high. Given the nature of the particular beast, I suppose the question would be, what's the vacancy rate in the financial district? I suspect it's up there.
6789. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 12/31/2002 10:57:48 PM
6790. seadate - 1/1/2003 12:12:50 AM
nice
6791. theDiva - 1/5/2003 7:17:35 PM
oh, now that is sick.
6792. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 1/5/2003 8:15:50 PM
No this is . . .
6793. RickNelson - 1/8/2003 8:28:20 PM
I've been home today with sore fingers.
Didn't stop me from typing though. I'm invincible!! Like that guy who says that just before he's frozen to death.
ANyway, lot's of music to catch up with today.
Old Sonic Youth, Xymox, Jesus and the Mary Chain and the Cure. Good stuff.
Right now I put on the music of Joy Division: "A Means To An End" "END" is the album name or CD, whatever.Lot's of obscure bands. Moby is playing now "New Dawn Fades" great tune!
6794. RickNelson - 1/8/2003 8:30:36 PM
The J & M Chain, "Dirty Water" with their give me shit, aint that the way it's supposed to be. That bit is priceless.
6795. RickNelson - 1/8/2003 8:33:00 PM
I spent years looking for the album version of "Sidewalking" on cd.
When my good friend T.S. made Commando Mix for me and dubbed two copies, that song was among the mix. Good stuff on that mix, I lost it during a long and winding road trip. To much token. Long time ago, though, that's old hat.
6796. RickNelson - 1/8/2003 9:10:28 PM
Question:
What was the word Joy Division sang in "Warsaw" and what did it mean if it was Prewogee? It sounded like Prewogee
Pre-woe-gee
But, was it prodigy?
1999q01
6797. RickNelson - 1/8/2003 9:52:50 PM
Wow,
have you ever seen the back cover of the Cure's "bloodflower" cd?
There's a splotch , like blood pouring, but it could seem to be a shrouded form. Akin to your renditions, but a stretch on my part.
6798. arkymalarky - 1/12/2003 2:27:49 AM
I'm more of fan of Peter Rowan....
My mother is absolutely in love with him. I'm not as familiar with him as my parents and Bro. Bro's drawn a lot of musical inspiration from that area. I'm trying to persuade him to post in here, btw, so don't embarrass me, 'k?
6799. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 1/12/2003 2:44:30 AM
Rick- No, but I'll check it out the next time I'm at Tower or Borders--thanks.
[Hi arky-angel }:•+]
6800. arkymalarky - 1/12/2003 2:49:18 AM
Hey Wiz! Lovely lady there.
6801. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 1/12/2003 3:05:52 AM
All ladies are lovely, ark!
6802. RickNelson - 1/12/2003 3:13:55 AM
wow's
gettin' giggy with it
6803. Ulgine Barrows - 1/12/2003 5:30:14 AM
I am so bummed CDNOW got swallowed by amazon. It takes lots more clicks to get to the music samples and half the samples don't work and one is forced into the evil RealPlayer instead of the less-invasive Windows Media Player. Ptui on them, they deleted my wish list, too.
Mondegreens: I've been hearing a song very frequently while driving the past 2 weeks. I don't know why - it's not particularly new, just seems to be playing every time I go pick up the kid from school.
It's by Macy Gray (the woman who sounds like Daffy Duck), and I think the title is probably "I Try"
I try to say goodbye, and I choke
Try to walk away and I stumble
Though I try to hide it, it's clear
I wear goggles when you are not near
Sometimes I hear that last line as
I blow bubbles when you are not near
Those lines can't be right. Someday I'll get around to looking up the real lyrics.
6804. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 1/12/2003 5:26:25 PM
Try Tower Records, Ulgine; they support The Windows Player.
[By the way, CDNow had a long list of business complaints with regard to rip-offs and delivery problems.]
6805. arkymalarky - 1/12/2003 11:44:27 PM
I thought it was "My world crumbles when you are not near."
6806. Trouble - 1/14/2003 4:35:50 AM
6807. banjomon - 1/18/2003 5:52:07 AM
If there are any Kansas fans out there of the "Dust In The Wind" fame, I would like to alert you to their latest release "Device Voice Drum" . It is a DVD of a live concert that was filmed at "Earthlink Live" in Atlanta, GA. It is currently the best music DVD on the market according to Amazon.com. The critical reviews have given it 5 stars. It features 18 of their classic songs and was recorded on 16mm film. It also features "state of the art" computer graphics by Anamusic.com. You can get a preview of this at www.kansasband.com. I highly recommend this DVD to fans of progressive rock & roll.
6808. banjomon - 1/18/2003 6:11:04 AM
Hello Arky from Malarky,
I finally got on here so I hope you are happy now. I expect you to throw me a party. Have you told people about the Legendary Eva Cassidy. If not allow me...
All you music fans listen up... Eva Cassidy is simply the greatest vocalist that has ever lived. Go out and get her album "Songbird" or "Imagine". You will fall in love. I promise. Since she passed away in 1996 at the age of 33, she has sold over 4 million records and is #1 in the U.K. and Sweeden. Also read quotes by Sting and Mick Fleetwood and Paul Simon who recommended her version of
"Kathy's Song" which he wrote, to the producers of the movie "Made in Manhattan". Visit www.evacassidy.org for more info.
Her 40th birthday would have been this coming Feb. 2nd
6809. arkymalarky - 1/18/2003 4:31:53 PM
Every day is a party in the Mote!
Sorry about not sending out the notices, thread hosts. He kinda caught me by surprise.
And btw, best do what he says. I know from experience.
6810. Cellar Door - 1/18/2003 5:22:16 PM
6811. banjomon - 1/18/2003 11:45:45 PM
In all fairness, I have to tell you that if you view the Kansas DVD on a "big-screen t.v." it will have a "grainy texture" because it was shot on 16mm film. However it was recorded in 5.1 digital surround so the audio quality is excellent. If you play it back in stereo, you will NOT get the full band effect that you would with 5.1 surround. The violin will sound quiet compaired with the rest of the band. I would advise you to view it on a regular size t.v. with 5.1 surround for the best performance.
6812. theDiva - 1/19/2003 3:23:04 AM
welcome, banjomon! Any brother of Arky's is a brother of mine.
We around here are hip to Eva. I've been telling these good folks about her since the Fray days. She's the best, and her passing most untimely.
6813. Ulgine Barrows - 1/19/2003 7:07:50 AM
Cellar, thanks for that link. Nice to hear some new stuff.
6814. wonkers2 - 1/19/2003 5:13:01 PM
"The sun's gonna shine in my back door some day. The wind's gonna rise and blow my blues away." Tommy Johnson
The U.S. Senate has declared (with unintended irony) that 2003 is the "Year of the Blues." here
6815. PelleNilsson - 1/19/2003 8:13:39 PM
This title is on top of the German non-fiction list:
Warum Männer lügen und Frauen dauernd Schuhe kaufen
It's not unfunny. Now brush off your German and suggest a translation.
Judith? Anyone?
6816. judithathome - 1/19/2003 8:53:43 PM
"The Luge Driving Guy and the Shoe Wearing Woman Go For Coffee"?
6817. PelleNilsson - 1/19/2003 9:01:58 PM
You are definitely on the right track but a slightly better version would be:
"Why men lie and women buy sensible shoes"
Don't ask me what it's all about. The list doesn't say.
6818. judithathome - 1/19/2003 9:05:15 PM
Oh wow! I'm amazed I even got near it...not very near but even so. Catchy title; sounds like a Hugh Grant movie waiting to happen.
6819. wabbit - 1/21/2003 5:24:19 AM
6820. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 1/21/2003 6:02:13 AM
For those who adore line, his influence won't end!
[Hey wab!]
6821. wabbit - 1/21/2003 4:14:48 PM
Hey Wiz!
Have you seen the da Vinci drawings at the Met? I'm going to miss them, which makes me sick(er).
6822. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 1/21/2003 4:57:35 PM
Alas no--I loath arctic travel to NYC.
6823. Trouble - 1/21/2003 7:19:56 PM
To:WoW
I wonder if daVinci or Al Hirschfeld would publish on the net cyber-pictures of their heavy wifes---in order to mock other women. Shame!
In other news,
Bob Dylan has contributed a newly composed and recorded song, "'Cross The Green Mountain", to the highly anticipated Civil War epic "Gods and Generals", which will open in theaters nationwide on February 21. Music plays a powerful role in the film -- in addition to the score by composers Randy Edelman and Jon Frizzell, with solos by Grammy-winning fiddler Mark O'Connor, the soundtrack also features an original song, "Going Home", by Mary Fahl, Sony Classical recording artist (and formerly lead vocalist of the band October Project). Directed by Ron Maxwell ("Gettsyburg"), "Gods and Generals" is based on the best-selling book recounting the dramatic early years of the Civil War -- from Manassas to the Battle of Fredericksburg.
The "Gods and Generals" soundtrack will be in stores nationwide on February 4. Initial shipments will include a limited edition DVD with a video of Bob Dylan performing "'Cross The Green Mountain," a Mary Fahl music video, and several scenes not included in the final print of the film.
Starting today, January 17, AOL members will be able to hear "'Cross The Green Mountain" at keyword FIRST LISTEN. On January 18, you'll be able to hear the song by visiting Netscape (http://www.music.netscape.com), Compuserve, or AIM.
You can pre-order the soundtrack now, with the limited edition DVD, from Amazon.com. Click here to order now.
www.bobdylan.com
6824. theDiva - 1/21/2003 7:55:53 PM
ahem.
6825. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 1/21/2003 8:39:06 PM
Trouble, your proctologist called. He found your head.
6826. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 1/22/2003 7:30:46 AM
6827. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 1/24/2003 12:25:18 AM
Gee, that thumbnail of Christo's new Central Park Project didn't get any response--I'm surprised--he's always been a fav of art lovers and the quality of his site drawings usually help sell his projects.
6828. judithathome - 1/24/2003 12:31:46 AM
I liked the islands he swathed in pink.
6829. cmboyce - 1/24/2003 12:44:34 AM
I like all his work, especially "Running Fence" and those pink islands, and I'm looking forward a lot to the Central Park piece.
6830. cmboyce - 1/24/2003 12:48:29 AM
I like all his work, especially "Running Fence" and those pink islands, and I'm looking forward a lot to the Central Park piece.
6831. cmboyce - 1/24/2003 12:49:20 AM
How come two? I dunno. I'm out of practice, I guess.
6832. cmboyce - 1/24/2003 12:50:16 AM
Nice site, Wiz. All the old faves.
6833. wabbit - 1/24/2003 12:54:04 AM
How did I miss that post? I'm also looking forward to "The Gates". I've always liked his site drawings.
6834. arkymalarky - 1/24/2003 1:39:37 AM
Hey CMBoyce! Great to see you.
I love it, Wiz. I looked at it last night but was too busy to Mote.
I can't believe I said that. I've got to get my priorities in order.
6835. judithathome - 1/24/2003 1:44:25 AM
CMBoyce, as I live and breathe!
I bought the most gorgeous art deco side chair yesterday; solid golden oak! I think you'd approve...got it for $35.
6836. marjoribanks - 1/25/2003 7:14:26 PM
Hiya Boyce.
--
I too am looking forward to the Christo installation in Central Park and will naturally post copious photos when it happens. In fact, I think I will try to volunteer for the staff of that set-up.
--
Over the past few months, while accompanying my tyke to various museums, I've started to shoot no-flash photos of various things that catch my fancy. I've found that having these photos has greatly helped my appreciation of the objects, since you never really have enough time to concentrate on individual pieces when you've got a few hours and a ton of things on your wish-list. I'll post some of the photos here over the next day or so for general enjoyment.
6837. marjoribanks - 1/25/2003 7:17:57 PM
Here is a new, spectacular, Gandhara head that the Sackler has acquired (the bad crop of the photo is courtesy Shutterfly).
6838. marjoribanks - 1/25/2003 7:19:54 PM
6839. marjoribanks - 1/25/2003 7:38:58 PM
6840. marjoribanks - 1/25/2003 7:40:23 PM
6841. marjoribanks - 1/25/2003 7:42:46 PM
6842. marjoribanks - 1/25/2003 7:44:11 PM
6843. marjoribanks - 1/25/2003 7:46:51 PM
6844. marjoribanks - 1/25/2003 7:51:25 PM
6845. marjoribanks - 1/25/2003 7:55:42 PM
Finally, not-museum-related and I can't remember if I've posted this or not - but here goes - from Central Park's famous (and famously kid-friendly) statue of Alice in Wonderland:
6846. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 1/26/2003 2:19:13 AM
HAHA! It looks like mostly gangsters with one wary angel!
6847. Cellar Door - 1/30/2003 7:01:47 PM
6848. Cellar Door - 2/3/2003 3:59:00 AM
6849. wonkers2 - 2/3/2003 4:51:40 AM
6850. Cellar Door - 2/3/2003 5:29:53 AM
Hey wonkers, what do you think of the work of David Hamilton's frequent collaborator Alain Robbe-Grillet?
6851. wabbit - 2/3/2003 6:25:37 AM
Record producer Phil Spector arrested in woman's death
Phil Spector, the record producer whose "Wall of Sound" backed up rock groups from the Ronettes to the Ramones, was released on bail Monday after his arrest earlier that day in connection with the death of a woman at his suburban home.
Spector, 62, posted bail late Monday, according to authorities familiar with the case. Earlier, Los Angeles County Sheriff's officials said Spector had been taken to a medical facility because he complained of feeling sick, but was then brought back to the Alhambra holding facility.
Spector faces a charge of first-degree murder, according to police. The district attorney's office said an arraignment date hasn't been scheduled.
6852. wonkers2 - 2/3/2003 1:53:53 PM
I thought Robbe-Grillet was a movie director??? Not familiar with his still photography.
6853. seadate - 2/3/2003 5:11:38 PM
Listening to Tod Vullo's CD the past few days. Such fine, fine guitar. So sad he was murdered 4 years ago.
6854. wabbit - 2/3/2003 6:55:14 PM
Nose surgery helped breathing, says Jackson on Brit TV
Jackson denied ever having had any alterations to his face other than two operations on his nose because "it helped me breathe better so I can hit higher notes."
He said his face was never reshaped with plastic surgery.
 |  |
6855. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 2/3/2003 9:18:54 PM
I wonder if he blow his ears now, when he get a cold?
6856. arkymalarky - 2/3/2003 11:53:20 PM
What's sad is he was naturally very attractive before all the ghoulish changes.
6857. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 2/4/2003 7:05:38 AM
His sadness is quite apparent in both pics.
6858. Trouble - 2/4/2003 6:39:01 PM
6859. Trouble - 2/5/2003 2:01:44 PM
The smear begins. Hollywood left start their attack on dead girlfriend of Phil Spector
6860. Trouble - 2/8/2003 7:36:58 PM
People blame former President Bill Clinton for many things, and you can tack on one more item to the list: The Rolling Stones finally played an unsatisfying show in Southern California, and Clinton's pre-concert opening remarks had something to do with that Thursday night at Staples Center, where the Stones played a free concert sponsored by the National Resources Defense Council.
6861. judithathome - 2/8/2003 7:46:29 PM
Clinton's reamarks had nothing to do with the performance. These guys are grandfathers; stands to reason they will run out of steam someday.
6862. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 2/8/2003 7:57:52 PM
If your only forte is ignorant bias, you'll take every opportunity to exhibit it.
Nothing personal, Rosie!
6863. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 2/8/2003 8:01:24 PM
I couldn't decide if this should be in the political thread or the art thread — so I've put it in both.
To Wit by Colin McEnroe
6864. Trouble - 2/8/2003 9:27:00 PM
Go away, WoW. You know nothing about art.
Hey, I know that song!
6865. Trouble - 2/8/2003 9:34:16 PM
My love she speaks like silence,
Without ideals or violence,
She doesn't have to say she's faithful,
Yet she's true, like ice, like fire.
People carry roses,
Make promises by the hours,
My love she laughs like the flowers,
Valentines can't buy her.
In the dime stores and bus stations,
People talk of situations,
Read books, repeat quotations,
Draw conclusions on the wall.
Some speak of the future,
My love she speaks softly,
She knows there's no success like failure
And that failure's no success at all.
The cloak and dagger dangles,
Madams light the candles.
In ceremonies of the horsemen,
Even the pawn must hold a grudge.
Statues made of match sticks,
Crumble into one another,
My love winks, she does not bother,
She knows too much to argue or to judge.
The bridge at midnight trembles,
The country doctor rambles,
Bankers' nieces seek perfection,
Expecting all the gifts that wise men bring.
The wind howls like a hammer,
The night blows cold and rainy,
My love she's like some raven
At my window with a broken wing.
Copyright © 1965; renewed 1993 Special Rider Music
6866. arkymalarky - 2/9/2003 12:45:26 AM
I know you're a Dylan fan, Mr. T, but why all the references lately?
6867. arkymalarky - 2/9/2003 12:50:41 AM
BTW, have you ever listened to Joan Baez's Any Day Now album of only Bob Dylan songs? I think it's a double album. She has some really nice renditions there, and I think that's one. I haven't listened to it in a long time.
6868. Trouble - 2/9/2003 5:00:29 PM
My son loves Dylan and I'm listening to his music that I haven't heard in ages.
In the news,
Benjamin Curtis, the 22-year old actor who portrays the Dell Guy in those bothersome computer commercials, was arrested late last night (2/9) on a marijuana possession charge, The Smoking Gun has learned. According to cops, Curtis was holding a "small bag of marijuana" when he was popped on Manhattan's Lower East Side (at Ludlow and Rivington for you Gothamites). Curtis is currently being held in Central Booking and is scheduled to be arraigned later today in Manhattan Criminal Court. Curtis, who lives in lower Manhattan, was charged with criminal possession of marijuana, a misdemeanor. Bonnie Shumofsky, the actor's agent, said...
6869. wonkers2 - 2/10/2003 4:52:37 AM
Good to see that the NYPD, prosecutors and courts are spending its time on the really important cases.
6870. Trouble - 2/10/2003 4:51:08 PM
Just days after he made headlines for not getting on the air sooner when the space shuttle Columbia broke apart, Brown's online biography at CNN.com was updated to note that "he helped anchor and lead the reporting effort on the coverage."
Trouble is, Brown wasn't on the air until 36 hours after the disaster, while the other network news anchors all made it on the air much sooner. As the various stories go, Brown, playing golf the day of the disaster, either didn't want to come in or couldn't.
But by late yesterday — and after a call from The News — Brown's online bio was updated to read that he worked "the aftermath of the Space Shuttle Columbia disaster."
"We changed it to better reflect the time that Aaron was on the air," a CNN spokeswoman said yesterday.
Richard Huff
6871. judithathome - 2/10/2003 5:02:31 PM
Trouble, shouldn't your last two posts be in Television? The Dell guy is hardly art or culture; he's not a music person or even close. And Aaron Brown is a television personality. Unless he paints in his spare time....
6872. theDiva - 2/10/2003 6:02:54 PM
I don't mind his having posted it here because, really, the only thing off-topic in this thread is a flame war.
However, I've copied the text into the TV thread if folks there would like to discuss it.
6873. judithathome - 2/10/2003 6:08:05 PM
No flame war, just a suggestion.
6874. theDiva - 2/10/2003 6:17:23 PM
Didn't say it was a flame war, Judith. Just said that flame wars were the only thing off-topic.
6875. judithathome - 2/10/2003 6:22:29 PM
?
6876. theDiva - 2/10/2003 6:27:47 PM
I interpreted your taking issue with Trouble's posts that 1) they belonged in the Television thread because 2) they were off topic (not having to do with art or music).
I addressed 1) by copying the posts to Television and 2) by stating the only thing off-topic in this thread is a flame war (as is my policy in the Cafe.)
6877. judithathome - 2/10/2003 6:34:29 PM
I understand, I understand...I was ready to delete that and write something chipper but hit post instead...
I wish I'd just stayed in bed like I wanted to...ha!
6878. theDiva - 2/10/2003 6:35:16 PM
Some days are like that. Whatcha gonna do, huh?
6879. judithathome - 2/10/2003 6:38:28 PM
Actually, I'm going to the hospital. But only for a test!
6880. theDiva - 2/10/2003 6:49:34 PM
????? Hope it's nothing serious.
6881. judithathome - 2/10/2003 7:06:44 PM
Nope...just a myriad of tests to prove nothing is.
6882. theDiva - 2/10/2003 7:09:47 PM
oh, what fun. Bleah. Hope things turn out okay.
6883. Trouble - 2/10/2003 10:34:18 PM
Celebrating birth of American Blues
6884. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 2/11/2003 7:09:07 AM
All best wishes, Judith!
6885. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 2/11/2003 7:11:31 AM
Meanwhile, in the studio . . .
6886. wabbit - 2/11/2003 1:28:55 PM
Wow, beautiful. I especially like the dynamism of the painting. Are these near life-size?
6887. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 2/11/2003 3:39:21 PM
Hey wabb, thanks. The painting is a quadrant of four panels, four feet high and mostly underpainting at this stage. The sarcophagus is around three feet and covered in copper and lead--to be patinated next.
Some of my brother's ashes are destined for the little compartment under the mummy's feet. The mummy is wrapped in patinated plumber's sheet-lead.
6888. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 2/11/2003 4:07:23 PM
quadrant grouping of four panels
6889. judithathome - 2/11/2003 4:22:40 PM
Wiz, I love the sarcophagus just as it is! How will the patina change it?
6890. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 2/11/2003 5:18:29 PM
Thanks, Judith. The patina will make it look ancient and react differently with each metal--so kind of a two-toned ancient, I guess!
6891. PelleNilsson - 2/11/2003 7:33:50 PM
I like those pieces, Wizard. I can only describe them as haunting, yet soothing. An impossible combination, I know, but then ...
6892. PelleNilsson - 2/11/2003 7:34:49 PM
What is involved in the process of applying patina?
6893. judithathome - 2/11/2003 7:38:06 PM
Age, usually...ha!
Seriously, I think it involves acids applied to the metals.
6894. PelleNilsson - 2/11/2003 8:02:19 PM
Forgerers have interesting techniques such as burying things in cow dung for extended periods of time. But I'm interested to know if it's something the Wizard can do in his own workshop.
6895. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 2/11/2003 8:31:02 PM
Thanks Pelle. Death is kind of haunting and soothing--nature's way of saying, "You can let go now!"
I can only forge American money--Scandinavian currency is much too intricate.
There are various chemical solutions which react with different metals that oxidize the surface. There are lots of different tricks--one I like is to spray on the solution and wrap the piece in plastic causing striated variations in intensity of the color.
This is an example of that technique on the wall behind the figure . . .
6897. Cellar Door - 2/14/2003 6:43:30 AM
6898. PelleNilsson - 2/14/2003 9:36:42 AM
Cellar's #6896 screwed up the page so I deleted it. It contained the same link as above.
6899. arkymalarky - 2/14/2003 5:40:26 PM
Bob and I both think that new Dixie Chicks song "Traveling Soldier" is fantastic. What I've always disliked about them--their lead singer just overwhelming the sound and causing a lot of their songs to grate--is a non-issue. The balance of vocals and instruments is perfect throughout in all the dynamics and maintains what could have been a hokey and overdone tear-jerker into a touching and clear little picture of personal tragedy.
6900. judithathome - 2/14/2003 5:56:09 PM
I heard it for the first time on SNL last week.
Nice song, well done by those ladies.
6901. arkymalarky - 2/14/2003 5:59:40 PM
A timely little anti-unnecessary-war piece, too.
6902. judithathome - 2/14/2003 6:01:14 PM
We need more of those, in my opinion.
6903. arkymalarky - 2/14/2003 6:03:38 PM
The Dixie Chicks are played in the best possible venue for that, too. It's not just preaching to the choir, it's a nice counter-balance to the attitude typical of country music wrt America and war.
6904. Trouble - 2/14/2003 9:52:00 PM
Columbia Records Announces the Bob Dylan Custom Mix CD
For the first time, Columbia Records is offering Bob Dylan fans the opportunity to create a custom CD with their favorite Bob Dylan songs! Visit http://www.custommixcd.com/dylan/ to order yours today, with up to 12 songs or 78 minutes of music and your choice of full-color CD art. Among the available tracks are some hard-to-find rarities.
With a custom mix Bob Dylan CD, there's nothing to download; you will receive in the mail a CD produced at your request, with your choice of songs. You'll have a chance to sample each track on the Custom Mix CD web site before you make your selections.
Create your Custom Mix CD today at:
http://www.custommixcd.com/dylan/
________
Keep up with Bob Dylan online at http://www.bobdylan.com/
6905. wabbit - 2/23/2003 4:55:17 PM
So, the Grammy Awards were last night. The surprise for me was that Norah Jones won every award for which she was nominated, including Album of the Year ... I thought Springsteen was a lock for that one. Also Eminem only got bleeped a couple times during his performance.
6906. Cellar Door - 2/25/2003 12:52:54 AM
Hazel Scott (Note the by-line.)
6907. wabbit - 2/25/2003 6:42:13 PM
Hey, it's your Bill! Good article, I'll have to look through my cd's to see if I have any recordings by her.
6908. Cellar Door - 2/25/2003 8:31:17 PM
There's only one available on CD at the moment -- "The Relaxed Moods of Hazel Scott." She plays with Max Roach and Charlie Mingus.
6909. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 3/4/2003 8:15:53 PM
6910. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 3/7/2003 11:39:16 PM
6911. judithathome - 3/7/2003 11:46:48 PM
Very good, Wiz! I love the patination.
6912. arkymalarky - 3/8/2003 12:56:42 AM
Wow, WoW!
6913. wabbit - 3/8/2003 3:05:31 AM
Yes indeed. I meant to ask when you posted the first one, is that the patina you were describing?
6914. judithathome - 3/8/2003 3:29:44 AM
Wiz, I just showed the pictures to Keoni and he was literally agape in admiration of your work. He asked me to tell you he thinks it's absolutely stunningly beautiful.
6915. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 3/8/2003 6:53:29 AM
Thanks for the feedback—and yes, wabb, it's the same method on the outside with a protective acrylic coating.
My brother died three years ago this week and he would have gotten such a kick out of knowing his ashes would wind up in this object.
When I was in high school, I made him a golf putter that had his name on it—he treasured it. We had plans of going to Sicily together to visit the town where our father was born.
He bought a new RV in 2000 and went golfing in Palm Springs for a month. In his rush to pack and go, he stubbed his toe, but ignored it. He was a diabetic and when he returned home to Santa Rosa, his foot was a mess and his doctor told him he may lose his leg. He wouldn't have it because he felt if he couldn't golf, he could be who he was. A young vascular surgeon told him he could save the leg.
Sal had heart failure during the operation; they had trouble reviving him and he went brain dead. The pulled the plug, he lingered for two days and then died.
So here I am, with my therapy in my cell, a new RV with a foot of snow still on the roof, escalating gas prices and war coming. Life is a strange journey.
Thank Keoni for me, Judith.
6916. arkymalarky - 3/8/2003 5:41:40 PM
Life is a strange journey.
Yes it is. I'm fortunate to encounter people like you on the way, and it is a privilege for me to experience you sharing your tribute to your brother and what you in your art have expressed of missing and loving him. That is a beautiful piece, and I would love to see it irl one day.
And you know that in your travels you and yours have a place to park that RV in rural AR any time.
I just hope it doesn't outclass my single-wide too much in contrast, with folks driving by and all.
6917. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 3/8/2003 8:51:38 PM
Oh arky, thank YOU for the heartmelting generosity of spirit in your response!
6918. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 3/12/2003 5:27:42 AM
Now that that's out of my system, it's back to nature . . .
[Click image for a larger view.]
6919. judithathome - 3/12/2003 7:14:37 PM
Wiz, I absolutely LOVE that painting! It is so right for the times....
6920. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 3/12/2003 8:19:21 PM
Oh, thanks a lot, Judith. I know what you mean. I've been going to an RV forum for technical info and the warmongering is at a fever pitch.
I may be changing the title of our tour to Watercolors Across Canada because of the all the 'murakin creeps roamin'round this country.
6921. wabbit - 3/12/2003 10:07:36 PM
Gorgeous, Wiz, very rich, love the dynamic of the sky and river with the bright lights against the land. Do you have any shows coming up? I'm hobbling, but I know how beautiful your work is in person.
6922. theDiva - 3/12/2003 10:51:07 PM
Wiz
I don't know what to say except thank you for #6915 and for sharing your gifts with us. Beautiful.
6923. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 3/13/2003 8:02:21 AM
Wabb-Thanks, I've been invited to show at a few good venues, but I'm so disenchanted with artists and the so called art world that I keep hearing myself saying "No thanks, I have other commitments."
I just can't seem to bear going to another opening--especially one of mine!
My wife thinks I'm getting agoraphobic . . . and she's all for it! [As an arts administrator at an opening, every sycophantic artist in the state glams on to her for a fellowship grant or a public art commission. At the other end of the spectrum, there's irate politicians who resent the fact they can't usurp the money for their crony artist friends. She can't wait to retire.]
6924. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 3/13/2003 8:02:40 AM
Thanks, Deev.
6925. Macnas - 3/13/2003 9:55:54 AM
Shadow over the land. Good work Wiz.
Yesterday I found out that a neighbour 4 doors away makes a living being an artist!
I noticed kids trooping in and out with pictures and whatnot, and found out that she runs art classes from her home. Sent my daughter to see her, all set up.
Saw her work, was astounded. She does the bread and butter work of cards and such, but her personal work is really good, even to a philistine like me. I found out that see runs a mini auction at home on a 3 times a year basis, and sells most of her work. You have to admire that.
6926. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 3/13/2003 4:12:08 PM
Thanks, Mac--yeah, we junkies have to be fiscally imaginative to survive in a culture that contemplates HUMMERS as high art.
[This from a guy who just bought an RV!]
6927. judithathome - 3/13/2003 4:20:13 PM
Speaking of public art and high art, my friend the bronze sculptor went to a committee meeting the other day for Public Art here in the city...he was receiving a big thank you for his "Sleeping Panther" piece which was installed across from the county courthouse late last year...anyhow, he came away from the meeting appalled to learn the wave of public arts in future is going to be artists working on such marvelous things as manhole covers, lamp posts, and park benches. Both Public and Art but hardly what you'd think of first as Public Art.
6928. theDiva - 3/13/2003 4:30:55 PM
I don't think that's necessarily a bad thing, though. First, the artist is working for pay, which is always good. Second, it beautifies our public spaces and elevates the most mundane things to a higher level. Art is where you find it, you know.
6929. judithathome - 3/13/2003 4:38:02 PM
Yes, but if you could see the wonderful piece he did and how it strikes passersby and how it entrances every single child who walks past, you'd see that it is quite a shock to an artist to see his commissions as being a way for the city to save money by having him design a manhole cover.
I don't care how "artistic" you make it, it is still a sewer cover. These are things the city needs and haven't the money for so they are calling them art and using that money setr aside for "art" to get them. It may be all well and good to look for art in unusual places but if I were an artist, I'd be more inclined to want to do something less utile.
I see your point but most of the artists who are applying to do Public Art pieces are royally pissed.
6930. downtown LB - 3/13/2003 4:40:53 PM
Judith, I think it depends on how good a job they do on the lamp posts.
I've seen some pretty interesting old gas lamps, from a time when people cared about making such things pretty, and interesting.
I have the good fortune to be associated with a magnificent limestone sculptor,(our company sells his work exclusively) who produces some very nice park benches, although, you won't see them in any parks.
I don't know a thing about manhole covers though.
It is a beautiful painting, wiz, but unlike Judith, I don't see a shadow over the land, I see a ray of light on a dark day. Then again, I don't have a great understand of art, so I could be wrong.
6931. Macnas - 3/13/2003 4:47:34 PM
There was a time, when artisans of the industial revolution would produce intricate and pleasing designs for the most mundane of items.
The gaslamp posts that LB refered to, and yes, even manhole covers, were examples of an industial art that drew inspiration from victorian gothic and more contemporary art deco that is now only barely imitated if at all.
6932. judithathome - 3/13/2003 4:50:21 PM
Well, I think there are plenty of commercially done lamp posts that can be used to beautify a city. I'd rather see an artist have free reign and do something from the heart that won't have to depend on specs and tolerances and so forth.
I'm seeing this from the perspective of a man who sculpts world class pieces that are huge...his commissions bring in thousands of dollars and to ask artists of that caliber to limit their wish to do public art to a $500 manhole cover is ludicrous. Their time and talent deserve more consideration and the money that was set aside for that purpose shouldn't be highjacked by a city council who didn't balance their budget properly in the first place.
6933. judithathome - 3/13/2003 4:51:49 PM
And LB, your interpretation of Wiz's painting is just as right as mine is...art is what we see and how we see it; it's different for everyone.
6934. judithathome - 3/13/2003 4:53:56 PM
Macnas, I agree with you about the beauty of industrial design...without it, Paris would just have a subway and not the Metro. ;-)
My gripe is aimed more at my city's leaders who are trying to rip off the Arts money and call it art...they are inept. And it makes me mad.
6935. Macnas - 3/13/2003 4:58:22 PM
judith
I understand your point.
I do differ though, as I see the beautification of practical things as feat of talent and craft.
6936. judithathome - 3/13/2003 5:06:49 PM
I do, too, but they only want the plans...the artists won't do the actual work. I guess it's a moot point, anyhow. That is what they've decided and if an artist wants to contribute, they know what they're getting.
6937. downtown LB - 3/13/2003 5:06:58 PM
I see your point also, judith, and understand some city planner (with the hammer stamp of approval), might have a pretty skewed idea of what an "artistic lamp post" is. It very possibly could end up being worse than a wodden pole with a mercury vapor light at the top.
6938. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 3/13/2003 5:08:31 PM
Don't be concerned, LB--art is always a Rorschach ® Test--and thanks.
My wife was telling me that The DOP (Dept. Of Public Works)—who make up artist contracts— is about to write in a clause that now makes the public artist responsible for any potential liability lawsuits that involve the artwork. That's like saying the plumbing contractor is responsible for anyone who leaves a faucet on in a building—causing damage.
This is a one percent program of allocated federal money that the politicians and the various state agency heads all resent not having control over.
Public art is close to becoming tourism billboards.
THIS is my wife's program and you may find it informative—take the tour, it's brief and it gives one an idea of the many kinds of materials and applications with regard to architecture and landscape.
6939. downtown LB - 3/13/2003 5:24:28 PM
well, we had a situation recently, where one of the world's current great architects, designed a series of lamp posts that were installed some 30 years ago. Well lo and behold, the lampposts started falling over last year!! (rusting at the base) I guess it has something to do with that kind of situaion. (the artists better have some understanding of structural engineering, I suppose)
6940. Macnas - 3/13/2003 5:27:51 PM
Hence the need for spec's and tolerances Judith!
6941. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 3/13/2003 5:37:03 PM
There are Sorceror's Apprentices EVERYWHERE!
By the way, Judith, you should give that link to your sculptor-friend and have them submit slides to the Public Art Slide Bank for future consideration in new public art projects. If a panel-jury likes the work, he could be invited to submit a proposal.
6942. theDiva - 3/13/2003 5:45:52 PM
Judith, try to look at it from another angle. The city may be looking for a way to keep this guy working. Surely manhole covers are mass-produced and can be bought very easily.
6943. judithathome - 3/13/2003 5:52:48 PM
Deev, it's not just this guy...there are several bronze sculptors in town who all compete for these jobs. And I think it's more of a let's get two things for one price with them, anyhow.
6944. judithathome - 3/13/2003 5:54:43 PM
Wiz, I will definitely give him the link! He does work for a private estate in upstate New York, the old Marjorie Post summer "camp" estate so he know how to deliver his stuff up North. ;-)
6945. theDiva - 3/13/2003 5:55:47 PM
If it's competitive bid, they have the option not to do it, no?
Yes, it stinks that there's no money for high art in public spaces, but that's the lay of the land these days, unfortunately. Times are tight for many jurisdictions, and things that some might see as 'luxuries' are among the first to go.
6946. Macnas - 3/13/2003 6:00:37 PM
I wonder will we see the old sponsor system coming back?
6947. theDiva - 3/13/2003 6:15:11 PM
I've wondered about that myself. What would be the benefits of that, versus public funding, versus letting 'the market' determine who gets what?
Let's talk about that a bit.
6948. Macnas - 3/13/2003 6:16:49 PM
I would, but I'm escaping from work. Talk to ye next week!
6949. theDiva - 3/13/2003 6:31:14 PM
dadgumit, I keep forgetting the time difference. SMOOCHES to you, Mac!
6950. judithathome - 3/13/2003 6:53:19 PM
Our museum has a fine exhibition on right now of works by Modigliani and on my way to the gym just now, I heard an promo for it; they played Erik Satie music in the background and it was the most perfect music for that art I could have ever hoped for...nice drive made even better!
6951. vanTHEman - 3/14/2003 1:36:59 PM
Regarding their "apologize," the fat Dixie Chick singer completely missed the point.
Sure, the pig has a First Amendment right to attack the president. But their (former) fans also have a First Amendment right to stop buying their music or go public with their criticism. The Dixie Checks are paid entertainers, and regardless of the First Amendment, they were stupid to say anything that would jeopardize their revenue stream. Especialy from a woman with an IQ of 80.
We have tickets to see them in June. Good seats too. Being a former leftist, I know how to heckle.
Time will tell what happens.
6952. vanTHEman - 3/14/2003 1:38:19 PM
Regarding their "apology," the fat Dixie Chick singer completely missed the point.
Sure, the pig has a First Amendment right to attack the president. But their (former) fans also have a First Amendment right to stop buying their music or go public with their criticism. The Dixie Checks are paid entertainers, and regardless of the First Amendment, they were stupid to say anything that would jeopardize their revenue stream. Especialy from a woman with an IQ of 80.
We have tickets to see them in June. Good seats too. Being a former leftist, I know how to heckle.
Time will tell what happens.
6953. judithathome - 3/14/2003 3:24:41 PM
Rather than heckle them, why not show them how you really feel and hit them in their revenue stream? Demand your money back now while the knee jerk fever is in full throttle...if you wait too long, it will have all blown over and you'll be stuck with watching the show and voicing your own opinion, which they likely won't hear or pay attention to, anyhow.
6954. arkymalarky - 3/14/2003 4:35:24 PM
I agree that people have a right not to buy their music if they don't like their comments, Van. Remember the Beatle album burning ceremonies? It might not have occurred to you and others that they value their right to express their opinions over their revenue stream, and many of those who love art and entertainment will overlook the politics of a talent.
What her weight has to do with it I have no idea, but it certainly reflects nicely on your own prejudices.
6955. judithathome - 3/14/2003 4:50:02 PM
Arky, why do you think so many people who disagree with what she said are calling her fat? It's amazing to me but I guess people do it to Rush, also...but why is that? Does their size have anything to do with how they think?
If she were the size of Ann Coulter, would her opinion be any more valid? People who disagree with Coulter do the same thing...comment on her size. Heck, I've done it and I've done it with Rush, too.
I wonder why we do that?
6956. arkymalarky - 3/14/2003 5:02:06 PM
I don't know. I have several really good friends who are significantly overweight (and Bob and I aren't exactly slim and trim), so I tend to automatically edit out weight remarks. Fathead is a different thing, but I personally prefer calling people butt-ugly. ;-) I have heard people around here call our governor "That fat Baptist preacher," but people usually play off on his name.
6957. Cellar Door - 3/14/2003 5:02:38 PM
Because sexual desirability is the "bottom line."
6958. arkymalarky - 3/14/2003 5:04:20 PM
That would explain my "butt-ugly" preference, then.
6959. arkymalarky - 3/14/2003 5:06:27 PM
I'd be more insulted as a singer to be compared to Britney Airhead than to be knocked for my weight for political remarks I'd made, especially considering some of the great singers who are heavy.
6960. vanTHEman - 3/14/2003 5:18:07 PM
Nice to hear mote's three girls weight in.
Sure it's an easy insult. I heard it first on the Simpsons when Bart was talking about the Chics.
And if Leann Rimes can lose the tonage, why not the fat singer who likes us to see her middle on network TV.
Phat people have no reason 2 live.
6961. arkymalarky - 3/14/2003 5:26:32 PM
And I always thought you were phat. Contrary to popular opinion, I realize.
6962. judithathome - 3/14/2003 5:27:17 PM
LeeAnn Rimes didn't lose weight; she just aged into her adult persona instead of that of a normal, prepubescent teen.
6963. vanTHEman - 3/14/2003 5:34:00 PM
It's LeAnn, sister. When you look at your mirror do you sing "Wide Open Spaces"?
Dixie Chick apologizes for saying she's ashamed of Bush...
http://www.wpmi.com/Global/story.asp?S=1180659
Any Dixie Chicks discs you want to unload could be mailed to:
President
Columbia Records
Sony Music
attn: Dixie Chicks "Anti-Americanism" Returns
550 Madison Avenue
New York, NY 10022
6964. judithathome - 3/14/2003 6:00:12 PM
It's LeAnn, sister. When you look at your mirror do you sing "Wide Open Spaces"?
Why should I? When I look in my mirror, I'm not looking at your head.;-)
6965. vanTHEman - 3/14/2003 6:00:17 PM
"DUMB & DUMBER" ALERT:
Dixie Chicks Pulled from Air After Bashing Bush
DALLAS (Reuters) - There are a lot worse things in country music than your wife leaving you or your dog dying. There's stations not playing your music because you done gone and said some things against the president.
Music superstars the Dixie Chicks are finding out that criticizing President Bush's plans for war in Iraq can cost you air play, big time.
Country stations across the United States have pulled the Chicks from playlists following reports that lead singer Natalie Maines said in a concert in London earlier this week that she was "ashamed the president of the United States is from Texas."
Station managers said their decisions were prompted by calls from irate listeners who thought criticism of the president was unpatriotic.
The group, which got its start in Texas, was one of the darlings of this year's Grammy Awards. The three-woman band that blends blue grass and pop hooks has spawned legions of fans who embrace the ideals of strong women celebrated in some of the trio's songs.
One station in Kansas City, Missouri held a Dixie "chicken toss" party Friday morning, where Chick critics were encouraged to dump the group's tapes, CDs and concert tickets into trash cans.
http://reuters.com/newsArticle.jhtml?type=entertainmentNews&storyID=2384303
6966. arkymalarky - 3/14/2003 7:16:55 PM
Yep, it doesn't take much to bring the book-burners out of the woodwork. And country music was just really beginning to improve its image too. I was actually listening to it some in the last couple of years. I'll decide whether or not to continue based on my local stations' censorship policies.
6967. vanTHEman - 3/15/2003 1:02:44 PM
"We've had a huge listener reaction and movement against the statements," said Paul Williams, program director for KPLX-FM in Dallas-Fort Worth, the nation's fifth largest radio market.
On the Web site for KSCS-FM, also in Dallas-Fort Worth, was a photo of the three-member group, with black tape over Maines' mouth. The headline at www.kscs.com read: "Have The Dixie Chicks Gone Too Far?"
Ted Stecker, KSCS program director, said he had never had this kind of response from an audience during his 30 years in the music business.
"A lot could depend on how the Dixie Chicks respond and face their fans," he said.
In Kansas City, WDAF set trash cans outside the radio station for people to throw their Dixie Chicks CDs away. The station has boycotted the group's music on air, and its Web site displayed more than 800 e-mails from listeners. Most people voiced outrage about Maines' comment and praised the station for its boycott.
A few voiced support for the group and for their right to freely speak their opinions about the country and the president.
But Tom Fontaine, an on-air personality at KILT-FM in Houston, said, "We stand behind our president and we are proud he is from Texas."
The station has suspended playing the Dixie Chicks
6968. arkymalarky - 3/15/2003 6:24:36 PM
I'm promoting a "Buy the Chicks" movement. Even non-fans will buy their albums and concert tickets on principle and those who support their freedom to speak and oppose censorship will remove radio stations who ban their music from their car buttons and alarm clocks.
6969. arkymalarky - 3/15/2003 6:25:49 PM
I'm trying to recall a banning of books or music in our country's history that we hold up proudly today.
6970. vanTHEman - 3/15/2003 6:47:38 PM
Free speech? Sure. I'm looking forward to the Chicks again playing street corners in Texas for coinage.
Or, dropping the fat dumb one like they did before to their cowgirl singer.
6971. judithathome - 3/15/2003 6:48:17 PM
Good exercise...people haven't been this angry since they decided with no proof that Pete Townshend was a pedophile. Of course, they didn't burn their Who albums even then.
6972. vanTHEman - 3/15/2003 7:00:29 PM
.."JOHN KERRY is The 4th DIXIE CHICK"..
...says TONY SNOW on today's ..'FoX News Sunday'..
NEVER FORGET
(at least Vietnam medal-thrower Kerry didn't make the national insult in another country)
6973. arkymalarky - 3/15/2003 9:04:43 PM
You haven't provided me a historic example, Van. When have we been proud of a past incidence of trying to shut someone up with censorship and book/record burnings?
They got where they are based on what Americans like, not based on their views, so wishing them back as street musicians because of a statement doesn't make much sense. If you're worried about musicians sending messages you don't like, I'd think there would be a lot more to focus on in other genres than those girls.
6974. vanTHEman - 3/15/2003 9:09:56 PM
Sure it does. They have every right to sing. The censorship charge is just a canard.
The sisters fired their first singer. Second song-bird has to go. Blame it on Saddam, the mass murderer.
6975. vanTHEman - 3/16/2003 5:03:54 AM
DALLAS, Texas (AP) -- Natalie Maines, lead singer of the Dixie Chicks, is finding out that sometimes saying you're sorry doesn't make much of a difference.
Radio stations nationwide are boycotting the Dixie Chicks, even though Maines publicly apologized for telling a London audience last Monday: "Just so you know, we're ashamed the president of the United States is from Texas."
Maines is a Lubbock native.
In her apology Friday, Maines said: "As a concerned American citizen, I apologize to President Bush because my remark was disrespectful. I feel that whoever holds that office should be treated with the utmost respect."
The words didn't carry much weight with listeners in Maines' home state and elsewhere.
"We've had a huge listener reaction and movement against the statements," said Paul Williams of KPLX-FM in Dallas-Fort Worth, the nation's fifth largest radio market.
In Kansas City, Missouri, WDAF-AM set trash cans outside its offices for listeners to toss their Dixie Chicks CDs. Its Web site displayed more than 800 listener e-mails, most of them in support of the station's boycott.
After more than 250 listeners called Friday to complain about Maines' comments, WTDR-FM in Talladega, Alabama, dropped the Dixie Chicks.
"The emotion of the callers telling us about their fathers and sons and brothers who are overseas now and who fought in previous wars was very specific," said Jim Jacobs, president of Jacobs Broadcast Group, which includes WTDR
6976. vanTHEman - 3/16/2003 1:41:28 PM
Country superstar Toby Keith has said he disagrees with what Natalie Maines said about President Bush and America. He also said he thinks "she needs to shut her big fat mouth"
6977. vanTHEman - 3/16/2003 2:24:03 PM
Why I've Dumped The Dixie Chicks
By Paul M. Weyrich
I don't follow contemporary music but I have to admit I became a fan of the Dixie Chicks. I liked their sound and you could actually understand what they were singing. Well, no more. In an appearance in London, their leader denounced our President and said they were embarrassed by President George W. Bush because they too were from Texas. The Dixie Chicks may be entitled to their opinion, but for them to give aid and comfort to the enemy when we are on the edge of war is just outrageous.
I'll never again listen to their songs. I certainly won't buy their CDs. I hope after this they are relegated to playing at Hank's Bar and Grille in Yazoo City, Mississippi. I don't know what has happened to the concept that "Politics Stops at the Water's Edge".
I guess there is no loyalty to this country any more.
I made many trips abroad during the presidencies of Jimmy Carter and Bill Clinton. I had profound disagreements with their policies. I was very careful not to let the foreign media take advantage of my views. If ever I was tempted to let the former Soviet Union know what I thought of Bill Clinton it was during one of our press conferences in Moscow. Despite being pressed, I would not take the bait. I was in Kazakhstan during President Clinton's impeachment trial in the Senate. At a press conference I was asked about the trial and declined to comment.
I despised what Clinton did. I thought the impeachment was justified. I thought he should be convicted. I could have said plenty. But I felt it improper to do so.
6978. vanTHEman - 3/16/2003 2:24:55 PM
There is no room for knocking any President of the United States abroad. There is plenty of room for that over here. But if I were the Dixie Chicks I wouldn't go running off at the mouth about President Bush and the war at one of their domestic concerts. Their audience consists of some of the President's strongest supporters. And while they don't take politics all that seriously, I guarantee if the Dixie Chicks spewed forth the venom against the President that they displayed in London at a concert in, say, Memphis, they would be run off the stage.
Performers in years past had views of our presidents and on their policies. They didn't express them unless they were doing so in a humorous mode. Bob Hope took some digs at FDR and Harry Truman, but they were funny to the point that even the supporters of those presidents could laugh. If you are wondering how I know that it is because I collect old-time radio shows.
I fail to understand what makes uneducated and uninformed performers think they can go outside of this country and make stupid and insulting remarks about our president. With more than 250,000 troops deployed in and around Iraq did it occur to these brazen performers that they might be doing harm to our brave men and women in uniform?
No doubt the Dixie Chicks had a lot of fans among the armed forces. They are lucky that news is scarce among the troops and most likely they won't find out about what was said. If they do, it will be all over for that little group.
I would not be surprised if their popularity takes a mighty tumble anyway, and if it does then it will serve them right. Perhaps if that does happen it will be a lesson to others. No matter what your views, when you go abroad, keep your mouth shut. Of course, it takes a thinking person to understand such a concept. Perhaps that is asking too much of people who seem to lack
brains.
6979. judithathome - 3/16/2003 5:47:37 PM
Diva, how many stories about the Dixie Chicks do we really need? As Bubbaette mentioned in Suggestions, this is veering off into Spamilicious country.
6980. theDiva - 3/16/2003 6:40:32 PM
The posts stand.
6981. judithathome - 3/16/2003 6:42:57 PM
That's fine...at least we won't be having any more for a week.
6982. bubbaette - 3/16/2003 6:46:36 PM
I wasn't asking that they be moved. Just noting that they were spam under Mote definition.
For the record.
6983. judithathome - 3/16/2003 6:56:03 PM
I wasn't asking they be moved, either. Just noting the same as you...and it is clear he is doing it in more than one thread.
6984. theDiva - 3/16/2003 7:10:03 PM
I understand, Bubb, and I believe you noted them in the proper venue. Thanks.
Okay, with regard to his posts in this thread being spam:
There were 28 posts between the first one Van made re: the Dixie Chicks and the one where Judith raised the issue of how many posts we needed about the Dixie Chicks.
Of that 28, 13 were posted by Van. Only one was a duplicate. Ten were posted by Arky, five by Judith, and one by Cellar. There was give and take at nearly each point but towards the end.
That doesn't meet my definition of spam. The Dixie Chicks may not be my cup of tea, but at least four registered posters in this forum took the time to discuss the issue.
When I checked in over the weekend, I saw the discussion and didn't think anything other than "oh, so that's Stone's latest moniker". Mind you, I only check this thread, the Cafe, and Suggestions, so I was/am unaware of what he was doing elsewhere. Evidently that's already been addressed by the moderators.
6985. judithathome - 3/16/2003 9:38:58 PM
I understand, Bubb, and I believe you noted them in the proper venue. Thanks.
Every time I've noted something like that in Suggestions, I get asked to take it to the host of the thread. So I thought I'd cut out that extra step and just mention it here. What's a complainer to do? ;-)
6986. theDiva - 3/16/2003 9:41:42 PM
Just remember, though, I am a very laissez-faire host. The only thing off-topic or taboo here is a flame war.
6987. Cellar Door - 3/16/2003 11:19:10 PM
Come you masters of war
You that build all the guns
You that build the death planes
You that build the big bombs
You that hide behind walls
You that hide behind desks
I just want you to know
I can see through your masks
You that never done nothin'
But build to destroy
You play with my world
Like it's your little toy
You put a gun in my hand
And you hide from my eyes
And you turn and run farther
When the fast bullets fly
Like Judas of old
You lie and deceive
A world war can be won
You want me to believe
But I see through your eyes
And I see through your brain
Like I see through the water
That runs down my drain
You fasten the triggers
For the others to fire
Then you set back and watch
When the death count gets higher
You hide in your mansion
As young people's blood
Flows out of their bodies
And is buried in the mud
You've thrown the worst fear
That can ever be hurled
Fear to bring children
Into the world
For threatening my baby
Unborn and unnamed
You ain't worth the blood
That runs in your veins
How much do I know
To talk out of turn
You might say that I'm young
You might say I'm unlearned
But there's one thing I know
Though I'm younger than you
Even Jesus would never
Forgive what you do
Let me ask you one question
Is your money that good
Will it buy you forgiveness
Do you think that it could
I think you will find
When your death takes its toll
All the money you made
Will never buy back your soul
And I hope that you die
And your death'll come soon
I will follow your casket
In the pale afternoon
And I'll watch while you're lowered
Down to your deathbed
And I'll stand o'er your grave
'Til I'm sure that you're dead
6988. Macnas - 3/17/2003 1:02:33 PM
I just do not understand this at all. What is happening to your country?
Why is the concept of free speech being mutated to suit the opinion of those who should know better? I don't know, it depresses me, when some singer speaks her mind, gets called a fat mouthed bitch and has her music destroyed and becomes virtually blacklisted.
Then we have fellows being beaten up because they did not stand up (for Christs sake) to listen to some country song written specificaly to cash in on pseudo patriotism.
So much for culture. "When anybody mentions culture, I reach for my pistol".
6989. RickNelson - 3/17/2003 1:43:49 PM
I'm not sure either Macnas. I felt I was in danger for about a month in Carbondate Il. back in '91. I was an avid protestor of that war. I wrote, I rallied, I marched, I did the things you see now.
Then at a rally on campus, in an auditorium, one of the group I knew came forward to warn that she had overheard a man and his son talking. Seems the man had suggested they cause some mischief. I cannot recall the specifics. It turned out this man lived in the same campus housing that my family did. He was across from us. I put up a sign in my window "No blood for oil" and he put up something pro-war. Back then, I had a low opinion of Kuwait.
I have since adjusted my opinion. In part because of MsIt. That's an aside. The fear of harm came when this man and his son deliberately parked near my car. I was in a back lot, working on the engine for a week. I was up, down and around the front. I was particularly aware of them one day when they came around while I worked underneath the front. I felt it was a game, and I just kept working and ignored them. This occured several times. That was all, just subtlety.
I don't know if they would have really done anything. I'm a big guy, I don't look imposing, but one never knows, so they likely didn't throw caution to the wind. Maybe there was nothing there at all. It's just the circumstances.
6990. judithathome - 3/17/2003 2:26:20 PM
Just saw a bit from Good Morning America showing a huge "No War" painted on one of the wings of the Sydney Operahouse, way up at the top point...visible for miles. Man, that was some kinda protest! It was startling, like seeing a gang sign tagged on a full half of the Statue of Liberty!
6991. theDiva - 3/17/2003 6:31:19 PM
Mac
It seems to me that free speech is alive and well in this country. The Dixie Chick spoke her mind as is her right, and certain sectors of her fan base exercised that same right when they objected to her statements.
Had an Iraqi musician criticized her government, she'd have a bit more to contend with than being called a fat-mouthed bitch.
6992. theDiva - 3/17/2003 6:31:54 PM
corrigendum - had an Iraqi musician criticized her country's leader....
6993. theDiva - 3/17/2003 9:55:39 PM
In other news....
This Saturday I will be singing with Richard Smallwood in the tenth annual Women of Gospel Music Conference Concert. I am beside myself with glee. This man is the Duke Ellington of Gospel.
From his bio:
Richard Smallwood has been honored by the Smithsonian Institution as a "gospel innovator and songwriter," and his hometown, Washington, D.C. heralded two separate occasions as "Richard Smallwood Day," also, distinguishing him with the Mayoral Art Award for "precision and excellence in artistic discipline." Smallwood's gift has made room for him to minister to presidents and dignitaries at all of D.C.'s halls of fame, including the Smithsonian, the Kennedy Center and the White House.
6994. magoseph - 3/17/2003 10:01:57 PM
Diva, please check your link, Diva. I wanted to read about Smallwood. Congratulations! Any way we can hear you singing?
6995. theDiva - 3/17/2003 10:12:51 PM
aw, phooey!
Let's try Richard Smallwood one more time!
If you come to the concert on Saturday, you can. I'll be in the first row of the tenor section.
6996. arkymalarky - 3/17/2003 11:09:19 PM
Congratulations Diva! What a great experience!
6997. wabbit - 3/17/2003 11:17:15 PM
DIVA!! How cool, congratulations!
6998. theDiva - 3/17/2003 11:22:01 PM
WABBIT!!!!
Thank you, darlings. This is the fifth conference I've attended, and he's the most incredible headliner we've had thus far. There are just no words for how excited I am, and what a wonderful, uplifting experience this is going to be. We're rehearsing every night this week.
6999. arkymalarky - 3/17/2003 11:28:58 PM
Are you going to be able to get a videotape of it?
7000. arkymalarky - 3/17/2003 11:29:17 PM
Hmmm?
7001. wabbit - 3/17/2003 11:48:23 PM
Damn, I coulda been a contendah.
7002. theDiva - 3/18/2003 2:11:29 PM
Arky
yes, but only the first half of the concert. His contract won't allow for recording the part of the performance where we sing with him.
7003. alistairConnor - 3/18/2003 2:26:58 PM
Wa-hoo Diva!
Tenor section? Is there no alto section?
My village choir's annual concert is coming up. A small affair, but we sound pretty good from where I stand. I'd like to make a recording of it.
7004. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 3/18/2003 4:33:42 PM
Go Deev!
7005. theDiva - 3/18/2003 5:25:59 PM
Connor
Thanks. There's sopranos, seconds, altos and contraltos (tenors). Anywho, it'd be cool if you could somehow record and link to your choir.
Wiz
very cute! Thanks.
7006. alistairConnor - 3/18/2003 5:49:12 PM
Yuss, I meant contralto of course. Does that mean that your section is... Mixed? How delightfully sinful.
7007. theDiva - 3/18/2003 11:16:43 PM
no, you goober. It's WOMEN of Gospel.
7008. Macnas - 3/19/2003 10:46:06 AM
Goober?
7009. alistairConnor - 3/19/2003 10:55:54 AM
I believe that means peanut.
Lend me a tenor, Mick. A contralto, if you're short.
7010. Macnas - 3/19/2003 11:28:01 AM
Drongo might be more appropriate....or perhaps gallah.
7011. theDiva - 3/19/2003 6:00:13 PM
it's means a goofy person. At least in DivaSpeak™.
7012. Macnas - 3/20/2003 9:58:40 AM
One entry found for goober.
Main Entry: goo·ber
Pronunciation: 'gü-b&r, 'gu-
Function: noun
Etymology: of Bantu origin; akin to Kimbundu [ng]guba peanut
Date: 1833
Southern & Midland : PEANUT
7013. arkymalarky - 3/20/2003 10:57:59 PM
That is very cool that it's origin is a Bantu language.
7014. arkymalarky - 3/20/2003 10:58:52 PM
its
7015. anomieme - 3/29/2003 3:39:08 AM
John Mayer: Has anybody mentioned this guy is probably the next big deal?
If you haven't seen his concert on MTV and now on DVD, you've prolly missed the biggest event this decade.
I'm no wuss when it comes to rock and roll. This guy is amazing.
Where's the noise? This might be a slow burn, but pick up the DVD while it's 15 bucks.
7016. anomieme - 3/29/2003 3:46:42 AM
"Your body is a wonderland..."
And he can play guitar!
7017. VanTHEman - 3/31/2003 8:17:46 PM
The best thing about Mayer is that he plays acoustic guitar. Good for kids to listen to wooden music.
But it is annoying for my 14-year-old daughter sings "my body is a wonderland" with her girlfriends and giggling, acting like her father doesn't know what that means.
Another band that can sing and play great music-- but talks too much on microphone--and likes to insult their country in foreign countries.
Especially annoying after enjoying with their sweet Vietnam-era song TRAVELING SOLDIER.
(3/31/03, 7 a.m. ET) -- The Dixie Chicks controversy continues with the trio getting some support from former Vice President Al Gore. Gore spoke to a college audience last week on the subject of fewer companies owning more media outlets, and what he sees as the increasing lack of tolerance for opposing views.
According to the Tennessean, Gore used recent attacks on the Dixie Chicks that followed anti-war comments by Natalie Maines as an example. Gore told the audience, "They were made to feel un-American and risked economic retaliation because of what was said. Our democracy has taken a hit," Gore said. "Our best protection is free and open debate."
Record sales have fallen for the Chicks and radio stations across the country banned the trio's music after Maines told a London concert crowd that she was "ashamed the President of the United States is from Texas." Maines later released an apology.
-- Nancy Brooks, Nashville
7018. VanTHEman - 3/31/2003 8:19:28 PM
strike--"with" in 4th graf.
7019. theDiva - 3/31/2003 8:27:19 PM
They were made to feel un-American and risked economic retaliation because of what was said. Our democracy has taken a hit," Gore said. "Our best protection is free and open debate."
There is nowhere in the world, I believe, where one has greater artistic freedom than in this country. You are free to produce your art as you see fit; given that liberty, you are also free to insult your market and jeopardize your earnings. The Dixie Chick, whatever her name is, paid her money and made her choice.
Absent evidence that there is a vast conspiracy at work, it seems a bit foolish for Vice-president Gore to posit that democracy is at risk.
As for free and open debate, well, she made her opening argument. Her fans and market outlets responded with theirs. Oh well.
7020. judithathome - 3/31/2003 8:48:37 PM
You are right; she made her statements and her public made theirs. Abetted a bit by hyterical reactions from the talk radio circuit but the fans had the choice to listen to both and make their own decisions.
But I do agree with Gore on this point: what he sees as the increasing lack of tolerance for opposing views. This has been quite obvious since before the war on Iraq was first proposed.
7021. theDiva - 3/31/2003 8:57:06 PM
Tolerance of whose viewpoints, by whom?
7022. judithathome - 3/31/2003 9:01:26 PM
Tolerance of anyone's viewpoints, I'd assume, by anyone. I think all of us could benefit from a little more tolerance, don't you?
7023. VanTHEman - 3/31/2003 9:15:03 PM
Garofalo: “Stupid People” Watch Fox &
Talk Radio Hosts Lie
Actress/comedienne Janeane Garofalo is back. War coverage may be keeping her, for now, off the cable news channels, but she popped up Friday night on HBO's Real Time with Bill Maher. [Be advised, this item includes an accurate quotation of a vulgarity.]
Garofalo labeled the U.S. attack on Iraq as “not fair” because it is an “unprovoked strike.” Talking about those denouncing Natalie Maines of the Dixie Chicks for saying she was “ashamed” to be from the same state as President Bush, Garofalo suggested the attacks on the Dixie Chicks are a “wonderful way for really stupid people to hook up. They meet...they tell stories about who their favorite Fox anchor is...”
When co-panelist Michael Graham, a radio talk show host, recalled seeing a sign at an anti-war march proclaiming, “We Support Our Troops...When They Shoot Their Officers,” Garofalo doubted it ever existed and flew into a rage about how “that's what all you right-wing radio hosts do. You make shit up all the time.”
7024. VanTHEman - 3/31/2003 9:17:09 PM
In between, Garofalo preposterously maintained: “Dissent is being criminalized.”
When we last heard from Garofalo she was claiming that Bush is just as dangerous to the world as Saddam Hussein. “Equal, in a different way,” actress/comedienne Janeane Garofalo replied when, on the March 6 The Pulse on Fox, Bill O'Reilly asked her if she thinks “George W. Bush is more of a danger to this world than Saddam?” After she condemned Bush for his “with us or against us” rhetoric and claimed his “'axis of evil' speech was not helpful,” O'Reilly shot back: “When you say that, people out there, they’re gonna think you’re a loon.” See:
http://www.mediaresearch.org/cyberalerts/2003/cyb20030307.asp#6
Back to Friday's, March 28, Real Time with Bill Maher on HBO. Garofalo appeared on the panel with talk show host Michael Graham and comedian/actor Larry Miller.
-- Garofalo whined about Iraq as the victim of the U.S.: “I would say a pre-emptive, unprovoked strike is not fair. This is a pre-emptive strike. It was not provoked. That is not fair.”
-- On anger at the Dixie Chicks: “You know what is good about these Dixie Chicks burnings or bashings? It's a wonderful, wonderful way for really stupid people to hook up. They meet, they throw some things on the fire, they talk about Vin Diesel, they tell stories about who their favorite Fox anchor is, they exchange phone numbers and in some cases has led to marriages.”
7025. VanTHEman - 3/31/2003 9:17:52 PM
-- Graham recalled seeing this sign at an anti-war march: “We Support Our Troops...When They Shoot Their Officers.”
That set off Garofalo: “That one guy that had that one sign that you'll probably beat into the ground. You're going to use it over and over whether it actually existed or not. That's what all you right-wing radio hosts do. You make shit up all the time.”
7026. alistairconnor - 3/31/2003 9:26:13 PM
When we last heard from Garofalo she was claiming that Bush is just as dangerous to the world as Saddam Hussein.
Well, with respect to countries invaded, the score is currently 1-1.
But one of the two has the capacity and the announced intention to invade some more.
7027. Edmund Dantes - 3/31/2003 9:51:25 PM
Saddam invaded both Iran and Kuwait.
Bush has invaded two as well, if you count Afghanistan.
7028. vonKreedon - 3/31/2003 10:01:26 PM
This is off the thread topic, but...
if I count countries invaded since 1980 I come up with:
7029. vonKreedon - 3/31/2003 10:01:30 PM
This is off the thread topic, but...
if I count countries invaded since 1980 I come up with:
7030. vonKreedon - 3/31/2003 10:02:12 PM
Ooops, I don't even think that I hit refresh.
7031. theDiva - 3/31/2003 10:10:08 PM
vonK
as long as we all behave, nothing is off topic. Post away, darlin'.
7032. VanTHEman - 3/31/2003 10:20:36 PM
Mercy, mercy...
Rolling Stones cancel big tour of red China because of killer flu.
7033. wabbit - 3/31/2003 10:24:05 PM
For April Fools' Day: Bush and Blair lip-synch at "Read My Lips"
7034. theDiva - 3/31/2003 11:06:03 PM
"Tolerance of anyone's viewpoints, I'd assume, by anyone. I think all of us could benefit from a little more tolerance, don't you?"
It's a fine sentiment, to be sure. But what did he mean?
7035. VanTHEman - 4/1/2003 10:42:12 PM
LOS ANGELES (AFP) - American actors and musicians are discovering that openly criticizing the US-led war in Iraq (news - web sites) can have a hefty price tag, with even Madonna (news - web sites) pulling the US release of a new video rife with anti-war imagery.
"She is after all a business woman and she has seen what has happened to the Dixie Chicks, and there has been a definitive impact on their record sales, on their concert dates," said politics and communications professor Sherry Bebitch Jeffe of the University of Southern California.
"I can't imagine that she hasn't taken that into consideration," Jeffe said before Madonna decided to ditch plans to release her video, "American Life," showing images of transvestite soldiers, Iraqi children and a grenade being lobbed at a lookalike of US President George W. Bush.
Jeffe notes that "it has not been a pleasant time for the Dixie Chicks."
Since its lead singer Natalie Maines' off-the-cuff remarks last month during a concert in London that she was "ashamed" to hail from the same state as Bush -- Texas, sales of their disc "Home" fell more than 40 percent, from 124,000 a week to less than 72,000.
Seeing the backlash triggered by her remarks "definitely could influence the decision-making of the artists," according to Jeffe.
Just in case, the Screen Actors Guild (news - web sites) has already made its viewpoint clear.
"We deplore the idea that those in the public eye should suffer professionally for having the courage to give voice to their views," it said in a statement.
"Even a hint of the blacklist must never again be tolerated in this nation," said the guild.
7036. jayackroyd - 4/1/2003 11:10:48 PM
vK
When was Haiti? Does Somalia not count because it went badly? And how do you figure Kosovo?
7037. jayackroyd - 4/1/2003 11:11:22 PM
Oh, and does the US get a quarter point or something for the Iraqi invasion of Iran?
7038. wabbit - 4/2/2003 7:03:11 AM
R.I.P. Edwin Starr
Soul legend Edwin Starr has died at the age of 61. The US-born star had been making records since the 1950s and was best-known for his enduring hit War.
7039. VanTHEman - 4/2/2003 6:41:44 PM
The Dixie Chicks' sales slide remains steady but hardly dramatic three weeks after lead singer Natalie Maines angered country-music fans with an anti-Bush comment she made to a London concert audience.
Home, the Chicks' Grammy-winning current album, sold 51,000 copies last week, which represents a 28 percent dip when compared with the previous week's 71,000 total. The first week after Ms. Maines' remark, it sold 124,000 copies. The disc remains at No. 1 on Billboard 's country-albums chart but has fallen out of the top 10 on the pop list.
The radio boycott of "Travelin' Soldier" on country stations and "Landslide" on the pop dial has, however, seriously impacted both songs. "Soldier," which had struck a chord with listeners because of its war-related subject matter, is already off Billboard's country-singles chart. "Landslide" plunged from No. 10 to No. 43 on the pop list and took a No. 1 to No. 11 dive on the adult-contemporary chart.
Meanwhile, in South Carolina, where the Chicks open their U.S. tour May 1 at the Bi-Lo Center in Greenville, an alternative-to-the-Dixie Chicks concert headlined by the Marshall Tucker Band has been planned for the same night. The gig will serve as a protest event for those banning the Chicks' music.
7040. vonKreedon - 4/2/2003 9:13:13 PM
Jay - I didn't count Haiti because I forgot, and it is very borderline by my criteria. Somalia and Kosovo I didn't count because they weren't meant as invasions to overturn a regime/conquer territory, though Somalia did morph into trying to get Adid, but still not quite the samething.
7041. judithathome - 4/7/2003 4:51:03 PM
I'me not sure everyone checks the TV thread so I am posting this here, too.
Watch for this program coming soon to your local PBS station:
Strange Fruit
STRANGE FRUIT explores the history and legacy of a song unique in the annals of American music. Best-known from Billie Holiday's haunting 1939 rendition, the song "Strange Fruit" is a harrowing portrayal of the lynching of a black man in the American South.
The film tells a dramatic story of America's past by using one of the most influential protest songs ever written as its epicenter. The saga brings us face-to-face with the terror of lynching as it spotlights the courage and heroism of those who fought for racial justice when to do so was to risk ostracism and livelihood if white - and death if black. It examines the history of lynching, and the interplay of race, labor, the Left and popular culture that would give rise to the civil rights movement.
7042. theDiva - 4/8/2003 12:17:03 AM
interesting that they're running it this week. Yesterday was her birthday.
7043. wabbit - 4/11/2003 1:03:47 AM
Singer Little Eva, who as a teen-ager recorded the hit 1960s dance song "The Loco-Motion," has died after a long battle with cervical cancer, her manager said Friday. She was 59.
7044. arkymalarky - 4/21/2003 12:26:48 AM
I remember MsNo posting about how thrilled she was seeing her perform live. I'm glad she got the chance.
Nina Simone
7045. theDiva - 4/21/2003 12:46:15 AM
GASP!
7046. ronski - 4/21/2003 2:04:45 AM
Sad about Little Eva, too. But I've been blubbering about Nina Simone in News.
7047. ronski - 4/21/2003 2:16:02 AM
And, Edwin Starr, of course.
Deaths in 3's.
7048. ronski - 4/21/2003 2:21:22 AM
At peace forever
For we are one.
7049. Ms. No - 4/21/2003 5:49:19 PM
I'm just heartbroken. I saw the news this morning and had to call the friend I went to the concert with. It's too early in the day for Gin, but we'll be hooking up via phone for a G&T tonight with some Nina on the stereo.
Simone's music has meant so much to me. I never hear her voice that I don't feel it in my bones. I'm so glad I got to see her perform. One of the very best evenings of my life.
7050. PelleNilsson - 4/21/2003 6:06:02 PM
I think I saw Simone in Paris in 1981. I didn't know of her then but from what I have read now, I think so.
7051. theDiva - 4/21/2003 6:30:20 PM
hugs and condolences, Sis. I thought of you at once.
7052. Ms. No - 4/21/2003 6:50:22 PM
Thanks, Deev. I feel kind of silly that it's hit me so hard. I mean, she's not my auntie or anything, but oh I'm going to miss knowing she's in the world.
Time to break out a little Blues, I think. If I listen to Ne Me Quitte Pas I'd just cry so I'll save that 'til I get home.
7053. theDiva - 4/21/2003 9:39:23 PM
Don't feel silly. Her art moves you. Of course you feel a loss.
I remember quite vividly hearing of Duke Ellington's death. I was sitting at the dining room table with the radio on...it was announced, and I burst into tears. Same when Pops died.
7054. robertjayb - 4/21/2003 10:16:30 PM
I think I saw Simone in Paris in 1981. I didn't know of her then but from what I have read now, I think so.
Could be the beginning of a novel...
7055. robertjayb - 4/25/2003 7:02:45 PM
Who shot Billy? Was it Stagolee, Staggerlee, Stack Lee, Stack-O-Lee, or Stack A Lee?
The story behind the old blues ballad; a NYTimes book review.
7056. anomieme - 4/25/2003 10:45:56 PM
I understand the vicarious grieving. Occasions increase as we get older I'm afraid. I saw the Doors in 68 and today I picked up a DVD of a 68 Doors concert. It was as though I was holding a moment of my youth. I never like the Doors much, so I didn't buy it. But they represented something to me.
I lived in England for 5 years and never visited any Beatles landmarks, even though I went to Liverpool a few times. I'm a music fan, but I don't personalize it much. Well, on a trip back to London, I had time to kill and rode up to Abby Road (St Johns Wood) on the tube. Wow! I approached the studio and saw the famaous "zebra" crossing and I felt odd. I hate to say I was transported to my youth, but it was like a connection from 1969 to that moment. People and places came flooding into my mind. The parking lot was full of Toyotas. Ha!
Silliness. But, then I wished I had taken the Beatles tour in Liverpool. I will, next chance.
7057. anomieme - 4/25/2003 10:58:36 PM
Haven't seen Rosie/Jesus/Trouble/VantheMan here lately. but I was going to say to him that we may have music in common.
If you're browsing....You should be ashamed to use the Van's name in vain. I'm quite sure he's not a Republican. If he is, I don't want to know! Ha!
Yes, John Mayer plays an acoustic, but he's good on an electric too. He has a good sense of song and real instrumentation and he performs without much affectation at all. What a break from boy bands and manufactured songs.
I can see why young girls would be enamored of one song. But he's got a larger appeal. Funny, the guys in the audiance on the DVD were singing right along with the girls.
Let's hope he's not a one-time phenomena
Release Mr Morrison from your grip.
7058. wabbit - 4/27/2003 12:56:25 AM
Van Gogh's "The Fortification of Paris," Picasso's "Poverty" and Gauguin's "Tahitian Landscape" were snatched overnight from the Whitworth Art Gallery in Manchester, northern England. The stolen drawings are worth more than one million pounds ($1.6 million), police said on Sunday.
7059. wabbit - 4/27/2003 3:46:28 PM
And just like that, they are found again:
Police found three paintings after an anonymous tip off Monday morning. The watercolors were found behind a public toilet near Whitworth Art Gallery, Manchester, where they were stolen at the weekend. Unfortunately, the paintings may have been damaged, having been left out in the rain.
7060. wabbit - 4/30/2003 5:59:15 AM
A creation by Iraqi artist Zerak Mera made from Iraqi army boots is seen where a statue of toppled Iraqi president Saddam Hussein once stood, in the center of Kirkuk, April 29, 2003.
How better to insult your former leader than by making a representation of him with objects used to convey derision.
7061. wabbit - 5/15/2003 6:01:56 PM
 | Country music singer-songwriter June Carter Cash, the wife of Johnny Cash, died in Nashville on Thursday after complications from heart surgery, a spokeswoman said. She was 73. |
7062. arkymalarky - 5/15/2003 10:29:27 PM
I didn't know that that interesting video of theirs "Hurt" was a Nine-Inch Nails song. It was strange and fascinating and they both seemed so old and frail it stunned me. I hadn't seen either of them on tv in a long time, but they had always been a couple that never seemed to change in their appearance.
7063. Pooh-Bah - 5/16/2003 1:00:33 AM
I just heard her sing "Ring of Fire." So sad, sad, sad.
7064. ronski - 5/16/2003 4:39:28 AM
Her last album is a treasure.
Rest in peace.
7065. alistairConnor - 5/18/2003 5:56:11 PM
This "difficult" interview with Lou Reed makes me like him more.
And this negative concert review makes me want to see the show.
He's a doll.
(Has anyone here listened to his Poe record?)
7066. arkymalarky - 5/18/2003 11:52:37 PM
I saw a television interview with him several years ago that was pretty good, and in fact had me much more interested in him than I had been, though I've always thought he defined cool in a musician. I admire that interviewer's honesty.
For some reason the concert review reminded me that Bob Dylan's playing in Little Rock again and so few tickets sold they moved it from Alltel Arena to a nightclub. I thought again about going, just to say I saw him live, but I guess I won't. I loved him from the time I first heard him, at about the age that interviewer heard "Walk on the Wild Side."
7067. judithathome - 5/18/2003 11:59:49 PM
Did you ever read the book of the same name by Nelson Algren? It was really laugh out loud humorous.
7068. arkymalarky - 5/19/2003 12:12:02 AM
No, in fact I don't think I've heard of it.
7069. Pooh-Bah - 5/19/2003 3:19:36 AM
I think I feel sick. You've got to be pretty perverted to like Lou Reed.
7070. alistairConnor - 5/19/2003 8:47:49 AM
Ok, Poohbear, I confess. I'm a pervert. I regard Lou sort of as an uncle. David Bowie too. Heavens, even Bryan Ferry.
Have you chundered yet, or shall I go on?
By the way, have you ever listened to Reed's album "New York"? I think he'd make a good mayor. I'm glad he hasn't become an embarassing old crank like Dylan.
7071. marjoribanks - 5/20/2003 5:23:46 PM
Dylan is "an embarassing old crank"? In what way?
I admit I haven't bought a Dylan album in ten years, but I've certainly heard new good songs from the codger in that time, and as far as I can tell he's unapologetically living an artist's life without pretense of marketablity.
This is a genre where i'm loath to throw around artist credentials, but if they are to be assigned - Dylan is in the ranks of the high cadre and has done nothing to be demoted.
Reed, whose work seems to appreciate in value with age, is undeniably in the same general league as Dylan. And he has, like Dylan, stayed thankfully immune to the vagaries of fashion (I love that New York album particularly). But that is it, there is no basis to promote him further.
7072. Pooh-Bah - 5/21/2003 4:44:39 AM
No, Reed's muse is full of perversion that made many mixed-uped homosexual kids into drug addicts. The real devil's music. He wrote maybe three decent songs.
I saw the Velvet Underground in concert in 1965. Headache music. Worse sounds I ever heard.
7073. marjoribanks - 5/21/2003 4:50:48 PM
Reed's muse is full of perversion that made many mixed-uped homosexual kids into drug addicts. The real devil's music
What an idiot.
7074. theDiva - 5/21/2003 6:32:25 PM
ah, now I recognize him.
7075. PelleNilsson - 5/21/2003 6:39:40 PM
He can run but he can't hide.
7076. judithathome - 5/21/2003 6:44:23 PM
"It's only words and words are all I need" to uncover the goofball. His vanity is such he can never be anything but transparent.
7077. judithathome - 5/27/2003 3:58:22 PM
Tody I am going to see this exhibit... The Quest For Immortality. I had hoped the link would show some of the pieces on display but alas, no, it does not.
However, I hope the crowd is a little smaller!
7078. arkymalarky - 5/31/2003 6:27:31 AM
I like the band Good Charlotte, but I'm only familiar with them like I am most current bands, from music videos, and I went to their website to see if their lead singer was duplicating with camera work as the guitarist, and they are identical twins. They have completely different styles, but they look exactly like the same person.
I'm really liking a lot of what I'm seeing lately. It's not the dark screeching as much, and more interesting. Some of it is retro-seventies and annoyingly repetitive, but a lot of it is innovative and shows some thought, not just weird to be weird.
7079. arkymalarky - 5/31/2003 6:28:06 AM
When I say "dark screeching" I'm thinking post-Nirvana type alternative stuff.
7080. greyfriars bobby - 6/4/2003 11:44:59 PM
Hello everyone, I'm a New Yorker.
7081. Macnas - 6/5/2003 11:09:43 AM
greyfriars bobby, wasn't that a series of books?
7082. wabbit - 6/8/2003 3:48:56 AM
The Tony's put on the best awards show, imho. Where else will you see two gay men win an award (for Hairspray), declare their love for each other and kiss? And nobody bats an eye. Not at the Oscars, and definitely not at the Grammys. Promptly followed by a low point...wouldn't you think that Joe Mantello, who won Best Director of a Play for Take Me Out, could have acknowledged Christopher Reeve, the award presenter, in some way? No. He blew right past Reeve, made his hyper speech, and more or less ignored Reeve entirely. Classless and awkward.
But then, there was Frog and Toad, Michele Pawk (who won Best Featured Actress for Hollywood Arms), Def Poetry Jam and La Bohème. And Hugh Jackman doesn't look half bad with shoulder length hair and trimmed nails.
7083. judithathome - 6/8/2003 3:45:50 PM
I commented to Keoni about the ass not saying a thing to Reeve, too...I'm certain everyone in the place noted it. A lot can be overlooked in the shock of the moment but that was really bad.
I was pleased with all the wins even though I had my money on Antonio...ah well, he'll be back.
And I didn't like Jackman's hair but he did a great job as host and I think he will do an outstanding job as The Boy From Oz, outstanding enough to maybe be back clutching a Tony next year.
And who besides me was shocked to see Malcolm Gets as a nominee? Hadn't seen him since Caroline In The City and wondered why.
7084. Max Macks - 6/9/2003 1:42:21 AM
Yahoo Headlines a day or so ago reported
that an "artist" named Spenser Tunick
persuaded 7000 ( sic) Spainards to pose
as a group naked in Barcelona.
It must have happened because Yahoo had a photo.
I suppose it's better than elephant shit
on canvas.....well if not better then... different ...
7085. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 6/15/2003 5:58:56 AM
7086. judithathome - 6/15/2003 4:42:58 PM
Pretty impressive powers of persuasion, if you ask me.
7087. judithathome - 6/16/2003 12:03:16 AM
Hume Cronyn...RIP
7088. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 7/8/2003 3:28:33 PM
THE ECLIPSE OF ART
By Julian Spalding
7089. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 7/8/2003 3:39:11 PM
As an artist and Art History instructor, I would have gladly, five years ago, passed on the following definition- ART: "Based on esthetics, the act of original creation, by manipulating a medium of public objects or events that serve as deliberately organized sets of conditions, having a definite beginning and end, for an experience in a qualitative mode."
However, I now predict that within five years, all major university-level "required" texts whose titles fall in the category of "The History of Art", will, and certainly should be, titled: "The History of Esthetic Experiences" as none of today's art scholars or writers appear, understandably, capable of defining what presently passes for...art.
James L. Weaver, MFA
7090. marjoribanks - 7/8/2003 3:52:01 PM
Fareed Zakaria's 'Future of Freedom' talks at some length about the collective catastrophe that has followed the 'democratization' of Art.
I tend to agree with Zakaria. Some arenas of human endeavour aren't well suited to blanket democratization and the destruction of hierarchical structures. The Art world, paradoxically, is and isn't one of these and while democratization has produced some interesting statements it has also undercut the historical tradition in an unwarranted throwing out of the baby with the bathwater.
--
There are some good lines in that article, Wiz. I kind of like the quote that there is no art, only artists.
7091. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 7/8/2003 4:20:59 PM
Marj- Art, (like much else) has been commandeered by the humping dogs of our species.
In a morass of spilth, creating platforms for contemplation, for a culture of Ritalin, is an absurdly hopeless activity . . . yet hope-filled as well.
7092. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 7/8/2003 4:22:44 PM
I'll get the Zakaria book.
7093. marjoribanks - 7/8/2003 4:29:17 PM
Well, read it in any case. It is short.
7094. PelleNilsson - 7/8/2003 4:32:37 PM
Do you have any current projects, Wiz?
7095. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 7/8/2003 4:32:39 PM
Oh good--I have A.A.D.D.!
7096. marjoribanks - 7/8/2003 4:39:58 PM
No, I mention short because most of the political books post-9/11 seem to be extended and hefty far beyond actual value.
Zakaria is brief and trenchant.
7097. PelleNilsson - 7/8/2003 4:40:27 PM
I too read Maureen Dowd.
7098. marjoribanks - 7/8/2003 4:43:35 PM
Good for you, Pelle.
7099. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 7/8/2003 4:48:55 PM
Thanks again, Marj.
Pelle- Meaning?
[A. You used her line and didn't give credit—gotchya!?]
[B. Marj didn't get your joke, but I did—wink, wink!?]
[C. We may have unfinished business, but I'm still above partisan bickering!?]
7100. PelleNilsson - 7/8/2003 5:13:28 PM
Meaning nothing, except that I recognized the reference. Don't be so suspicious. Besides, I'm still curious about any current art project you might have.
7101. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 7/8/2003 7:25:17 PM
Don't be so suspicious.
Yeah right—delete my images in one thread and flatter me here.
7102. PelleNilsson - 7/8/2003 8:28:19 PM
Well, I had hoped for a thawing of relations but if that's not possible I can live with it.
7103. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 7/8/2003 8:36:29 PM
I'm not angry, Pelle--just shocked by your proprietary authoritarianism. If you were interested in comity, you'd have admitted your action was unfair.
7104. Macnas - 7/10/2003 9:24:17 AM
For some reason, this woman annoys me.
7105. Macnas - 7/10/2003 9:38:59 AM
Wiz,
I'm not going to step between you two, but Pelle is the kind of fellow who would delete himself if, in hindsight, he thought he was wrong to post whatever it was.
I always like to see you posting, you add a bit of flash to things. I also think threads survive or subside by their moderators.
7106. alistairConnor - 7/10/2003 10:28:54 AM
(about the Harry Potter books)
She added: “Ms Rowling, I think, speaks to an adult generation that hasn’t known, and doesn’t care about, mystery.
“They are inhabitants of urban jungles, not of the real wild. They don’t have the skills to tell ersatz magic from the real thing, for as children they daily invested the ersatz with what imagination they had.”
Byatt also claimed the books were “derivative”.
Actually Mac, I think she's got it exactly right. (I speak as a father who is about to order the 5th book for my daughter; I have sometimes been reduced to using these books as bait in order to get her to read better things).
They are a step up from the world of Pokemon and Gameboy, but they are sort of a hybrid between that and actual literature.
7107. Time - 7/10/2003 10:34:08 AM
'You don't always show your sweet side' -LW, mmm yeah.
7108. Time - 7/10/2003 10:37:56 AM
That's no fair, you edited.
7109. Time - 7/10/2003 10:42:51 AM
You think you understand my pain? You can't feel my pain, friend. You know nothing about pain.
7110. Macnas - 7/10/2003 11:55:48 AM
Alistair
"The wind in the willows" is considered classic children’s literature, indeed, of the type which the author above is wistfully longing for our children to read. However, my daughter of 7 finds it very difficult to read and certain chapters downright incomprehensible, "Piper at the gates of dawn", as a for instance.
The overt paganism, which, by the way, seems to me to be more obvious than any of the Godlessness or satanism that the Potter books are accused of purporting, means nothing to her, and will not until she has done some very extensive reading.
I think this person has more issue with adults reading the Potter books. The quote you showed above indicates a certain amount of contempt for the general public, which are obviously more interested in buying JKR's books than anything she herself, Booker prize and all, has ever written. If people want to read Potter, so what?
I read everything that comes my way, I don't give a damn what some intellectual fascist thinks I should have/should be reading.
7111. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 7/10/2003 3:38:35 PM
7105. Macnas - 7/11/03 3:38:59 AM
Wiz,
I'm not going to step between you two, but Pelle is the kind of fellow who would delete himself if, in hindsight, he thought he was wrong to post whatever it was.
Thanks for the input, Mac, nevertheless, I don't hear any denials from Pelle with regard to his unfair deletion of a relevant image—so I have to assume he thinks it was justified. It's just a point of principle and not one of animosity on my part.
As far as Harry Potter goes, I think global human resonance speaks volumes, in that people yearn for a hero/heroine with courage and the capacity to inspire the positive bonds of love and friendship—in any age. I'm sure Dickens had his envious detractors and we'll just have to see if Rowling survives the test of time.
7112. marjoribanks - 7/10/2003 3:47:49 PM
I read this Harry Potter book and have read all the others with some enjoyment.
It's a worthwhile read in the context of the whole series, but this one features an irritating Potter and reveals a series of flaws in the other main characters that is (overall) a bit dismaying. I suppose it's carefully crafted to reflect being fifteen and is a pretty good job done of that.
I can have endless comments, but I doubt too many other people here are interested. One main one, however, is that Rowling seems to me to have dangerously veered into cinematic territory. That is, the movies appear to have seeped into her creative consciousness and this volume suspiciously resembles a screenplay more than the straight-ahead children's lit that the first few were.
If the trend continues, it will detract from the timelessness of the series, and will start to put a genuine shelf-life on the books. Which will be a shame, because the first three (in particular) were solid childrens books which are likely to have lasting value for generations.
7113. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 7/10/2003 3:47:56 PM
I'm still curious about any current art project you might have.
7114. Macnas - 7/10/2003 3:48:26 PM
re 7111
I don't think they will, not in the same way as Dickens at any rate. Dickens had a sharp sarcasm and humour which delights and surprises his new readers all the time. He also underscored all he wrote with a vivid, grimy realism that was born of his own hard times. (how punderiffic was that!)
7115. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 7/10/2003 3:53:33 PM
. . . Rowling seems to me to have dangerously veered into cinematic territory.
I haven't read the latest, but I confess that the movie characterizations have seeped into my conceptions of the characters when I'm reading about them.
7116. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 7/10/2003 3:54:42 PM
(how punderiffic was that!)
Bravo!
7117. Macnas - 7/10/2003 3:56:45 PM
I thank you.
7118. alistairConnor - 7/10/2003 4:11:04 PM
... well, I just hope that it will turn out to be a better film than the first two, depressingly pedestrian. I only like them for the Quidditch matches.
(yeah, secretly I like the books too, but I can't let on, because I'm a snob)
7119. marjoribanks - 7/10/2003 4:12:36 PM
Well, some of the movie characters were just right (Snape, Dumbledore, Hagrid), and Rowling is famous for sketching out her ideas (and did so before the movies) so there is fidelity to her visual imagination.
But there are fight-scenes in this book which are scripted for movie value, and one wonders whether lasting value is being sacrificed for special-effects immediacy.
--
Like the photo of some of your workspace, Wiz. Nice to see that you're still working with and on those struggling mummified figures.
7120. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 7/10/2003 4:31:28 PM
I like the HP books because they deal with the age old theme of seeing through illusions and there's a kind of salvation in that.
The golden ring you desire is already on your finger and the snake you're so frightened of is only a rope on the ground.
7121. marjoribanks - 7/10/2003 4:41:25 PM
Well there is also the age-old theme of a youth escaping humdrum existence, finding that he has a secret and exciting life, and learning the wonderfully complicated and arcane rules of a new universe.
--
But, in any case, I fail to see why AC thinks there is any snob value whatsoever in denying that he likes and reads Harry Potter.
7122. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 7/10/2003 4:46:30 PM
Thanks marj. I'm in a stage of my artistic life where I'm no longer interested in the results—but rather taking roads I would never have had the courage to explore because of an impending exhibition or commitment.
I can finally take all of the risks of creation and destruction—to really learn, I mean.
7123. Time - 7/13/2003 4:25:01 AM
marjoribanks, I thought that too (#7112), some of the book seems now to be written with an eye to what cool special effects can be had nowadays.
7124. theDiva - 7/13/2003 3:30:27 PM
7125. theDiva - 7/13/2003 5:16:12 PM
7126. wabbit - 7/16/2003 1:29:05 AM
Latin music icon Celia Cruz, the "Queen of Salsa," died Wednesday afternoon after battling cancer, her manager said. She was believed to be 79 years old.
Cruz's influence went well beyond the dance floor and music studio, as her style, creativity and success established her not only as an innovative entertainer but also as an ambassador of Latino culture. She helped reinvent the sound of modern Latin music, with its tropical background and drumbeats that set-off swift, hip-shaking, swirling and whirling dance moves for more than half a century.
In more than five decades of performing, during which she released more than 70 albums and appeared in 10 movies, Cruz scooped up many of music's highest accolades, including five Grammys and two Latin Grammys. She also enjoyed major and frequent tributes from outside the music industry, including honorary doctorates from Yale University, Florida International University and Miami University; a National Medal of Arts, the United States' highest honor for an artist; and a star on Hollywood's Walk of Fame. Streets in New York, Mexico, Costa Rica and Miami, Florida, bear her name. Clip of Mi Vida Es Cantar
7127. theDiva - 7/16/2003 3:14:29 PM
oh no! Always in threes! Another loss for the music world.
7128. wabbit - 7/16/2003 5:01:58 PM
Yep, that's the same thought I had. Hard to believe Carter and Segundo were 95 years old!
7129. theDiva - 7/16/2003 6:29:07 PM
WABBIT!
7130. wabbit - 7/16/2003 7:41:56 PM
DIVA!! Don't know if you saw my post in the Cafe, but I hope everything is going well at Casa Diva.
7131. theDiva - 7/16/2003 8:22:08 PM
everything's fine, sweetie. Thanks for asking. And you?
7132. wabbit - 7/16/2003 8:29:43 PM
That's good to know, I've been thinking about you and your family a lot and hoping for the best. We're fine here, working working working, wondering if we'll ever get a vacation - you know, just the usual!
need some artspeak, hmmmm...
Didn't you have some singing engagement recorded not too long ago (ok, maybe back around Christmas)? Any mp3's available?
7133. theDiva - 7/16/2003 9:20:53 PM
It was in March, and I've only got it on regular old cassette. Do you want me to snailmail you a copy?
7134. wabbit - 7/16/2003 9:39:23 PM
Yes please! I'll email you my address.
7135. wabbit - 7/16/2003 10:08:13 PM
Of course, that means I need to know which email address to use...if you drop me a line at viwabbit at yahoo I'll send the address.
btw, if you like, I can convert your tape to wav.
7136. theDiva - 7/16/2003 10:25:22 PM
I'll order a copy when I go to church this weekend, and yes, I would love for you to convert if it isn't too much trouble! Thank you, doll! Send me your snailmail address at my budgethag@aol.com account.
7137. wabbit - 7/16/2003 10:41:14 PM
On its way!
7138. wabbit - 7/29/2050 5:05:33 PM
Hey WoW, congratulations on the fellowship award, tell us more!
7139. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 7/29/2050 6:08:08 PM
Every dog has his day and yesterday seemed to be mine.
No big deal fellowship, just a private foundation regional grant that allows me some more time to pursue the bound/cocoon figures without whoring in the gallery brothels or envious/insecure-faculty-staffed community colleges in the area.
I was also asked to do a frontpiece for a limited edition ("hand-bound, museum-quality") James Salter short story.
These days are rare, however—very rare!
7140. Macnas - 7/29/2050 6:10:29 PM
Mind if we bask in the afterglow?
7141. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 7/29/2050 6:19:33 PM
Mac- [Not really knowing how to take that post] Such as it is, no.
7142. Macnas - 7/29/2050 6:25:35 PM
I delight in the good fortune of even my online acquaintances, no matter how big or small the event, or permanent or passing the benefit.
7143. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 7/29/2050 7:14:30 PM
Thanks Mac — you know what Chat Forum Shellshock can do! ;?}
7144. wonkers2 - 7/29/2050 10:34:19 PM
7145. wonkers2 - 7/29/2050 10:44:29 PM
7146. wonkers2 - 7/29/2050 11:05:34 PM
Cap'n Dirty offers a moonlight cruise on the Tomater Sloop to the Mote Maid most likely to be a descendent of Madame X. Who might it be--Ms. No, Arky, judithathome, theDiva, thoughtful, Magoseph, CalGal, betty, Jenerator, absensia, ranheim, wabbit? (Forgive the Cap'n for any gender misidentification and any ladies unintentionally omitted!) Clues: Madame X was born before the Civil war to a rich Creole plantation family in New Orleans, moved to France at a young age with her widowed mother, married a rich man before she was 20, had notorious affair with her gynecologist (a handsome and notorious Parisian ladies man)and several other men. Both she and her gynecologist were the subjects of famous paintings by the great American painter, John Singer Sargent.
7147. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 7/29/2050 11:33:40 PM
Good story, wonk—I enjoyed it, thanks.
They don't make 'em like that anymore!
7148. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 8/1/2050 2:27:27 AM
7149. wabbit - 8/1/2050 9:11:54 PM
Beautiful. I find these very comforting, Wiz. How big are they?
7150. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 8/2/2050 1:08:12 AM
Thanks for responding Wabbit—they're about 40" by 20." I've just finished six new ones that I'm much more excited about. I'll try to take some details for a better idea. They're very engaging close up.
I see them as so much about what's going on in the world — wounded and wrapped cocoon-like figures that echo the suffering, despair, mystery and hope in our contemporary crash of civilizations.
I've sworn off the so called art world and the NY gallery scene, but I really think Galerie St. Etienne would appreciate these.
By the way, did you happen to see my post about the Mark Kingswell review/essay entitled "ART WILL EAT ITSELF" in the August issue of Harper's?
7151. wabbit - 8/2/2050 1:37:03 AM
I'll look forward to seeing details of the new work.
I didn't see your post about the Kingswell essay, I've been working like a dog and must have missed it. I just went back several posts and couldn't find it, is it in this thread?
7152. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 8/2/2003 4:42:36 AM
I think it was in the Escape thread, but no matter. It's a great read,
7153. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 8/4/2003 10:51:58 PM
7154. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 8/5/2003 5:35:22 PM
7155. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 8/7/2003 5:32:16 PM
" . . . Knowing that Richter's color panels are an allusion to Ellsworth Kelly's 1951 Colors For A Large Wall can be fun if you know how to shop or surf; but recognizing allusions and supplying theoretical fill-in are just more self-congratulation. If we were bolder and more honest we would see the current aesthetic economy as the sign of a depressing endgame in which art has lost its way and is too scared to say so for fear of what the consequences might be. So-called fine art has struggled to free itself from the bonds of elitism and privilege, opening up to a larger sphere only to find that the result was an empty and defeated art world. Three hundred channels and nothing to watch. It's a bit like the old rap against democracy: in the land where everybody is somebody, nobody's anybody. When anything is art, art becomes nothing,
. . . Three decades later, conceptual art has become a winking insult, a condescending piece of self-indulgence dressed up as a radical challenge to the staid old art world, where things had to be painted and displayed and maybe even the result of talent." [Mark Kingswell "ART WILL EAT ITSELF" Harper's 8/03]
7156. ScreamingSin - 8/8/2003 8:22:49 AM
They look like sarcophagi full of despair, to me, not comforting at all. Tied up and no way to get out.
I prefer the green shadings in the last one 7154, perhaps some hope that cocoon will metamorphose.
7157. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 8/8/2003 5:22:57 PM
. . . perhaps some hope that cocoon will metamorphose.
BINGO!
The title of that is MGS (for Mass Grave Site) motivated by a fervent longing for a human spirit that will transmute despair into compassion and empathy rather than vengeance, retribution and the sacrifice of more innocents.
The truth is only "ugly" to those who need to deny it in order to function in a cocoon of complacency . If mayhem and the tools of mayhem are continually worshiped and subsidized from a place of fear and ignorance, hope will indeed perish.
So how does beauty function?—by allowing us to truly see just how ephemeral life is.
9/11— the mother of all marketing devices.
7158. wabbit - 8/8/2003 6:28:04 PM
That last one is a real beauty, Wiz.
I'm going to try to find Harper's this weekend and read the article. It sounds like something I've been saying for years (as have you, I'm sure we've had this conversation!).
7159. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 8/8/2003 7:39:47 PM
Thanks wabb--it's my fav too.
7160. judithathome - 8/9/2003 5:39:18 PM
Gregory Hines...RIP at age 57.
7161. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 8/10/2003 5:27:01 PM
I liked his spirit--that's what made his dancing so exuberant.
7162. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 8/10/2003 11:44:49 PM
The frontispiece for a limited edition short story entitled Bangkok by James Salter, to be published this coming Autumn.
7163. PelleNilsson - 8/13/2003 8:50:06 PM
Curio stuff:
With the 1953 New York premiere of a biblical epic called "The Robe," Twentieth Century Fox introduced CinemaScope, a proprietary name for a process developed by a French engineer named Henri Chrétien in the 1920's, to which Fox had acquired the rights. Chrétien's "hypergonar" adapters made use of an optical trick called anamorphosis, whereby a curved lens placed in front of an ordinary camera could squeeze a large field of vision into the frame. Another lens, affixed to the projector, would reverse the process, spreading out the image onto an extended screen.
The anamorphic effect had been explored by 19th-century scientists and Renaissance painters, including Holbein, who famously used it to embed secret symbols in "The Ambassadors" (1533).
From Britannica:
Anamorphosis: in the visual arts, an ingenious perspective technique used to give a distorted image of the subject represented in a picture when seen from the usual viewpoint, but so executed that if viewed from a particular angle, or reflected in a curved mirror, the distortion disappears and the image in the picture appears normal.
Holbein's The Ambassadors:
Can you see the secret symbols?
7164. rdbrewer - 9/5/2003 9:31:04 PM
I see what looks like a distorted skull. That gives me an idea about how to see anything else that might be there, by holding the picture edge on to where the skull comes into proportion. But, my LCD screed craps out at that angle. So, I can't see anything else -- if there is anything else to see.
7165. judithathome - 9/7/2003 4:14:23 PM
Warren Zevon...RIP
Warren Zevon, who wrote and sang the rock hit "Werewolves of London" and was among the wittiest and most original of a broad circle of singer-songwriters to emerge from Los Angeles in the 1970s, has died. He was 56.
7166. marjoribanks - 9/7/2003 11:42:12 PM
Yo Wizardo,
1) I really like the frontspiece. I have a real thing for painted images on/relating to text, and yours is highly appropriate fir its purpose.
2) I visited the small but very nice Jersey City museum a few days ago, and was suddenly struck by some similarities in your recent (posted) work to some (differently scaled) paintings in an exhibit entitled Napalm Elegies by one Rudolf Baranik.
Feel free to disagree, but looking at the (illegally taken, I'm so bad) photos a minute ago I think the comparison is valid. FWIW, Baranik painted his pieces in response/reaction to the Vietnam War and was (like you) given to graphic artistry in support of his beliefs.
So, here you go, a gift stolen from the Jersey City Museum's walls -
7167. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 9/8/2003 5:45:31 AM
Hey Marj, thanks—I can see the link.
Ive been working on another lead figure, a Bound Venus . . .
7168. wabbit - 9/8/2003 3:53:32 PM
 Photographer and filmmaker Leni Riefenstahl, best known for the Nazi propaganda films "Triumph of the Will" and "Olympia," has died at the age of 101.NY Times obit |
7169. wabbit - 9/8/2003 3:54:40 PM
Going political on us, Wiz? ;)
7170. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 9/8/2003 5:34:21 PM
Who me?
[Jesus, 101!]
7171. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 9/12/2003 11:43:05 PM
7172. wabbit - 9/14/2003 5:46:12 AM
How different this feels from the previous wrappings. No peace at all. The drawing/monotype has an air of resignation, but the sculpture is all struggle. Good strong stuff, Wiz!
7173. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 9/14/2003 6:03:39 AM
Thanks Wabb and how right you are—my fingers are bloody and raw from the "struggle!" I have a curator coming Wednesday for a studio visit (which I'm dreading).
I love the way you can't tell if the head is in profile or looking straight at you. It's like a Rorschach.
7174. jayackroyd - 9/23/2003 4:22:28 AM
Zagat's top ten albums:
"Born to Run"
"Abbey Road"
"Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band"
"The Joshua Tree"
"The White Album"
"Kind of Blue"
"Darkness on the Edge of Town"
"Revolver"
"Dark Side of the Moon"
"Achtung Baby"
Lots of Beatles cannibalism here.
7175. ScreamingSin - 9/23/2003 7:12:50 AM
That is one lobotomized list!
I remember the first time I had business in NYC, me and my outdated Zagat restaurant guide stumbled into some overpriced French restaurant on the upper East side. The waiters fell all over themselves, the chef made like 7 samples of various desserts for me to try. All very lovely.
Then at the end I found out why: Zagat had made a printing error the past year and they were so overjoyed to find someone carrying a copy with "their year."
And here I thought it was my charm that bowled them over.
My son is fascinated by the cover art on Pink Floyd's Wish You Were Here.
7176. ScreamingSin - 9/23/2003 7:15:51 AM
Not so much the man in flames on the front cover, but the invisible guy on the sand dune on the reverse.
7177. ScreamingSin - 9/23/2003 7:16:46 AM
Invisible ankle and wrists are disconcerting, I suppose.
7178. ScreamingSin - 9/23/2003 7:17:14 AM
stop!
7179. jayackroyd - 9/23/2003 10:23:06 AM
No, I would not use Zagat's to pick NYC restaurants.
Nor albums, for that matter. But I nonetheless thought the selections were interesting.
7180. jayackroyd - 9/23/2003 10:25:32 AM
Gabba gabba hey.
7181. ScreamingSin - 9/25/2003 8:56:45 AM
Why did you think the album selections were interesting? I goggled at Kind of Blue, what the hell is Miles Davis doing in that kind of list? I mean, it's a good album, but a totally different genre than the others. Opera is seriously under-represented.
7182. Macnas - 9/25/2003 2:37:35 PM
Top ten albums eh? hmmm.....in no particular order...
Can’t Buy A Thrill – Steely Dan
Revolver/Rubber Soul - The Beatles, couldn’t decide which I like better.
Ill Communication – Beastie Boys, if only for Sure Shot and of course, Sabotage.
The Undertones – Undertones first album. Alistairconner will understand.
Dark Side Of The Moon – Pink Floyd, and if I could I’d throw in the Live at Pompeii soundtrack as well.
Inflammable Material – Stiff Little Fingers
Exile On Main Street – Rolling Stones
The Specials – The Specials first album.
Live And Dangerous – Thin Lizzy
Top Priority – Rory Gallagher
7183. alistairconnor - 9/25/2003 2:54:39 PM
Your choices by Steely Dan, the Stones, the Specials would be in my top 10 or near it.
But for the Undertones, I prefer (I worship) their last work, the Sin of Pride.
(Never even released in NZ. Just love record companies.)
7184. alistairconnor - 9/25/2003 2:56:04 PM
Other Irish artists in my pantheon include Van Morrison and the Pogues, though I'd find it hard to single out an album in each case.
7185. alistairconnor - 9/25/2003 2:58:11 PM
Opera is seriously under-represented.
Yeah, but requires a separate list altogether. Honestly, which would I rank higher, Carmen or the Buzzcocks' Another music in a different kitchen?
7186. Macnas - 9/25/2003 3:38:52 PM
re 7183
Van Morrison - Astral weeks
Pogues - Rum Sodomy and the Lash
Never my favourite artists, but both capable of some great moments. Haunted By The Ghost, which Shane wrote for that awful film Sid and Nancy, is one of favourites of all time, no exaggeration.
7187. Macnas - 9/25/2003 3:40:52 PM
Tell me alistair, how do you rate Positive Touch??
I like it a lot, quirky and smooth at the same time.
7188. wabbit - 9/25/2003 4:07:28 PM
 Singer Robert Palmer died in Paris early Friday morning of a heart attack at age 54. |
7189. judithathome - 9/25/2003 6:06:22 PM
George Plimpton is dead at 76...RIP
7190. alistairConnor - 9/28/2003 4:35:38 PM
Astral weeks, check (Van has committed countless atrocities, but he can't undo that record). Rum, sodomy etc, check.
You're right on both.
Positive Touch? You know, I had to look it up (Undertones fan site) to get it straight in my head... The joke is that these, like most of my favourite records, are sitting in beer crates at my brother's place in New Zealand, and I haven't heard them for 15 years... Yes, I used to listen to that one a lot.
The preference for the Sin of Pride : I love the title and the cover 
(part of the mystique of those big vinyl records, a CD just isn't a cultural artifact in the same way). I love the heroic attempt at mass appeal (I like it all the better that it failed), I love the soul-crossover thing they created, I hated the fact that they split up straight afterwards...
I love the stark honest banality of the lyrics, the poetry of the stuff that was important to them. More songs about chocolate and girls, indeed.
Poets all of you.
7191. Macnas - 9/29/2003 9:45:25 AM
Just how good is the above post?
"Sit down, relax, and cancel all other engagements.
It's never too late to enjoy dumb entertainment...."
7192. wonkers2 - 9/30/2003 5:25:48 AM
Cap'n Dirty sez, "The Cap'n really liked Robert Palmer's famous video with them zombified wimmen playin' guitars behind him."
7193. wonkers2 - 9/30/2003 5:26:55 AM
But your daughter didn't. Do you understand why, you little sex fiend?
7194. ScreamingSin - 10/2/2003 7:51:37 AM
They had super cheekbones, those 'zombified wimmen'.
7195. seadate - 10/25/2003 8:38:01 AM
I just love it here. Click on "listen now" to tune in.
7196. seadate - 10/25/2003 8:44:05 AM
At the moment, they're playing a Jim Croce tune I don't recall ever hearing .... name of the tune may be "Dreamin' Again".
7197. concerned - 10/25/2003 9:33:13 AM
Thought I'd share this high fashion what-is-it I came across.
Digital Pasties not supplied with gown. Whoever designed this must hate women.
7198. PelleNilsson - 10/25/2003 6:26:33 PM
Why did you think that?
7199. judithathome - 10/25/2003 6:37:02 PM
For starters, how do you walk in it?
7200. PelleNilsson - 10/25/2003 6:45:55 PM
Why do you think one is supposed to walk?
7201. judithathome - 10/25/2003 7:04:33 PM
Oh no reason...I guess she could get from one place to another by having half-clad bronzed weightlifters pick her up and carry her.
7202. concerned - 10/26/2003 2:17:04 AM
re. 7198 -
I don't think it shows any respect, either wrt practicality or aesthetically, for whoever wears it, and I don't believe it respresents anything either.
7203. seadate - 10/26/2003 2:25:35 AM
just hates fashion models, maybe?
7204. judithathome - 10/30/2003 12:04:44 AM
Look what's coming to my town!!
7205. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 10/30/2003 1:52:12 AM
And they're all leaving my town!
The Caravaggio is a gem, Judith and the only landscape that's survived in his oeuvre. St Francis in Ecstacy [being cradled by an angel.]
7206. judithathome - 10/30/2003 3:03:30 AM
Caravaggio is my fave...I am counting down the days til it arrives. We have one here and I never tire of looking at it.
7207. rdbrewer - 11/9/2003 11:51:09 PM
I was looking back in this thread. This strikes me as funny, as I am a Tulsa resident:
6035. PelleNilsson - 4/12/2002 1:40:26 PM
We are listening to Don Williams doing "Living on Tulsa time". What's so special about Tulsa time?
6036. judithathome - 4/12/2002 1:45:15 PM
You know how people in this country ask "Where does the time go?"
Well, it goes to Tulsa.
6037. Rivendell - 4/12/2002 1:46:45 PM
Juditha,
That would make Tulsa a black hole - no?
6038. judithathome - 4/12/2002 1:49:20 PM
Guess so...although the original joke punchline was "Cleveland".
6039. PelleNilsson - 4/12/2002 2:31:10 PM
Is that so? But what is Tulsa in the first place? And why should time go there?
Now listening to Edmundo Ross. Takes you back to the time of dinner jackets and long dresses.
6040. theDiva - 4/12/2002 3:31:38 PM
Tulsa is a town in Oklahoma, and my guess is that the song refers to a slow and lazy pace of life.
6041. arkymalarky - 4/12/2002 5:14:01 PM
Tulsa is probably the nicest town in OK. Pretty laid back yet with a progressive feeling for its location.
7208. arkymalarky - 11/10/2003 12:09:50 AM
Well would you agree with my assessment of Tulsa, then? I've only been there a couple of times, but I have several friends from OK who love Tulsa.
7209. rdbrewer - 11/10/2003 12:19:48 AM
Yes and no. OKC is bigger and with more to do. Plus, it has been growing for the last 20 years. Tulsa is pretty, lots of trees, but its growth has been slow in the same time period.
7210. alistairConnor - 11/10/2003 1:41:25 AM
More gratuitous Americana (nothing closet about me, I'm OUT!)
Well I'm going back to Tulsa one more time
I've got home sweet Oklahoma on my mind
Name the artist? Easy...
7211. rdbrewer - 11/10/2003 4:31:52 AM
That sounds like Leon Russell.
7212. alistairConnor - 11/10/2003 10:15:54 PM
And nobody else sounds like Leon Russell... thank god for that.
7213. judithathome - 11/10/2003 11:10:23 PM
I love Leon Russell...adore him.
7214. ronski - 11/10/2003 11:16:25 PM
RIP: Art Carney.
7215. arkymalarky - 11/11/2003 12:30:25 AM
We saw Leon Russell perform with the Allman Bros not too many years ago, but we'd seen him on the way to the concert, driving his own bus. I guess he's truly a one-man show.
7216. judithathome - 11/11/2003 12:53:11 AM
He's written some wonderful music...
7217. arkymalarky - 11/11/2003 1:03:52 AM
One more post and that ridiculous outfit goes off my monitor.
Yeah!!
BTW, I've always enjoyed Leon Russell's music, whether he performs it, or someone else.
7218. rdbrewer - 11/11/2003 1:26:24 AM
I like Leon too. What a strange voice.
And speaking of strange voices, I think he made an album with Joe Cocker. I can't recall any tunes right now. One might need a translator for that one.
Leon has a house about a mile from here. I understand that he has a big party once a year and invites old musical friends.
Quiz: Without looking it up, who wrote Give Peace a Chance?
7219. wonkers2 - 11/11/2003 1:52:29 AM
One of the fastest sailboats ever on the Pacific was the Leon Russell, named after the artist and its owners who were his fans and whose first names were Leon and Russell.
7220. Macnas - 11/12/2003 9:34:50 AM
re 7218
Wasn't it Lennon?
7221. alistairConnor - 11/12/2003 12:13:23 PM
7218 : Cocker/Russell did the "Mad dogs and Englishmen" tour/record. I could probably just about quote the whole thing verbatim. The classic Joe Cocker song (way back before he died and went to Grammy land) was Russell's "Delta lady".
7222. rdbrewer - 11/12/2003 2:51:52 PM
Give Peace a Chance was written by Russell.
7223. Macnas - 11/12/2003 5:13:12 PM
Are you sure?
7224. Ms. No - 11/12/2003 5:39:09 PM
Well, I'm having a hard time settling on the AMG it since Lennon and McCartney recorded it in 1969 and Rusell didn't record it until 1970 but they're all listed as the composers on their own albums.
Requires deeper digging.
7225. alistairConnor - 11/12/2003 5:41:04 PM
Two different songs with the same name.
Different tunes, different words.
7226. Ms. No - 11/12/2003 5:41:07 PM
er....settling IT on the AMG, since....
sheesh
7227. Ms. No - 11/12/2003 5:43:49 PM
I see it attributed to Lennon&McCartney everywhere except on Leon Russell's albums.
7228. Macnas - 11/12/2003 5:45:14 PM
Russell's song was "Please give peace a chance", apparently.
7229. Macnas - 11/12/2003 5:51:08 PM
This site will tell you all about the crap records that you saw in the bargain bin but never bought.
7230. Ms. No - 11/12/2003 5:55:46 PM
Interestingly enough both George Harrison and Ringo Starr are credited as musicians on that album.
7231. Ms. No - 11/12/2003 5:56:32 PM
Ah, just saw AC's post. Thanks for the info!
7232. Ms. No - 11/12/2003 6:45:34 PM
Just have to put in a little Fiona Apple plug here. I'm listening to her second album this morning and wishing I was driving through an overcast day with the stereo on full blast.
mmmm.....good stuff
7233. rdbrewer - 11/12/2003 11:25:27 PM
Check out thse worst album covers ever. Here, here, and here. One of my favs:
7234. rdbrewer - 11/12/2003 11:27:41 PM
Check out these kewl kats:
7235. rdbrewer - 11/12/2003 11:29:15 PM
And this guy:
7236. Ms. No - 11/12/2003 11:29:55 PM
oh.
my.
gawd.
7237. rdbrewer - 11/12/2003 11:57:22 PM
You like that Zip Zap Rap, doncha?
7238. rdbrewer - 11/13/2003 12:00:58 AM
(Groan.) Look at that gawd awful reflection in Devistatin' Dave's sunglasses. It couldn't look worse if they tried.
7239. alistairConnor - 11/13/2003 12:42:23 AM
The Ivan Henrys have got to be Swedish. Surely.
7240. rdbrewer - 11/13/2003 1:47:14 AM
Yes, Alistair. One of those links is to the worst Swedish album covers ever.
7241. rdbrewer - 11/13/2003 1:48:37 AM
And don't call me Shirly.
7242. PelleNilsson - 11/13/2003 8:31:24 AM
Please tell me that you checked out the links before you posted, Alistair.
7243. alistairConnor - 11/13/2003 9:15:15 AM
No, I regret to say that they just empirically looked Swedish to me.
The Swedish bunch of guys I ever saw.
7244. alistairConnor - 11/13/2003 9:21:38 AM
How to soften the blow. No, I think I just have to be brutally frank.
OK, so the 1970s was the quintessential bad-taste decade, throughout the Western world. But Sweden was definitely top of the pops.
It will take centuries to wipe out the memory of Abba. Sort of Sweden's Vietnam.
7245. PelleNilsson - 11/13/2003 11:45:06 AM
I'm afraid you are right. I know only one of those bands, Cool Candys, I think they are still around, but I remember the type well. They travelled around playing dance music in small towns where the important thing was to keep the beat steady so that the drunks didn't mash their partners' toes.
7246. Macnas - 11/13/2003 11:49:21 AM
Much like our showbands.
7247. PelleNilsson - 11/13/2003 11:50:28 AM
The ultimate in scene costumes:
Probably designed and made by some girlfriend.
7248. Macnas - 11/13/2003 11:51:55 AM
Holy Christ! I don't think I've seen that much velveteen outside of a stuffed toy warehouse.
7249. rdbrewer - 11/13/2003 4:43:13 PM
I think they were the cause of the velour crisis in the seventies when I couldn't secure enough to make a Star Trek pullover.
7250. rdbrewer - 11/13/2003 4:43:58 PM
Tell us the truth, Pelle. You have several of those albums, right?
7251. rdbrewer - 11/13/2003 5:20:42 PM
I have to post one more:
BTW, I got these links from Andrew Sullivan.
7252. Ms. No - 11/13/2003 6:36:57 PM
Wait a minute. How could this one have not made your list??
Does the guy on the bottom remind anyone else of Shelley Winters in the Poseidon Adventure?
7253. rdbrewer - 11/13/2003 7:48:15 PM
I know. I just love those little elf halter tops.
That androgynous person at the bottom does look just like Shelly Winters.
Joyce, Message # 7233, looks just like Dustin Hoffman's "Tootsie" character.
7254. marjoribanks - 11/13/2003 8:11:54 PM
When I was about six years old, my uncle returned to India from Cambridge with an album given to him by his Swedish girlfriend. It was a group called the Hootenany Singers, and consisted of Swedish folkie trilling.
Since he played the album every day, and mooned on about it, and once told me, quite ferociously, that it was the kind of music that you could listen to again and again and not get bored, the music had a certain impact on me.
I can actually remember full songs from it, not the incomprehensible yodelling of course but the tunes. If the album cover exists somewhere on the Internet I'm sure it would be as cheesy as the ones above.
Years later, I figured out that this Uncle was in England when groups like the Rolling Stones were gaining popularity - yet he was listening to this pap.
7255. PelleNilsson - 11/13/2003 9:54:56 PM
Björn and Benny of Abba started out with the Hootenany Singers.
7256. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 11/14/2003 7:26:07 PM
[Click on image for link.]
7257. judithathome - 11/14/2003 7:37:44 PM
Wiz, I love the tones in your pieces...did you study with Resika or something? I like yours better.
7258. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 11/14/2003 10:39:19 PM
Thanks Judith. I did study with Resika—in NYC & Ptown. I like his better! ;-]
There is much more quality and subtlety of image on the card. Send me your address and I'll make sure you get one.
7259. rdbrewer - 11/14/2003 11:22:08 PM
I like 'em. I think I've been to those places on the right.
7260. judithathome - 11/15/2003 7:15:09 AM
Wiz.....done.
7261. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 11/15/2003 6:03:44 PM
Thanks rd—archetypal New England.
7262. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 11/20/2003 7:24:34 AM
7263. wonkers2 - 11/20/2003 7:17:14 PM
Nice. I have a photograph with almost the same sky. I'll try to put it up (not today).
7264. judithathome - 11/20/2003 8:01:11 PM
Stunning work, Wiz...I especially like the first one.
In the second one, you have managed to caputure the scariness of a pasture at the back of my granddad's farm...it was beautiful but to a child, the unknown nature of it was very frightening.
7265. wabbit - 11/20/2003 9:30:30 PM
I don't know, Wiz, Resika's are nice, but I prefer yours. Beautiful.
7266. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 11/21/2003 12:09:26 AM
Hey-thanks for the feedback, Kids. I was talking to my dealer (not the heroin dealer), we had just walked out into the late afternoon light and he pointed to the sky and said "That's you!"
He handles a lot of plein air painters, like Wolf Kahn, Stuart Shils and Eric Aho so he knows what's what with landscape. He asked me how I managed to paint from my memory and still have it seem like I was actually there when I painted them. It occurred to me that I wasn't interested in any of the specifics that plein air painters look for to kind of authenticate their work. I thrive more on the feelings I get from being in the landscape more than what the place looks like. It's these feelings that some how come up when I paint that spur me on.
Then Kevin (the dealer) said Resika is more of a swashbuckler with a brush and his work was always about "Look what I can do!" Then he made my day by saying that my work was much more contemplative and about what's out there in nature--more like Morandi. Well, that made my day, Morandi is a very big hero in my life. At one time I would have thought he was blowing smoke up my butt for an effect, but his sincerity was apparent.
I just want to give the viewer enough information to trigger their own visceral perceptions of their encounters with landscape.
[Hope that doesn't all sound pretentious.]
7267. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 11/21/2003 12:09:40 AM
I just went to a Rob Storr lecture last Tuesday (former MOMA curator); the condescending populism and contempt of the artist illustrated in countless (". . . and then I bought this for The Modern") slides of work that needed a thousand words to even hope it would be retained in the viewer's heart and mind.
Everything had to be gutsy or social or political and above all, novel. I took great solace in knowing he was unaware of his own basic assumptions and biases. People like Resika who have devoted decades to pursue a soulful vision are discounted out of hand for a photographer who stages a contrivance to answer the most banal questions of a compulsive adolescent.
[End of rant.]
Anyway, I'm always more interested in what people feel than think and I appreciate your encouragement. Thanks again.
7268. wabbit - 11/21/2003 3:01:20 AM
Then Kevin (the dealer) said Resika is more of a swashbuckler with a brush and his work was always about "Look what I can do!"
Funny, I was just answering a student's email and got to thinking about your images and came up with exactly that thought. I see websites all the time that scream "Lookie what I just learned!" instead of giving the viewer anything useful (remember the early days of KPT?). That was the same difference I saw in Resika's work as opposed to yours. It isn't that his aren't good, but there is something about the visibility of the technique that doesn't grab me the way your work does. When I look at his prints I'm looking at the ink and thinking about what he did to get the image. When I look at your prints, I remember things that have happened or think about things that never were. Yours are better.
7269. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 11/21/2003 6:21:13 AM
Oh wabb, thank you very very much—it's much appreciated and most gratifying. I've learned a lot from Resika, especially about setting the stage for a dramatic spacial development which he got from Hofmann.
It's been quite a day, I just got word that James Salter is crazy about the hand-colored monoprints for the special edition of his hand-made book. The word was "I hit it out of the park."
This is an A/P I kept for myself . . .
My idea was a pressed rosebud that looked like it left a wound of dried blood on the page. The short story is about a book dealer visited by his old flame who played havoc with his former life—before he was married and a new father. She tries to talk him into a weekend of unrestrained passion in Bangkok. He's surprised and overwhelmed with conflicting feelings as he remembers their past and what she once represented in his life.
Kevin, a rare book dealer (and my art dealer) is the publisher and is in the process of a painful divorce. He has a young daughter who is having considerable difficulty with the breakup, so the story has a lot of resonance on many levels.
7270. ScreamingSin - 11/21/2003 7:07:28 AM
Wiz, that everlasting apricot sunset 7262 with the scurry of life below, well done.
7271. judithathome - 11/21/2003 5:35:37 PM
I like the idea that the rose can wound without thorns, too....beauty and perfection can do that.
7272. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 11/21/2003 7:04:39 PM
Thanks J@H & SS—I am redeemed!
7273. rdbrewer - 11/21/2003 8:01:13 PM
Wiz, I love your pics. The remind me of dreary, drizzling fall days in the countryside.
7274. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 11/21/2003 11:08:58 PM
Thanks rd, more coming—I'm in the process of doing a webpage for the show.
7275. Edmund Dantes - 11/22/2003 2:15:36 AM
7276. wonkers2 - 11/22/2003 2:21:07 AM
Wonkers says, "Great picture, Wiz!"
Cap'n Dirty sez "Great pitcher, Dantes!"
7277. rdbrewer - 11/22/2003 5:14:11 PM
So, Wiz, would it be gauche to ask you how much they go for?
7278. judithathome - 11/22/2003 5:41:56 PM
Dantes picture reminds me of Dali.
7279. rdbrewer - 11/22/2003 5:48:01 PM
It reminds me of the 70's.
7280. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 11/22/2003 5:49:40 PM
rd- No, they're gouaches! Seriously, though, the prices haven't been set yet. That will be the very last thing to do—the work is being framed now and that cost will be a factor. November Field is in a $300 hand-gilded frame with an 8 ply archival double-thick mat—another $100. I'd expect it to sell for around $2500. The dealer takes half. The same size Resikas are selling for $7000. By NYC standards, they are equal in quality, but they're bargains in terms of cost. This is "Hartford—The No Risk Capitol of the World."
7281. Edmund Dantes - 11/22/2003 5:51:20 PM
Another from the same artist:
The first reminds me of Dali too.
7282. judithathome - 11/22/2003 5:53:43 PM
Who IS the artist, Ed? Nice fantasy pieces.
7283. judithathome - 11/22/2003 5:56:04 PM
Wiz, yesterday as we were returning from a drive in what little country is left around here, we saw a WOW sky. I mentioned to Keoni, "That's a Wiz sky..."
It was golden rosy and deep pinkish with dove grey and streaks in blue.
7284. Edmund Dantes - 11/22/2003 5:56:34 PM
Ken Weissblum
7285. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 11/22/2003 6:11:20 PM
Thanks Judith, but being in Texas, are sure it wasn't a Weissblum sky?;-P
7286. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 11/22/2003 6:11:44 PM
are YOU sure
7287. rdbrewer - 11/22/2003 6:52:33 PM
rd- No, they're gouaches! Seriously, though, the prices haven't been set yet.
Ha! Really, though, they're not gouaches, right? They're watercolor?
7288. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 11/22/2003 6:56:30 PM
No actually, the more recent images are monoprints, but three of the four images on the card are gouaches.
7289. rdbrewer - 11/22/2003 7:02:10 PM
I had to look up "gouache." I thought it meant something else -- the white stuff with which you prepare a canvas.
I didn't know you could do that to watercolor.
7290. rdbrewer - 11/22/2003 7:05:30 PM
Check these definitions. They seem strangly unfamiliar--not at all like what I remember.
7291. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 11/22/2003 8:35:17 PM
Go fuck yourself and AnalDantes, rd.
7292. Edmund Dantes - 11/22/2003 9:09:22 PM
Now, what did I do?
Speaking of Dali....
SALVADOR DALI'S FORGOTTEN DISNEY CARTOON
7293. rdbrewer - 11/22/2003 9:30:26 PM
Wiz, here's a quarter. Buy yourself a sense of humor.
7294. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 11/22/2003 11:37:25 PM
Bullshit, I gave a sincere response to your deceitful questions. You and Dantes are unworthy of anything other than ignoring and a "Don't Feed The Animals!" sign.
7295. Edmund Dantes - 11/22/2003 11:56:03 PM
I'll say one thing for Whizzy; at least he has an artist's temperament.
7296. rdbrewer - 11/23/2003 12:10:52 AM
My deceitful questions? I gave a sincere response too and added something I thought was funny. Typical ballpark-it Feeler "reasoning." You guys intuit feeling only, not motivation.
Corrollary: Your type can never admit an error, because to do that, for you, is tantamount to admitting you're a bad person--even though the two have nothing to do with one another.
Lucky for me, I don't have to walk on eggs around your temperament.
7297. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 11/23/2003 2:06:32 AM
7298. Edmund Dantes - 11/23/2003 2:22:43 AM
"I am not an animal! I am a human being!"
7299. rdbrewer - 11/23/2003 2:59:06 AM
I'll punch you in the gouche if you don't stop deceiving.
7300. wonkers2 - 11/23/2003 11:06:07 PM
Storm sky like Wiz's 7262 here
7301. wonkers2 - 11/23/2003 11:07:46 PM
RDB, what did I do wrong?
7302. rdbrewer - 11/23/2003 11:38:28 PM
I don't know, wonkers. Why don't you try it again. Make sure you get all of the url. Sometimes when it's long you have to scroll down while you are highlighting it.
7303. wonkers2 - 11/23/2003 11:51:25 PM
I type them in one letter at a time and then proof read it.
7304. rdbrewer - 11/24/2003 12:12:40 AM
Advice: Never do that. Too unreliable.
7305. wonkers2 - 11/24/2003 12:22:46 AM
RDB, I believe this is what I typed, plus <> at beginning and end. Is is possible that shutterfly timed out?
img src="http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv47b3cf37b3127cce82fcc0b93db60000001610" width="300"
7306. rdbrewer - 11/24/2003 12:26:51 AM
That looks right. Did you go back and try again? Go to the picture and
7307. rdbrewer - 11/24/2003 12:33:21 AM
img src="http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv47b3cf37b3127cce82fcc0b93db60000001610" width="300"
Wonkers, you're missing a character in that string. You're missing a slash before the 47. That's why you need to cut and paste.
Here's an address for a photo I put up previously that I compared to yours:
http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b3ce29b3127cce8fe9ad5837320000002610
7308. wonkers2 - 11/24/2003 12:34:26 AM
I'll try it again later. My wife needs the machine now. (Or thinks she does.)
7309. Magoseph - 11/24/2003 12:35:54 AM
All I can say is that if I have finally mastered the art of posting pictures, so can Wonkers do as well. I tried to enlist Whiz's help once but he sent me an email saying: Who's going to paint my house if I teach you? Well, I offered to be his upstairs French maid and never heard from him again.
Then both rdb and Rick gave me advice and somehow one of these guys must have gotten to me because I did it and did it again.
7310. wonkers2 - 11/24/2003 2:26:59 AM
7311. wonkers2 - 11/24/2003 2:30:48 AM
When I saw Wizardofwhimsy's #7262 above it reminded me of the picture posted above which I took last summer on Lake St. Clair just before a 40 mph rain squall hit. I wonder if Wiz was painting a similar storm sky? If so, he captured the sky quite well.
7312. wonkers2 - 11/24/2003 2:32:31 AM
Erratum: Cap'n Dirty took the picture from Tomater Sloop!
7313. Edmund Dantes - 11/24/2003 6:47:38 PM
7314. judithathome - 11/24/2003 7:16:42 PM
Here's a link to my friend's website.
Bronzes
7315. PelleNilsson - 11/24/2003 8:41:22 PM
Very nice, judith. But you may want to tactfully remind your friend that it is 'figurative', not 'figuritive'.
7316. rdbrewer - 11/24/2003 8:45:33 PM
ED, ever notice that the turkey is strange looking, misshapen? Maybe it's a goose?
7317. judithathome - 11/25/2003 2:12:28 AM
Well, he didn't design the website so he should take it well. ;-)
7318. Edmund Dantes - 11/25/2003 3:43:52 AM
rd: I think the guy who is looking outward at the viewer is creepy. It's probably Rockwell himself.
7319. Macnas - 11/25/2003 2:06:38 PM
It looks like someone serving up the severed arthritic right hand of a giant.
7320. Magoseph - 11/25/2003 3:10:12 PM
Sensuous Maquette
Polished and Painted Bronze
22" tall 
7321. Magoseph - 11/25/2003 3:19:58 PM
Oops! Sensuous Maquette is actually Dancer Maquette. Here is Sensuous! 
7322. Edmund Dantes - 11/25/2003 7:06:45 PM
Sensuous Maquette is actually Dancer Maquette.
Easy mistake. I think Dancer is the more sensuous of the two.
Dancer Maquette looks like Anorexic Maquette.
7323. Magoseph - 11/25/2003 8:19:51 PM
American Woman
Not very representative, in my opinion, since American women have the best bodies of the world.
7324. judithathome - 11/25/2003 8:29:25 PM
This is a place that just opened in Dallas. It's very impressive. It was all this man's private collection.
Nasher Sculpture Center
He still has enough stuff to change the exhibits many times over throughout the year.
7325. Magoseph - 11/26/2003 12:03:16 AM
You like this from the Nasher site, Juds?
7326. Magoseph - 11/26/2003 12:13:51 AM
Alexander Archipenko (American, born Russia, 1887-1964), Woman Combing her Hair, 1915, bronze, 35.6 x 8.6 x 8.3 cm, Tate Modern, London.
I absolutely adore this sculpture, saw it on the Nasher site but then lost it and had to look for it elsewhere. I wonder if the work is there on exhibition.
7327. judithathome - 11/26/2003 3:38:44 AM
I think some of the pieces might be on loan for the opening but the majority of the sculptures are Nasher's. He and his wife collected for years.
7328. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 12/9/2003 12:47:38 AM
For those of you interested in my fine art efforts, email me for the website of the current exhibition.
wizardofwhimsy@yahoo.com
7329. JRoth - 12/12/2003 3:25:35 AM
Anybody familiar with the 1610 Vespers by Monteverdi? The celebrated performance in St. Mark's by Gardiner is now on a rather good DVD. I'm a big fan of sacred music despite my agnosticism, but this performane also conveys a delicious sense of the profane intermixed with etheral harmonies.
7330. alistairconnor - 12/14/2003 12:12:27 AM
Vespro della Beata Vergine! Gardiner, San Marco. Yes, I own that on two CDs. What extras to you get on DVD?
Saw a superb concert version a few years ago by Jordi Savall's outfit. One of my best musical memories.
I'm frankly atheist, but that doesn't turn me off the art, music or architecture.
7331. ScreamingSin - 12/14/2003 7:31:49 AM
7281. Edmund Dantes - 11/23/2003 4:51:20 PM
Another from the same artist:
That's a picture that takes in the breath! Who is it?
It's lovely.
7332. Neato - 12/14/2003 8:43:01 AM
I love Monteverdi, but I like a gutsy choir. Sometimes those english choirs are a bit too polite and perfect for my taste.
7333. alistairconnor - 12/14/2003 11:24:33 AM
Then you would have liked the Savall version. I wonder if there's a record of it? The choir, La Capella Reial de Catalunya, are certainly gutsy... I would almost say they rock.
(He's moved on to later baroque and classical, which is a shame, but at the time he was the master of Renaissance and early baroque.)
Aha. Looked it up. Astrée 8546 Monteverdi: Vespro della Beata Vergine (1610) La Capella Reial de Catalunya / Coro del Centro Musica Antiqua di Padova - Jordi Savall
7334. Neato - 12/14/2003 11:31:30 AM
wow, thanks, I'll try to get those Vespers
7335. Edmund Dantes - 12/14/2003 11:31:18 PM
SS: It's Ken Weissblum.
7336. Edmund Dantes - 12/16/2003 4:43:43 PM
7337. wonkers2 - 12/27/2003 4:54:38 AM
7338. wonkers2 - 12/27/2003 5:04:56 AM
7339. judithathome - 12/27/2003 4:53:27 PM
You may as well tell us...doesn't look as though anyone wants to risk being wrong. ;-)
7340. wonkers2 - 12/27/2003 6:08:34 PM
Well, let's see if Pelle Nilsson can identify him. I believe they are fellow countrymen. Hint: he was Eliel Saarinen's next door neighbor for many years here in the U.S.
7341. wonkers2 - 12/27/2003 9:32:22 PM
Well, let's see if Pelle Nilsson can identify him. I believe they are fellow countrymen. Hint: he was Eliel Saarinen's next door neighbor for many years here in the U.S.
7342. rdbrewer - 12/27/2003 10:45:32 PM
7343. Edmund Dantes - 12/27/2003 11:04:38 PM
Gustav Vigeland?
7344. rdbrewer - 12/27/2003 11:43:48 PM
No, William Shatner.
Heh. Who did the sculpture of the boy pissing in the ocean in Oslow (or was it Copenhagen, can't remember)?
7345. Edmund Dantes - 12/28/2003 3:43:57 AM
Do you mean Mannekin Pis?
7346. Edmund Dantes - 12/28/2003 3:45:27 AM
7347. rdbrewer - 12/28/2003 3:52:47 AM
That's the one.
I think I've seen that, but the one I know I've seen is the young woman sitting on the rock next to the sea. Don't know if they're the same artist. Is either of these Wonk's artist?
7348. Edmund Dantes - 12/28/2003 3:57:45 AM
You're talking about "The Little Mermaid," in Copenhagen (Edward Eriksen).
Since I don't know yet who Wonk's artist is, I can't answer your question. It doesn't look that much like the Vigeland stuff I remember, but that was the first Scandinavian sculptor I thought of.
7349. wonkers2 - 12/28/2003 4:04:49 AM
I expect Pelle will be able to identify the sculptor and the name of the sculptures. I believe there is a duplicate in Sweden or Denmark. They are beautiful. I'v taken hundreds of pictures of them. And if I were more adept at linking I'd put up a few more. The statue of the woman is one of eight larger than life sculptures arranged in a circle around a fountain.
7350. rdbrewer - 12/28/2003 4:05:19 AM
Here it is:
It was made by Edvard Erichsen in 1909 and sits in the bay in Copenhagen. I walked by it quite by accident.
7351. rdbrewer - 12/28/2003 4:05:52 AM
Oops, another cross post.
7352. wonkers2 - 12/28/2003 4:23:49 AM
Here's a link to some of the most beautiful sculptures I've ever seen. They are 10 feet tall.
7353. PelleNilsson - 12/28/2003 8:58:35 AM
I guess the artist wonkers refers to is Carl Milles (1875-1955). He spent long periods in the US and became a citizen after the war. You find some more of his sculptures here
7354. wonkers2 - 12/28/2003 5:08:29 PM
Carl Milles was a great sculptor. I'm fortunate to live not far from Cranbrook academy where he was artist in residence for 30 years or so. Cranbrook's grounds are graced by perhaps 50-60 of his sculptures. The most famous one is the Orpheus Fountain which is incredibly beautiful. He his house on the campus was next door to that of Eliel Saarinen who designed all the original buildings which comprise the Cranbrook campus. Eliel's son, Eero, designed the St.Louis arch, the GM Technical Center, the TWA terminal at Kennedy Airport in NYC, and many other landmark buildings.
7355. judithathome - 12/28/2003 5:16:44 PM
Eero is very famous in crossword puzzles, too. ;-)
7356. rdbrewer - 12/28/2003 10:31:54 PM
Re: The Little Mermaid
ED, I was backpacking in Europe on a Euro-Rail pass in the spring of 1984. I got off the train in Copenhagen and started walking. I was taking the long road to a B&B. I had already passed the mermaid when I looked back to my left, and there she was. I was gobsmacked and delighted at the same time. I had seen pictures of her before and recognized her immediately.
There was some excellent sculpture in Brugge too. It was in a small park or square--not the main clock tower square. Seems like it was surrounded by paths and grass and possibly water features. I remember seeing shops on the other side of the park. This was the one time I stayed at the Holday Inn on my tour, as I was ready for some relative luxury, after having stayed in B&B's and hostels for a while. So, I'm sure the park is probably near the Holiday Inn.
Sidebar: That was the time I learned never to make long distance, much less, international, calls from one's hotel room. The surcharge for the two calls was more than the price of the room itself.
7357. PelleNilsson - 12/28/2003 10:49:18 PM
There are very few Swedish artists who are known internationally outside the cognoscenti circle. One of them is Carl Henric Reuterswärd for thsi piece outside the UN building.
Reuterswärd is of an old* noble family. One of his ancestors was police chief in Stockholm in 1792 when king Gustaf III was shot and killed at a costume ball at the Royal Opera, an event turned into an opera by Verdi. The conspiracists were duly apprehended. Two were executed, others were exiled.
*Not really old, 14-15th century noble families have simple names of one or two syllables.
7358. judithathome - 12/28/2003 11:13:16 PM
Isn't that the gun Ed keeps posting over in Politics with Howard Dean's name on it, only upside down? ;-)
7359. Edmund Dantes - 12/28/2003 11:13:29 PM
rd: I've backpacked Scandinavia via Europass as well. My impression of the Little Mermaid was she was much smaller than I expected.
She's been beheaded at least once by vandals, and it seems to me there was some similar defacement another time.
I saw Vigeland Park right at dusk, as in these photos:
7360. rdbrewer - 12/28/2003 11:36:33 PM
What a gorgeous picture.
I arrived in Oslo during the day,but I don't have a specific recollection of seeing that park.
We need to get the travel thread back up. Did you go to Flam and Bergen?
7361. rdbrewer - 12/28/2003 11:38:41 PM
some bad editiong there, I see
7362. rdbrewer - 12/28/2003 11:46:03 PM
Brugge, Belgium, that is. What a picture perfect city.
7363. judithathome - 12/28/2003 11:58:13 PM
Did you climb the bell tower there?
7364. rdbrewer - 12/29/2003 12:16:51 AM
Yes. Beautiful. You were there?
I took some nice b&w pictures and color around town.
7365. judithathome - 12/29/2003 4:56:29 PM
Yes, we've been to Brugge and Brussels and Waterloo, too.
We went to Copenhagen and Oslo and Stockholm...all over Scandinavia, in fact. Missed Bergen, however.
7366. Edmund Dantes - 12/29/2003 10:08:59 PM
Did you go to Flam and Bergen?
Yep, at least the Flam-Myrdal run and a day or two in Bergen. That same site has some nice pictures of Flam:
7367. rdbrewer - 12/30/2003 1:18:04 AM
How about that train? Did you buy a copy of Terry Plant's book about the laying of those tracks? Apparently, he has been hawking that book for years on that short streatch of railway. Probably making a comfortable living doing it.
Also, did you stay at or go to that lookout hotel on the edge of the cliffs there above the route of the train? Their dining room had large glass windows overlooking fjords on both sides.
7368. rdbrewer - 12/30/2003 1:20:20 AM
I stayed in Bergen a couple of days too. I remember walking past a huge pond or reflecting pool with some sculpture on the way from the station to my B&B.
When were you there?
7369. rdbrewer - 12/30/2003 1:42:43 AM
Norway would be strikingly beautiful--if not for the price of beer.
7370. Edmund Dantes - 12/30/2003 4:47:28 AM
Your pic in 7369 is more what I remember than the one in 7366.
Prettiest place I saw on the entire trip was Abisko National Park in Sweden.
Did you buy a copy of Terry Plant's book about the laying of those tracks?
Nope, when I traveled by backpack I traveled as light as I could. I'd tear pages out of my Thomas Cook once I was done with a place just to save the weight.
My Scandinavian trip was about 10 years ago.
7371. jexster - 1/1/2004 12:58:35 AM
Jerry Seinfeld
Jerry returns to stand-up to prove he's still master of his domain. Yadda yadda, indeed.
7:00 pm, 9:30 pm Friday, Jan. 9
@ Paramount Theatre, Oakland, CA
$45.50-$75.50
7372. Edmund Dantes - 1/2/2004 9:49:29 PM
A New History of Art, by Paul Johnson
7373. rdbrewer - 1/3/2004 4:42:19 AM
I was thinking of Gordon Lighfoot's If You Could Read My Mind. There is a strange section that goes like this:
I'd walk away like a movie star
Who gets burned in a three way script.
Enter number two:
A movie queen to play the scene
Of bringing all the good things out in me.
Does anyone know what this means?
7374. angel-five - 1/3/2004 5:01:18 AM
Have you ever listened to an artist that just entrances you so completely that you want to meet them? Even though you know that there is a big difference between what you hear on a polished album by someone making a living doing music, and what they are like?
7375. wonkers2 - 1/3/2004 5:54:53 AM
I met an artist once--a great Canadian folksinger whose name was Ed McCurdy, as I recall. At that time he was singing bawdy English ballads. After his concert at the Raven Gallery, six or eight of his fans of both sexes accompanied him back to his motel room. My impression was that some of the group hoped he was straight and others that he was gay. We drank into the wee hours, some of the groupies apparently trying to out-wait the others. I finally gave up on one of the girls in the group and went home.
7376. judithathome - 1/3/2004 5:55:07 PM
We had drinks with David Clayton Thomas after a concert once...he was amazed that so few people showed up for his gig at an officer's club in Japan. We complimented him after the show and he invited us for a drink in the bar...we were with him for about 2 hours and he was charming.
He was on his own by that time, had left Blood, Sweat, and Tears or they left him, whatever.
7377. Edmund Dantes - 1/3/2004 8:55:18 PM
rd: The song is about unrequited love. In the first stanza, Lightfoot talks about his own feelings, comparing himself to the dark, romantic heroes of old--like Heathcliffe in Wuthering Heights.
Then he compares his beloved to the more modern sensibility; she doesn't love him the way he does, but more the romantic idea, Harlequin Romance kind of thing.
In the part you cite I think he is like Rick (Humphrey Bogart) in Casablanca--"a movie star who gets burned in a three way script" and who walks away at the end, the odd man out.
In that vein, his beloved is "the movie queen" (Ingrid Bergman, Elsa), who brings out a noble behavior in him, i.e., eternal self-sacrifice.
But, he says, real love isn't all like the movies, "heroes often fail," and we have to "be real." The love he feels isn't matched by her own feelings and his love has died.
7378. rdbrewer - 1/3/2004 9:06:11 PM
Thanks, ED. I couldn't figure out what the hell a three way script was.
How about "Enter number two"? Is this a line Jex would appreciate?
7379. rdbrewer - 1/3/2004 9:07:33 PM
BTW, I couldn't make myself go to the rest of the song for the answers. I wasn't going to give the earworm any more fuel.
7380. Edmund Dantes - 1/3/2004 9:10:20 PM
How about "Enter number two"?
His character is number one in the three-way script, hers is number two.
I've never listened to it as he really wants a three-way, and that's the "feelings that [she] lacks." But I suppose that's possible...
7381. rdbrewer - 1/3/2004 9:28:05 PM
"Enter" as in enter the movie scene in the extended metaphor, not just enter as in "show up" (what I was thinking) or "enter number two" as in taking the back door route to the mattress dance.
7382. judithathome - 1/3/2004 11:06:00 PM
It's from the script in his mind, obviously.
The title is "If You Could Read My Mind" not "If You Could Imagine All Sorts Of Weird-ass Things That Might Go On In My Mind".
7383. rdbrewer - 1/3/2004 11:09:48 PM
Like I said, I didn't care to look at the rest of the lyrics. The earworm hath turned.
7384. TheWizardOfWhimsy - 1/4/2004 5:20:13 AM
LOL—these two have delusions of poetic adequacy!
7385. Edmund Dantes - 1/4/2004 6:18:28 AM
Play nice, now Whiffy. No one was talking to or about you, so don't start trouble. This here's a friendly thread.
I have a lyrics question for you, rd. I think I know the answer, but let's see what your take is.
In "You're So Vain," Carly Simon sings:
"I had some dreams, they were clouds in my coffee."
What do you think that means?
7386. rdbrewer - 1/4/2004 6:51:02 AM
The back door reference was tongue in cheek, btw.
That's a good one, ED. It sounds like the persona is looking back on her youth and on unrealized dreams that took shape and disappeared again, like clouds of cream in a coffee cup. At the time that song was written, people would have associted coffee drinking with someone past their teens and at least approaching middle age. The persona is taking stock, looking back.
7387. rdbrewer - 1/4/2004 7:01:14 AM
Whiz's replies to me today included "flaccid," "soft," and a reference to inadequacy. (And then he accused me of projecting.) Gee, I wonder if we do a Freudian critical analysis on that.
7388. judithathome - 1/4/2004 3:24:04 PM
Ed, if you and RD are having such a chummy and closed discussion, excluding all others, why not take it to e-mail so no one else will intrude?
I think the way the Mote works is that people can enter discussions at any time or at the very least, comment on them.
7389. Edmund Dantes - 1/4/2004 3:58:58 PM
Funny you advising people to take it to email, given your history and all, JudyHomebound. Best to not go there, though, eh?
<smirk>
rd: I agree, but I was thinking more about the imagery of clouds.
I think the clouds were the singer's teardrops falling into the coffee and temporarily making diluted spots that looked like clouds.
7390. judithathome - 1/4/2004 4:15:37 PM
Funny you advising people to take it to email, given your history and all, JudyHomebound. Best to not go there, though, eh?
If you'd really like to, feel free to do so. But I think you might not like it much, either. Mr. Glass House.
7391. Edmund Dantes - 1/4/2004 5:00:52 PM
If you wants to wrassle with me, take it to the Inferno, kiddo.
7392. Edmund Dantes - 1/5/2004 2:42:50 PM
The Death of Classical Music (or at least the recording of it)
7393. wonkers2 - 1/5/2004 5:07:58 PM
Too bad! Although I don't listen to classical music, live or recorded, nearly as much as I used to.
7394. Macnas - 1/5/2004 5:23:15 PM
I wonder why the demand for classical music had died off so abruptly?
7395. Edmund Dantes - 1/5/2004 5:26:12 PM
I don't know, but I've heard the recording industry in general is in terrible shape because of its inability to control reproduction of its product (along with other less important factors).
So my thought is that classical music is just most susceptible to the industry's belt-tightening.
7396. Macnas - 1/5/2004 5:33:24 PM
re 7395
That makes sense.
I've never bought a single classical record, and never listened to any other than the few Deutsche Gramophone LP’s that happened to be in my house when I was growing up.
7397. angel-five - 1/6/2004 11:46:27 PM
I think we should have a roundtable discussion of what we've been listening to lately.
7398. wabbit - 1/6/2004 11:55:52 PM
A very good friend (and an ex to boot) sent me a box full of blues cds, which I am slowly working my way through. Great stuff. Guitar Shorty, Sherman Robertson, Will and the Poor Boys ... you get the idea.
I am also thinking about transferring some old tapes to cds, music I used to paint/print by late at night. Sugar, Lucious Jackson, TMBG, Belly, The Murmurs, Killing Joke, etc.
7399. Macnas - 1/7/2004 9:24:05 AM
That’s a kind of coincidence, as I've only recently started going through a bunch of old cassettes of mine, which were uncovered during an archaeological dig at my mothers house.
I can't believe I listened to, never mind took the time to copy to tape, half of this stuff.
But as to what I'm listening to at the moment, I've been replacing my worn vinyl slowly but surely and am delighted afresh by the crisp sounds of the Specials and the Selector.
And as usual, Steely Dan's back catalogue continues to soothe me.
7400. wabbit - 1/7/2004 3:48:01 PM
Like you, I cannot believe I once listened to some of what I find in my collection, especially the crap from the seventies (not all bad - I've worn out Aja). Some of what I have isn't particularly good music, but it is so interwoven with specifics memories that, when in the mood, I can still listen and enjoy. That's just the pop/rock music, though. The jazz, blues, showtunes and classical stuff I love and never find tiring. Still need to be in the mood to listen to most things, though. Classical, including opera, is about the only thing I can put on whenever. I was delighted to come into possession of a copy of "The Rabbit of Seville" a couple weeks ago. It was my introduction to opera.
7401. Macnas - 1/7/2004 4:17:03 PM
I've heard of the Barber of Seville, but never the Rabbit.
My Missus is in a Neil Young groove at the moment, which I don't mind at all, sometimes his screechier songs do grate though.
I tend to listen to compilations (purchased or selfcompiled) while I'm driving, and particular artists when I am at home. Indeed, there is not much on the market today that I would buy an entire album of, I find I like perhaps one tune in particular and discard the rest.
7402. angel-five - 1/8/2004 7:08:13 PM
Down in the shadows of your deepest secrets
I sleep next to the precepts you hold most dear
Your heart is in my province hour upon hour
I shiver when you feel the cold,
Everything you say I hear
Like a bomb and its fuse,
We bring bright light
But I could be a devil to you
I could bite like a tarantula
Right through the skin
And leave my poison dream
I've been listening to lots of stuff, but more than anything it's been fast-paced trance to ambient. I'm not so much for the hammering rhythm, but a whore for the grooves.
7403. angel-five - 1/8/2004 7:09:14 PM
But my last five songs have ranged from 80s rock to 90s angst to 2004 trance to 200 ambient to Digging in the Dirt.
7404. rdbrewer - 1/8/2004 7:24:09 PM
I've had music training which has contributed to an ability to store a huge catalogue of earworms. Just a couple of tones from a squeaking door can trigger a tune--or even one tone of the right frequency, timbre, and duration. I blew across the opening of a 20oz plastic pop bottle the other day because one of my dogs loves it. But that one hoot triggered a Gordon Lightfoot song.
So I've been listening to music from the late seventies, several from Steely Dan, f/x, to the early 90's which is the about the time I stopped paying attention.
7405. marjoribanks - 1/8/2004 7:49:06 PM
After holding out for four years, I finally took the plunge and bought some children’s albums.
When the older tyke was born, I gave a listen to the stuff all the kids in our neighborhood were listeneing to and flat out drew a line. Raffi is not absolutely horrible, but I’d prefer not to have to listen to ‘Baby Beluga’ and the like more than once a year if possible. And the other children-targeted dreck from Barney on through the Wiggles will never be allowed in my house. So, his quiet time music as a tiny baby was classical, muted jazz from Joplin to the Cuban octogenarian Ruben Gonzales. And sing-along music has been, variously, the Beatles, Sinatra (Fly Me to the Moon) was a big favorite, and now some country (by his choice, not mine).
But now, with the new baby, and the fact that we are spending tons of time indoors and at home, some new music was called for, and I have gone and bought a few children’s albums that we can all tolerate listening to. All are recommended for those of you who have children or want to give someone else’s kids a gift.
7406. marjoribanks - 1/8/2004 7:49:15 PM
1) They Might Be Giants – No!
This is a great for kids right about my tyke’s age (four), because it is an Enhanced CD. The songs are as quirky and catchy as you’d expect from these NYC hipsters, and the CD has some whimsical games you play along with the songs. Our tiny critic particularly likes ‘Robot Parade’ (…in a future time…children will work together…to build a giant robot…..there’s electric cars..there’s electric trains…here comes a robot with electric brains) and the sweet ‘Where Do They Make Balloons’.
2) Not For Kids Only – Jerry Garcia
Consider that the decidedly unhip 70-plus grandma also loves this album. It’s very very laid back and bluegrassy Jerry Garcia (and a friend whose name I forget) singing and plinking out minimalist renditions of a bunch of folksy kids songs with zero pandering in the musicianship or the song choices. It’s the only version of ‘Teddybears Picnic’ adults can hear without puking, though the house favorite is definitely ‘Freight Train’.
3) Buckwheat Zydeco – Choo Choo Boogaloo
I have to admit that this album is my least favorite of the bunch, mainly because of an annoying (though suitably N.Orleans-inflected) narration between songs. But the tyke (and his mom) love it, and there is some curious pleasure in watching your kid waggle his hips, get down and sing along to Mardi Gras standards like ‘Iko Iko’.
4) Taj Mahal – Shake Stirree
This is a curious album, a huge hit with not only my tyke but his cousins as well. The reason is that it is consciously sing-along, with choruses to each song. But the cool thing is that it is also unreservedly a real blues album without a weak track, and only a certain amount of softening of the usual subjects of blues songs. Given time, I think this will be the longest-lasting family favorite.
7407. marjoribanks - 1/8/2004 7:58:37 PM
But my favorite album right now, and one of the best head-cleansing, ear-popping, disks I've added to my collection in a very long time is this one.
The Bad Plus is a straight-ahead jazz piano trio, but these fellows have made their chops, digested them, and produce an absolutely winning and intensely unique sound. The pianist is fantastic, sweet yet cerebral with something resembling a real punk style. And the drummer, hands down, is the best new player of the instrument I've heard for a very long time. Everyone seems to compare him to Keith Moon, it's valid.
And then there is the subject matter that these bold fellows have taken on. Their own compositions are fine, but on their covers of 'Smells like Teen Spirit', 'Heart of Glass' and 'Flim' their album is genuinely sublime.
All in all, this is a group to watch and hear very closely. They're showing us the way forward, as few musicians ever do in our lifetimes.
7408. arkymalarky - 1/8/2004 11:13:58 PM
It’s very very laid back and bluegrassy Jerry Garcia (and a friend whose name I forget) singing and plinking out minimalist renditions of a bunch of folksy kids songs
Not Dave Grisman, is it? Didn't they do an album together once?
7409. marjoribanks - 1/9/2004 4:29:28 AM
Yes, I'd never heard of Grisman before.
7410. arkymalarky - 1/9/2004 4:58:41 AM
Oooh, he's a great mandolin player. Dawg music (Dawg is his nickname--he ain't the prettiest fella), jazz/bluegrass. I want to think Bela Fleck played with him long ago. I'd have to ask Bro. Actually, I think it was a more rock-grass bunch whose name I can't recall. There's a nest of wonderful musicians in that unusual vein of music.
7411. charliel - 1/11/2004 2:26:04 PM
I have a mandolin instruction book by David Grisman with 6 (!) CDs, and I haven't had time to crack it open. I've promised myself to do it Real Soon Now.
7412. alistairConnor - 1/11/2004 2:42:15 PM
My project to transfer my vinyl collection to mpg is stalled, by practical matters (the floor of the shed I'm staying in is so unstable, the records jump all the time) and by time constraints. I don't think I'll manage more than a few on this trip.
So far, I have managed Drums and Wires (XTC) which I could have found easily enough on CD or on the internet.
7413. jayackroyd - 1/11/2004 3:31:18 PM
Garcia and Grisman did multiple albums as Grateful Dawg. There is a documentary on DVD called just that, Grateful Dawg, that captures some of their perfomances and other interactions.
7414. jayackroyd - 1/11/2004 3:31:49 PM
Bela Fleck shows up in the movie as well.
7415. jayackroyd - 1/11/2004 4:05:39 PM
Marj
I burned a cd from vinyl of mostly Jonathan Richman for my niece and nephew, and it went over well. I dunno what's in pressing these days, but songs like "Hey there little insect" and "Ice cream man" were popular. But their favorite seems to be "New England"
I've already been to Paris, already been to Rome
But what did I do but miss my home
Oh ho New England
I've seen old Israel's arid plain
It's magnificent, but so's Maine
Oh ho New England
7416. Macnas - 1/12/2004 9:49:17 AM
Jonathan Ritchman, sometimes sublime.
I walked past the stop and shop
Then I drove past the stop and shop
I liked that much better
than walking past the stop and shop
'cos I had the radio on.
7417. wonkers2 - 1/18/2004 12:36:02 AM
George Balanchine didn't believe in a distinction between fine and popular arts. He once choreographed for Ringling Brothers Circus a ballet for 14 elephants and convinced Igor Stravinsky to compose the music.
7418. wonkers2 - 1/18/2004 12:38:42 AM
Also, he choreographed 18 movie musicals.
7419. justears - 1/18/2004 4:18:00 AM
A former student of mine just gave me a double CD of the Indian Bollywood composer: Rahman. It includes a computer video disc. It is completely entrancing, combining graceful sensuality and innocence in a bewitching combination. What an amazing contrast to American "drug sex and rock n roll." or hip-hop fingers in your face grinds. Somebody buy me a ticket to India.
7420. rdbrewer - 1/18/2004 7:22:18 AM
My first rock concert was ELO. It was their Face the Music tour in about 1975/6. And I was completely unprepared for the magnitude of the event. I was blown away. Everything was new to me.
I remember getting goosebumps during "Nightrider". First, the song was great to begin with--and it eventually became my favorite ELO song--but they fired up huge green lasers that bounced around on stage forming a cage-like effect and then shot out over the heads of the audience. The stage was lit with blue light and with red highlights from the left side that created an overall blacklight effect. It was beautiful, mesmerizing. I had always dreamed of seeing a laser. I had no idea. Everyone in the crowd was standing, and a good percentage of them had lighters lit. I remember smiling and waves and waves of euphoria. This was such a surprise for an 8th grader, way beyond my expectations. I had seen the Carpenters a few years earlier, and I was expecting something along that line. Not even close.
This tour must have been one of the very first uses of lasers, because I never saw lasers like that again. Concert producers would never approve lasers of that wattage today. I'm sure their engineers knew what they were doing, but that was dangerous. They looked like huge green flourescent tubes hanging in the air. Glad I got to see it.
"Nightrider" was one of their last songs, and we left after that. My sister had to get me home.
I was thinking of ELO and "Nightrider," because one of the lines is very similar to a line in "MacArthur Park" that I was spoofing yesterday. Now I'm thinking about buying a copy of Face the Music. This is the favorite of many ELO purists, because it was their first big commercial success. They were just coming into their own. It was before the art deco logo and some of the overdone stuff that came later.
7421. rdbrewer - 1/19/2004 6:43:07 AM
I've decided to get several CD's. In the past I've purchased albums for one song or even a few licks. Four of these CD's have at least one song with an extremely good hook or two. They were used in tv commercials. That's where I heard them. I should probably listen to the radio more often, but I'm no longer willing to sift through the crap and wait for good songs to come up. When I do hear a piece of something good, I try to track it down. I bought a Hooverphonic CD a couple of years ago the same way.
1) ELO, Face the Music
2) Coldplay, A Rush of Blood to the Head
3) Ivy, Long Distance
4) Papas Fritas, Buildings and Grounds
5) ATC, Planet Pop
Anyone have these? If so, how about the album as a whole, the other songs?
7422. rdbrewer - 1/19/2004 6:46:28 AM
Anyone ever notice that Max Weinberg, Conan O'Brian's drummer, looks just like Sid Blumenthal?
7423. judithathome - 1/19/2004 3:01:23 PM
Maybe it IS Sid and he's moonlighting.
7424. charliel - 1/19/2004 7:08:07 PM
Weinberg was Springsteen's drummer long before he became Conan's.
7425. Macnas - 1/20/2004 11:52:41 AM
Conan O'Brian? I thought from the above he was a singer or something, now someone tells me he's a talk show fellow.
7426. angel-five - 1/24/2004 4:48:56 AM
The last album I picked up was Rammstein
i Mutter.
It has thoroughly floored me.
7427. angel-five - 1/24/2004 4:49:29 AM
That should read Rammstein Mutter.
7428. arkymalarky - 1/24/2004 5:25:26 AM
Hey, while you're in here I want to say while I'm thinking about it that I do love Evanescence's lead singer's (Amy Lee) voice. I don't know how much the band change affected them, but what I've heard lately really enhances her.
7429. arkymalarky - 1/24/2004 5:27:29 AM
You had mentioned it in RI when their first song had come out and I didn't like the hollerin'guy that was dueting with her on it and it made the whole thing feel too frantic for my tastes. After that I got to really liking frantic for a while--it's like having a punching bag in your car.
7430. rdbrewer - 1/24/2004 5:58:15 AM
A-5, we miss your kung-fu.
7431. angel-five - 1/24/2004 6:24:57 AM
Evanescence is decent enough. Amy Lee's vocals grow on me but there's little else anymore about the band which captures my attention.
If you like Evanescence's sound, there's an Italian group called Lacuna Coil
which just so thoroughly kicks Evanescence's ass that it's hard to quantify. The only drawback is the occasionally growled male vocal. I'd suggest downloading To Live is to Hide and The Ghost Woman and the Hunter if it sounds interesting to you. I have a picture of myself lying around somewhere, taken with the lead singer, who is just mind-numbingly hot.
7432. angel-five - 1/24/2004 6:25:40 AM
Man do I miss easy-HTML formatting.
7433. angel-five - 1/24/2004 6:44:12 AM
Probably an even better track to download and check LC out, would be Entwined.
7434. arkymalarky - 1/24/2004 3:52:26 PM
I just love her voice, which I think is very pure and clean without the annoying attributes a lot of lead female vocalists have to me in modern "rock" groups. I haven't paid much attention to anything else about them, but in their first song it was impossible not to notice the rest of the music, and it was distracting, imo.
Thanks for the heads up on Lacuna Coil.
7435. angel-five - 1/28/2004 5:27:53 AM
Last five songs spun:
Sarah McLachlan Fear (Hybrid's Supercollider mix)
Rammstein Adios
My Life With The Thrill Kill Kult After the Flesh
William Orbit Barber's Adagio for Strings
DuMonde Human
7436. angel-five - 1/28/2004 5:36:32 AM
The lyrics to Tarantula, by Faithless:
Down in the shadows
of your deepest secrets
I sleep next to the precepts
you hold most dear
Your heart is in my province
hour upon hour
I shiver when you feel the cold,
Everything you say I hear
Like a bomb and its fuse,
We bring bright light
But I could be a devil to you
I could bite like a tarantula
Right through the skin
And leave
my poison
dream
Deliciously Unsuspecting
Protecting you from all harm
Except perhaps from reasoning
7437. Snowowl - 1/28/2004 6:03:14 AM
RIP Janet Frame
7438. marjoribanks - 1/29/2004 7:42:48 PM
I burned a cd from vinyl of mostly Jonathan Richman for my niece and nephew, and it went over well. I dunno what's in pressing these days, but songs like "Hey there little insect" and "Ice cream man" were popular. But their favorite seems to be "New England"
That is a very promising tip, Jay. Thanks.
7439. HCaulfield - 2/4/2004 5:26:35 AM
Mrs. HCaulfield is in NYC teaching practical theater to a section of students from a prominent southern university. She is on the lookout for pedagogical opportunities. Any tips would be appreciated; free/cheap is good. Mention "The Producers", and I'll send the boys over to bust your kneecaps.
Love,
HC
7440. angel-five - 2/4/2004 5:35:24 AM
There's a name I haven't heard for about eight years.
7441. HCaulfield - 2/4/2004 6:52:46 AM
angel-five,
I'm slicing the umble pie; youse who have stuck with this merry band deserve all the tasty bits. I'm grateful you even remember my lame participation from long ago.
7442. wabbit - 2/8/2004 3:17:45 AM
Ok, Outkast is cool enough, but that was the best acceptance speech I've heard in, well, probably ever. Dre finally made his way to the stage to accept the Grammy for best rap album (Speakerboxxx: The Love Below) and said, "Thank you."
And then he was gone.
The White Stripes rock.
7443. alistairConnor - 2/8/2004 12:31:13 PM
The White Stripes won something?
Hey I'm hip.
My elder sister made a copy of a White Stripes record for my younger sister. She dropped it off at my brother's place, but they were playing it before she was out the door, so she had to make another copy.
I'm still waiting for mine.
Probably I should buy one. They seem like nice folks.
7444. wabbit - 2/8/2004 3:55:13 PM
They won a couple, Best Rock Song for "Seven Nation Army" and Best Alternative Album for "Elephant".
official Grammy site - Grammy.com
a different list of Grammy winners
7445. judithathome - 2/23/2004 11:11:35 PM
Posted in one of the threads at the Atlantic:
Composer Bart Howard ("Fly Me to the Moon") died this weekend. According to the obit in the L.A. Times, "Howard is survived by his companion of 58 years, Thomas Fowler." I read this this morning, about five minutes after AWOL made his proposal for a marriage amendment.
7446. CharlieL - 3/2/2004 5:49:30 AM
Hi, everyone!
We heard tonight that the Brunswick, ME Celtic Festival wants us this summer.
That means we have trips to NY, MA, ME, NC, WV and RI this summer.
I'm tired just thining of it.
7447. wabbit - 3/2/2004 6:03:46 AM
Hey CharlieL! Please post more info when you know things like dates and locations, it sounds like great fun!
7448. CharlieL - 3/3/2004 5:58:00 AM
Will do, wabbit.
7449. Macnas - 3/3/2004 3:56:55 PM
Chuck, come back to Ireland so I can heckle you.
7450. CharlieL - 3/3/2004 4:04:22 PM
Macnas, we may be in Scotland again next summer. We played on Skye this past summer, and it was wonderful, and they even liked us, which was a plus.
That may be as close as we get to Ireland. It's really strange here in the States. Scottish festival groups will hire us even though Scots music is only about 1/4 of our repertoire. About the same amount is Irish as well, but Irish groups won't hire us because they say we're not Irish enough. We're not trying to be Irish, or Scottish, for that matter, we're trying to show how all the Celtic strands of music intertwine.
When we played in Scotland, they got it. When we inquired about playing in Ireland, they weren't interested. It won't stop us from trying again, but it's discouraging.
Things may change a bit now that we have a piper who can play Uillean pipes as well as the several Scottish pipes. He also plays concertina and Northumbrian pipes. It's been fun reworking our stuff to take advantage of the new sounds we have.
7451. Macnas - 3/3/2004 4:05:09 PM
There is a band I like a lot touring America at the moment, they're called The Frames, and sound like, I don't know what they sound like, other than mostly very good.
If you like good "indie" style rock/pop or whatever you prefer to name it, I'm sure you'll enjoy the live show, which is where they are at their best.
7452. arkymalarky - 3/4/2004 12:12:31 AM
Bro played in Northern Ireland a couple of summers ago (don't remember where, but several places), but it was bluegrass and he worked with a guy out of Germany who he's exchanged touring with over the last number of years between the US and various places in Europe. The German sets them up in Europe.
7453. arkymalarky - 3/4/2004 12:13:34 AM
I'm wracking my brain--I know I've seen/heard something by the Frames but can't think what.
7454. arkymalarky - 3/4/2004 12:15:29 AM
I'm back watching music videos. It seems like I went almost a year watching next to no tv and now I'm finding what's out really interesting. Still a lot of crap, but things seem much more creative than they were a year or so ago. It could very well just be the difference in my frame of mind, though.
7455. Macnas - 3/4/2004 10:54:04 AM
Chuck, I'm disappointed to hear that, but I'm not surprised either.
There is a broad streak of elitism running through Irish music, and by Irish music I am referring to traditional/folk music.
Ceoltas Ceoltoiri Eireann are becoming more moribund as time goes on, and are not interested in anything but maintaining the purity of the music. This means they are not interested in developing other aspects, or exploring further, or doing what you are doing Chuck.
This tends to influence a lot of people directly and indirectly, but does not stop Irish music from mutating all the time. I've heard it blended with African music so successfully, you’d wonder why nobody ever did it before.
If you are trying to get into the traditional circuit, forget it. They know what they like and what they want is more of it. Traditionalists don't like music from Scotland, never mind youse fellows doing your thing.
Have you looked at the celtic fusion festival up north in County Down? I think they'd like your music.
I think with a bit more investigation you would find a few open doors Chuck, whether or not it is actually worthwhile is another thing entirely.
7456. alistairconnor - 3/4/2004 12:37:13 PM
Have you looked at the celtic fusion festival up north in County Down
In a sweet little town in the County Down, one morning last July...
Sounds like a cool stop for a holiday trip -- a family-style event. I've been toying with the idea of Ireland for several summers now.
Unfortunately the official web site is not up to date, I can find no reviews of 2003 nor program for 2004... was it really that bad?
7457. Macnas - 3/4/2004 2:27:40 PM
I know the event went ahead last year, but have not heard or read any reviews.
I just found out that some of the local council were unhappy with the expenditure (Unionist DUP of course), so perhaps it is on hold until some arrangement is made.
7458. Macnas - 3/4/2004 2:42:09 PM
alistair, I think the Galway Arts Festival might suit you and yours, they have events specifically for children to enjoy, and Connemara in the summer can be very nice.
7459. PelleNilsson - 3/4/2004 3:56:19 PM
There is nothing more boring than traditional folk music, be it Irish, Swedish, Thai, Croatian or whatever.
7460. Macnas - 3/4/2004 4:29:38 PM
I don't know Pelle, there is something about Swedish folk music that brings to mind the mewling of a newborn elk being beaten to death with a bag of bicycle bells.
Hardly boring.
7461. PelleNilsson - 3/4/2004 5:10:44 PM
Hahaha! But fess up: you've never heard any Swedish folk music.
7462. Macnas - 3/4/2004 5:13:22 PM
I 'fess.
I do like my own Irish music, everything else (folk wise) is just too alien for me in it's raw state.
But I was close to the truth about Swedish folk music wasn't I?
7463. PelleNilsson - 3/4/2004 5:49:22 PM
Yes and no, Macnas. Some of it is quite melodious. But boring. On the basic level there is a certain sameness to all folk music. Simple tunes, simple instruments, lots of repetition. You wouldn't find the Swedish variant all too different from the Irish one.
7464. PelleNilsson - 3/4/2004 5:51:04 PM
I strikes me that we should involve the new poster Linnea in this. She hosts a local radio program in the US devoted to folk music.
7465. Macnas - 3/4/2004 5:56:51 PM
That would be good, I like the wireless.
I'll check in on Monday, 'cos I'm away home now.
7466. alistairConnor - 3/4/2004 6:16:18 PM
Galway festival, looks good! Among the musical line-up, I could fancy:
Linton Kwesi Johnson
Boz Scaggs
Ron Sexsmith
Kila
The Proclaimers
and if the others are of that calibre, they are very good indeed... will consider.
I might go and see a medieval mystery play too.
7467. alistairConnor - 3/4/2004 6:19:58 PM
By the way, if you were all wondering what our Irish engineer looks like.
Here he is, dressed for a challenging day at the office.
7468. Linnea - 3/4/2004 9:16:04 PM
Felt my ears burning . . .
Folk music is not boring.
Jay Ungar (of "Ashokan Farewell" fame - that's the tune you can't get out of your head, from the Ken Burns film about the Civil War) started out studying classical violin. He says that most pieces were mostly boring, but would usually have one section that really kicked. When he discovered folk fiddling, it was all the kick-ass parts and none of the boring stuff.
Playing something from the new CD by Dervish, as I type.
7469. Linnea - 3/4/2004 9:21:39 PM
Oh, and as far as Swedish music goes, I like this group a lot. And this one.
7470. wonkers2 - 3/4/2004 10:16:41 PM
Beautiful music and graphics. And Linnea is a beautiful name.
Cap'n Dirty sez, "Welcome aboard, Linnea, how about a moonlight cruise on the Tomater Sloop?"
7471. arkymalarky - 3/5/2004 2:24:41 AM
I don't know Pelle, there is something about Swedish folk music that brings to mind the mewling of a newborn elk being beaten to death with a bag of bicycle bells.
That's hilarious.
Bro plays very traditional folk/bluegrass and has since high school, and the funniest thing he ever told about it was how at big festivals Japanese bluegrass bands would travel to the festivals and play and sing songs like "Let me be your Salty Dog," but when he'd try to talk to them about the music they didn't speak English.
I like traditional folk to a point, but my parents and brother eat it up. Bro lives in the heart of folk music here in AR. He plays other styles and is really good on the guitar. We had a good band in college, if I say so myself. But here, unless you live in one of our "urban" centers (very loosely used term here), there's no future in it without trying to "make it" like Evanescence and leave. With bluegrass and folk you can play as much as you want, make a good second income, and still live where and how you want.
7472. arkymalarky - 3/5/2004 2:26:12 AM
Wabbit mentioned White Stripes upthread at the Grammys. I saw on some program that he's produced an album for Loretta Lynn of all her own compositions. He's a fascinating fella.
7473. arkymalarky - 3/6/2004 4:24:35 AM
Anybody listened to Joss Stone?
7474. anomie - 3/6/2004 7:58:17 PM
Never heard of Joss Stone.
I'm looking at the Amnesty International DVD. Tracy Chapman has a wonderful voice.
Voices are amazing things - the primary musical instrument.
7475. anomie - 3/6/2004 8:02:05 PM
Some voices don't hit home without the visual. Tracy Chapman, Whitney Houston, Dolly Parton.
Others are worse on viewing. Prince, Bruce Springstein.
7476. judithathome - 3/6/2004 8:06:54 PM
More worse on viewing: Tom Waits; Joe Cocker....
7477. anomie - 3/6/2004 8:07:48 PM
Jimmy Page is playing one of those dual-neck guitars. I hate that. Seems so indecisive. Jimmy Page, no less.
7478. anomie - 3/6/2004 8:08:38 PM
And then, he's playing a Les Paul. What's up with that?
7479. anomie - 3/6/2004 8:10:14 PM
Robert Plant is a great looking 50-something rocker, and this is from about 6 years ago.
"Squeeze my lemon..."
7480. judithathome - 3/6/2004 8:18:10 PM
Les Paul is super cool!
7481. anomie - 3/6/2004 8:22:42 PM
Okay, I know the Les Paul Special is a guitar player's dream, but to me it seems like a toy.
My lead player years ago had a Mosrite of all things. I had a strat. I played a Telecaster,and I still have an SG. I want a Rickenbacher someday.
But a Les Paul? It's a toy. It's a Fender neck on a Hukalalie body.
7482. anomie - 3/6/2004 8:24:08 PM
Radiohead is great, but I hate watching them. Especially the lead singer. He's such a twat. Bujt he's good. Gotta admit.
7483. anomie - 3/6/2004 8:31:05 PM
This is a running commentary on the Amnestey International DVD, if that hasn't been clear.
7484. anomie - 3/6/2004 9:42:35 PM
James Taylor, the Pull Over DVD.
I've seen JT live twice. This DVD is typical but that's a good thing. Here's the thing. Imagine a folk singer, surrounded by a string section, brass section, vocal section, lighting and stage managers...camera crews...and it all seems like good ole James just singing away.
A triumpth of subtlety.
7485. justears - 3/7/2004 2:08:38 AM
Anomie, What is Amnesty DVD to which you are referring?
7486. anomie - 3/7/2004 2:52:46 AM
It's just the DVD, for James Taylor.
7487. Macnas - 3/7/2004 11:04:50 AM
alistair, I wouldn't mind a suit like that with some of the systems I have to walk down these days.
Add a beard and he could be me.
7488. anomie - 3/12/2004 4:31:55 PM
Judith,
How right you are about Cocker. Tom Waits is interesting to watch, for me though. Doesn't improve my perception of his voice, maybe even distracts. But he's intersting. Cocker is like a nervous twitch you want to get rid of. Ha!
7489. anomie - 3/12/2004 4:34:10 PM
Justears,
Sorry, the Amnesty DVD is something I bought in the very early days of DVDs. Maybe 1997 or 8. It's a benefit concert with various artists. I don't have the box anymore, but an Amazon search and knowing the year of production might turn it up.
7490. jayackroyd - 3/15/2004 7:14:43 PM
BTW.
I saw King Lear at Lincoln Center last night, with Christopher Plummer in the starring role. Quite good, actually. Very solidly cast. It may be a tough ticket at this point, but if you are interested in Shakespeare productions, it's well worth seeing. If you happen to be in or around NYC, of course.
7491. judithathome - 3/15/2004 8:23:35 PM
Friday night we are going to see a local production of "Lion In Winter" with a very strong cast, people who will do it justice, I'm sure. After that, we're going to an after-perfomance party for the Fort Worth Opera at a cozy restaurant we love. And dinner before the play!
Busy night, considering how long I've been idle.
7492. anomie - 3/19/2004 7:01:09 PM
Lion in Winter...How do you NOT compare any performance to Hepburn and Whatshisname. I think they spoiled it for any other actors.
7493. judithathome - 3/19/2004 7:20:44 PM
They have...the woman doing Eleanor was clearly doing Kate H. almost to the tremors and wavery voice! The guy did better but I just kept seeing Peter and Kate.
However, the dialogue was still superb.
7494. anomie - 3/20/2004 1:15:01 AM
Anyone hear the new love song by Janis Ian?
"...I still have the taste of you in my mouth".
Zowie, talk about coming out iof the closet! Must be timed for the gay wedding set.
Jannis Ian is a very underrated artist, BTW. One of my favorites.
7495. PelleNilsson - 3/25/2004 10:38:40 AM
You may remember that some time ago I posted a picture of three stone statuettes. Taken by the cellphone camera it was quite bad. Here is a better one:
We bought them in a rather untouristic village in Morocco. The odd thing is that they have a distinct Germanic/Norse look. I think of them as The High One, The Equally High One, and The Third after a story in Snorre's Edda.
7496. judithathome - 3/25/2004 3:32:01 PM
"...I still have the taste of you in my mouth".
Zowie, talk about coming out iof the closet! Must be timed for the gay wedding set.
Really? I don't see why that couldn't work in a hetero way, too. ;-)
7497. wabbit - 3/26/2004 5:51:29 PM
Yesterday I dragged Spunky to the Boston Museum of Fine Arts to see Gauguin Tahiti. The exhibit was built around the Boston MFA's recently restored Gauguin painting Where Do We Come From? What Are We? Where Are We Going? and covers both his trips to Tahiti. Where Are We Going is reunited with four paintings now owned by the Musée d’Orsay, Paris - the four are from a group of six, no info on the missing two - along with a group of eight related paintings that have not been seen together since 1898 when Gauguin shipped them to Paris. There are paintings from various other museums and private collections, and several wood carvings that are just gorgeous. One painting I found particularly beautiful is on loan from The Puskin Museum of Fine Arts, titled Aha Oe Feii? (Are You Jealous?). Online images don't do this painting justice. A five piece carved doorframe is up in one of the last rooms and there are a few wood panels scattered throughout the show. One room centers on Gauguin's woodcuts. If you like Gauguin, it's a very nice show and will be up until June 30.
7498. judithathome - 3/26/2004 6:46:59 PM
Is this show by any chance traveling after that?
7499. wabbit - 3/26/2004 6:48:44 PM
Nope, Boston is the only US stop.
7500. wonkers2 - 3/26/2004 9:49:38 PM
Interesting Moroccan sculptures. Are they old? Perhaps they were influenced by Norse sculptures. I have some recent Zimbabwean sculptures that were influenced by Cubism. And they also resemble your Moroccan ones, Pelle. Or perhaps Picasso, et al, were influenced by the Norsemen??
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