Ooooooooh, so scary!
Halloween has always been my favorite holiday. As a child I would read any ghoulish tale of supernatural horror I could get my hands on. My father would drag me out of bed in the middle of the night to watch the late-night horror movies on TV. Both my parents loved ghost stories and everyone dressed up on Halloween. My grandmother's grandmother used to wear a bedsheet and pop up at bedroom windows in the middle of the night just to scare the daylights out of the children. My other great grandmother regularly attended seances and on several occasions took my young grandmother with her.
Now, my family is likely a bit more dedicated to their pursuit of a good scare than most, but humans have always had a fascination with the darker side of the supernatural. We like to believe in ghosts and ghouls and vampires and haunted houses. We enjoy being scared silly.
I've got a few questions I'd like to explore. I'll post them next.
2. Ms. No - 9/15/2003 11:45:29 AM
1. I've been calling this the Year of Movies for Me because of the seeming record number of major release horror films. Why the sudden increase when we had so few for so many years?
2. Recently I ended up in debate with some literary types about what constitutes the horror genre in fiction. It's changed in recent years. It used to be that horror meant the story had supernatural elements. Now, anything with a lot of blood and gore seems to qualify.
3. Do you find that the things that scare you fictionally are the same things that scare you in real life? Do you suffer more terror thinking that a chainsaw weilding freak may come after your sweetbreads or that the IRS may come after you with a tax audit? Why is only some fear fun?
3. arkymalarky - 9/15/2003 12:01:06 PM
I don't like being scared or watching really suspensful movies. They affect me physically too much. If they don't click as scary then they're only funny or stupid, so I don't get much from the horror genre unless it's really campy fun, like Tremors. I thought the Blair Witch Project was idiotic. Had it worked for me I couldn't have watched it. I could barely get through it anyway because of the loudmouthed lead. The Exorcist scared me silly when I was 16, but both Bob and my dad (in separate viewings) laughed all the way through it.
Mose used to watch all that stuff and loved every bit of it, until she watched "The Ring" last year. She won't watch them any more since that one. It had her spooked for weeks.
4. arkymalarky - 9/15/2003 12:01:54 PM
Or maybe I was 14 when I saw the Exorcist. What year did it come out?
5. concerned - 9/15/2003 12:02:20 PM
Isn't there a Freddy vs Jason movie coming out? Don't think I'll see it, myself.
6. arkymalarky - 9/15/2003 12:11:15 PM
Mose has. Her boyfriend loves scary movies, and she thought that one would be stupid. She said it was, but was very gory. Which I guess is the point.
7. Ms. No - 9/15/2003 12:17:56 PM
Arky,
The Exorcist came out in 1973 and I think it's still one of the best horror movies of all time.
At first I was surprised to hear that The Ring had such an affect on Mose and then I remembered a movie that I saw when I was about her age that significantly changed my life for about three days. I'm too embarassed to even mention the title at this point because the film was so incredibly bad. Horrid. Drek. Should've been shot to put it out of it's misery. But at 17-20 there's no telling what will set you off. ;-)
I have a good friend who absolutely will not watch anything like a horror movie. He claims there's enough horror in his life already that he doesn't need to see it in films. This always struck me as odd since I truly believe that most people go to horror movies to take their minds off of their real-life troubles.
8. arkymalarky - 9/15/2003 12:21:55 PM
Yep. I was 14. Scared the crap out of me.
Bob says the scariest movie ever made was "Last House on the Left." Turns out it's a Wes Craven movie, as we found out from a movie info book Bob's friend gave him at her garage sale.
I haven't seen The Ring, but I said something to my students about how it affected Mose (they know her) and several of them, guys and girls, agreed. Maybe it is an age thing with some movies.
9. arkymalarky - 9/15/2003 12:22:53 PM
And you know you're going to have to mention that title sooner or later. ;-)
10. Ms. No - 9/15/2003 12:27:47 PM
I'm not a fan of those kinds of films. I'm not big into gore and rather than scaring or entertaining me the films mostly just frustrate and piss me off. People are so stupid in them. They deserve to die for that as far as I'm concerned, but they don't interest me enough to bear witness to their deaths.
HOWEVER I almost considered seeing it because the Freddy Krueger series was one that I actually did enjoy. That's because the Freddy movies had an acceptable loophole in addition to a really good hook. Everyone has heard of the old wive's tale that if you die in your dreams your heart really does stop and you die in real life. Everyone knows that they do wacky things in their dreams for no aparent reason. So, we've got a monster that stalks his victims in their dreams and the leeway for them to behave counter to all logic because people don't behave logically in their dreams. Great set up.
Not that they weren't too gorey for me, because they were, but the Freddy Movies were different for me than Halloween or Friday the 13th or any of the billion knock-offs they spawned.
11. Ms. No - 9/15/2003 12:39:16 PM
Ah, Last House on the Left. This is major for me not because the movie itself was so terrifying but because it's one of several films that mark what I think is a significant change in the genre.
Last House on the Left has nothing at all supernatural about it. It's "reality horror". The Texas Chainsaw Massacre is another. A lot of these types of films came out in the early 70's and they were kind of a new thing.
I think they sprang out of the Manson Family killings.
12. Ms. No - 9/15/2003 12:44:57 PM
Arx,
I've never actually seen House of 1000 Corpses and don't have any plans to do so. It looks to be heavy on gore again which just isn't my thing. I mean, I'll tolerate gore if the film has something else going for it, but if the only aim of the film is to pump as many gallons of blood as they can in 90 minutes then I'll take a pass.
13. thoughtful - 9/15/2003 12:53:07 PM
lots of terrifying movies, but the scariest i recall were the haunting of hill house by shirley jackson (not to be confused with the house on the haunted hill) which may have been age-related having been a teen when I saw it.
The other though that was so incredibly intense was Duel with dennis weaver...spielberg's first. Yikes!
14. Ms. No - 9/15/2003 1:06:12 PM
I rented the 1963 Haunting of Hill House not long ago. I had always wanted to see it because it had an excellent reputation as a great horror movie. It was scary. I'll have to read the book now, though, because the main problem I had with the movie is to do with the female lead character. I wonder how much of that was directing and acting and how much of that is really Jackson's concept.
The remake a couple years ago was horrid. Some good creepy images, but not enough to make a film from and the horrid CGI evil entity was laughable. This is all beside the fact that some truly gifted actors were made to look ridiculous by a terrible script/director/editing. This one was a total train wreck.
15. PelleNilsson - 9/15/2003 2:13:53 PM
Ms. No wrote People are so stupid in them.
But isn't that always so in the classical horror movie? How many have we seen where the heroine wakes up by some mysterious noise and instead of barricading her doors she lights a candle and, in her sweeping white nightgown, she descends down dark stairwells, examines cavernous, spooky rooms, only to be caught, or nearly caught by [insert favourite avatar here]?
16. Ms. No - 9/15/2003 2:43:05 PM
I think it depends on what one considers to be classic horror and whether one is primarily cinema focused or literarily focused.
Nothing ruins a film or story for me faster than the characters behaving like total morons by wandering around in their underwear in the dark with a flashlight when they know a killer is on the loose. Or lying to the people who are there to help them. Or failing to go for help, find a telephone, make sure the bad-guy is really dead this time etc.
I know that this has become staple fare for a large number of horror films. It's accepted and even expected and perhaps enjoyed by many fans of the genre, but I will continue to disparage these kinds of forced plot contortions and cheap thrills. They're lazy contrivances.
Nobody does anything stupid in The Exorcist or the original Night of the Living Dead. Psycho, Carrie, Rosemary's Baby, Jacob's Ladder, In the Mouth of Madness, Poltergeist, Wicker Man, The Sixth Sense. These movies are all terrifying but they don't rely on the stupidity of their characters in order to place them in danger. The whole point is that you can be smart, you can be rational, you can be a good person and do the right things and you can still end up dead.
That to me is horrific. I'm not particularly frightened by a lot of what passes for horror in recent years. Nobody with half a brain needs to be.
17. judithathome - 9/15/2003 2:52:44 PM
Don't Look Now is one of the most scary movies I've ever seen...just very full of dread, the entire time.
18. Ms. No - 9/15/2003 3:11:05 PM
That makes several lists of Top Horror Films, but I have to admit that it's one I haven't seen. Of course, there are a lot of horror movies I haven't seen so it isn't unusual. ;-)
19. Ms. No - 9/15/2003 3:11:16 PM
I'll have to check it out!
20. judithathome - 9/15/2003 3:16:07 PM
It's very stylish and intelligent...and sexy!
21. judithathome - 9/15/2003 3:19:30 PM
And now for something completely different:
Creepy PEEPS!!!
22. thoughtful - 9/15/2003 3:35:34 PM
Anyone else seen Duel? It originally was a made for tv movie, but I believe its out in video now. I still remember my brother and I watching it as teens and the 2 of us just climbing the walls!
23. thoughtful - 9/15/2003 3:37:29 PM
Old friend of mine always found the scariest thing being dealing with a human being who holds your life in their hands and with whom it's totally impossible to reason. I have to admit that Misery filled that bill....had second and third thoughts before I went to see fried green tomatoes as I just wasn't sure I could see Kathy Bates again!
24. Ms. No - 9/15/2003 3:40:17 PM
"It's very stylish and intelligent...and sexy!"
Sexy, yes. A lot of horror stories - filmic, written or oral - have an intense focus on sex. All of the classic slasher films are guaranteed to include sexual overtones and generally lots of scantily clad or naked women.
I read an article some moths ago about horror stories as cautionary tales warning against premarital sex and sexual promiscuity. I wish I could remember where as it was almost certainly online.
Think of how many campfire tales begin with a pair of young lovers who have parked out on a deserted Lovers' Lane to make out and instead end up dismembered by a psychopath. In recent years the serial sex killer has become a favorite subject for both films and popular fiction. The message seems to be aimed at women more than at men, however. The virginal female always survives.
Have we always had this link between sexual depravity and horror? I can't think of a time when we didn't. The vampire, one of the oldest bogeymen, has always had a sexual nature. Succubi, Incubi, demons looking to couple with human women, virgin sacrifice, Satanic orgies. Is the link between sex and horror biologically programmed into the human mind?
25. Ms. No - 9/15/2003 3:48:35 PM
I haven't ever seen Duel. That's another I'll look up. Misery was an excellent tale both the book and the film. King is probably better known for his supernatural tales, but I've always found that his ability to make the mundane and ordinary menacing one of his greatest talents. Stories like Misery, Quitters Inc., The Body, Apt Pupil, The Breathing Method, The Last Rung on the Ladder which have no sinister evil powers behind them are no less horrifying than his other tales. In fact, for many they are more horrifying because they seem more possible.
26. judithathome - 9/15/2003 3:49:25 PM
There's a fabulous Goya, I believe, of a incubus sitting on the side of a woman's bed...
Thoughtful, I remember Duel and it was very unsettling and scary...and I was a grownup!
27. wabbit - 9/15/2003 4:17:49 PM
Then there are the goofy horror movies, like The Toxic Avenger.
Thoughtful, I agree about Duel, gave me the willies when I first saw it! The Shining steps away from reality, but I like it anyway.
28. thoughtful - 9/15/2003 4:34:23 PM
There were these really lousy horror movies way back...one that always seemed to be shown every xmas was called "the crawling eye"...I remember watching it on tv with my cousins for many years, rolling on the floor with laughter.
There was another with these zombies who were walking around stiff-legged with their arms out in front. Local station used to run them late at night on a show called "Creature Feature".
Then there was Zacherley...anyone remember him? Don't know if he was local or not, but he spoofed these horror flicks. Very funny. I guess my age is showing. Sigh.
I thought the shining was very good....some images will never go away, esp of Jack in his "here's johnny" face or the unbelievable stack of pages, "All work and no play makes Jack a dull boy."
29. Ms. No - 9/15/2003 5:04:56 PM
Wabbit,
Ah TROMA!
For pure cheese factor nobody is better than Troma. I'll definitely have to put them in the link even though I can't think of a single one of their films that I'd put on the "good horror" list. They're a breed apart and have to be enjoyed as a sub-genre of horror.
Troma is what you get if 14yo boys make horror movies. What a blast!
30. spunkymisg - 9/15/2003 5:10:06 PM
redrum redrum redrum...
31. Ms. No - 9/15/2003 5:17:07 PM
The Shining was a great movie as long as I don't think about the book when I'm watching the film. The book scared the crap out of me. The movie was terrifying, but it strayed from the book in some essential areas of character development that disappointed me.
32. alistairconnor - 9/15/2003 5:18:47 PM
I took the girls to see Pirates of the Caribbean the other day, thinking it might be too much for the six year old... but I've never seen such an un-scary movie. Which is quite perverse really, considering the zombie "special effects", which are very clever, and the amount of death depicted.
It was just so... completely Disney, it couldn't be scary.
33. Ms. No - 9/15/2003 5:41:23 PM
Sidenote on Scary Disney:
It's long been claimed that no one has ever died on Disney property --- they die on the way to the hospital or at the hospital if they die at all. News of accidents rarely gets out and if it does it's hushed up quick.
Just last week there was a wreck on the Thunder Mountain Railroad and a patron was killed. It was reported on the radio exactly once that I heard and the claim is now that the ride didn't kill the man but that he died of a heart attack.
I know several people who've worked for Disney and the hold that company has on the media is truly frightening.
34. wabbit - 9/15/2003 5:59:35 PM
Hmm, the local news here was saying he was one of four (I think it was four) people who have been killed at Disneyland since it opened back in 1955.
I've never read a single Steven King book or story, so I had no image in mind when I saw The Shining, or Carrie.
35. Ms. No - 9/15/2003 6:07:16 PM
Wabbit,
Lots of dire things have happened at Disney - as they do at any large public amusement venue - but you rarely hear about them particularly in areas near the parks.
Carrie was much truer to the book as far as characterizations went. Other good adaptations of his books are Firestarter, Misery, Delores Claiborne, Stand By Me, Shawshank Redemption, The Green Mile, The Dead Zone.
The best bet is never to get your heart set on an adaptation for which King has also written the screenplay. They have a terrible track record.
36. concerned - 9/15/2003 6:23:48 PM
Would 'Plan 9 From Outer Space' qualify as a horror movie, or does its amateurishness as a movie place it in a different genre?
37. wabbit - 9/15/2003 6:31:55 PM
Now *that* was a fun movie!
38. concerned - 9/15/2003 6:34:09 PM
Maybe I should fire up my vhs copy tonite:)
39. wabbit - 9/15/2003 6:34:55 PM
Speaking of movies that were scary when I was young, how about Wait Until Dark?
40. wabbit - 9/15/2003 6:37:48 PM
I'll pick up a copy of Plan 9 one of these days. It will be right at home next to Creature From The Black Lagoon!
IMDB has a list of the Top 50 Horror movies. The worst ten are at the bottom of the page.
41. concerned - 9/15/2003 6:39:26 PM
I remember that I went through a simultaneous HP Lovecraft and Stephen King novel and short story phase a while back. I remember particularly enjoying King's 'The Stand' and 'It' as well as short stories by both authors.
42. Ms. No - 9/15/2003 6:48:11 PM
I think Plan 9 has to be included in the horror genre, but there are sub genres. There's a definite place for camp or Troma would be out of business....well, maybe not since they offer plenty of naked breasts as well. ;->
43. rdbrewer - 9/15/2003 7:50:12 PM
Wabbit, Night of the Living Dead is at #40 on that list. Seems like it should be closer to the top ten.
My favorites include the inadvertently funny variety, like Plan Nine.
44. judithathome - 9/15/2003 8:04:13 PM
The TV movie of IT was scary...I never pass a street grating without thinking of Tim Curry in clownface leering out at ground level.
45. wabbit - 9/15/2003 8:10:49 PM
Well, Young Frankenstein (sound file) is at #11, so I doubt the list is a good barometer of horror.
Has anyone seen Aswang?
46. rdbrewer - 9/15/2003 8:19:39 PM
You guys remember the green monster in the Adrienne Barbeau movie Swamp Thing? If so, can you think of a politician who looks just like the monster? (I'll name one later.)
Speaking of green monsters, there was a weird, campy, wonderful movie called The Green Slime. Remember that? I loved it. Here's a good user comment from IMDB:
You have to love a sci-fi movie that:
1) Is a Japanese-produced product featuring a mostly-Anglo cast (saves on dubbing cost).
2) Has equivalent special effects of any given "Godzilla" movie.
3) Has Italian bombshells named "Sheila Benson".
4) Gives you slime creatures that look like Sigmund the Sea Monster.
5) Has a mad doctor (isn't that a pre-requisite for these movies? Thought so.).
6) Has one of the all-time coolest title songs I have ever heard in my entire natural life.
If you watch "The Green Slime", just think: if Jaeckel had brought the rest of his "Dirty Dozen" cronies along with him, the Green Slime would never have stood a chance.
Oh well....
Seven stars. By the way, does anyone know where to get this movie's soundtrack? I have GOT to get that song....
That pretty well sums up how I feel about it. Some low budget sci-fi/horror movies are terribly entertaining.
47. rdbrewer - 9/15/2003 9:48:19 PM
Ooooooooh, so scary!
48. alistairconnor - 9/16/2003 3:52:51 AM
3) Has Italian bombshells named "Sheila Benson".
What's the logic here? Italian bombshells give you more bang for your buck than Anglos, and nobody cares about their accent?
49. thoughtful - 9/16/2003 8:04:07 AM
Can't resist...is that last picture GWB landing on that aircraft carrier?
50. thoughtful - 9/16/2003 8:20:26 AM
Attack of the 50 foot woman...how did those shreds of clothing stretch so far?
The Blob...Sci Fi meets Rebel without a Cause
The Fly, Them, Mothra....what is that obsession with giant insects?
51. Macnas - 9/16/2003 9:06:58 AM
Mothra, now there was a bizarre idea, lets have a giant.....moth.
At least Godzilla was a great big dinosaur type creature.
Then there was that whole Mothra vs Godzilla business...
"I'm Godzilla, and you're Japan!" -Name that film??
52. dr_mabeuse - 9/16/2003 9:07:27 AM
Worst Monster movie ever: "The Creeping Terror"
This is an ultra low budget flick filmed around Lake Tahoe about 1960. The movie was something of a scam since the producer/director/star actually charged local citizens to be in the movie, then disappeared shortly after it opened and was never heard from since. The monster is a giant piece of carpet with automobile radiator hoses hanging from it that schleps along the dusty landscape at a fearsome one mile per hour. It was animated by a bunch of college kids beneath it, and you can occasionally see their feet.
After filming, the sound track was lost, so, rather than go back and rerecord it, the entire film is narrated apparently by the same guy who used to do those Coronet Educational Films (like "Colombia: Land of Zinc and Copra"). The music is some wild, futuristic pastiche performed by a group consisting of piano, organ, snare drum, and trumpet, and the composer paid the producer a couple grand for the priviledge of writing it.
It's the usual story of a monster from a flying saucer who starts humping around the countryside eating folks. You can see the 'actors' trying to shove their way into the monster's mouth while it shakes its radiator hoses at them. The film also features the producer's teenage girlfriend (supposedly she was only 17) as his wife, and the guy who went on to write "Dress For Success" as the scientist who wants to save the monster. This guy went on to become Richard Nixon's wardrobe consultant, no doubt using his fine dramatic work in the film to slingshot himself into that position.
Really, this one is unbvelievable. You can read all about it in one of the "Golden Turkey" books (forget which one). I bought my copy from Rhino, I believe, but if your Blockbuster has a "Turkey" section, look for it there. It's just astonishing.
53. dr_mabeuse - 9/16/2003 9:07:57 AM
Worst Monster movie ever: "The Creeping Terror"
This is an ultra low budget flick filmed around Lake Tahoe about 1960. The movie was something of a scam since the producer/director/star actually charged local citizens to be in the movie, then disappeared shortly after it opened and was never heard from since. The monster is a giant piece of carpet with automobile radiator hoses hanging from it that schleps along the dusty landscape at a fearsome one mile per hour. It was animated by a bunch of college kids beneath it, and you can occasionally see their feet.
After filming, the sound track was lost, so, rather than go back and rerecord it, the entire film is narrated apparently by the same guy who used to do those Coronet Educational Films (like "Colombia: Land of Zinc and Copra"). The music is some wild, futuristic pastiche performed by a group consisting of piano, organ, snare drum, and trumpet, and the composer paid the producer a couple grand for the priviledge of writing it.
It's the usual story of a monster from a flying saucer who starts humping around the countryside eating folks. You can see the 'actors' trying to shove their way into the monster's mouth while it shakes its radiator hoses at them. The film also features the producer's teenage girlfriend (supposedly she was only 17) as his wife, and the guy who went on to write "Dress For Success" as the scientist who wants to save the monster. This guy went on to become Richard Nixon's wardrobe consultant, no doubt using his fine dramatic work in the film to slingshot himself into that position.
Really, this one is unbvelievable. You can read all about it in one of the "Golden Turkey" books (forget which one). I bought my copy from Rhino, I believe, but if your Blockbuster has a "Turkey" section, look for it there. It's just astonishing.
54. judithathome - 9/16/2003 9:14:11 AM
Dr. if you refresh on a page where you are last poster, you get a repeat post. Go to the front page to refresh.
55. Macnas - 9/16/2003 9:15:13 AM
Good post though, I want to see that flick.
56. judithathome - 9/16/2003 9:26:16 AM
A local guy made a movie almost as bad as what the Dr. described... The Killer Shrews...he did it in the 60s, too. Black and white, very dark. He dressed up a group of German Shepards in rat suits and turned them loose on groups of people who all ran in horror. Too funny! The little suits would shift this way and that as the dogs chased their screaming prey.
57. Macnas - 9/16/2003 9:30:36 AM
What were people thinking when they set out to do these things?
58. judithathome - 9/16/2003 9:31:00 AM
I can't believe it! This thing is listed in the Internet Movie Database...The Killer Shrews. And it was made in 1959, not the 60s.
59. dr_mabeuse - 9/16/2003 12:30:42 PM
(Sorry about the stutter-post)
It's no surprise to me that people make bugs into monsters. The more you know about insects the more disgusting they are: female mantisses eating the male's head while his bottom keeps on copulating with her, wasps paralyzing caterpillars and laying eggs on its body so that the larvae can eat him alive when they hatch. Ugh. Very high nausea factor.
But what about giant rabbits? Anyone remember a made for TV movie called "Night of the Lepus"? Giant bunnies terrorize a town, giant bunny noses twitching, pawing people to death?
60. Macnas - 9/16/2003 12:35:52 PM
Do you think the people who made "Night of the Iguana" were tempted at all??
61. judithathome - 9/16/2003 12:44:24 PM
Yes, and I'm certain Tenneessee Williams saw more than his share of giant lizards while suffering from the DTs!
62. judithathome - 9/16/2003 12:46:55 PM
I remember the giant rabbit movie...all they did was enlarge the rabbits. Pretty amazing.
There was another similar gimmick in a movie called Food Of The Gods and not only did rabbits become humongus but chickens, too.
63. Ms. No - 9/16/2003 12:58:10 PM
I was just thinking about Buffy the Musical when Anya is singing about her fear of giant bunnies.
64. Ms. No - 9/16/2003 1:04:43 PM
Dr. M, good to see you!
65. rdbrewer - 9/16/2003 1:37:02 PM
Alistair:
"3) Has Italian bombshells named "Sheila Benson"."
What's the logic here? Italian bombshells give you more bang for your buck than Anglos, and nobody cares about their accent?
Exactly! Her name is Luciana Paluzzi, the poor man's Raquel Welch. In their extremely inadvertently funny way, the movie makers named her Sheila Benson.
This 1969 movie is the last 50's movie ever made.
66. rdbrewer - 9/16/2003 1:38:51 PM
Thoughtful, that was Bush landing on the carrier. I thought I'd slip that past you guys.
67. judithathome - 9/16/2003 1:39:28 PM
So what were the scary Urban Legends you grew up with?
We had the Man With The Hook and a local goat monster that lived at the lake nearby...he was amphibious.
68. rdbrewer - 9/16/2003 1:46:42 PM
No one has a guess on my Swamp Thing question? Who is the politician who resembles the monster in that movie?
Here are a couple of pictures: 
Hint: He's in the Bush administration.
69. judithathome - 9/16/2003 1:50:21 PM
I'm lookin' at him right now...Rummy.
70. PelleNilsson - 9/16/2003 2:37:23 PM
Ha! I recognized the style but I couldn't place it. Hi there, Herr Doctor Doctor Lohr!
71. dr_mabeuse - 9/16/2003 3:19:53 PM
I don't know about Rumsfeld, but that's Michael Jackson's fifth nose, isn't it?
They pretty much castrated the Swamp Thing when they made him into a Pollution Ranger. He might be scary but he's not sexy.
The Japanese have a special love/hate relationship with Godzilla that goes beyond what we in the West feel for any of our monsters other than maybe Drac &/or Frankenstein's monster. I read somewhere that Godzilla is a kind of symbolic representation of the United States for them.
72. judithathome - 9/16/2003 3:45:50 PM
Not surprising...isn't Dracula repressed sex for us?
73. rdbrewer - 9/16/2003 3:51:16 PM
Dr. Mabeuse:
That's interesting, because Godzilla is alternatively good or bad (usually good), depending upon which movie you're watching. My favorite is the one with Godzilla and King Kong.
And speaking of Godzilla, the actor who wore the Godzilla suit was hired by the makers of The Green Slime to wear the green slime suit. This is obvious from the way the actor gets into both characters. The vocal inflections are identical too.
Judith:
It's not Rummy. Someone else is even a better fit.
74. judithathome - 9/16/2003 3:54:08 PM
Oh yeah...Clutch Cargo himself, Tom Ridge.
75. judithathome - 9/16/2003 3:55:23 PM
(I was swayed to go with Rummy because I watching his press conference at the time.)
76. dr_mabeuse - 9/16/2003 4:01:31 PM
Actually I thought of Howard Dean
77. judithathome - 9/16/2003 4:54:27 PM
Well, but he only wants to be in the administration...RD said this guy was already in it.
It was the stiff neck that did for you, wasn't it?
78. thoughtful - 9/16/2003 5:01:27 PM
Sorry, I must be dense today...exactly what is wrong with a female munching off the head of her partner?
I've found it to be quite effective in reducing divorce lawyer fees....
79. rdbrewer - 9/16/2003 5:04:25 PM
Judith, right! Not his neck, though. It's mostly his cheek bones, chin, mouth, simian ridge, and laugh lines. It would be more clear in a better picture. Look at these: 
80. judithathome - 9/16/2003 11:18:55 PM
RD, the neck remark was about the Dr's thought on Howard Dean.
Nice picture comparison...separated at birth, for sure!
81. Macnas - 9/17/2003 5:13:11 AM
Halloween is just as commercial here as it is elsewhere, and is now a successful "give retailers more of your hard-earned for low quality tat" time of year.
Nonetheless, most people still recognise it as Samhain, (sow-whin) which was the ancient New Year, for Celts at any rate. At this time of year, for 3 days or so, the divide between the living world and the spirit world would narrow.
Bonfires are lit to keep the evil spirits away and everyone is careful not to go abroad at night unless they have to.
Our monsters were called Puca (pookah), and took the form of huge black dogs and horses with red eyes that would curse or kill anyone who was unfortunate to come across them. The Ban Sidh (ban-shee) are not a quintessential part of Halloween, as some may think.
People became paranoid at this time of year, as they were in fear of being cursed (mallacht) by neighbors who wished ill of them, via a pisheog or geas (curses and charms) that would cause potatoes to rot in the pit and cattle to die.
Holy water was sprinkled in mangers and sometimes hazel leaves were made into a small wreath and hung up the doorway.
The morning would be spent beating the bounds of your lands to check for evidence of intrusion, looking for old eggs (gluckers) thrown into a field or yard that were part of the curse method, checking the hay stooks for any pieces of rotten meat that would be buried inside to spoil the hay and encourage rat infestation.
Trick or treat eh?
82. rdbrewer - 9/17/2003 9:50:30 AM
Macnas:
That was interesting.
Halloween is just as commercial here as it is elsewhere, . . . . Our monsters were called . . . .
Where are you?
83. Macnas - 9/17/2003 1:17:09 PM
Ireland rd.
84. rdbrewer - 9/19/2003 10:12:52 AM
Macnas, we have one good Irish pub/restaurant where I live. Yesterday, I had corned beef and cabbage boxty and a large chunk of battered and fried cheese topped with honey. (Not sure if that last one was traditional Irish fare.) They also have something called "scotch eggs," eggs rolled in sausage. Not exactly gluckers and rotten meat, but close.
85. judithathome - 9/19/2003 1:41:21 PM
I made scotch eggs for a party once...very tasty and if you keep them in store, a quick breakfast to heat up if you're running late.
86. Ms. No - 9/19/2003 6:17:48 PM
I'm off to see Underworld tonight about a war between Vampires and Werewolves. It will probably disappoint, but I can't stay away. It looks too gorgeous.
Vampires and werewolves as depicted in film and literature have become more attractive than repellant in recent years. They've always held a certain amount of fascination for people. Certainly vampires have a decidedly sexual allure.
Vampires and werewolves are beautiful and so we've embraced them. Many of them are heroes. Even when they're evil we still have an empathy for them.
Why not for Zombies? Is it the smell? Or just the lack of human intelligence? Perhaps it's not death but ugliness that we fear most.
87. rdbrewer - 9/19/2003 7:27:17 PM
Werewolves: male PMS mythified?
88. dr_mabeuse - 9/19/2003 10:12:44 PM
I think all great monsters have to be sexy in some way. Vampires and werewolves are both very sexual. Zombies no. Nor is the Mummy, nor the Creature from the Black Lagoon, or Rodan or any of the giant bugs. The invisible man? Maybe in a snickering, high school kind of way, but not really.
I've always thought one monster who didn't get the credit it deserved was the Fly. The remake played up the nausea angle too much, but to me at least, the idea's really horrible. Not sexy though.
And just who is sexy from the last 20 years or so? Freddy & Jason: a little bit. Nah. I think the sexiest monster is the Alien, especially in the first movie. All that juice, that mouth getting erect.
In fact, Ridley Scott said that he kept one thing in mind when he was filming it, and that was sex.
89. arkymalarky - 9/19/2003 10:24:58 PM
Ugh. I'd hate to be that guy's partner.
90. Macnas - 9/20/2003 5:15:03 PM
Scotch eggs are, as far as I know, an english creation.
Deep fried battered cheese is a rural northern Italian dish. Real heart attack stuff, but nice though.
Corned beef is rare here, we use honest salt bacon. And boxty, well, lets just say its hardly stimulating to the taste buds.
There is very little to Irish cuisine, I don't know I could even say there is such a thing. If there is anything to differentiate it at all from ordinary english cuisine, it is the ingredients, which can be very very good.
How scary is that? not very.....BOO! (there ya go).
91. arkymalarky - 9/20/2003 5:36:48 PM
I thought you differentiated all foods by their ingredients.
Boo Who?
92. rdbrewer - 9/20/2003 9:42:24 PM
I have a good title for a new horror/scifi B movie:
"Absorba the Greek"
93. PelleNilsson - 9/22/2003 12:32:16 PM
Irish cuisine = potatoes.
But the seafood is nice. Oysters, crabs, various varieties of clams.
(I'm an expert. I've been to Belfast twice.)
94. PelleNilsson - 9/22/2003 12:32:53 PM
My god!! Make that Dublin, Dublin, Dublin!
95. Macnas - 9/22/2003 12:43:42 PM
We got rid of all you Nordic types once before Nilsson, we can do it again...
96. PelleNilsson - 9/22/2003 1:00:34 PM
You just thought you did. We're in your genes for ever.
97. Ms. No - 9/22/2003 1:18:56 PM
Dr. M,
"I think all great monsters have to be sexy in some way."
I think a lot of the great monsters are sexy, but sex comes into play with a lot of them that aren't. It's the allure of forbidden or prurient sex. The Creature from the Black Lagoon isn't sexy, but the scene everyone knows from the movie is how he stalks the woman in the white bikini.
Similarly, there isn't anything sexy about Jason or Michael but there's a lot of sex going on around them. Sex marks the victims. In film it's practically a law that some nubile young thing has to get naked in order to be killed.
It's horror as abstinence-only sex education. "Forget about STDs and pregnancy. If you have premarital or deviant sex you're going to end up dismembered by a psychopath."
Only they play to the prurient by showing everyone exactly what kinds of behavior will get you killed. During the 70's and 80's if you wanted to see naked women on the big screen your best bet was a slasher flick.
98. thoughtful - 9/22/2003 1:25:32 PM
"Irish cuisine = potatoes"
Since potatoes are from the "new world" what did the irish eat in pre-colombian days?
99. wabbit - 9/22/2003 1:28:47 PM
Ms. No, how was the movie?
100. PelleNilsson - 9/22/2003 1:41:06 PM
Swedes, probably.
101. Ms. No - 9/22/2003 1:44:22 PM
Wabbz,
Very disappointing. I just wrote a review over in Movies & TV.
102. wabbit - 9/22/2003 1:46:54 PM
Just read your review. What a disappointment, but I can't say I'm surprised. One review said essentially that "Underworld" is two hours of all the unlikeable things from the second "Matrix" movie.
103. Ms. No - 9/22/2003 1:55:18 PM
Yeah, that about fits the bill. It wasn't scary, it wasn't sexy, it didn't have any mystery other than the big "What the hell were they thinking" kind.
They completely and totally missed out on what is captivating about the vampire and werewolf myths. It was just another bad adaptation of Romeo and Juliet in gangland.
104. Ms. No - 9/22/2003 1:58:44 PM
Deep down, people are intrigued by the idea of becoming vampires or werewolves. They want to be turned. It's a flirtation with the dark side of our natures. I think this wanting is why we've turned vampires and werewolves into heroes in recent years. We've had to clean them up so it doesn't look so bad that we find them alluring.
105. Tatelou - 9/22/2003 5:30:36 PM
Hi Ms. No!
I'm with you on that. Vampires in particular have been 'sexed-up' in recent years by authors and film makers alike. We all have inner dark desires, and most of us are too ashamed to admit it. That's why, as you said, vampires and werewolves are often no longer seen as the antagonists, but now portrayed as the protagonists. We root for them to suceed with their nefarious plans and deeds.
Another consequence of our 'de-sentisitization' towards vampires, werewolves and other classic horror monsters is this: authors in the horror genre are pushing the boundries much more. Over the past twenty years there's been a marked shift in the content of horror novels. They no longer purely rely on elements of the supernatural to shock, scare and downright terrify us. They still tap into our innermost fears, but these fears are more realistic, so are horrific in their own respect.
The book 'Island' by my favourite author, the late Richard Laymon, contains no element of the supernatural, but it is one of the most gripping, shocking, cringe inducing and terrifying books that I have ever read.
106. arkymalarky - 9/22/2003 6:07:21 PM
Hey Tatelou. Welcome to the Mote.
MsNo, I've heard your '97 expressed before, but I don't remember where. I tease Bob that since we've gotten a dish he'll watch anything with "N" in the description just for the novelty of seeing it, no matter how much "V" it has or how few stars.
107. Tatelou - 9/22/2003 6:50:41 PM
Hi Arkymalarky, thanks for the welcome.
108. rdbrewer - 9/22/2003 6:58:03 PM
Hi, Tatelou -- or should I say "Out Late"?
Ms. No, maybe the vaguely sexual monster (VSM) is better because the fear, aggression, and sex centers in the brain are so close, overlapping in some areas. So the VSM stimulates all those areas on some level for a better thrill.
109. wabbit - 9/22/2003 8:14:18 PM
Welcome Tatelou!
I always thought Frank Langella's Dracula was hot.
110. judithathome - 9/22/2003 10:03:23 PM
I saw that sucker (heh) seven times...he was very hot, indeed.
111. Macnas - 9/23/2003 3:19:13 AM
Most vampires now seem to have a leather fetish of some sort, and are generally tall good looking types.
So very different from the gibbering fanged beast whose shredded clothes are stained with earth and gore.
I prefer my vampires to be blood crazed, well nigh unstoppable fiends. Not some sleek well dressed pale catwalk refugee who wears mascara and has issues of one kind or another.
112. rdbrewer - 9/23/2003 9:44:28 AM
Macnas, that reminds me of a great scene in the movie Vampires where James Woods' character describes vampires to the priest in the truck.
113. Ms. No - 9/23/2003 2:52:05 PM
Hi Lou! Good to see you.
"Over the past twenty years there's been a marked shift in the content of horror novels. They no longer purely rely on elements of the supernatural to shock, scare and downright terrify us. They still tap into our innermost fears, but these fears are more realistic, so are horrific in their own respect."
I've started this post a half dozen different times in a half dozen different ways and I'm still not very coherent. I give up. I'll just get it out in random bits and see if maybe we can get the through-line of a decent theory worked out of it.....maybe...if luck smiles.
What significantly changed about our world in the late 60's and early 70's? I know that Vietnam was a different war than those before it if only because it was a publicly viewed war. I think perhaps we stopped lying so much about our innocence.
We tend to look back at the 40's and 50's as some kind of golden era of happy, intact families and material wealth the likes of which we'd never known before. It was an innocent, simple time blah blah blah. I think that's hooey.
I think the public record of those times has skewed our vision because of what was and was not permitted by the censors of the day.
It also occurs to me that the Cold War was in high gear. The threat of nuclear holocaust was a very real fear. It's hard to work up much fear for things that go bump in the night with the horror of nuclear anihilation staring you in the face. When reality is horrifying enough why make up monsters?
114. dr_mabeuse - 9/25/2003 4:36:20 PM
There were several things that happened in the 1960's and '70's to change our concept of evil was the reaslization of the old Walt Kelly truism: We Have Met the Enemy and He Is Us. Assasinations happened, in which we learned that evil did not have to be supernatural. Viet Nam and Civil Rights happened, in which we found that our nation was capable of evil, despite what we'd always thought. Watergate happened, so whom do you trust? And finally the youth revolution turned over the common cultural assumptions of acceptable behavior and courtesy.
In the 30's and 40's the idea of a creature sucking someone's blood might be horrifying, especially to a culture so repressed and conflicted sexually. By the 60's our medical esptablishment was making vampires look like wussies. We were inured to that kind of thing.
The new kind of monster because that creature that arose in our midst; something from our own neighborhood that suddenly exploded in our face. Look at Jason. He's scary because he doesn;t even have a face: he could be anyone
(By the way: Hi Tatelou too!)
115. dr_mabeuse - 9/25/2003 4:40:28 PM
"The Exorcist" was the scariest movie of the last 30 years.
Or was it "Jaws"?
Neither of them sexy, either. So there goes that theory.
116. Ms. No - 9/25/2003 4:50:24 PM
The Exorcist gets my vote but it's tied with Night of the Living Dead (never to be judged by the horrid sequels).
You're right on the lack of sexiness in either of these. Jaws wasn't a sexy film, but don't forget the skinny dipper who gets it first. That's the image they put on the book cover as well.
Horror doesn't always have sexual overtones, but it's too common to be purely coincidental.
117. Ms. No - 9/25/2003 4:54:28 PM
I was doing some research (that sounds so much more serious than "I was surfing the net") the other day and got side tracked.
I came across a site called CrimeLibrary.com and was going through their serial killer pages. The 70's and 80's seem to have been rather thick with them although there were serial killers long before that. It just seems that the 70's and 80's had more than their share.
118. dr_mabeuse - 9/25/2003 5:31:58 PM
From 113: "It's hard to work up much fear for things that go bump in the night with the horror of nuclear anihilation staring you in the face. When reality is horrifying enough why make up monsters?"
Funny, the usual theory cited to explain the sudden rash of monster movies in the 50's is exactly the opposite. Supposedly all those giant bugs and spacemen were a way of sublimating and focusing our fears.
119. dr_mabeuse - 9/25/2003 5:37:14 PM
Has anyone ever heard any good radio horror? Up here they usually play some classic shows from the hg9olden era of radio drama around Halloween: the people who turn inside out, the Giant Chicken Heart (really!)
One of the scariest things I ever heard was while I was driving across Texas. It was night and it was an old radio drama with Vincent Price as the keeper of an isolated lighthouse. One dark and stormy night (naturally), the wreck of a ship washes up on the island, and it's crawling with rats. The flood onto the island and of course head for the lighthouse. He barricades himself inside but they get in. Then he fights them from floor to floor until he's trapped alone in the very top...
And then I lost the %$@%$! signal! I actually turned around and drove back the way I'd come to try and hear the end but I never did.
Does anyone know how it ended?
120. Ms. No - 9/25/2003 5:50:01 PM
How incredibly frustrating. Maybe it's out on recording somewhere. It's not a story that I know, sorry I can't tell you the ending.
"Supposedly all those giant bugs and spacemen were a way of sublimating and focusing our fears."
I think that's likely true, but as we moved into the 60's and 70's I think we became as afraid of our own Pollyannaism. Conspiracy theories and reality-based horrors became the norm. I think we decided that we were somehow more sofisticated or enlightened because we were willing to admit that real life wasn't Ozzie and Harriet and the Cleavers.
It's funny, I was just a kid, but I remember the 70's as being incredibly sleazy. It's probably all just about production values for me anyway. ;->
121. arkymalarky - 9/25/2003 6:47:49 PM
I was a teenager, and they were.
122. wabbit - 9/25/2003 11:22:34 PM
DrM, Three Skeleton Key sounds like the story you heard. A bit of history about the story is here.
123. Tatelou - 9/26/2003 7:33:42 AM
Hi Ms. No, and Dr M, good to talk to you both here. Thanks for the welcomes from everyone.
First of all, on the subject of films that scare us, the only 'film' (it was a TV mini series, so not actually a film) that really scared me was 'Salem's Lot, adapted from King's novel. I was quite young when I first saw it, about 10 I think. The scene where the child vampire floats at the kid's window, scratching the glass, terrified me. I was unable to go near a window at night for ages, unless the curtains were drawn, for fear of seeing a floating vampire. Even now, at the grand old age of thirty, I find that film creepy. That film wasn't sexy, either.
On the subject of what changed in the 60's, 70's and even 80's I think some very good points have been raised. By that point in time almost everyone had a TV, and the horrors of the real world were brought into our living rooms. War no longer seemed like some distant event, unrelated to our lives, we watched the events and ramifications unfold in front of our eyes.
Television news constantly reports murder, rape and mass killings, and these things tap into our innermost fears. The actual rate of violent crime hasn't actually risen that much over the past thirty years, but our fear of violent crime has risen dramatically.
Ms. No, I agree, there did seem to be a rise in the number of serial killings in the 70's and 80's, that's also true of my country, the UK. The notable one that I remember is Peter Sutcliffe: The Yorkshire Ripper. Women began to be afraid to go out alone at night, we all became more careful and paranoid as a society. I think that's why a lot of people nowadays find reading about a serial killer much more terrifying than reading about a monster or even a vampire. We can relate these things to our own interpretation of reality.
124. Macnas - 9/26/2003 7:50:33 AM
I had to laugh after reading Tatelou's post, as indeed Salems Lot still does count as one of the scariest things I've seen on screen, albeit the small screen.
It is amazing when you consider that it was a 2 part television show, with David Soul of all people in the main role.
I know Stephen King was disgusted that the main vampire was portrayed as a mindless fiend, whereas in his book he is the total opposite. I thought it was carried off really well nonetheless.
125. Ms. No - 9/26/2003 12:46:44 PM
hahaha, the child vampire at the window is still one of the scaries film moments ever for me as well!
Okay, here's a shot in the dark:
Crime in general has greatly decreased over the last 20 years although certain violent crimes have increased (this is mainly due to gang violence). I read more pulp fiction than anyone I know and in the last five years I've found that you can't swing a dead cat without smacking a psychological thriller about super-criminals being tracked down by super-profilers and forensic scientists.
We've made our monsters more realistic in that they aren't actually sent by the devil, but we've also made them totally unrealistic in their power and intelligence. We still aren't dealing with reality which says you're more likely to be hit by lightning than to become the victim of a serial killer.
What is it that we're distracting ourselves from? The Cold War is over. Certainly we've had military (jeeze, are having) conflicts, but the threat of nuclear war isn't the same today as it was in the 50's when people actually built bomb shelters in their basements.
We've got hundreds of thousands of men, women and children on anti-depressant and other prescription mood-regulating drugs. Has the world population suddenly so radically biologically changed or have we altered our world to the point where we're not equipped to live successfully in it without chemical aid?
What aspect of ourselves are we trying to distract from?
126. dr_mabeuse - 9/26/2003 3:58:00 PM
Well gee, Ms.No... I don;t think we have to look for a deep psychological reason to explain our fascination for a good story, and human beings have always liked scaring one another. But as to your question:
"Has the world population suddenly so radically biologically changed or have we altered our world to the point where we're not equipped to live successfully in it without chemical aid?"
I think the answer is pretty clearly your second choice.
Maybe this isn't the place to discuss it, but I think one of the major changes over the past 25-30 years is the failure of the idea of Progress. Since the Age of Enlightenment it's generally been assumed in the western world that mankind has been making progress towards a better world, and this belief has served to give life a sense of meaning and purpose, even taking the place of religion.
I don't know anyone who believes that anymore. Things are changing, and changing terribly quickly, but it's pretty apparent now that they're not getting especially better, and they're probably getting worse. Tomorrow doesn't look very bright.
We've come to see that we are our own worst enemy, and that those machines and scientific breakthroughs that were supposed to set us free and create a "leisure explosion" (Ha! Does anyone remember that crisis? The problem we were going to have with all our free time once the machines took over?) have instead made things worse.
Compared to what many of us face in our day to day lives, dealing with a Freddy or a Jason almost seems like fun. At least that kind of evil has a face.
127. Ms. No - 9/26/2003 4:08:20 PM
And at least one has the hope of surviving by being smart and following the "rules".
I had completely forgotten about the crisis of the leisure explosion. Do you know of any stats that track the length of the work week over the past 40 years? I know I hear all the time that we work harder, longer for less now than ever before particularly in the U.S., but I don't know if that's true or just an urban myth.
128. Ms. No - 9/26/2003 4:10:37 PM
I suppose for topicality's sake we could haul ourselves off to the Slow Thread if we really want to sink our teeth into this.
129. dr_mabeuse - 9/26/2003 5:33:43 PM
A big thanks to wabbit for directing me to the end of that rat story in post 122. But what an anticlimax!
Can you find a link to that other great Halloween radio show: the mist that turns people inside out?
130. ScreamingSin - 9/29/2003 6:38:04 AM
'give retailers more of your hard-earned for low quality tat'
I think in times gone by, there was a reason to bring the outsides indoors and decorate the homes with bay and evergreen. It used to drive away bugs and mice vermin, I think. Also there was joy in the harvest, why not carve a pumpkin?
Now there are plstic whatnots everywhere, can't throw them out, build bigger storage bins for all the plastic replicas that used to go in the compost, hey!
131. ScreamingSin - 9/29/2003 6:44:09 AM
When I was kid I used to looooove Halloween. Now, it's just Xmas a few months earlier with different-colored lights, different treats & presents. I was in a gift shop the other day buying a birthday card for my auntie, and there was a black tree with orange ornaments on it.
A few years ago my brother-in-law and family talked us into going to a mall Because It Was Safe. Yeah, and so lame it didn't look like Halloween to me.
132. Neato - 9/29/2003 6:53:47 AM
When I was growing up in NZ there was no halloween - but we did have Guy Fawkes night on 5th Nov, it was magic, buying the fireworks, letting them off with the neighbours, the ham boiling in the old copper in the backyard.
Then fireworks were banned - sob - and halloween, a suspect American festival was introduced to distract us from the lost of ther fireworks night -according to my Mum.
133. Neato - 9/29/2003 6:55:01 AM
obviously I mean the loss of the fireworks
134. arkymalarky - 9/29/2003 7:11:24 AM
I like my fall traditions to start with the County Fair, but because of family illness we didn't get to do that this year, so I'm not really hyped up for the holidays. I'm hoping by Halloween I get into it some.
I like Halloween around here because of the stuff people put in their yards, much of which also works for Thanksgiving--square haybales and mums and pumpkins.
135. arkymalarky - 9/29/2003 7:12:41 AM
School Halloween carnivals can be a lot of traditional fun--haunted houses, hayrides, cakewalks, game booths--and I think our school is having one this year. Don't know yet if I'll go.
136. Neato - 9/29/2003 7:28:33 AM
I don't think we know how to do halloween properly down here - it's spring for a start!
137. PelleNilsson - 9/29/2003 10:47:36 AM
Halloween seemed to pick up steam here at the end of the 90s, but it turned out to be no more than a fad. Just as well, in my view. I'm against imported traditions.
138. rdbrewer - 9/29/2003 3:58:32 PM
Pelle, that must have been strange for people who were unaware of the fad. Were kids knocking on doors in neighborhoods looking for candy?
139. wonkers2 - 9/30/2003 11:14:20 PM
Nearly all of our traditions are imported!
140. ScreamingSin - 10/3/2003 3:11:49 AM
There's no comfort by the light of the moon
Breathe new life into to the tired veins
Don't go to bridge of sorrow
Your knuckles will be bound into concrete
And your hair will turn white
141. Macnas - 10/3/2003 4:12:05 AM
Like I said before, mad as the mist and snow.
142. Magoseph - 10/31/2003 9:20:58 AM
How did Halloween get to France?
Some sources say that Celts in northern France also celebrated Halloween, but this is unconfirmed. In any case, Halloween is not a traditional French holiday, yet it becomes more popular every year. How and why this is so is a combination of cultural influence and corporate marketing.
The French had been hearing about Halloween from foreign residents and tourists and in their English classes for years before the holiday ever showed its (masked) face in France. In 1982, the American Dream bar/restaurant in Paris began celebrating Halloween. At first it had to explain the holiday to each customer, but since about 1995, French customers have tended to be more and more familiar with Halloween.
The Mask Museum in Saint-Hilaire-Saint Florent was opened by Cesar group in 1992, and the owners started working to expand Halloween in France the following year.
Philippe Cahen, president of Optos Opus, claims that he single-handedly "imported" Halloween to France in 1995, despite admitting that Halloween already existed there (nope, doesn't seem like a logical claim to me either). Cahen created Le Samain cake in 1997 and registered the word "Halloween" as a world trademark. He also challenged 25 artists to come up with works with a Halloween theme, and the results were exhibited at the Victor Hugo Clinic.
In 1996, the village of St. Germain-en-Laye held a Halloween party on 24 October in the middle of the day, to give locals an idea of what it was all about.
Meanwhile, companies like France Télécom, McDonald's, Disney, and Coca Cola began using pumpkins and other Halloween images and ideas in publicity campaigns. This simultaneously increased French people's knowledge about Halloween and made it seem like another imposition of American culture.
143. arkymalarky - 10/31/2003 9:50:50 PM
I am not happy with the Halloween mood this year. They're pushing consumerism so hard they've skipped it and Thanksgiving, apparently, and are straight into Christmas already. I much prefer my holidays one at a time.
144. wonkers2 - 11/1/2003 12:06:11 AM
It's overdone by many in my town--with elaborate and expensive yard decorations, some professionally done by landscapers who will soon be hired to remove and replace them with elaborate Christmas decorations. Why take the fun away from the children?
145. arkymalarky - 11/1/2003 11:32:34 AM
That is stupid. That keep-up-with-the-Jones'-lawn trend in the suburban subdivisions every season of the year is annoying as hell--except on Christmas. I like fall Halloween/Thanksgiving decorations, but a splash of fall mum colors and some pumpkins and hay are plenty--along with a few cute Halloween things.
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